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Old Oct 19, 2012, 09:58 PM
TRB
United States, TX, Richardson
Joined Oct 2005
91 Posts
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Night vapor---RTF or BNF?

http://www.hobbytown.com/Shop/-Night-Vapor-RTF/

I'm thinking about buying one of these planes from LHS to have something to fly indoors. I have never had or flow a micro model before. I just got back into RC so the 2.4GHz thing is kind of new to me.

It's available in either RTF for $130 or BNF for $100.

I do NOT have a spektrum-compatible radio. My only radio is on old Futaba 4-channel crystal radio with no features besides servo reversing. It's basic, but it just won't die on me.

I can get the BNF model for $30 less. The question is, should I buy a BNF and put the $30 toward a Spektrum transmitter that is at least as featureful as my old Futaba? Would you care to recommend one?

On the other hand, I can buy the RTF and get a 'free' spektrum transmitter for basically $30. Can I bind that transmitter to any specktrum reciever and use it for other, 'real' planes, or is it just too crappy for that? Quantify 'crappy' please. Remember, my current transmitter is very basic.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 10:15 PM
Registered User
United States, IA, Sidney
Joined May 2012
179 Posts
If you are going to get into this I would suggest buy a good T/X first then get the BNF Vapor. I would pass on the RTF Vapor T/X and like you said, invest in a new T/X. This will allow you more options for planes.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 10:24 PM
TRB
United States, TX, Richardson
Joined Oct 2005
91 Posts
But does the crappy RTF transmitter work with other spektrum receivers? And does it have enough range for normal planes? Because I might be able to use it for my Slow Stick if so.

How much do I have to spend to get a good/decent TX? I have heard that there is no way to reprogram/rewire the Night Vapor to put the rudder on the left stick where it belongs, so the only way to get the rudder on the left stick is with a radio that allows mixing.
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 10:27 PM
Power Wheels Guru
UNGN's Avatar
Southlake, TX
Joined Jan 2008
7,327 Posts
If you buy the BNF, somebody on RCG will sell you an RTF TX for less than $20 shipped... not that would anyone would want one.

A DX6i and up TX is an "investment". if you buy a used one and take care of it, when you sell it, you'll lose less than the cost of an RTF TX... which ISN't an investment.

A DX6i used is about $100. A used DX7 is about $150. 5 years fron now, these prices will probably be only $25-35 less than this.

That is only $5 - $7 year depreciation.

You can get rudder on the right stick of a vapor swapping in an AR6400 in place of the Vapor brick Or buy a DX6i or up TX.

The RTF TX can be used with all DSM2 RX's but its only good for 300 ft and can be flaky closer than that. It also has crappy resolution and no model memory.
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Last edited by UNGN; Oct 19, 2012 at 10:32 PM.
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Old Oct 21, 2012, 06:50 AM
Wanton construction
Pouncer's Avatar
Stockholm Sweden
Joined Sep 2006
964 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daravon View Post
But does the crappy RTF transmitter work with other spektrum receivers? And does it have enough range for normal planes? Because I might be able to use it for my Slow Stick if so.
Yes it'll work with all Spektrum receivers.
It's fine for the Ultra Micros such as the Mustang, Trojan, Corsair, Champ or Vapor that can be flown at close range and don't necessarilty need programming.
Not good for the Sukhoi, Beast, 4 Site, Extra (you definitely need expo and dual rates for those) or the fast ones like the Stryker and MiG 15.

Range is an issue, I wouldn't use the RTF transmitter (DX4) on anything larger than an UM, ever.
I don't think the DX4 is crap, it is what it is, an inexpensive short range low resolution 4 channel transmitter. It has its uses.

I'd go with the RTF, there's a space for it in the transport box and when you decide to upgrade you keep it as a spare, or a loaner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNGN
A DX6i used is about $100. A used DX7 is about $150. 5 years fron now, these prices will probably be only $25-35 less than this.
A bold statement
Just speculating, but for all we know Spektrum might release an updated DX6i tomorrow, with DSMX and basic telemetry, 30 model memory, 4 mixes and a 3 position flap switch, with an optional Lipo pack, and this at a price point below the current RSP.
Particularly if they -still specualting- discontinue the DX5e and push the new DX6i as the entry level 4+ channels transmitter.
That would bring down the price of used DX6i's quite a bit I think.
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Old Oct 21, 2012, 08:32 AM
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I R Irv's Avatar
United States, IL, Washington
Joined Nov 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pouncer View Post
A bold statement
Just speculating, but for all we know Spektrum might release an updated DX6i tomorrow, with DSMX and basic telemetry, 30 model memory, 4 mixes and a 3 position flap switch, with an optional Lipo pack, and this at a price point below the current RSP.
Particularly if they -still specualting- discontinue the DX5e and push the new DX6i as the entry level 4+ channels transmitter.
That would bring down the price of used DX6i's quite a bit I think.
Your profile says your from Sweden, but this 'bold statement' makes it sound like your from "Middle Earth"
TODD
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Old Oct 21, 2012, 08:47 AM
Registered User
United States, NJ, Browns Mills
Joined May 2005
1,936 Posts
In my case, it's an Ember that we have for indoors and calm outdoor flight.

I bought a BNF version, using our DX7 for the radio. It worked fine, but it took up a memory slot we could've saved for something else.

We like to take the Ember with us when we go camping. In calm weather, it's great for shooting touch & goes off picnic tables and flying between trees. Problem is, the DX7 is larger and bulkier, so it and its carrying case take up a lot of extra space in our crammed truck.

