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Old Jun 11, 2007, 01:05 PM
SOARMINDED
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United States, OK, Mannford
Joined Jul 2006
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Building PG 5 Meter Ventus have ????

Hi Group, I bought a Ventus kit from one of our club memebers THANKS Bruce D. !!! Anyway the wingrod tube in the fuse is not a tube but just a thin guessing one layer of cloth tube?? I could break it by squeezing it! The ends where it mates to the fuse is built up like most kits with a nice fillet but no strength in the middle really no support at all I think? The retract is right below and my thoughts were making a plywood plate that ran from the wingrod tube area to the retract bolted to the retract and glued to a new REAL TUBE glued between the fuse sides. There looks to be no plywood or anything at the wingroot fillet area for strength?? So i thought just gluing a tube across was a waste of time. My only worry is landing impacts on the gear with this setup?? The gear is made of brown ( spelling ) phenolic material and I have heard this is not strong and real weak on side loads? I guess i could make new side pieces ouy of aluminum for the retracts looks so simple but didn't want to bother if there was no need or a waste of time. Do you think guing in a tube will be strong enough for normal thermal flying and very mild aerobatics like loops or rolls?? kind of floating spar system?? I heard there is someone local Calif. maybe that makes carbon wing rods. I would like to buy one or two for other kits also if he is still making them. Also this thing has 3 ali and 1 flap per wing. Can i use digital servos ( never used them before ) and use a hitec or other programer to limit travel on the ali. surfaces to get what i want it travel? or do you need a electronic match box?? mounted or on board the aircraft at all times to do this?? Or do i need to step up to Futaba's new 12 channel radio and not worry about this? What are your thought Futaba's 12 channel versus multiplex's 12 channel on sailplane use? With this many digital servos 12 so far maybe 2 more. What kind of power setup would you recomend? I have seen a few different optical servo isolaters and power panels. Which one would you guys recomend, i haven't seen any listing use of this many servos. Would 2 recievers be better with this much current flowing thru them? I know allot ??? But I had allot on my mind as i look at this beauty.
Jerry
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Old Jun 11, 2007, 11:43 PM
k2k
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United States, CA, Oceanside
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Well, let me answer one question at least. I have a 5M Krause Venutus and a 9 channel Multiplex radio. The tip aileron is pin driven by middle aileron segment. I put digital servos on the inboard and middle aileron segments and programmed them. The servo lead goes to the inboard servo where there is a Y harness for the middle segment aileron to plug into. It has worked out very well and eliminated the need to use a matchbox.
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Old Jun 12, 2007, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GNX430
Hi Group, I bought a Ventus kit from one of our club memebers THANKS Bruce D. !!! Anyway the wingrod tube in the fuse is not a tube but just a thin guessing one layer of cloth tube?? I could break it by squeezing it! The ends where it mates to the fuse is built up like most kits with a nice fillet but no strength in the middle really no support at all I think? The retract is right below and my thoughts were making a plywood plate that ran from the wingrod tube area to the retract bolted to the retract and glued to a new REAL TUBE glued between the fuse sides. There looks to be no plywood or anything at the wingroot fillet area for strength?? So i thought just gluing a tube across was a waste of time. My only worry is landing impacts on the gear with this setup?? The gear is made of brown ( spelling ) phenolic material and I have heard this is not strong and real weak on side loads? I guess i could make new side pieces ouy of aluminum for the retracts looks so simple but didn't want to bother if there was no need or a waste of time. Do you think guing in a tube will be strong enough for normal thermal flying and very mild aerobatics like loops or rolls?? kind of floating spar system?? I heard there is someone local Calif. maybe that makes carbon wing rods. I would like to buy one or two for other kits also if he is still making them. Also this thing has 3 ali and 1 flap per wing. Can i use digital servos ( never used them before ) and use a hitec or other programer to limit travel on the ali. surfaces to get what i want it travel? or do you need a electronic match box?? mounted or on board the aircraft at all times to do this?? Or do i need to step up to Futaba's new 12 channel radio and not worry about this? What are your thought Futaba's 12 channel versus multiplex's 12 channel on sailplane use? With this many digital servos 12 so far maybe 2 more. What kind of power setup would you recomend? I have seen a few different optical servo isolaters and power panels. Which one would you guys recomend, i haven't seen any listing use of this many servos. Would 2 recievers be better with this much current flowing thru them? I know allot ??? But I had allot on my mind as i look at this beauty.
Jerry

Hi there Jerry to answer your question on the carry tube for the joiner, it is just that a carry tube the physical loads are taken buy the locator pins in conjunction with the big phillets at the root. As your not flying the model without the joiner in place there is no way the tube can crush or distort, remember it is a round tube not a square box in the fuse! so the simple answer is just don't pick it up buy the tube in the fuse and you will be fine. the other consideration is how long has the model been flying prior to your aquisition??? still working hey so why stuff with it!!!!
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Old Jun 12, 2007, 11:14 PM
k2k
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United States, CA, Oceanside
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I think the retract is probably ok. I had one like this in a 4.2M ASW 27 and it worked fine until I did a 600 foot vertical landing.

