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Old Nov 09, 2009, 06:31 PM
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Carmichael, CA
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Thanks again to Dave for posting data on another very relevant motor. I maidened my buddy's 4.5oz AUW mini swift this Sunday; I built it last week with this setup: 12T-24awg-Y hex 16gm motor, 2s480, gws5030hd. I didn't have time to test the setup before my buddy took his wing home, but I did get to do the trim flight. Too many good things to say... bottom line, this motor is off the hook! At least 30mph vertical, 45mph level; she performed incredibly, just like my 3s microdan speed 2505 powered swift 2, but at half the scale.

I'm building another mini swift with identical specs (I built his); to be sure, when I get to that point I'll post some bench test numbers on my motor with the TP pack. We're both thinking about dropping to a 4530 prop since the lipos seemed to be overworked after this Sunday's flights (tp 2s480 PL2). One of the packs took 1.2hrs and 550mAh, which to me is suspicious and warrants a bench test. I'll be testing my rewind this week.

Cheers,
Kev
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Old Nov 09, 2009, 06:39 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Kev, you're flying too hard for too long! The 12T Wye should actually be a pretty modest amp load; we fly 11T Wyes all the time on our 30" wings and they stay about 9 amps. So I'm guessing 8 or less for the 12T. On the other hand, we're using 610 MAH batterys rather than the 480s. So maybe you should drop down a little or at least cut your flight time down.

Oh oops, ignore the above; that's for a 5043 prop. With a 5030, you should be way down there like 6-1/2 amps or so.

The Rhino 460s have been more durable than the TP 480s for me, by the way.


Dave
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Old Nov 09, 2009, 11:07 PM
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Dave those TP's, are they the pro lite V2's? On the V2 pack it states 20C at 9.6A and burst to 40C 19.2A What C rate is those Rhino's ? Thanks.
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Old Nov 09, 2009, 11:14 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
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The Rhinos I have are 20C, and I think that's still the way they come (when they're in stock). My 20C prolites were not quite as good -- they actually started out fairly strong but dropped off fast and hard.


Dave
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Old Nov 11, 2009, 02:00 AM
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I have noticed the same thing thought it was my motor but those packs seem to sag down the voltage fast.
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Old Nov 11, 2009, 02:41 PM
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Carmichael, CA
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Not the news I wanted to hear guys, but thanks for the heads up. My buddy just bought 4@ 2s480pl2's, so we might have to prop down to keep them alive. If I get time I'll plot some curves with my iCharger and see how much current my 1-flight old 480 wants to do.

I know C rating is not standardized (a laughable situation really), so tp will probably tell me to take a hike if I ask for warranty replacement of a 9A pack that failed at 7A. I've had awesome results with 730, 910, and 1350 PL2's, so I assumed 480 pl2's would be the ticket. Live and learn...

Back on topic: looks like I'll be more or less done building my mini swift tonight, so I'll be able to benchmark the 16gm-12T-2s480 pl2 setup very soon. I was holding off on the bench test until the motor was mounted on the plane. The mount's grub screw threads are very fragile, so I didn't want to risk unnecessary damage by mounting it on my test stand. I already stripped one of the threads on my buddies mini-swift.

Cheers,
Kev
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Old Nov 11, 2009, 05:27 PM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truglodite View Post
...tp will probably tell me to take a hike if I ask for warranty replacement of a 9A pack that failed at 7A.
They'd be silly not to! They're still making a killing even at 50% off list. I'm actually surprised they ever turn down a warranty claim...


Dave
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Old Nov 12, 2009, 11:22 PM
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Carmichael, CA
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Got the bench numbers in, and my results fell short once again (dcalc constants)... but the mini swift's are flying like bats out of hell either way! See attachments for data... So far we like the 5030, but I just got a 4530 to test; I'd rather run at 85%, but not if my buddy leaves me in the dust with his 5030. Lots of field testing to do...

Dave, it won't kill us financially even if they don't, so I plan on letting my 480's serve some time on my mini. I included a discharge plot from logview; sorry I couldn't take it to 9.6A, but my equipment limited me to about 6.5A. I don't test much; it felt a bit too warm (37C), but it did squirt out 480 (ok, 474mah). Average voltage was 7.179V. Perhaps I should read that test as: 9A is over the top for the tp 480, and I need to prop down to the 4530?

I have no issues with driving the snot out of the motor with 5030 and 2s730 prolites though.

