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Old Nov 05, 2013, 05:32 PM
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electrich's Avatar
United States, GA, Atlanta
Joined Feb 2011
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Why do people care so much about a manual? I bought mine used off a friend. He said it balances approximately at the wing rod. Put a 3s 2200 in it and go nuts. That's all I needed to get it airborne. And it flies awesome. If someone/a company wants to copy a plane, I'm sure they would buy one, strip it down and reverse engineer it. How many times do you actually follow the instructions to the letter when you build a ARF? The hard work is done at the factory.
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Old Nov 05, 2013, 07:16 PM
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United States, AZ, Mesa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by electrich View Post
Why do people care so much about a manual? I bought mine used off a friend. He said it balances approximately at the wing rod. Put a 3s 2200 in it and go nuts. That's all I needed to get it airborne. And it flies awesome. If someone/a company wants to copy a plane, I'm sure they would buy one, strip it down and reverse engineer it. How many times do you actually follow the instructions to the letter when you build a ARF? The hard work is done at the factory.
I take it you've never built an Addiction-X then? There's a little thought that goes into it. The manual is really very good, and I strongly recommend reading it before assembling any PA kits. A digital copy online would be valuable for numerous reasons - GOOGLE for one, convenience for builders is another, and of course it's valuable for prospective buyers too. I have both avoided and bought kits partly based on the manual many times. The more expensive an airplane is, the more likely I am to look at the online manual before buying.

PA is in direct competition with several other companies, we all know who they are. Without exception, those companies post their manuals online. It's just something you have to do. As I have stated before, I believe the product itself is better than the competition, so why would you want to leave hole in your service, anywhere?
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Old Nov 05, 2013, 08:40 PM
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USA, GA, Atlanta
Joined Nov 2008
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I just find it bothersome that hundreds of persons request it in each and every thread, over and over and over and over and over again-

PA's reason for not posting the manual just does not hold any water. It is foolish to feel someone can reverse engineer with only a manual.
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Old Nov 05, 2013, 10:32 PM
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electrich's Avatar
United States, GA, Atlanta
Joined Feb 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
I take it you've never built an Addiction-X then? There's a little thought that goes into it. The manual is really very good, and I strongly recommend reading it before assembling any PA kits. A digital copy online would be valuable for numerous reasons - GOOGLE for one, convenience for builders is another, and of course it's valuable for prospective buyers too. I have both avoided and bought kits partly based on the manual many times. The more expensive an airplane is, the more likely I am to look at the online manual before buying.

PA is in direct competition with several other companies, we all know who they are. Without exception, those companies post their manuals online. It's just something you have to do. As I have stated before, I believe the product itself is better than the competition, so why would you want to leave hole in your service, anywhere?
Thankfully I did not have to build it, as it was bind and fly. I also scored an AMR ultimate that was rtf in the same deal lucky me. I guess my point is not so much about the lack of an online manual, but more about the fact that with forums like this the shared information of the masses sometimes leads to a broader array of experiments and results as to how the plane sets up best.
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Old Nov 05, 2013, 11:17 PM
I'm torquing to you!
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Wattle Grove NSW Australia
Joined Nov 2006
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Originally Posted by electrich View Post
Thankfully I did not have to build it, as it was bind and fly. I also scored an AMR ultimate that was rtf in the same deal lucky me. I guess my point is not so much about the lack of an online manual, but more about the fact that with forums like this the shared information of the masses sometimes leads to a broader array of experiments and results as to how the plane sets up best.
Well you got 2 top planes there! Addy X for low, slow, silly 3d. And the AMR a crazy tumbling bipe that will slow down and 3d like a demon too!
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 10:46 AM
Pro Bro #1963
Joined Mar 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsbauman View Post
I just find it bothersome that hundreds of persons request it in each and every thread, over and over and over and over and over again-

PA's reason for not posting the manual just does not hold any water. It is foolish to feel someone can reverse engineer with only a manual.
I'll have to agree 100%......just doesn't make a bit of sense! What are they afraid of??????????
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
I take it you've never built an Addiction-X then? There's a little thought that goes into it. The manual is really very good, and I strongly recommend reading it before assembling any PA kits. A digital copy online would be valuable for numerous reasons - GOOGLE for one, convenience for builders is another, and of course it's valuable for prospective buyers too. I have both avoided and bought kits partly based on the manual many times. The more expensive an airplane is, the more likely I am to look at the online manual before buying.

PA is in direct competition with several other companies, we all know who they are. Without exception, those companies post their manuals online. It's just something you have to do. As I have stated before, I believe the product itself is better than the competition, so why would you want to leave hole in your service, anywhere?
this is exactly how I feel.

