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Old May 25, 2010, 12:06 AM
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Help!
Dont know where to start for an acrobatic plane.

I have not flown for a few years and want to fly again, everything I flew before was multiplex (all brushless); Easy star, TwinstarII, TwinJet, FunJet, Gemini, Minimag, Magister, Twister.
But I want to try and fly a pattern plane, now I saw small ones using the same battery sizes as my old planes (3s 2000mah) and they seem way too small and jittery, and I have no where to start on many things.

What is a good size for a pattern plane? (can you also add the power system and battery needed to power a plane of said size)
How do the Spektrum 7-channel DX7 fair with these kind of planes?
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Old May 25, 2010, 12:49 AM
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GWS Formosa is a classic pattern plane. The small (classic) Formosa has a 35" wingspan, and runs about 15 oz flying weight, typically using a 3S/1000 or thereabouts. The larger Formosa II has a 42.5" wingspan; typical flying weight around 2 lbs, with a 3S/2500 or so.

The larger 'Mosa is a a bit of a 3D/pattern hybrid, with oversized control surfaces.

You might also want to look at the Groovy from airborne-models.com. It's a nice balsa pattern plane. 42" wingspan and very floaty. Somewhat more sedate than either of the Formosas.

Going up a notch in size and price is the Aspera from 3D Hobby Shop... 46" wingspan and just under 3 lbs. flying weight.

TexasRCplanes.com is having a sale at the moment on an interesting pattern plane they call the Tojeiro.
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Old May 25, 2010, 01:04 AM
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And the size of those planes will fly fine in low-medium winds?
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Old May 25, 2010, 08:15 AM
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Most competition pattern planes are pretty large. My own pattern plane is what the pros would call "practice size." with a 46" wingspan. It is as stable as a train on a rail and will do anything a large pattern plane will do with less mass, of course. It is called the Aspera and you can buy one from 3D Hobby Shop. Here's a shot of mine:



Another respected one is the Helios from Hyperion. it is available in a size smaller than my Aspera and a size larger. It is also an excellent pattern plane for us amateurs. I don't own one so I don't have an image. You can fly F3A or IMAC patterns with many, many planes. These are simply designed for the purpose.

Good luck with the quest.
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Old May 25, 2010, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicBanana View Post
And the size of those planes will fly fine in low-medium winds?
The two Formosas are excellent windy-day fliers.
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Old May 26, 2010, 06:57 AM
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Pattern planes in general are good windy fliers. They are designed for stability.
Any of them would be great.
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Old May 26, 2010, 09:28 AM
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I have been definitely looking at the aspera, seems like a great place to start.
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Old May 26, 2010, 02:35 PM
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There are so many pattern planes in the 1-meter class - they all fly good on your basic 3S 2200/Park 480 setup. The Aspera is a little bigger and I think I would run it on a 4S setup, but there may be a high-amp 3S way to power it. The Formosa is another option if you don't mind foam. My little Formosa flies really great in wind - the pattern design with the long tail really improves the tracking in all conditions. However, when you get into precision flying, you will realize that really it's the pilot which makes a plane fly in the wind... it has very little to do with the airframe as long as the basics are there.
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Old May 26, 2010, 06:16 PM
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The Aspera is only 3 lbs. A 3S setup is just fine. Mine is running a 500 watt motor, 45 amp ESC and 11X8 prop on a 3S 2650 battery. It reads about 380 watts at full throttle static. That's more than enough to do all the maneuvers with ease. I could go up one motor and ESC size and go to 12X8 on the prop and still run fine on 3S.
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Old May 26, 2010, 06:54 PM
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Yeah but I think it's better and more efficient to go with higher voltage in those situations. Either way will work, but 45 amps on 3S, and only 34 on 4S - it's a more than 20% drop in amperage. Some older batteries wouldn't handle the high current so well, while with a 4S setup you could use old, crappy Hobby-king batteries and it would all be fine. And one thing is true about pattern planes - you don't need as much power as you would with a 3D setup. I have a very modest setup on the Formosa, and similar with the Brio - it can go vertical for a while but will stall out eventually.

The Brio is one I would like to see return. I'm still super-bummed about mine, I flew it for 3 years before the elevator broke - always flew good, not a 3D plane, but a very nice precision plane.

Brio 10 Pattern Practice (6 min 54 sec)
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Old May 27, 2010, 10:12 AM
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Im looking at the scorpion motor seeing this for example:

Scorpion SII-3020-780 Data Sheet
APC 11x7E 30.55Amps 427.7Watts 61.5mph 2011gr Thrust 70.94oz
If the plane is 3lb or 1365gr wouldn't this motor of only 430watts be sufficient? or how much must the thrust ratio be for a good setup?

Link to the next step up Scorpion SII-3020-890 Data Sheet
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Old May 27, 2010, 11:17 AM
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TB: not from direct experience but I'll wager either of those Scorpions would do the trick, unless the plane ends up inordinately heavy for some reason.

I'm not sure where the Aspera's stall speed is at, but you might want to check the pitch speed carefully. Ideally you want a hefty ratio between top speed and stall speed. Eg. if it stalls at 20, top speed should be 60 or more.
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Old May 27, 2010, 11:36 AM
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Ok, what about the thrust what should be a good ratio for acrobatic pattern flying?
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Old May 27, 2010, 12:37 PM
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1:1 is plenty for IMAC aerobatics. This isn't a 3D plane. If it helps, the Scorpion 3014 bolts right in with no modifications at all. Put a 45 or 50 amp ESC and 11X8 prop and you will have all the power you need. Same with the 3020. Just a little heavier. You could go up to a 55 or 50 amp ESC a larger prop with the 3020 and do 3d maneuvers. The plane has plenty of rudder for 3d but the ailerons are a bit small for that purpose.
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Old May 27, 2010, 05:10 PM
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Good to know
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