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Old Dec 11, 2010, 02:38 AM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
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Peter Rake's Morane Saulnier AI - Upsized

What does one do when taking a break from building Peter Rake prototypes? Why, build another Peter Rake design of course - just for the fun of it

After seeing Halfastrut's Morane Saulnier AI and then taking a closer look at Charlie's version in a recent FSM, I was hooked! Deciding to take a leaf from Hammerd's recent builds (more like several chapters actually...) I checked what 1/6 scale would be and at about 56", it seemed and ideal design to 'upsize'. 1/6 gives plenty of options for scale detail - even pilots, Vickers guns etc are easier to source if I got lazy!

What changes for a bigger model. An email to Pete secured a CAD plan to doodle with plus the suggestion that it should upsize without much modification apart from wood sizes. To make some working plans, I took the FSM freebies and got them enlarged by 1.3333.... - 1/8 to 1/6. Even the basic wood works out OK - esp. as I'm going to hand cut it.

So down to detail - obviously, a bigger model allows some things to be different. I will attempt to make the aileron linkages scale(ish) - much the same as the Ballila - fuselage mounted servos with pushrods, cranks and torque tubes. Also the MS AI had the tail linkages internal. At 1/6 scale there may be just enough room for this. The rather complex wooden struts have been given a lot of thought and at this size, could be made functional and realistic.

I have also decided to do the rather more complicated version armed with two Vickers guns in a Camel-like cowling.

Next - cut some balsa..

Pat
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 02:46 AM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
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Cutting Ribs is very Therapeutic...

The wing is mostly as per the plan with a couple of changes. I wanted to try using a thin ply TE to get a less fragile thinner edge - mine is of 1/32 ply glued to a slight rebate on extended ribs. The ribs are 2mm and 4mm corresponding 1/16 and 1/8" on the original. Since there are no servos, holes for the aileron torque tubes will be added later. The three spars are of spruce and a little larger than the plan.

Next - build a wing.

Pat
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 02:57 AM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
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Which Aircraft to Model....

There are many variants - Swiss, Jap, Czech, French etc - but the aircraft for which most photographic data is available is the "Moustique" French #7 flying as part of the French Memorial Flight Association - which is an excellent on-line resource. This probably what I'll go for or something very similar - even though it has been modelled many times!

Pat
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 03:12 AM
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South Africa
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This is going to be a fun one to follow Pat - good luck and enjoy

Owl
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 05:32 AM
What's 3D?
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Australia, WA, Ellenbrook
Joined Feb 2008
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Looks like all your extra building space has gone to your head Pat for a bloke who was stepping back and rationalising the project list and fleet you have failed miserably, great stuff, I will be tagging along for the ride as usual!

Cheers
Craig
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 06:01 AM
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United States, NY, Dobbs Ferry
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looking forward to this build. actually i enjoy ALL of your builds!

ST
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 07:45 AM
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Albuquerque, NM USA
Joined Sep 2003
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Pat,

Nice choice!

One small bit of advice, given your flying venue. Build the rudder and fin strong. They end up being the 'tailskid' more than I cared for. I finally cut some out of solid balsa.

charlie
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 01:47 PM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
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Charlie - thanks for the tip!
Craig - I only really have two models being actively built plus this one. Plus two others that are VERY long term - for when I feel the urge. Plus a long list of '....I'd love to build that......' BUT - no 'pressure' builds. For me, the commitment of a contest or prototype build is double edged. Lots of incentive but also my stress levels tend to go high as well. If I prang a SPAD or Lysander, it is sad but a proto. F2b or Ballila is downright infuriating (and a great embarassment!) - and no doubt causes its designer anxious moments!

There is no doubt that my big adrenalin rush comes from the research, planning, collecting materials, deciding how to do and building an airframe. I love it. At the moment with this one, I am up at 6am and opening up the garage to the summer sun (yes we have some today!) and planning the next AI moves. I'll also be there at 11 pm unless something good comes up on the SciFi or History channel

Enough rambling on - a cup of coffee and into the workshop before 7am

Pat
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 02:53 PM
What's 3D?
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Australia, WA, Ellenbrook
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Good onya Mate, get back to the basics and build for you! Looks like some complicated wire work is involved with the struttery on this one, what sort of wire diameters will be required? Looking forward to seeing this part especially, as for me it is the most infuriating part of these builds, Especially the larger dia wire!

Cheers
Craig
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 03:37 PM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
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A Quick Wing..

The basic wing was very quick to build once the ribs were cut. It follows Pete's plan pretty much exactly but without the servo bays. A few wood sizes were changed for economy, expediency or necessity! The main spars are slightly smaller than the up-sized plan but the rear are bigger. The tip parts remained at 1/8 balsa etc.

Before gluing the wing halves together, I need to sort out what is needed for the torque-tubes. After my experience with the Ansaldo, I'll make sure I use TUBE this time, not rod

Span measures at about 56.5" with a chord of 11 - about 4.3 sq ft.
At 12 oz/sq ft, I should aim for about 48-50 oz max - around 1.5 Kg. So I need to be careful.

Pat (havin' fun)
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 03:49 PM
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Lovely (and very quick) Work there Pat.

Obviously the Lynch house has all its chores up to date and building can proceed without interuption from Mrs Pat.

Why are you restricting yourself to 12 Oz? I's just flicking through Gordon Whitheads' "Radio Control Scale Aircraft" and he would allow 15-20 for that type of subject.
Obviously it's better to keep it as light as possible, but I cannot see why 15 Oz/SF shouldn't be perfectly OK for a fighter type.

Cheers,

Hugh
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 04:09 PM
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If I may ask a question out of ignorance... is this the same as what others call the AI ( aye - eye ) model?

I'm seeing conflicting information as to which is correct ( if any )... and since I'm trying to research what the AEF's color scheme was... I figure knowing the proper model name may also help in that research.

Thanks..

Randy
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 04:27 PM
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USA, OH, Olmsted Falls
Joined Sep 2005
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Pat,
Another fantastic choice that you will (of course) turn into a fantastic model. I can't wait to see the result.
For my part I'm hoping the interest you kick up will convince Pete and Charlie to offer a 1/6 scale short kit.

Tim
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 04:28 PM
a.k.a Maltone
Australia, NSW, Goulburn
Joined Jan 2005
6,416 Posts
Oops....

Randy - thanks for the correction - it is certainly an AI not A1 Not having long finished the Ansaldo, I got A1 stuck in my aging brain.........
I've gone back and changed all the A1 references in the build!

The confusing part is the extra model type names MoS 27, 29, 30 etc - depending on guns, engines etc. The only written info I have so far is the Windsock mini datafile #5 which is rather limited.

Thanks for correcting MY ignorance

Tim - since I'm hand cutting, I'll leave an enlarged kit to others! But with only a few ribs, by hand is not a problem. Then again, there are those formers........

Pat
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Old Dec 11, 2010, 04:50 PM
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Pat,

Well... that makes two of us being ignorant then... I wasn't trying to correct anyone just understand why some are saying A1 vs AI. Just in case you were concerned you are in good company... Peter Rake also calls it A1 ( at least he did in Charlies thread ) as well as BalsaUSA sells it using that name. I just figured that I was missing info since Peter and others also say A1.

Still... I don't want to take this thread off topic discussing simple semantics that in the end doesn't matter much... I was just curious about it since I was also doing research in this area.

Thanks for the reply none the less,
Randy
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