For kicks, I threw in a picture of one of the 16gm hex's I rewound, as it came from the factory. Amazing this stuff passes QC!!! There was 3 turns that were scraped by the rotor, and CA all over the place. FWIW, the other one was also shady, but at least it didn't have CA glue in the windings.

Cheers,
Kev
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Old Nov 13, 2009, 10:50 AM
Dave North
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truglodite View Post
Perhaps I should read that test as: 9A is over the top for the tp 480, and I need to prop down to the 4530?
That was my conclusion. I found you could nurse them along if you held the peak under 7 amps and that only occasionally. Otherwise they hit the death spiral really fast. The 460s can tolerate short 9-amp use, but on a regular basis that'll kill them too.
Quote:
I have no issues with driving the snot out of the motor with 5030 and 2s730 prolites though.
Absolutely! My 730s lasted half of forever and did a fine job for over a year. The Rhino 610s are about as good and hold higher voltage at first.
Quote:
For kicks, I threw in a picture of one of the 16gm hex's I rewound, as it came from the factory. Amazing this stuff passes QC!!! There was 3 turns that were scraped by the rotor, and CA all over the place.
Nice work on the 11T rewind; as you know by now it's an easy wind but the challenge is staying away from the face. I got a few that looked like that -- right down to the scuffed wires. Those are a horror to clean off. As I'm way too sure you know.


Dave
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Old Nov 16, 2009, 01:02 AM
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"16gm Wonder" Rewind Spreadsheet (excel)

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showa...1&d=1258354769

Let me know if there's any missing or incorrect data, and I'll try to keep it up to date as ppl add data to this thread.

Cheers,
Kev
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Old Nov 17, 2009, 10:01 AM
I make bad look so good.
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League City, Texas
Joined Sep 2006
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Dave,

Do you think the 9T delta would actually work on an EDF50 (NOT the EDF55) on 3S? Or would it go nova? I might have to give it a try although I need to get some 23awg wire. I saw you did a 10T with 23awg so 9T shouldn't be a problem.

Steve
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Old Nov 17, 2009, 11:39 AM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
Joined Apr 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveC68 View Post
Do you think a 9T delta would actually work on an EDF50
I'm guessing yes, and that's the crudest kind of guess. The upside is a 9T should be fairly easy -- just make sure to keep that frontside flat. There just isn't much room between stator and bell. But the 10T was a pain only because of the last turn; without it I think it would have been a simple wind.


Dave
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Old Nov 22, 2009, 11:03 AM
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Carmichael, CA
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Just noticed this motor, and was curious what's up:

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...idProduct=8614

Hex 16gm with 0.2mm lams and better magnets, perhaps even more room up front? Looks tempting anyways.

Kev
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Old Nov 22, 2009, 11:20 AM
Dave North
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USA, CA, San Jose
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truglodite View Post
Hex 16gm with 0.2mm lams and better magnets, perhaps even more room up front? Looks tempting anyways
Read the first review on the higher Kv model:

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...r_Motor_2300kv

Bottom line: very slight improvement, still a pain to unwind.

Dave
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Old Dec 21, 2009, 07:52 PM
I Love My Ember!
Arroyo Grande, CA
Joined Jun 2008
1,099 Posts
I managed to get a wind I think I like, as well as the tools to do the calcs, well, at least halfway decent calcs. My tach is only accurate to the 100rpms, and Amps only accurate to the .1A unit. 3s tests done with a 3s360 Rhino, 2s tests done with 2s800 Zippy

16g Hex 18T 26awg newbie wire terminated wye.

No load - 3s
A: 0.6
V: 11.89
RPM: 19500
kV : = 19500/11.89 = ~ 1640kV
No load - 2s
A: 0.5
Vrest: 8.33
V: 8.28
RPM: 13900
kV : = 13900/8.28 = ~ 1678kV


Load 6030 3s360
A: 5.3
Vrest:11.7
V: 10.22
RPM: 13000
thrust: 290g

Load 5030 3s360
A: 3.5
Vrest: 11.61
V: 10.58
RPM: 15200
thrust: 212g



Load 7035 2s800
A: 4.3
Vrest:8.21
V: 7.81
RPM: 10000
thrust: 232g

Load 7035 3s360
A: 6.8
Vrest:12.3
V: 10.4
RPM: 12600
thrust: 360g
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