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Old Apr 08, 2009, 02:52 PM
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Question
Lama Speed Kit

I've seen the Speed Kit on YouTube. I've even done some reading here in this forum.

I can see what the guy did, kind of, but how can I make my own or obtain the pieces needed?

I've seen Barak1001's comments:

Quote:
It's a waste of money. They sell an extended shaft, and they sell a "koax booster". Which is basically a brushed ESC able to handle 11.1 volts.

By the time you pay for the booster with shipping you could spend less than $20 more and convert over to brushless with a heading hold gyro.
I already have an extended inner shaft so where do I get a Coax Booster? Do I have this right, a Coax Booster allows me to use an 11.1 Battery instead of the 7.4v? This is all that's needed to gain that much speed?

The heli's (Lama's) in the YouTube video are quick as . Seriously.

Here is the translated webpage:
http://translate.google.com/translat...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Barak1001 also mentions going brushless with a HH Gyro for additional $20. Would my Lama be as fast as shown in the videos with this upgrade (Brushless & HH Gyro)?
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Old Apr 08, 2009, 02:59 PM
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it's all up to how brave you are to push your lama and how good the weather is.

if you are lucky to fly on a calm day with your slightly modified lama, usually with an extended shaft, and shorten flybar, and longer servo arms, you can really push it quite fast (in a straight line) if you are brave with your stick. you'd probably lose balance at some point and crash. so it's all depending on how brave you are.

more power will definitely help. So what Barak is saying is that instead of spending $$ on that booster thing (which would only allow you to use 3S on brushed motors), you could be better off get a brushless setup for a better power to weigh ratio.
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Old Apr 08, 2009, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHawk19
I've seen the Speed Kit on YouTube. I've even done some reading here in this forum.

I can see what the guy did, kind of, but how can I make my own or obtain the pieces needed?
.....
I already have an extended inner shaft so where do I get a Coax Booster? Do I have this right, a Coax Booster allows me to use an 11.1 Battery instead of the 7.4v? This is all that's needed to gain that much speed?

The heli's (Lama's) in the YouTube video are quick as . Seriously.

Here is the translated webpage:
http://translate.google.com/translat...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Barak1001 also mentions going brushless with a HH Gyro for additional $20. Would my Lama be as fast as shown in the videos with this upgrade (Brushless & HH Gyro)?
Brace yourself JHawk,

this is going to be a loooong one.
First thing first: if you really interested in the KoAx booster, I can tell you exactly where to get it, and who and what to write to (as I am in email contact with the guy who sells them). But I can also tell you something else, which is that - considering the current $ to Euro exchange rate - it will set you back about 70$ until you will hold it in your hands about 2-3 weeks after ordering.
(While I'm trying to collect my thoughts about what of all the many things I'd like to write now (after I pondered quite a while if I should really do this post) let me also tell you, that if I remember correct the guy from the video/webshop got kicked out of the german forum, because it is not allowed there to promote your own shop and he kept on doing it)

Now, you say you already use an extended inner shaft - but do you also use the Xtreme 180SE motors already?
Because they are basically mandatory to be able to really get the full potential of increase in power out of using a coaxbooster with 3S.
If you DON'T USE the Xtreme motors yet, this will set you back another 26$ + S&H in addition to the booster.

And there Barak and dendog have definitely a point - for this price you can already go brushless - but price alone is not the question, there are more things to ponder ....

I do not use a KoAxbooster myself but several friends of mine do - and they all will admit that one big disadvantage of the Xtreme motors is, that you will need silver brushes to reach the full 3S potential and those will be worn out after about 15-20 flights depending on how aggressive you fly ... which will set you back a good 3$ every 20 flights, let alone the PITA it will be to unsolder the old and resolder the new brushes....
Despite all this, in the end it will be a question of conviction - many people in germany do it instead of going brushless, even with all the disadvantages connected to it, because going brushless is impossible for someone who does not know how to solder (and there I do speak from experience otherwise my BL project would be long flying) and also because all this "new" stuff can be pretty intimidating. But this is a whole other story, similar to the question of "do I or don't I use a converter to go brushless - which a lot of people in germany did during the last few weeks successfully) (( oh, and in austria too))

so for brushless there are so many things to think about - for example people in germany use about 4 different types of motors apart from Don's C10's (it is possible to read a lot about this in the german forum) Further there are many more mixers than just GWS, Turnigy and Blue Arrow ... from reading I would say the larger part of the German BL flyers (a lot of them inspired by this forum here) also use the 10A ESC's instead of 5 or 6A ones. Oh - and then of course there are several people in the mean time who fly with 3 different converter solutions - the one from the AEO set, one which is called Quax converter and is similar to the ones "thesteve" introduced for the 4#3 and one which they order from NC over ebay to be shipped to germany.