If I'm going to spend almost $600 on a plane, from a company I have never bought anything from before, I want to take a look at the manual first. Plain and simple.
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 03:18 PM
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South Africa, GP, Randburg
Joined Dec 2006
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Just for my own interest, what are you guys hoping to find in a manual that will help you decide that you can't find in this thread? There is more info, tips, images, videos and user experiences just here on RCG than a manual can ever hope to deliver, not to mention the Malaysian and German RC forums.
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 03:48 PM
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United States, AZ, Mesa
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Originally Posted by demonGti View Post
Just for my own interest, what are you guys hoping to find in a manual that will help you decide that you can't find in this thread? There is more info, tips, images, videos and user experiences just here on RCG than a manual can ever hope to deliver, not to mention the Malaysian and German RC forums.
Sorry, but digging through forums looking for tidbits of information in among all the static is a total waste of time when you can pull up a manual and look at that instead. In addition to the sheer time-waste of digging through forums, they are OFTEN wrong, whereas the manual is always right. Why should I have to sift through a bunch of opinions, many of which will be wrong, when I could just go to the documentation of record and see the truth?

I get this a lot: "Why do you buy PA crap, when they don't even do X?" - mostly that X used to be "can't get any service" but it's always going to be "whatever the competition is doing that PA isn't doing" and if you want to compete in the modern world, you just can't leave any holes like that. You have to do everything the competition is doing, and more - anything they do, you have to do. That is just the nature of competition. Arguments about the value of the manual and copyright issues don't really matter - everybody else puts their manuals online so you have to also. That's really the only thing that matters - PA is not doing something everyone else is doing, and that makes them come up behind in a comparison.
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 03:48 PM
I'm torquing to you!
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Wattle Grove NSW Australia
Joined Nov 2006
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And flying videos.
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 04:05 PM
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United States, AZ, Mesa
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Originally Posted by Mr Kamikaze View Post
And flying videos.
PA has some of the best flying videos out there, even the ones from regular folks are pretty good. I'm not a big fan of the videos which are a collection of 3-second clips "edited" together - I like to see flying, and would rather see a hat-cam video with natural sound.

Still, I'm going to keep going with my point that it's all about how you compare to the competition...

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...ion+aerobatics (13,900 results - mostly NOT about PA planes, but the first page of results is mostly what I wanted)

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...20hobby%20shop (67,000 results - almost all about 3DHS planes)

This is probably more a direct result of market share than anything else.

If you're wondering why I care so much, it's selfish of course. I want to see PA stick around, and I want them to be competitive and be able to bring prices down. Without market share, they just won't be able to do that, and I will continue to have to pay the higher prices and deal with the lower availability. If the brand was more popular it would be good for us.
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Old Nov 06, 2013, 04:15 PM
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USA, GA, Atlanta
Joined Nov 2008
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I feel differently in that I don't feel PA has to just because other do.

Rather, I feel they should because:

a) it has been requested by their customers hundreds of times over, in each and every PA thread.

b) PA's reasoning for not uploading manuals is unfounded and not realistic.

c) there is really no cost to PA to upload manuals online. All they need is a scanner.

d) it would satisfy a lot of persons' needs. Whether it is a potential customer looking at the construction, or a second hand owner that has inquiries, they all could benefit from having access to a manual.
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Old Nov 13, 2013, 07:03 PM
This is BAT country!
Gonzo 1971's Avatar
United States, MI, Ovid
Joined Nov 2003
585 Posts
Please pa fix your website. Enable right clicking so I can browse in multiple windows. Shop and compare. I dont think people stealing images should be an issue. I find that very irritating. Minor but irritating.
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Old Nov 13, 2013, 07:43 PM
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Not only that, in developer circles it's considered really bad design. And, smart users know how to ignore the minor annoyance and do what they want anyway, so it's kind of pointless too.

(simple workaround)
http://geekswithblogs.net/Davak/arch.../16/47179.aspx

(why it's stupid)
http://andyfryer.blogspot.com/2010/1...ght-click.html

http://forums.port80.asn.au/showthread.php?t=12451 (lol - "if you don't want something on the internet, don't put it on the internet")

http://security.stackexchange.com/qu...ct-on-security - ("it has generally fallen out of favor due to being a combination of ineffective and annoying")
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Old Nov 13, 2013, 08:03 PM
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LOL that is frustrating... with my mac, swiping those images is not even a hassle.
I just need to press Command+Shift+4, then crop the picture and it automatically saves it to my desktop.
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