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Old Nov 14, 2012, 04:03 PM
Brett
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So Cal
Joined Apr 2002
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Originally Posted by screamin' eagle View Post
Wow, sorry I missed it. That's a heckuva an impressive speed for that hill. I am not nearly as familiar with it as you guys, but my impression is that the shape of the hill is terrific, but the wind tends to be off-angle and cycling.
Most of the time it's probably good for 100-130mph, tops. But on the day after a storm, in those blustery, unstable conditions, it can get quite strong. I think Spencer measured the front side wind speed at 25mph?

On that day, BigSwede unfortunately gained the distinction (or honor) of being the only person to blow up a plane DS'ing there. It's the plane other pretty green plane in this picture...
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 05:15 PM
Ninja Master
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United States, CA, Thousand Oaks
Joined Feb 2007
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I'm gonna think of it as an honor Brett. As you know, my Pike Precision was brand new, I just maidened it the day before. I'm wondering if it really was an F3F layup, it seems very light with only one layer of carbon. I think it might have been an F3B layup. Upon further inspection it appears that the RDS in the ailerons weren't able to handle the speed, causing flutter and destroying the plane. So I guess it doesn't matter if it was an F or B layup, the RDS wouldn't have handled it anyways. The radar read 171 mph the lap before it blew up, and this lap was a bit faster. This was my last lap before punching out, since I was worried about overspeeding this plane. I thought for sure it would be able to handle any speeds Kanan was able to dish out.
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 06:18 PM
Confirmed Chronic
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Pacific Palisades, CA
Joined Jul 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSwede View Post
I'm gonna think of it as an honor Brett. As you know, my Pike Precision was brand new, I just maidened it the day before. I'm wondering if it really was an F3F layup, it seems very light with only one layer of carbon. I think it might have been an F3B layup. Upon further inspection it appears that the RDS in the ailerons weren't able to handle the speed, causing flutter and destroying the plane. So I guess it doesn't matter if it was an F or B layup, the RDS wouldn't have handled it anyways. The radar read 171 mph the lap before it blew up, and this lap was a bit faster. This was my last lap before punching out, since I was worried about overspeeding this plane. I thought for sure it would be able to handle any speeds Kanan was able to dish out.
Major bummer. Wow.

That said, 171 is way fast for any F3F ship that doesn't have a specialized layup for DS, IMO. Heck, that speed will blow up a glass Opus. I usually hit the brakes on my Acacia II around 120mph, same for the other F3Fs I've had in the past.
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 10:42 PM
AvB
Wind, hill, ... I'm keen ...
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Australia, QLD, Woody Point
Joined Nov 2006
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I dunno Dom. My Willow (carbon) does 175 with ease although after a while it got some flutter from the skin separating from part of the drag spar. Some seem much better than others. I think they'd all go faster and be safer if the skins were bonded together strongly rather than the narrow bead of splooge that some have.
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 11:13 PM
JWs are Shear Fun!
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USA
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Light, Slow, Expensive.
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 11:13 PM
Confirmed Chronic
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Maybe I'm overstating it. I get nervous when I start to hear noises as planes cross the shear.
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 11:27 PM
AvB
Wind, hill, ... I'm keen ...
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No I think you're right there. If you're hearing noises or seeing undue shudder you're right to back off. The Willow is a full carbon so it's probably on the heavier stronger end. Seems very strongly built. A perfect fun DS acro plane for 150-ish etc.

But listening for wing noise doesn't help with the planes whose tails blow up easily! As Daboz has said repeatedly that's the weak spot for a lot of planes. My Stratos DS was looking fantastic at 170 till the full floating stabs blew up!
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Old Nov 14, 2012, 11:29 PM
Ninja Master
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United States, CA, Thousand Oaks
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Well, in any case I had no business pushing it that fast and I paid for it. It really did feel super smooth and there was no warning. But anyway, I might have to pick up a new Kinetic 2M (just to get this thread back on track)!
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Old Nov 15, 2012, 03:03 AM
Where is the inspiration
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Moira
Joined Feb 2006
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Thanks for this update.
I have been wondering what was happening with this model.
I will have one of these models one day. and hopefully not in the too distant future.
Also like the green, but don't think is surpasses the bright Orange and blue.
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Old Dec 02, 2012, 09:03 PM
PB of 733kph
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Christchurch, New Zealand
Joined Jul 2005
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So what servos are going to be options for this model? We have the proven MKS6125.

What about the new hitec, or JR equiv.?
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Old Dec 02, 2012, 09:12 PM
Ninja Master
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United States, CA, Thousand Oaks
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Spencer had the new Hitec 7115s in the one he brought up to Kanan. There was plenty of room left for something thicker.
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Old Dec 02, 2012, 09:19 PM
PB of 733kph
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Christchurch, New Zealand
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Trying to figure cheapest for good reliability and purpose
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 01:04 AM
Registered User
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United States, CA, Los Angeles
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In my opinion, the MKS DS6125 is the preferred servo and fits everywhere with the aileron bay being just a little bit tight. Not the cheapest choice but realistically it's not that big of a premium. Also, its nice to be able to use only a 4cell Nimh pack. I think the K2m with the MKS servos will be OK to very high speeds. Especially if you install them with Smartmodel aluminum frames with external bearings! Either way, I recommend using aluminum arms as the plastic ones are a little smallish.

The servo bays are deep enough to hold JR DS378/388HV for the flaps and elevator, but the ailerons would have to have a slight bulge.

I put the Hitec HS7115th on every surface of my lightweight layup K2m figuring it would be a good place to test them out. The install was really easy and in fact, they fit completely flush with no jelly bean covers required for the flaps or ailerons. I am running mine on a 5cell AA eneloop pack and have had no problem with their performance. Pretty incredible performance for a servo of that size (I'd like to see Hitec take the same approach with the HS-5125). If you're planning on going over 300mph regularly, I'd recommend installing a 3rd bearing to eliminate bearing flex or consider a bigger servo.

If you're trying to save some $$, the Hyperion DS095FMD would also fit easily and should be up to the task. Just read up on burn out problems that some seem to have before you decide to go down that road. I don't personally have any experience with these but they might not be worth the initial savings if it happens in the air...
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 01:18 AM
PB of 733kph
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Christchurch, New Zealand
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Awesome Info Spencer! Cheers man!
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Old Dec 03, 2012, 02:13 AM
R.I.P
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Australia, QLD, Toowoomba
Joined Jan 2010
3,487 Posts
Nice Spencer. I went for the DS6125 on my Scorcher ailerons but didnt go with the bearing supports as I didnt think they'd fit. Turns out they would have fitted after all, but I had no time to get any more. They should still go ok I reckon but it would have been good to have the bearing frames in there.
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