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Old Jan 21, 2011, 01:14 PM
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Davison, MI
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Thanks Keith,

Opps.... I didn't catch that...

Searched under Micro SD and that popped up. I'm a moron....

Off to search for a micro card. lol

Joe

I gave up and just ordered 4 cards from the place Tom recommended.

http://www.datamemorysystems.com/_me..._DM55_0977.asp

Thanks Tom, I got 4 cards for just over the cost of one at Rat Shack.

Just have to wait a couple more days.

Joe
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:18 PM
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Poland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post

I'd be interested in seeing other's results, and whether the 10000 kbps bit rate and auto-stop on low battery power go hand in hand.se two recording features characteristics
Camera in the mode 10000kbps.
Record, Stop, and then continue recording until the end. Recorded in
5 minutes 5 seconds
20 minutes
17 minutes 18 seconds
I noticed that the times recorded for 10000kbps and 7000kbps are very similar. The difference is the length of the file.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:19 PM
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United States, MA, Walpole
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jantares View Post
For me changing the mode of 10000kbps at 7000kbps is when:
Click the "ON-OFF" button, pause 1-2 seconds, click the "ON-OFF" button, pause one second, click "ON-OFF" button.
Click the button "Shutter" and the camera is recording, click the button again and record STOP.
I tried your procedure again, this time first trying it by taking a couple of still photos before toggling back to video mode, and a second time just by toggling back and forth without taking any videos. Same results... my camera shoots about 7050 kbps on average no matter what button dance I do. But as I mentioned before, I don't see the lower bit rate as a disadvantage for these cheap cameras... I'd rather have the smaller file size.

Since the still pictures are up-converted images, approximating a 2X size increase from the CMOS sensor size, I wonder if one of the prior versions of the firmware toggles to the higher bit rate to try and improve the quality of the up-converted still images a bit? If that was the intent, I wonder if it works?

jantares, did you do the firmware swap to eradicate the date/time stamp on your pictures. If so, we should have the same firmware, unless the date stamp patch does not over-write all of it.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jantares View Post
Camera in the mode 10000kbps.
Record, Stop, and then continue recording until the end. Recorded in
5 minutes 5 seconds
20 minutes
17 minutes 18 seconds
I noticed that the times recorded for 10000kbps and 7000kbps are very similar. The difference is the length of the file.
Thanks. Yes, I'd expect the times should be very close to the same assuming you get 30 fps in both modes and start with a freshly charged battery. Just more data with the higher rate that needs to be encoded/decoded each frame, which doesn't change the frame rate or length of recording. But in addition to making the files bigger, it will cause the encoder chip in the camera to work harder while recording, which might eat up a tiny bit more power. Maybe not enough to be noticeable, though.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:28 PM
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I just tried jantares' method to switch from 10 to 7Mbps, and it works! My camera defaults to 10Mbps when I turn it on, it always has until now. Using his method I can get it to record at 7Mbps. I cannot see ANY difference in the video at all though. I even tried pointing it to the window then back to make it "step" the exposure and color balance, thinking maybe the processor would be free to work a little faster there if it was writing data slower, but no go. They look identical at both bitrates. It is still interesting though, that you can get it to change that way. I'd love to know why and what other effects it might have.

I also tried letting it record until the battery ran out. This was before I knew how to change it to 7Mbps, so it was recording normally at 10. It made two clips, 1.6GB each, 20 minutes long. There was no 3rd shorter clip, so I'm assuming it didn't save that file. I did not scan for a corrupt file though.

Back to bitrate... The only real advantage I can see is if you had a smaller card, or a slower one. The battery dies before it fills a 4GB card, so I'm good there. Both of my cards can keep up with it so that's good too. If you had a 2GB card though, using 7Mbps might get a few more minutes of time on it, or a card that's not quite fast enough at 10Mbps, might be able to keep up at 7. Worth a shot anyway!
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithLuneau View Post
I just tried jantares' method to switch from 10 to 7Mbps, and it works! My camera defaults to 10Mbps when I turn it on, it always has until now. Using his method I can get it to record at 7Mbps. I cannot see ANY difference in the video at all though. I even tried pointing it to the window then back to make it "step" the exposure and color balance, thinking maybe the processor would be free to work a little faster there if it was writing data slower, but no go. They look identical at both bitrates. It is still interesting though, that you can get it to change that way. I'd love to know why and what other effects it might have.

I also tried letting it record until the battery ran out. This was before I knew how to change it to 7Mbps, so it was recording normally at 10. It made two clips, 1.6GB each, 20 minutes long. There was no 3rd shorter clip, so I'm assuming it didn't save that file. I did not scan for a corrupt file though.

Back to bitrate... The only real advantage I can see is if you had a smaller card, or a slower one. The battery dies before it fills a 4GB card, so I'm good there. Both of my cards can keep up with it so that's good too. If you had a 2GB card though, using 7Mbps might get a few more minutes of time on it, or a card that's not quite fast enough at 10Mbps, might be able to keep up at 7. Worth a shot anyway!
Thanks for the tests. Since my camera defaults to 7000 kbps and does not toggle up to 10000 kbps, it now seems that might be the difference... those that default to 10000 kbps might be the only ones that can be toggle back and forth?