One 10 or 12 channel receiver should be able to handle your plane by itself. If you don't want to put all your faith in one receiver then two will work fine also. One advantage of two receivers is that if your retract binds then you only compromise half the plane. The alternative is a separate battery for the retract servo.

Do not substitute a carbon rod for the existing steel rod. A carbon rod needs to be larger in diameter to get the same stiffness. Carbon rods also fail catastrophically. Do not substitute a steel jacketed carbon rod. It will bend. Be happy with the steel rod, it will work well.
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Old Jun 14, 2007, 10:14 AM
SOARMINDED
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United States, OK, Mannford
Joined Jul 2006
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Well, let me answer one question at least. I have a 5M Krause Venutus and a 9 channel Multiplex radio. The tip aileron is pin driven by middle aileron segment. I put digital servos on the inboard and middle aileron segments and programmed them. The servo lead goes to the inboard servo where there is a Y harness for the middle segment aileron to plug into. It has worked out very well and eliminated the need to use a matchbox.

Hi, My Discus 2B is driven the same way but there is quite a bit of slop in the linkage. Now it is a used sailplane and was flown on the slope most of it's life before I bought it so that might be wear and tear on the holes for the pins??? I have not researched it that much but will now i am restoring ( REPAIRING IT! ) when i recover the wings. Do you use the same travel for both inner and outer ali. ? Or are you using different servo arm lengths to adjust travel??
Thanks Jerry
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Old Jun 14, 2007, 10:19 AM
SOARMINDED
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United States, OK, Mannford
Joined Jul 2006
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Big Nuts 181Hi there Jerry to answer your question on the carry tube for the joiner, it is just that a carry tube the physical loads are taken buy the locator pins in conjunction with the big phillets at the root. As your not flying the model without the joiner in place there is no way the tube can crush or distort, remember it is a round tube not a square box in the fuse! so the simple answer is just don't pick it up buy the tube in the fuse and you will be fine. the other consideration is how long has the model been flying prior to your aquisition??? still working hey so why stuff with it!!!!

This is a brand new kit, I do live by that rule if it is working fine why F$%#@ with it?? ( race cars don't count! ) I was just worried the root area has no wood inside the layup and might just crack on a hard landing or as the wings flex up and down during fast tows or normal flight,wear the fuse at the wing fillet area till it weakens to much. Thanks Jerry
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Old Jun 14, 2007, 10:26 AM
SOARMINDED
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United States, OK, Mannford
Joined Jul 2006
410 Posts
I think the retract is probably ok. I had one like this in a 4.2M ASW 27 and it worked fine until I did a 600 foot vertical landing.

One 10 or 12 channel receiver should be able to handle your plane by itself. If you don't want to put all your faith in one receiver then two will work fine also. One advantage of two receivers is that if your retract binds then you only compromise half the plane. The alternative is a separate battery for the retract servo.

Do not substitute a carbon rod for the existing steel rod. A carbon rod needs to be larger in diameter to get the same stiffness. Carbon rods also fail catastrophically. Do not substitute a steel jacketed carbon rod. It will bend. Be happy with the steel rod, it will work well.

I knew about the relationship dia versus strength but was hoping to put that joiner on a diet! I will stick with it and enjoy the plane soon. I was all ready thinking dual battiers for the airframe and another for the retract. I have seen 2 sailplanes try and burn down from jammed retracts and one was saved by his vario battery alarm and the other because he slammed it in on landing and noticed the retract binding badly. I want to do some heavy 1 hour and longer flights and maybe a few cross country events and want to use this ship as a test bed for radio ideas. I have allways worried about my battiers in my sailplanes and ordering a vario from Dean soon. Matter of fact will get 3 airframe setups and swap the vario in between sailplanes to be safe from now on. Thanks Jerry
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Old Jun 14, 2007, 11:06 PM
k2k
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In response to the pin driven aileron mechanism developing slop, I've only been flying the plane about a year but I doubt that it ever will have a problem with that. The pin is a piece of music wire which floats in brass tubes. I seriously doubt that it is going to wear very fast. I did use the same travel for all of the ailerons. I think if you want scale, the inboard segment should travel less than the middle segment and the tip aileron should only go up. Too much trouble for me.

I have a Multiplex ASH 26 which uses the floating wing joiner method and carries the load of the fuselage on the two locator pins. The wing fillet really isn't all that thick and is only fiberglass. The plane is 5 years old and has lots of flight time and landings with no problems. I don't think you need to worry about it.

You are wise to worry about the retract. If possible, have one channel for the retract so you can bring the wheel up while you can see what is going on.
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