So, I started looking around for a smaller, cheaper radio when a friend gave me the transmitter from one of his RTF micro heli's (Don't recall which one, but it's a Specktrum transmitter). Now I can carry everything in the Ember box, making it easier to 'lug' around. To my surprise, I found that the Ember flies better with the "toy" radio, mainly because it has more control throw than the default on my DX7.

So, the plusses for the "toy" transmitter include being easier to transport, cheap, and it frees up a memory slot when you get a better transmitter for your bigger stuff.

CD
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Old Oct 21, 2012, 09:03 AM
Way to many airplanes!
Canada, QC
Joined Oct 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pouncer View Post
Just speculating, but for all we know Spektrum might release an updated DX6i tomorrow, with DSMX
New DX6i are DSMX already....
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Old Oct 21, 2012, 09:15 AM
Way to many airplanes!
Canada, QC
Joined Oct 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daravon View Post
BNF or RTF?
Not sure if they have upgraded the foam in the box for the Night Vapor, but here's my advice from somebody who own many old Vapors (not Night version though...).

The small Tx is awesome because it does make the whole package easy to carry aroung. The small Tx fit inside the box. But, with the old Vapor, you had to add your own way to hold it down, as it could move around. (All other ultra-micro airplanes that have the room for the small Tx have a way to hold it down while in transit, without any modification...). A simple tie, or in my case a velcro strap does the thing.

That being said, everything the other guys have said is true. You can buy it RTF, or you can easily find a used Tx for it for cheaper. Or you can get a module for your VERY old Futaba, or you could buy a more recent decent Spektrum Tx with model slots, or you could buy a more recent Futaba with a Spektrum module.

You may want to think that eventually, you will let others fly it. (that's why I have many now... I let anybody learn the ropes with them). So for that reason alone, the small Tx is not a bad idea. Novice won't accidentally drop/hit your expensive Tx. Also, it may be easier to sell it later on, if it's RTF (or you can offer it as RTF and BNF and sell the small Tx separatly if you sell it BNF). So, basically, don't hesitate to get the small Tx, used or RTF....
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 12:07 PM
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Joined Mar 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daravon View Post
But does the crappy RTF transmitter work with other spektrum receivers? And does it have enough range for normal planes? Because I might be able to use it for my Slow Stick if so.

How much do I have to spend to get a good/decent TX? I have heard that there is no way to reprogram/rewire the Night Vapor to put the rudder on the left stick where it belongs, so the only way to get the rudder on the left stick is with a radio that allows mixing.
It's a 3ch plane and the RUDDER belongs on the right stick (MODE 2)...BECAUSE on a 3ch plane the rudder is THE MAIN STEERING control...

Put it on the left stick and you lose all ability to co-ordinate the elevator as you turn. by adding back pressure...

The rudder belongs on the left stick ONLY on aileron planes... You think all the manufactures are dummies????
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 07:22 PM
Registered User
USA, CA, Westlake Village
Joined Sep 2004
1,824 Posts
Depending on how small of an area you will fly indoors, might want to wait on the newly announced Mini Vapor.

I have a Night Vapor and it does not fly as well indoors as the original Vapor which was a little lighter (which makes a big difference).

I am very excited about this Mini Vapor as I have always liked the Vapors!

The rtf controller works great for indoors and outside if you do not fly it far away. I usually fly my Night Vapor very far away on calm nights. It is AMAZING how far you can fly it with the lights. I use a dx7 or dx8.

Pete
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Old Oct 23, 2012, 11:29 PM
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Canada, AB, Fort MacLeod
Joined Aug 2011
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I have found that the range is limited to around 300 feet. I've lost control twice at about that distance. Once I got control back by running closer to the plane, the second time I found the plane at the base of a tree a block away. No damage luckily.
The RTF "toy" transmitter is still my first choice for my night vapors , ember 2, and champs because of how small, light, and easy to hold it is. The DX8 sits on the shelf when I'm flying these.
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 06:51 AM
Way to many airplanes!
Canada, QC
Joined Oct 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Five View Post
I have found that the range is limited to around 300 feet.
Are you sure the antenna is still there? It's easy to rip it apart, and you can still fly it (though you get a lot shorter range). Other reason could be because you're using the small RTF transmitter? Only bad thing about that one is the fact that the antenna is often pointing straight at the airplane while flying (it doesn't fold 90 degree), and that's the worst situation.
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Old Oct 25, 2012, 12:20 AM
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Canada, AB, Fort MacLeod
Joined Aug 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RealGambler View Post
Are you sure the antenna is still there? It's easy to rip it apart, and you can still fly it (though you get a lot shorter range). Other reason could be because you're using the small RTF transmitter? Only bad thing about that one is the fact that the antenna is often pointing straight at the airplane while flying (it doesn't fold 90 degree), and that's the worst situation.
All the equipment is just fine and , yes it was the RTF transmitter which is not a full range transmitter.
300 feet is a long distance to see these small planes unless you go real high [which is what I was doing]. I have to walk past 4 neighbors houses to be 300 feet away from mine.
Most people fly well within that distance and never have a range issue but I thought I should mention it since I have. Just something to be aware of, not feared.
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Old Oct 25, 2012, 07:37 AM
Way to many airplanes!
Canada, QC
Joined Oct 2009
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That's ok, I was under the impression that I did go much farther with the RTF, but I've been flying my Vapors mostly from my DX7, so maybe my old brain is all mixed up. I've been doing a lot of thermal riding with mine (set throttle to about 10%, so the propeller is not pulling the airplane, but it's not dragging either) and ride some nice late evening thermal to the point were you suddenly figure this thing is just a dot in the air and if you ever loose direction, you'll have no clue where the plane is going.


P.S.: The newer Vapor (much smaller) is now a great choice as well (RTF and BNF as well). No lights though and probably not good at all outside (though, it's red...)
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