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Old Sep 04, 2013, 04:30 PM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
2,794 Posts
Build Log
DC-3 C-47 Project

I have always wanted to build a DC-3. I have considered the Top Flite kit but I am almost convinced I should just scratch build the thing. So, for a prototype I am building a small Guillows conversion to get familiar with the airframe and test out some ideas.

The end goal is to build a 80-100" version and have solid ideas about equipment installation, CG and were best to build a battery hatch etc. Setting the goal at 82" would be nice because then I could use the retracts designed for that kit.

So for now here is my start on the tiny C-47 version:



I have cut lightening holes in all the formers and ribs and scalloped the main crutch pieces. I am trying to save weight where I can.
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Old Sep 04, 2013, 08:26 PM
Exodus 4:13
bhoov128's Avatar
United States, FL, Davenport
Joined May 2012
9,478 Posts
Very cool... in for progress updates

Ben
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Old Sep 04, 2013, 08:31 PM
Or current resident
glewis's Avatar
USA, FL, Tampa
Joined Jul 2002
4,917 Posts
I'm in!
This one is on my bucket list since mosquito control used them to spray around here in the early 70's. They used 2 aircraft that flew in formation spraying at treetop level. It was so cool to be jolted out of bed right a dawn by the sound of 4 radials thundering overhead.

Glenn
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Old Sep 04, 2013, 08:37 PM
Heads up...
RMCCOR7737's Avatar
United States, VA, Stafford
Joined Jun 2009
744 Posts
Watching also. love the Guillows conversions...
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Old Sep 04, 2013, 09:54 PM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
2,794 Posts
I am jazzed about this one. A micro DC-3 is interesting to me for some reason. However, the end goal is to size this up to at least 80".

I have the ESC's, receiver, motors, servos all set aside and tested so it is just a matter of fabricated the air-frame and plugging through the process. Right now my big concern is weight (of course) and I would like to place the target at 350 grams. I am not going to sheet this one. The stringers are quite close together on the fuse and I think it will look really nice without sheeting and I want the best flight performance I can get.

Right now the electronics and power system are as follows:

2X Park 250 motors from HK
2X 10 amp ESC's from Headsup
5X 3 gram servos from Headsup
Orange 6 channel receiver without the case
Coverite Solite covering
Props: TBD
Gear: probably fixed but I would like to consider some sort of micro retracts

Controls: Ailerons, Elevator, Rudder, Throttle, Split flaps

I have not decided whether to do a C-47 or DC-3. The decals Guillows provides for Eastern Airlines are really nice. There is a nice Gonney Bird down at the Evergreen Flight Museum that might make a good full size reference.

Dave

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Old Sep 05, 2013, 12:22 AM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
2,794 Posts
Finished framing up the wing:



Prop selection is proving difficult since I would like a 3 blade. Most of the 3 blade props like GWS are to shallow pitch for this plane. I need a 4x4 3 blade to be scale and maybe a 5X4X3 or 5X5X3. So far I am not finding a prop that would look scale but it may just require a 2 blade prop for flying.

Dave
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 12:32 AM
Übung macht den Meister..
Deuce's Avatar
United States, OR, Fairview
Joined Jul 2006
3,026 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by payne9999 View Post
I am jazzed about this one. A micro DC-3 is interesting to me for some reason. However, the end goal is to size this up to at least 80".

I have the ESC's, receiver, motors, servos all set aside and tested so it is just a matter of fabricated the air-frame and plugging through the process. Right now my big concern is weight (of course) and I would like to place the target at 350 grams. I am not going to sheet this one. The stringers are quite close together on the fuse and I think it will look really nice without sheeting and I want the best flight performance I can get.

Right now the electronics and power system are as follows:

2X Park 250 motors from HK
2X 10 amp ESC's from Headsup
5X 3 gram servos from Headsup
Orange 6 channel receiver without the case
Coverite Solite covering
Props: TBD
Gear: probably fixed but I would like to consider some sort of micro retracts

Controls: Ailerons, Elevator, Rudder, Throttle, Split flaps

I have not decided whether to do a C-47 or DC-3. The decals Guillows provides for Eastern Airlines are really nice. There is a nice Gonney Bird down at the Evergreen Flight Museum that might make a good full size reference.

