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Old Oct 13, 2012, 02:17 PM
Fly it like you STOL it!
Endlesslag's Avatar
United States, FL, Daytona Beach
Joined Jan 2011
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Any info on this engine?

Came across this engine in a box of my dad's stuff from when he was a kid...
I got it running again, and I think I found out which it is, but I am trying to figure out what plane it came in, and then what I can put it in now to have a bit of fun!

I think it's a cox 191-5 product engine, and he says all he remembers is his brother flying the plane once and crashing it, destroying the airframe (the box said it was indestructible! Apparently not )
If anyone has any idea what it was, how common the engine is, etc let me know.
Thanks!

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Old Oct 13, 2012, 02:46 PM
"Unnecessary Necessity"
coriolan's Avatar
Canada, QC, Quebec City
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It is indeed a 191-5 from 1976/77 and it was used in the PT-19 of the time:
http://www.mh-aerotools.de/airfoils/cox_frameset.htm
Product Engine .049 (0.8 cm³)

Manufactured between 5/1976 and 9/1977 (#191-5, ECJ #28d)

This engine was equipped with a mesh exhaust screen to prevent painful burns. This was the first solution for people complaining about burning their fingers when priming with too much fuel might have caused a small fireball when they applied power to the glow plug. Another (and maybe more important) effect of the wire screen was to limit power and thus speed, facilitating to fly the C/L models. A small and heavy plastic C/L model with a .049 running at full speed can fly quite fast and is thus difficult to control for the beginner.

This particular engine has probably been used in a PT-19 trainer airplane.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 02:54 PM
Fly it like you STOL it!
Endlesslag's Avatar
United States, FL, Daytona Beach
Joined Jan 2011
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Okay.
I'm thinking of building a Stik type plane to put it in and have a little fun with it this winter.

The spring starter is broken, and the gaskets are toast, plus I'd like one of the integrated fuel tanks.. Are those pretty standard for the cox engines? If I bought one from cox international would it bolt right on, or is the bolt pattern different for the different engines?
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 02:57 PM
Fly it like you STOL it!
Endlesslag's Avatar
United States, FL, Daytona Beach
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Cox .049 191-5 (1 min 21 sec)


There's the video of it running. My tach had low battery, so I think the numbers on it were wrong.
I kept it on the rich side too, just because I don't think it ever really had a chance to be broken in ~40 years ago.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
This engine was equipped with a mesh exhaust screen to prevent painful burns. This was the first solution for people complaining about burning their fingers when priming with too much fuel might have caused a small fireball when they applied power to the glow plug.
This is pretty funny! I started my first .049 at the age of 10 and I never experienced this issue. I have never even heard of anyone having this problem.Also, this is the first one of these screens that I have seen. As a kid I am pretty sure that I would have recognized that this screen (like the muffler on my go-kart) was holding the motor back.

I always used a small dental suringe (the kind with the curved plastic pointy tip) to fuel my .049's and also to prime them.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 03:37 PM
Fly it like you STOL it!
Endlesslag's Avatar
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Also something else I noticed...it spins clockwise looking from the front. That's backward from any of my other engines....any reason why?
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 03:52 PM
"Unnecessary Necessity"
coriolan's Avatar
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The end of the video seems to show a pusher prop which would explain the engine having to go CW, Reed valve engines can rotate any direction and Cox had CW andCCW spring starters as well as props for some of their models (Airboats & tether cars). The hole pattern on the back of the crankcase is the same for all .049 Cox reedy so its easy to adapt a babeBee tank to a production engines (CoxInternational has all theses parts)
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Endlesslag View Post
Also something else I noticed...it spins clockwise looking from the front. That's backward from any of my other engines....any reason why?
The engine is happy running in either direction. On a controliner, the clockwise prop direction helps torque the airplane to the outside of the circle, giving you more line tension, especially on the take-off.

The easiest tank set-up for this engine is the snap-on helicopter tank. See: http://coxengines.ca/cox-integrated-mini-fuel-tank.html

It's a short run, minute or less. But if you're a beginner, this could be good! You can add a larger, external tank later.
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Old Oct 13, 2012, 04:27 PM
Fly it like you STOL it!
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Nah, I'm fine with more than I minute. I've been flying for a bit. I think the 5 or 8cc babe bee tank will work fine, and I'll build something fast...all my bigger planes are relatively slow- set up for 3d or scale flight...
A mini pylon racer would be a blast!

Also the spring starter is no big deal to me, my electric starter will get it going with a tap to the prop.
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 12:43 PM
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Electric starters and Coxes are not a real good combination....

The crankshaft does not have a trustwasher behind the propdriver, so chances are, after a while the crankpin will touch the backplate.

Brgds, Bert
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Endlesslag View Post
Okay.
I'm thinking of building a Stik type plane to put it in and have a little fun with it this winter. The spring starter is broken, and the gaskets are toast, plus I'd like one of the integrated fuel tanks.. Are those pretty standard for the cox engines? If I bought one from cox international would it bolt right on, or is the bolt pattern different for the different engines?
A Cox tank will fit the engine. It is a direct bolt on. 8 cc tank gets about a minute's worth more flying than shorter the 5 cc tank. Bernie at Cox International has tank assemblies with gasket and bolts:

http://coxengines.ca/fuel-tanks-lines/ (all tanks)
http://coxengines.ca/8cc-fuel-tank-c...49-engine.html (8 cc tank)

If in good condition, you can reuse your reed valve.

He's also got a replacement starter spring to replace your broken one:

http://coxengines.ca/cox-.049-snap-s...g-no-drag.html
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 07:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Brutus1967 View Post
Electric starters and Coxes are not a real good combination....

The crankshaft does not have a trustwasher behind the propdriver, so chances are, after a while the crankpin will touch the backplate.

Brgds, Bert
Unless you have a BB engine, electric starters are a BAD idea. They are not needed anyway for most engines, especially 1/2As.
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 11:31 PM
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The reed valve engines are easy starting, unless a bad starting battery, bad or dead plug, or they have been exposed to dirt. Then the solution is to disassemble, rinse in a mild solvent, reassemble. The spring starter the Cox's come with are more than adequate. If there is no spring, sometimes they will after a good flip with the finger or chicken stick, run backwards. I usuallly toss a rag into the prop to stop it. I know that some poo poo this idea, but I use the glass filled nylon props, never had a problem. If one has a choke tube like on a Sure Start, simply cover the tube with a finger and engine stops.
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