Your eye also response as mine would... no visual difference in the two bit rates when viewing on your PC monitor. MAYBE a slight difference could be seen if the video were played back on a large, high quality digital flat screen display, but for PC or web use, the smaller data rate looks the same but can make a big difference when you start to accumulate and save them, or copy them onto DVDs for storage! That's about 30 MB less space required per minute of video when recorded at 7000 kbps!
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post

jantares, did you do the firmware swap to eradicate the date/time stamp on your pictures. If so, we should have the same firmware, unless the date stamp patch does not over-write all of it.
I did not change, nor firmware removed the date and time. My 808HD is one of the first purchased from the Internet-shop365.
I ordered a second camera, and it will delete the date and time.
The forum is someone who has the 808HD at 10000 kbps mode and removed the timestamp.
I wonder if he can pass 7000kbps mode the same way as my 808HD.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithLuneau View Post
I just tried jantares' method to switch from 10 to 7Mbps, and it works! My camera defaults to 10Mbps when I turn it on, it always has until now. Using his method I can get it to record at 7Mbps.
...
Keith, did you do the firmware patch to erase the date stamp on yours?
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 03:27 PM
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Yes, I've removed the time/date using the files at the start of the thread.

For what it's worth, I'm viewing the videos on a 28" HANNS-G LCD monitor at 1920x1200 resolution, so I'm able to see them in all their glory, and can't see a difference just watching the video files. I would try to compare a frame from each bitrate, but it would be hard to do, given the grain in the video that changes from frame to frame already. You would probably have to do some serious analyzing of various subjects to find any notable difference in the two.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 04:09 PM
jhi
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Norway
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Bitrate and bricking

Quote:
Originally Posted by jantares View Post
I did not change, nor firmware removed the date and time. My 808HD is one of the first purchased from the Internet-shop365.
I ordered a second camera, and it will delete the date and time.
The forum is someone who has the 808HD at 10000 kbps mode and removed the timestamp.
I wonder if he can pass 7000kbps mode the same way as my 808HD.
I don't know if this is of any interest, but I can also switch from 10Mbps (default) to 7Mbps by following Jantares' procedure.

What makes this a little special is that my camera comes from the first batch, I guess, as I ordered it early desember. I thought I had bricked it trying to remove the time stamp, but managed to make it work again by copying the "time stamp ON" firmware file back to the micro SD card. It looks like the firmware gets loaded into memory from the card - it takes ab. 11-12 seconds to start the camera now - still much better than a bricked camera . Fimware file with/without timestamp doesn't make any difference now regarding bit rate, and the time stamp disappear/appear as expected. My conclusion is that the bitrate behaviour is not affected by the time stamp firmware we have been discussing, but rather from some other code or hardware.

PS
I know many have had no success trying to unbrick their camera. I don't remember now exactly how I managed to revive it, but I THINK I had the camera connected to the computer with the red LED lit (charging) and then with the "time stamp ON" firmware on the card, pressed the ON button once. After 11-12 seconds the yellow LED lit and the camera was working again. I have tried several times to make the camera work WITHOUT the file without any success. Hope this helps..

/Jan
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 04:50 PM
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what is the best wide lens for HD#11? AND FOR #3? THANK U
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 05:41 PM
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I know it's been discussed to some degree already, but how in the heck to you mount these to get rid of vibration? I finally got to fly mine on a plane this evening, a Dynam Skybus twin. I took the time to balance both props as best I could, and mounted the camera on top of the rudder looking forward. It's a great view, and the video quality is just great! Real impressed with it now that I've actually got it in the air. Focus is great too.

BUT... There's way too much "jello"! For mounting, I had a little flat balsa shelf on top of the rudder which is quite solid. I had velcro on that and on the camera. I got it positioned where I wanted it, then hooked a rubber band tight over the camera and down the sides of the rudder holding the camera firm. Still bad vibration though.

I have tried "soft" mounting the #8 and #3, and had the same problem with both of them unless I used a LOT of foam padding around the cameras so they were just lightly sitting in a nest of foam...

Any good pictures of how you're mounting your cameras and not getting wavy video?
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeithLuneau View Post
I know it's been discussed to some degree already, but how in the heck to you mount these to get rid of vibration?
...
You've taken the first critical step... balancing the props. I think you'll find that what works on one plane doesn't on a different one, simply because of the different vibration frequency and amplitude, and different airframe ridity and vibration harmonics.

I'd go for a different mounting location for starters. The rudder may feel solid, but when in the air, it likely flexes and vibrates a lot more than you think. It only takes a minute bit of oscillation to cause the picture to move in the video frame as the camera scans it.

Try a more solid location, like the fuselage, I usually wrap mine in a piece of EPP foam sheet and tape that rigidly to the fuselage. Or I wedge it (again wrapped in EPP sheet foam) in a slot on some of my EPS foam planes. Then it's a matter of finding the right motor rpm that gives the best video, and you can zero in to those throttle locations by lightly restraining your plane on the ground (or hand held at the CG if no LG) with the camera shooting video.
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arnaldo26 View Post
what is the best wide lens for HD#11? AND FOR #3? THANK U
Just a few dozen posts back:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=934
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
Maybe you missed this recent post of mine? I've found you can use any plain, generic, USB charger that works from your mains plug if you just start the camera recording first with the camera disconnected, THEN connect the mains supply. It will continue to charge and record until your flash card is full after that!
Thanks a lot Tom - yes I did miss it. It would be nice if there was a mode or firmware mod that allowed the oldest file to be over written if the card is full. This would be really useful for driving as well.
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