As far as the speed kit is concerned, the guy also uses carbonfiber reinforced ultrahard blades which you can buy in germany (and which I will be hopefully be able to import to the US sometime in the future) (the next step will be that they will introduce this type of blades for the 53#1 and Esky Big Lama ....
The drivetrain or however the mechanics are called, is most likely some of the delrin stuff like they sell it at rivesud and I'm sure he also uses reinforcements for the stock blade grips (can also be purchased in Germany)

Anyhow, as much as the people in germany were inspired by EQMOD and dendog for copying the double swash plate mods, I have to say from being really active in the german forum (much more than here) I think the "innovational CG" shifted quite a bit from the forum here to the forum in germany ... a year ago the guys here were way ahead of the curve in terms of going BL - in the mean time it looks to me like a lot more in that field happens in germany and austria right now....

My personal pet peeve at the moment is experiments with the blades to get more power out of a lama or blade - inspired by an experiment from another guy in the german forum I am trying out HM38 blades on my lama at the moment - in all different variations (long, short and more) different ones on upper and lower rotor and so on ....
Worst problem is, the thing is a lot more powerful but I have constant blade clashes - despite using the longer Xtreme shaft. So on Friday I will try the 20mm longer Helitek shaft and really hope that this will prove to be an antidote against blade strikes (up to now I wasn't that lucky)

So, like I said, this was a long one, now I'm curious what you guys have to say about all that

Regards,
Sven
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Old Apr 09, 2009, 08:07 AM
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Sven,

Thank you for the information. That was a lot to take in.

I did have Xtreme motors, but have switched to Aero-Nutz. I like them better. I am happy with how well my Lama flies now and I would rather not go through the process you described to get a KoaxBooster and Carbon Blades, etc...

I think I may just look into the BL Conversion.
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Old Apr 09, 2009, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHawk19
Sven,

Thank you for the information. That was a lot to take in.

I did have Xtreme motors, but have switched to Aero-Nutz. I like them better. I am happy with how well my Lama flies now and I would rather not go through the process you described to get a KoaxBooster and Carbon Blades, etc...

I think I may just look into the BL Conversion.
Fair enough JHawk,

as I could observe following this forum here, BL is the much more common way here in the US to soup up a heli anyway.

Sven
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Old Apr 09, 2009, 10:37 AM
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I have my CX2 down to the last screw. I am going to do a complete overhaul and go brushless with a lightweight 3S battery and do a lot of weight saving mods. I have real doubts about FFF even with higher power however. Extending the shaft enough to get away from BS's makes it very vulnerable to bending in the event of a hard hit or tipover. Shortening and lightening the flybar should help, but the heli gets real twitchy then. I plan on using folding blades like the Lama only metal grips. The only metal upgrade I refuse to use is the lower head, but I may be stuck using it with the new grips. I got fairly decent FF with my CX2 in stock form and very light wind, but not enough to get it back upwind if the wind speed increased during the flight, which it seems to do here a lot.
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Old Apr 09, 2009, 08:17 PM
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Hey J-hawk if you already have the aeronuts, why not just tune your V3 for quick flite, here is my CX2 with aeronuts, 7.4v 800mah 20c helipros boomtown boom and skids, 2.0 supershaft and folding blade conversion, I have made V4s and V3s this quick also.......
Helitek Tuner CX2 (3 min 38 sec)
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 06:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decuzar
Hey J-hawk if you already have the aeronuts, why not just tune your V3 for quick flite, here is my CX2 with aeronuts, 7.4v 800mah 20c helipros boomtown boom and skids, 2.0 supershaft and folding blade conversion, I have made V4s and V3s this quick also
Hey Decuzar,

Here is a video of my Lama V4 flying. I think I need to get the 2.0 supershaft. I have the Aero-Nutz and the 7.4v 900mAh Mystery battery. I don't have the pod & boom setup, cuz I like the scale look a bit better.

