You could still use the Wye termination method if you really want to.
You would likely have to use fewer winds of thicker wire to get the same results...

Sorry guys. I must have clicked the wrong thread. For some reason I thought this was an Assassin thread. Apparently it's the DIY thread for motor winding. My mistake.

Just to stay on topic THE ASSASSIN ROCKS!

The motor winding aspects of this thread is awesome but I'm wondering if some people may be getting lost in it.

Here is a setup that is proven to be reliable and rocks.

Little red motor (FC2812)
9 winds of 24ga Microdan wire (good results reported with both the newbie and the hi-temp version).
DLRK wind as demonstrated here:

Motor Winding Tutorial (HobbyKing CF2812) (10 min 56 sec)

Skip the radio shack wire and go with the Microdan wire.
If you are a hard head like me and want to try the radio shack wire you might want to stick with 11 winds.

Originally Posted by jetpackninja

if you wind according to the video and pick any adjacent two wires one will be the Start of a phase, one will be the End of a phase.

Good info, but...

What I'm saying is that I pick random adjacent wires, and mine have worked, even though my phase "starts" are all three together, and my phase "ends" are all three together. The video skipped straight from the end of the first phase to all three phases having been completed, so I've never known to alternate the direction of winds for each phase. ...and yet... they work! I dunno, crazy. *emoticon for shrugging shoulders*

Originally Posted by jetpackninja

Little red motor (FC2812)
9 winds of 24ga Microdan wire (good results reported with both the newbie and the hi-temp version).
DLRK wind as demonstrated here: http://vimeo.com/18554942

Great summary. OK, I'll shut up about the winding for a while

Here we go, a thread-relevant question: My Widowmaker seems to be flying just fine, but as I hold it on the ground, it seems to be... flimsy, I guess is the word. Glides great, and controls really well even in fast flight, so I don't know if I really need to change anything, but a little pressure in my hands seems to make it start to fold. Should I be worried?

Will, as long as it's flying great don't worry.
The main thing to check is the carbon spar. You wanna make sure that it isn't broken and is glued in securely.
I broke mine at least three times.
The Widowmaker has a tendency to make me fly beyond my reaction times.
I hit those stupid irrigation pipes so many times with that thing...
The Widowmaker is never going to feel as solid as the Assassin but then again it wasn't designed to be...

Originally Posted by denial15

Sorry guys. I must have clicked the wrong thread. For some reason I thought this was an Assassin thread. Apparently it's the DIY thread for motor winding. My mistake.

lol. I've been thinking the same thing the last few days! However, I have learned a lot over the last 100 posts.

On the Assassin, why are the servos placed so close to center, with the control horns at the inner most point of the elevons? Isn't a lot of control authority lost with this setup? Would placing the servos farther out, so that the control horns are in the center of the elevons, produce better leverage and control authority?

Originally Posted by MikeD096

On the Assassin, why are the servos placed so close to center, with the control horns at the inner most point of the elevons? Isn't a lot of control authority lost with this setup? Would placing the servos farther out, so that the control horns are in the center of the elevons, produce better leverage and control authority?

Sure, if you can get it to balance right, and have long enough leads for the servos. I always try to get mine out as much as I can. I also try to put them at an angle so that the push rod is perpendicular to the elevon, rather than to the cross-spar. I know lots of people point them straight back, and it works fine. I've just had better luck avoiding binding, servo chatter, and bowing push rods when they're perpendicular to the elevon.

But again, you have to maintain the proper CG, and on a small plane like the Assassin, servo placement can make a big difference.

Originally Posted by elCapitan

I'm not going to claim to be a winding expert either, but at 5:30 into this video (the one I used to learn the first time), he clearly says it doesn't matter which two adjacent wires you twist together to form the leads that go to the ESC. He even spins the motor on the table and picks randomly. I took that to heart, and have never worried about which to to pick either, and like I said, have never had any sort of a problem.

And W5BSA, when you say to solder E1, E2, and E3 together, I have no idea what you mean by that. The only soldering I do is soldering each twisted pair into the bullet connector.

Am I really this lucky that I'm misunderstanding that badly and have still successfully re-wound 4 motors? Or are we talking about a different termination? Or is the issue of figuring out a "correct" adjacent pair an urban myth? I can't say I plan to change what I'm doing, when it's working so well.

I've done 8 successful rewinds just grabbing two next to each other, not worrying about where I started or ended. (after I have the winds on of course). I just rewound one last night. I"ve got the wires twisted up. I'll test it with s1 connected to s2 and see if it really matters or not.

Originally Posted by elCapitan

Sure, if you can get it to balance right, and have long enough leads for the servos. I always try to get mine out as much as I can. I also try to put them at an angle so that the push rod is perpendicular to the elevon, rather than to the cross-spar. I know lots of people point them straight back, and it works fine. I've just had better luck avoiding binding, servo chatter, and bowing push rods when they're perpendicular to the elevon.

But again, you have to maintain the proper CG, and on a small plane like the Assassin, servo placement can make a big difference.

Ditto on what elCapitan said. I think the placement per the instructions is more of an ease of placement, CG, and protection sort of thing.

I usually move mine out and set the control rods and horns perp to the elevon, but I suffer a little when it comes to battery placement. I have to place mine further forward than the instructions indicate. So far, several are in the air that have been built "my" way, and have held up fine.

The others in our club that have built them per instructions are also doing fine...so it comes down to a personal preference.

I keep telling myself that I am going to build the next one per the instructions, but I just cannot get myself to do it.

You'll actually notice the updated instructions don't have a fixed placement for... well, anything, pretty much. Yes, the photos show a particular location, but the written instructions say to lay everything out on top, attain the proper CG, then mark where all of your electronics are before cutting/melting bays.

There are just too many different motors, ESCs, servos, and batteries out there to have a single measured location that will work for everyone. Every builder's electronics weigh a slightly different amount. By laying things out on top first, you can choose where everything goes, as long as it balances on the proper CG. It may be a little trickier (an extra person is helpful at that point), but it means a well-balanced plane in the end, with less chance of having to fill in a hole and cut a different one.

You'll actually notice the updated instructions don't have a fixed placement for... well, anything, pretty much. Yes, the photos show a particular location, but the written instructions say to lay everything out on top, attain the proper CG, then mark where all of your electronics are before cutting/melting bays.

Yep, no longer giving measurements and locations (from what I can see) for the servo/rx/esc slot, BUT the pics (as you mentioned) still show the servos in the same relative position...and the build videos (which a lot of people use) still show the position of the slots and placement of the electronics. That makes it easier for people on their first build I suppose.

I have yet to build a plane where I didn't do things different from what the instructions indicate. :-)

Originally Posted by jetpackninja

Nice explanation.

the FC2822 is the same motor as the FC2812 with the windings terminated differently to give the lower Kv rating.

Happy winding

I am using a FC2822 on a 3D plane and your statement peaked my interest - but I don't think that it is correct.

The stock FC2812 is reported to have a kv of 1534 (delta). If the FC2822 were simply terminated wye, it would have a kv of 1534/(square root of 3) = 886. Instead it's reported to have a kv of 1200.

The FC2822 also has normal looking leads (ie, 3 pairs) so am guessing that it's just more winds of smaller wire terminated delta?

Yeah- very possible.
I'll quickly state that I don't have any of the FC2822 motors- I was just repeating what I had seen on a different motor winding thread...

Thanks for catching it.