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Old May 07, 2010, 03:05 PM
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Thanks for the report!

Quote:
Originally Posted by f4addict View Post
The TV nozzles had so much play and moved in a weird spiral way at full throttle which caused the 2nd crash i did take them out after the crash.
What a drag. But I believe it. After I had built the tv nozzles, they looked so badly constructed that I did not build them in but used Freewing Su-34 nozzles instead. They work well, and on the Su-47, too.

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permanently and using metal gear servo's on the elevator.
Good choice. I used good servos, but not with MG.

Quote:
The intakes on the bottom of the plane are not at all needed, but is a good place to hand launch.
And to transport the beast.

Quote:
The wings still flex like crazy, but i guess after all these crashes, this is how it's going to be.
I think you need CF in the wings, otherwise they will always flex too much.

Cheers and happy flying,
Henrik
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Old May 07, 2010, 03:12 PM
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I do have around give or take 3 spars in the wings, but with all these crashes, i guess it's developed a personality.
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Old May 07, 2010, 08:10 PM
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One thing is for sure. After all the time and work I've put into this bird, next time I'm just going to get the RTF and modify it. Although it gave me many hours of fun during the winter no-fly season, I'm pretty spent building it.

Although the RTF is only available via Banana so I'm not sure if that's a good idea either.
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Old May 09, 2010, 10:26 AM
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Brazil, MG, Ipatinga
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i decided to order a kit from them after the horrible experience with them and sure enough another big big mistake. The kit was broken and the protection foam on the box was intact, which means it was broken before it was placed in the box. They are now officialy banned by me. Never never never again.
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Old May 15, 2010, 02:53 PM
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Freewing, Lanxiang, Starmax.... they all have the same "Quality" Check.

Every planes are different in quality, assembly, etc....
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Old May 15, 2010, 04:07 PM
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i am having a blast with this thing on a 6's 3300. decent 4 min flight. I am not that great of a 3d guy, but i am sure someone could hover it easily.
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Old May 18, 2010, 04:32 PM
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Germany, Ladbergen
Joined Dec 2006
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Hello guys,

im thinking about getting the airframe only and do some modifications, and id be glad about some feedback about my ideas:

when i read this thread, i get the impression there are the usual retract-problems. What do you think about using two skids from steel-wire for the main-gear, and only using a retractable front-gear (X-15 style), maybe replacing the front-gear with a solid one of metal. The wire-skids would be almost unvisible in flight, save weight and servos.

Another idea i have is to mount the canards fixed, using only normal elevator and aileron controls, and im thinking about not using the TV-system, at least at the beginning.

My intention is to get some of the complexity out of this bird, id only need 6 servos this way (2 aileron, 2 elevator, 1 for the retract front gear and 1 for steering the front gear).

Id appreciate any thoughts about this,

greetings from germany

Detlef
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Old May 18, 2010, 07:43 PM
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Greetings,
The retracts are not at all a problem, they work perfect, and are actually better then some plastic one's you will find. The problem is that we flew from high grass runway which is not an ideal place for it. Make sure you install 2 CF rods in the wings to prevent flexing. If you decide to take the gears out, make sure you shut the doors off and glue them, so will be more aerodynamic look. To my knowledge, all the flights went with the complex mixing that's going on, with elev-ali-canards. I personally have not come across anyone who has maidened it with the seperate ali'e and elev's. However i could be wrong. The idea of canards on a seperate channel,,,= good idea. The idea of canards fixed = not so good. cause you'll need them later on after a couple of flights for all the tricks like high alpha.
That is just my own thought, definately toss out the stock TV system, if you want TV use freewing system instead.

Duduca, we need to meet up for another day of formation flight.
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Old May 19, 2010, 12:52 PM
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Hello Detlef,

I think the retracts are not very good, but reasonable. You have to be careful to adjust them so that the servos run free, and making the front gear turn left and right properly is a twiddly issue ("mickey mouse", as somebody wrote before in this thread). But it is possible.

Don't fix the canards, at least I strongly recommend not to. You will need the capability to adjust the canards to get the airplane properly trimmed out. Look at the video from Pete from Banana Hobby and notice the position of the canards after landing. I had similar trim angles in my Su-47. How would you know in advance that that is the "right" angle?