Lama V4 Flight (5 min 1 sec)
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decuzar
Hey J-hawk if you already have the aeronuts, why not just tune your V3 for quick flite, here is my CX2 with aeronuts, 7.4v 800mah 20c helipros boomtown boom and skids, 2.0 supershaft and folding blade conversion, I have made V4s and V3s this quick also.......
OK, what does "why not just tune your V3 for quick flite" mean? I've got the Aero-Nutz because they were recommended here and I don't see any great performance gains. The longer servo arms have helped with response, but there is no way my Lama 4 performs like my neighbor's stock CX2. I also have twitching in the tail that I didn't notice before the swap. I have Mystery batteries and indestructible skids, Xtreme boom, etc. I guess I'm missing something if it doesn't want to perform.
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 12:09 PM
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what are the aeronuts that you guys keep mentioning?? motors of some kind??
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erdnuckel2
Fair enough JHawk,

as I could observe following this forum here, BL is the much more common way here in the US to soup up a heli anyway.

Sven
so how do you go brushless on a cx2??.never have seen that before..
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHawk19
Hey Decuzar,

Here is a video of my Lama V4 flying. I think I need to get the 2.0 supershaft. I have the Aero-Nutz and the 7.4v 900mAh Mystery battery. I don't have the pod & boom setup, cuz I like the scale look a bit better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aO52AmMmPFU
Very Nice J-Hawk, I also like the scale look better than just the pod and boom, but if ya wanna really haul BUTT ya gotta loose the rear canopy (doesnt take much a breeze to upset it with the full scale body, looks like ya got the V4 dialed well ya must be using longer than stock servo arms, real nice real nice, have a great day.
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kodak_jack
OK, what does "why not just tune your V3 for quick flite" mean? I've got the Aero-Nutz because they were recommended here and I don't see any great performance gains. The longer servo arms have helped with response, but there is no way my Lama 4 performs like my neighbor's stock CX2. I also have twitching in the tail that I didn't notice before the swap. I have Mystery batteries and indestructible skids, Xtreme boom, etc. I guess I'm missing something if it doesn't want to perform.
Hey Jack, I dont know the full setup ya got on your V3 but maybe I can help ya,as far as your neighbors stock CX2 out performing your V3 I can figure that one out real quick, if he hasnt added any upgrades and its bone stock, Im sure it will pluck your V3 from the sky. I dont know where people have ever thought that the xtreme skids and extreme carbon fiber booms were upgrades, they only look good and totally destoy the performance of the V3, I have built at least a dozen V3s with diffrent upgrades and the worst ones have always been the ones with xtreme carbon fiber booms and carbon fiber skids (serious pork) the best ones i have built were using robbins skids and the flexible extreme plastic booms that look like stock (lite weight) this last combo is lightening quick and will destroy a stock CX2. Another thing that could be hurting your performance could be your electronics, many times I have upgraded motors on the Esky 2.4 4in1s and gain very little power, I have been told that the esky 4in1 will limit amp draw of a more powerful motor, (dont know about the specs) but first hand I have noticed it happening. Most of the V3 and V4s I do for my customers I talk them into swapping in an E-flite 4in1 or 3in1 and ar6100 for a lot better performing heli, as far as your tail twitch when ya went with the aeronuts have you adjusted your gain? many times when you upgrade your motors you need to make adjustments to your 4in1, hope this helped, have a great day.
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Old Apr 10, 2009, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newbie39
what are the aeronuts that you guys keep mentioning?? motors of some kind??
Hey Newbie Aeronuts are upgraded motors 180 sized for the esky or Blade series coax they have huge air slots in them for cooling and they use ball bearings rather than brass bushings they run real smooth and are pretty quiet, the yellow CX2 Im flying in the video uses Aeronuts and properly setup it has enough power to push the CX2 beyond 20mph. Have a great day.....
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Old Apr 11, 2009, 12:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by decuzar
Hey J-hawk if you already have the aeronuts, why not just tune your V3 for quick flite, here is my CX2 with aeronuts, 7.4v 800mah 20c helipros boomtown boom and skids, 2.0 supershaft and folding blade conversion, I have made V4s and V3s this quick also.......http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-I0S4bZtNo
That was the best ending to a heli vid I have ever seen!
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