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Old Jan 16, 2016, 12:53 PM
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looking for an ideal trainer before flying my bix3

Hi, im currently building a bix3 which i was intending to use to first of all learn on and then use for fpv flight.... however i feel i have gone a bit over board on the build and have already put the fpv gear in along with a pixhawk (hkpilot32). I have also spent some time/effort/money on painting it.... i guess i wanted a project for the winter

Im now thinking i should maybe get another trainer to begin with, just to give me some confidence and experience before using the bix3. I could either buy another bix type plane and put basic electronics on or go the scratch build route.

I'm currently leaning toward either a minibipe kit or a VAS spark... both seem to offer good durability but having gone over budget on the bix 3 I'd like to hear what you guys have to say on the matter... what plans would you suggest to follow if I was going down the scratch build route? (There are so many options)

I would like it to be fairly small but it probably would cost less if I was actually to go up in scale as I could utilise my 3s 2200 may packs that I bought for the bix3. But I'm not adverse to the idea of going smaller...

Any input would be great (even if it is to bite the bullet and fly the bix3)

//holo

Edit: I forgot to mention about expected build difficulty... although I'm not really experienced with scratch building (or any format of model building for that matter) I'm not too worried about build difficulty... I'd rather take my time and have a challenge along with learning a few things along the way
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holonomic View Post
Hi, im currently building a bix3 which i was intending to use to first of all learn on and then use for fpv flight.... however i feel i have gone a bit over board on the build and have already put the fpv gear in along with a pixhawk (hkpilot32). I have also spent some time/effort/money on painting it.... i guess i wanted a project for the winter

Im now thinking i should maybe get another trainer to begin with, just to give me some confidence and experience before using the bix3. I could either buy another bix type plane and put basic electronics on or go the scratch build route.

I'm currently leaning toward either a minibipe kit or a VAS spark... both seem to offer good durability but having gone over budget on the bix 3 I'd like to hear what you guys have to say on the matter... what plans would you suggest to follow if I was going down the scratch build route? (There are so many options)

I would like it to be fairly small but it probably would cost less if I was actually to go up in scale as I could utilise my 3s 2200 may packs that I bought for the bix3. But I'm not adverse to the idea of going smaller...

Any input would be great (even if it is to bite the bullet and fly the bix3)

//holo
Have you flown an RC plane yet or will this be first time ?

The scratch built plane I use to teach first timers is the EzFly , which is VERY stable and can be slow flying if built lightweight ( light wing loading ) . And it also has a protected motor/prop ( like the Bix ) if it noses into the ground . If you scale it up to 150% you could use the 2200's , but I recommend building it as LIGHT as possible for best ( and slowest ) flight , and low mass/momentum for when it hits the ground .

If you are in the USA or Canada you can build it out of Dollar Store foam board for an airframe cost of about $2 .

Here are the plans ( PDF file )
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showa...6&d=1334660760

Here is one of mine , so slow and stable that I'm flying with one hand while filming with the other .

Copy of EzFly with under-cambered wing (1 min 57 sec)
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 01:53 PM
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Thank you for the reply. That indeed does fly very slow! I shall keep that one in mind as it will be my first fixed wing experience. Having had experience with quads and micro copters, a long with flight sims.

I have also just come across the slowboat thread which is probably not an ideal trainer really but i really like the idea of keeping the plane once I have progressed onto the bix3 as a fun line of sight plane which I can either take to the local reservoir or take on boating holiday but I'm unsure if it is too advanced?

//holo
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 01:56 PM
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Let me know if you decide to build an EzFly , I'll be happy to walk you through it !
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 02:09 PM
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Let me know if you decide to build an EzFly , I'll be happy to walk you through it !
Thank you! I shall have to price up and source the foam as i live in the UK

But the more i look into it i think scratch building is definatly going to be in my future... i have always enjoyed building the quads and this bix3. So scratch building seems to be a nice way to extend the build time

Just waiting for input on the slowboat as a trainer but i think it is currently between that and this ezfly.

//holo
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holonomic View Post
Thank you! I shall have to price up and source the foam as i live in the UK

But the more i look into it i think scratch building is definatly going to be in my future... i have always enjoyed building the quads and this bix3. So scratch building seems to be a nice way to extend the build time

Just waiting for input on the slowboat as a trainer but i think it is currently between that and this ezfly.