The TV system as shipped by Lanxiang is indeed very flimsy. I built it, but didn't glue it to the airframe as it looked so weak. I chose the Freewing Su-34 nozzles which are very good IMHO. But I would use the TV nozzles for sure, even if you use only the stock Lanxiang nozzles. One reason is that it is not clear yet whether you want the airstream go exactly straight out of the airframe. For the Su-34, there seems to be a consensus that the stream should go slightly (about 2 degrees) "up". How would you adjust this later without the TV nozzles? I did some experiments with differing nozzle angles, but I can't give a good recommendation yet except that you can certainly overdo it if you trim the nozzles up too much :-).

If you dislike the complexity, I propose you buy the Su-34, it has fixed canards and all the control surfaces and TV nozzles work very well out of the box. For me, the complexity of the Su-47 is part of the fun.

Cheers,
Henrik
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Old May 19, 2010, 12:55 PM
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Hello F4Addict,

Quote:
Originally Posted by f4addict View Post
To my knowledge, all the flights went with the complex mixing that's going on, with elev-ali-canards. I personally have not come across anyone who has maidened it with the seperate ali'e and elev's. However i could be wrong.
I flew the Su-47 three times so far with the elevator and canards separated from the ailerons. It worked very well, at least the aircraft is very agile, tracks properly in the turns, and didn't have hickups. It is very, very fast though at my AUW of 2,68kg.

Cheers,
Henrik
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Old May 19, 2010, 01:34 PM
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Hi F4 and Henrik,

thanks for your replies and input, i really appreciate it. Its true, fixing the canards and leaving off the TVs would kill a lot of possibilities that are in this jet. Its kind of two hearts beating in me, one is tempted by the low number of servos when leaving off some features and making it less complex.

It sounds to me that you two had several good flights with the SU equipped "full house", so perhaps best compromise for me would be to start with only the main controls and add the rest later when i get a bit used to this jet. But in any case id keep the ailerons and the rest of the controls
separate.

Henrik, when i remember it right you are using Wemotec Minifans, the older type or the minifan pro? Im asking because i have two older Minifans laying around and would like to know if theres much improvement with the newer pro-version.

Retracts and grass-fields...the never ending story. Im only flying from grass thats not too long, but of course our field has some bumps and dents, so im still a bit concerned about the retracts, but i guess ill just try it. What i like about the retracts is that they move backwards when they come out.

Does anybody know the diameter of the wheels?

Greetings

Detlef
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Old May 21, 2010, 03:21 PM
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Hello Detlef,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Detlef View Post
so perhaps best compromise for me would be to start with only the main controls and add the rest later when i get a bit used to this jet.
I would not disable the TV nozzles. TV really helps. If you are afraid of overcontrolling, adjust the pushrods on the TV control horns so that they move less, or use expo or servo travel limiting on your radio.

Especially when the plane is slow, e.g. on a landing approach, having the TV nozzles gives you much better directional control than the control surfaces do with the slow airflow over them.

The TV nozzles are also pretty helpful IMHO when you want to rotate the plane during takeoff.

Quote:
when i remember it right you are using Wemotec Minifans, the older type or the minifan pro?
I used the minifan pro with a HET 2W25.

Cheers from Munich,
Henrik
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Old May 21, 2010, 04:01 PM
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Hi Henrik,
I respectfully disagree. I would say the su-47 nozzles have too much play and the dowels which move them tend to get stuck at high speeds, which turned out a reason for my 1st crash. I first thought of it to be a stuck servo, but after watching the tape a couple of times, i found out the tv nozzle was stuck. TV would definitely be excellent, only if you use the freewing nozzles, even rclander tv system or any good quality nozzles. The stock just have too much play in them too.

I just had a flight yesterday i have a video, will find some way of uploading it.
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Old May 21, 2010, 04:03 PM
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Mine pulls 1500 and change watts on 6's are these accurate numbers i am getting?
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Old May 21, 2010, 04:44 PM
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Hello F4Meister,
Quote:
Originally Posted by f4addict View Post
I respectfully disagree.
Well, you built it that way and have the flying experience with the bad nozzles, then I believe your advice in this case :-) and withdraw mine.

By the way, in this link posted by a Lanxiang representative in the Mig-29 thread, you can see very impressive photos of the new Mig-29 and the new nozzles that Lanxiang is using:
http://www.lxhm.us/en/products_show....&id=169&flag=0
The new ball nozzles look like Freewing nozzles, and the way the pushrods are connected, looks like the Freewing Su-34, too. Much better.

Cheers,
Henrik

PS: It seems that our beloved Su-47 is already old !
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