Dave

I need to get out to the Evergreen museum again... However, the fly-in in Hood River is this weekend!

The Gooney is coming together fast! Somewhere, I have (or maybe Pa has it) an old plan for a C/L DC-3, can't remember the span, though it was bigger then 3'. It shows an Ohlsson and Rice paint scheme (!) and the fuse is a big chunk of carved balsa. Good outline, however.

James
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 01:09 AM
Registered User
San Bernardino California U.S.A.
Joined Dec 2009
1,328 Posts
This is just a dry run ...

... for a larger project, right?

If thats the case, use a 2 blade prop.

If its important to do the 3 blade thing, Ive had success using rubber powered props, 3 props cut into 6 blades, than thread and epoxied to a hub over a plan at 120 degrees, get the idea? Its not too hard to do.

Anyway, Ill be following this thread, as it looks like fun, for sure. .....

Laramie.
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 01:28 AM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laramie View Post
... for a larger project, right?

If thats the case, use a 2 blade prop.

If its important to do the 3 blade thing, Ive had success using rubber powered props, 3 props cut into 6 blades, than thread and epoxied to a hub over a plan at 120 degrees, get the idea? Its not too hard to do.

Anyway, Ill be following this thread, as it looks like fun, for sure. .....

Laramie.
Yes, I am wanting to do a small park flyer size and then move on to the 80-100" one. The 80" or larger will not be a problem as far as finding props but in the smaller sizes (5" or under) it is difficult.

Dave
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 01:38 AM
Southern MN USA
meltor's Avatar
Joined Jun 2012
409 Posts
cool! this one is on my list as well. i'm in.
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 02:35 AM
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Joined Jan 2013
53 Posts
I'm interested too looks like a good challenge. Are you going to use counter rotating props or both same direction?and what degree of down and right thrust if any?surely must be some?
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 02:42 AM
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United Kingdom, England, East Riding of Yorkshire
Joined Jan 2011
621 Posts
Hi Dave – I have this one on the board right now (I must start a build log) and it is proving to be a challenging conversion – I shall be following with interest, looks great so far.
Charles
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 08:18 AM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GROUNDeffected View Post
I'm interested too looks like a good challenge. Are you going to use counter rotating props or both same direction?and what degree of down and right thrust if any?surely must be some?
Contra-rotating is what I usually do on multi-motor projects although it really doesn't matter much. On planes where the engines are not on the centerline the P factor effect is not noticeable to me. I have flown small and large twins and 4 motor planes both ways and saw no so-called torque effect on takeoff roll. The only thing I could see was the plane turned one direction slightly better than the other but it was a very subtle effect.

So far on all my multi-motor projects I have used zero right and zero down. If I need some down I will add it after maiden unless someone out there who has built this model has advice. The contra rotating question is often answered by prop availability. If there aren't nicely matched sets of props by a given maker then the plane cannot be setup that way. I am currently flying a 75" B-17F and all 4 motors are turning the "normal" direction. I had it setup contra-rotating as well early on.

Dave
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 08:52 AM
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Bill Smudge's Avatar
United States, KY, Bowling Green
Joined Jul 2011
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Hey Dave,

The bones are looking great, retracts will be nice if you can pull that off.

Looking forward to the rest of the build.

Bill
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Old Sep 05, 2013, 09:07 AM
Balsa&Tissue
payne9999's Avatar
United States, OR, Beaverton
Joined Jan 2011
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Originally Posted by Bill Smudge View Post
Hey Dave,

The bones are looking great, retracts will be nice if you can pull that off.

Looking forward to the rest of the build.

Bill
There is one other guy out there that was working on a small DC-3 (not Guillows) and he had a design for tiny retracts. However, he did not explain the mechanism design. I may search for his build log and see if he will share the design.

One thing I hate about micro builds is finding a way to access the components and the battery mount. I am going to frame up the entire plane, temporarily mount all the components and check CG. Then I will figure out what part of the plane will have the main access hatch. I have been thinking through this and the only way to know is to frame it all and check the CG.

Dave
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