//holo
I've heard this foam board available in the UK is similar to the USA Dollar Store foam board .
http://www.foam-board.co.uk/20-x-30-...-of-25-sheets/
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 03:31 PM
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I had a Bix3 and I think you are wise to learn on something more suitable.
The EzFly mentioned above would be an excellent choice to help your thumbs sort out fixed wing flight.
The Bix3 is a strange beast. Mine was better than I thought it would be, in some ways, but worse than I imagined in others.
One of the good things was power. Many users feel the need to upgrade the motor but mine would take off from the grass on 1/2 power with ease. Mind you, I did not use the silly little wheels and their fairings. I gave it decent size wheels.
The disappointing thing, for me, was the way it flew. I am used to my planes going where I have pointed them but the Bix3 was a 'wanderer.' Plus it would alter its trim from day to day and sometimes flight to flight. Or even during the flight.
The recommended 2200 battery is not enough to get the CG in the correct position. I used an extra 800 pack to power my FPV gear and that worked OK.
Anyway, I lost the thing when the vision went away and it has vanished never to be found.
I wouldn't buy another. It's back to scratch building for me.
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 06:24 PM
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The Bix3 is Bad or Difficult flier ??? !!!

Oh My oh My why would HK do that to neubeez ?

Take a look at the Beeker !

A similar High wing Pusher design.

It's very similar and I find it easy to drive around with 3 channels.
Admittedly I have yrs of flying so it's going to be a little different for neubeez .
I have several Vimeo movies of it flying in my back field.
https://vimeo.com/bobneitzke
Some as a high wing , some as a Bipe


New builders have to learn to NOT put so much into their 1st plane as it's going to disappoint.

Wait for doing Pretty until you have experience flying.
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 07:43 PM
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New builders have to learn to NOT put so much into their 1st plane as it's going to disappoint.

Wait for doing Pretty until you have experience flying.
As Springer puts it : " it's sacrificial " .
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 07:55 PM
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I like the Flite Test Storch. Easy to fly, easy to modify, easy to build!

Landing Practice with the Storch (12 min 46 sec)
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 08:08 PM
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Birdo', most of my planes have no dihedral and are rigged at zero everything + a tad of right rudder. I was amazed to find that these planes are more stable than the Bix3.
If I took it up, trimmed it out and then left it hands-off while I put on the goggles it would be doing something stupid by the time I was back on the sticks. My current flat wing scratch built thing is always in far better shape in the same scenario.
I could never get my Bix3 to freeflight. It always wanted to execute the classic terminal spiral dive.
But then, if you have not flown lots of better planes you'd think the Bix3 was just fine, and that's how an RC plane behaves.
I think this applies to a lot of ARFs.
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 09:07 PM
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Very interesting comments. I compared the bix 3 and volantex ranger for quite a while before deciding on the ranger. (Thought it looked better, and it was cheaper) But while reading reviews I learned I would probably have trouble with the stock motor angle. I sure did! It flew poorly, crooked, climbing and diving with power application..... Not stable. But I knew it was a solid plane. After converting it to a twin tractor config, enlarging all control surfaces and adding flaps, it now flies beautifully. So I'm not surprised to hear similar comments on the bix 3 as they seem like similar planes. In contrast, the flite test bushwhacker I scratchbuilt flew straight and true from the first maiden. Sometimes I think arfs need a lot tweeking.

The quality of my ranger is excellent, and I think volantex makes a great plane for the $, but it definitely wasn't for a newby, and took a lot of work.

I would highly recommend scratchbuilding a flite test design to learn on. They are easy to build, easy to fly, easy to repair. The storch was an excellent suggestion.
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Old Jan 16, 2016, 09:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holonomic View Post
Thank you! I shall have to price up and source the foam as i live in the UK

But the more i look into it i think scratch building is definatly going to be in my future... i have always enjoyed building the quads and this bix3. So scratch building seems to be a nice way to extend the build time

Just waiting for input on the slowboat as a trainer but i think it is currently between that and this ezfly.

//holo
Well, my good British fellow, I fear you already have the beginnings of the foamie scratchbuilding addiction! As addictions go, it'a pretty innocuous, so feel free to try a bunch of planes. Most all of us have a build list longer than we expect to live, so join the club!

I think I would make the Slow boat a second plane if I were you. As it's a water plane, you will have to take additional precautions (like corrosionx on all electronics) if you want to fly it off water. Can't remember if it flys off grass well or not, but in any case, it wouldn't be the "natural" runway for the plane. It's a great plane and on my build list.

If you just want a trainer to get your thumbs and fingers working right on a fixed wing plane, the EZFly is good as any. If you want to go for a more realistic look, then there are other ones like the Blue Baby that are good well behaved trainers. What you do need to remember is that "it's only foam"! build a simple plane, fly it til you get bored with it, build another a bit more complicated and swap gear (you will need to size them similarly to make that easier). You can crank out a simple plane really fast, and get the feel for building and flying at the same time!
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