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Old Sep 23, 2012, 11:24 PM
bobepine's Avatar
Joined Jun 2011
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I'm not really familiar with requirements regarding antenna placement. I always use heatshrink on mine and never had any problems. Reception is good, at least as far as I can fly while keeping a visual on the quad. Perhaps the way I do it is not recommended for FPV since one would tend to fly at greater distance. Frankly, I'm not sure.

Best,
Chris
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 11:49 AM
Get Airborne
Sweden, Skåne County, Hofterup
Joined May 2012
310 Posts
I think light weight is one of the most important qualitys when building my first quad. I am aiming at <200gram exclusive LiPo.

Please advise me:
-Suggestions of low weight (small) brushless motors that is wise too use with the KK2.0 board?
-Suitable dimension of the frame (prop-prop)?
- What propellers to use, with the proposed motors and KV?
-Where to buy motors and props?

The goal is a very light and probably small quad, run by the KK2.0 flight controller.

My quad experience so far is from V929, X100 and V939, because of extremely low weight they often survive bad crashes which is a good thing.

My steps for construction.
1. Decide type of Control board. (KK2.0) I love the integrated LCD display.
2. Type of brushless motors. And what propellers to use.
3. Dimension of frame.
4. Make the frame.
5. The rest............

Thanks in advance! Sven
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 01:14 PM
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Considering you want to use a KK2 board, and you'll need 4ESCs and 4 brushless motors, I think your goal of 200 grams or less is cutting it close.

I think a good starting point for you would be to look at the recommended specifications for such tiny frames on www.bambucopter.com. Looks like you're in Europe and bambucopter is a good place to buy parts from because their shipping cost for international shipping is very low.

Look at their "Classic 20" or "Crab 25" frames. They list the needed parts you need to get good performance and these are right around the size of frame you're thinking of building. So if you were to build such a small frame yourself, the specs listed for these small frames on the bambucopter website should work very well for you. That said, these little bambucopter frames are quite cheap and you might consider building one of them as a first quad because they fit your requirements and they are just about unbreakable. Very, very tough frames.

I hope this helps, and good luck with your first build!

Best,
Chris
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Old Sep 24, 2012, 02:14 PM
Get Airborne
Sweden, Skåne County, Hofterup
Joined May 2012
310 Posts
Thanks Chris, then I have a look at Bambucopter.

Of course I report the progress later on. //Sven
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Old Sep 27, 2012, 10:31 AM
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United States, WV, Hurricane
Joined Jan 2010
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Hey Chris,

Would it be possible to get a sort of description on what you are doing when you do flips on the sticks. I've been watching the video of the Crab 25 I bought from you and still have to say your quad flying is some of the most fluid I have seen. I see lot's of people do flips and rolls and can do them myself on the mqx, but I don't go doing so much back to back as I lose way to much altitude after just one. The way you just move from one flip, roll to the next in any direction is what amazes me. I think what I'm catching that I don't see in many other videos is it seems like you give it a little up thrust right before you go into the maneuver which keeps it from losing hardly any altitude when the flip or roll is completed.

I know it's practice, practice, practice, but I just thought maybe a little walk through on the stick might help get ahead of the game a little bit.
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Old Sep 27, 2012, 11:49 AM
bobepine's Avatar
Joined Jun 2011
7,376 Posts
I use a very steep throttle curve in my radio, for one. This helps with good throttle response in terms of retaining altitude on recovery. Most of the time I do let it drop a bit, though, unless I flip close to the ground. Makes the recovery smoother. My throttle curve is set as a linear curve and from 75% and upward throttle on the stick, the output is set to 100%. Essentially, the top 3 points on the curve are set to 100% and my low point is set to 0% and everything in between is inhibited to create a linear curve.

As for stick movement, the idea is to reduce throttle when inverted unless you do large loops with lots of altitude during which holding the throttle constant works fine, but even then, reducing throttle a bit when inverted gives you better control.

As for quick flips, reducing the throttle when inverted is key, especially when flipping close to the ground. Higher flip rate programmed in the flight controller helps, of course, but throttle management can really make a difference between a fast flip and a not so fast flip. For example, if you reduce the throttle at the same time as you initiate the flip, the quad will flip much slower, whereas if you let the quad go through 25 or 30% of the flip before reducing the throttle, then it will flip much faster. Bottom line is if the props turn faster under higher throttle output when initiating the flip, the quad flips faster but you still have to reduce throttle when inverted or else you lose too much altitude and control. The same goes with giving it a bit of a throttle punch when initiating the flip. This simply helps propel the quad into it's flipping rotation.

If you saw my thumb on the throttle stick when doing back to back flips and rolls, all you would see of my thumb on the throttle stick is an up and down, and up and down motion.

You know, Warthox actually has videos where he shows the sticks as a separate layer. You should look them up on Vimeo with the search terms "Warthox Flight School." That guys is an amazing pilot. Weird thing is, he doesn't use colored props or any kind of orientation markings, yet, he rarely loses orientation. He always seem to know which way is which.

Don't hesitate to post more questions if they come to mind.

Best,
Chris
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Old Sep 27, 2012, 12:50 PM
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United States, WV, Hurricane
Joined Jan 2010
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Thanks so much Chris for that explanation. I will have to work on learning how to work with Throttle curve and such. All of the little quads I've flown have had no need for those settings so they've just been in Acro mode. First I better just get confident flying as is.

Yeah I've watched Warthox videos a many of times. He's just in his own league! I don't know of anyone on the planet that can fly quite like that. It's just insane!
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Old Sep 27, 2012, 01:05 PM
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You're welcome. And yeah.... That Warthox fellow is something else. He's like the Yoda of quads. I do hope to gain similar skills eventually. I watch his videos periodically and then I go out there and try to do what I see him doing. It's not that easy! Costs me props most of the time.

Best,
Chris
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Old Sep 27, 2012, 02:21 PM
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United States, WV, Hurricane
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Good thing you gave me lots o props.

Not trying to suck up, but I have to say for the short time you've been flying quads you seem to be doing pretty awesome!
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Old Sep 30, 2012, 10:22 AM
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United States, NY, New York
Joined Nov 2011
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Just curious, would'nt the PID settings be different for 1.0 and 1.2 versions of firmware? Chris, are you using 1.2?


PS quad frame I got from you is a dream to fly, however I did a no-no and attempted a flip with default stick scaling. Ran it so hard into the ground, I had to dig it out Thanks for spare aluminum tubes, one of them came in handy
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Old Sep 30, 2012, 12:02 PM
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Joined Jun 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by templton89 View Post
Just curious, would'nt the PID settings be different for 1.0 and 1.2 versions of firmware? Chris, are you using 1.2?


PS quad frame I got from you is a dream to fly, however I did a no-no and attempted a flip with default stick scaling. Ran it so hard into the ground, I had to dig it out Thanks for spare aluminum tubes, one of them came in handy
PI settings for both versions of the firmware have the same effect. No difference. Glas to hear you like the custom frame, Sir.

Best,
Chris
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Old Sep 30, 2012, 03:26 PM
Stop me before I build again!
United States, NY, Albany
Joined Sep 2012
1,320 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlcamp7 View Post
Thanks so much Chris for that explanation. I will have to work on learning how to work with Throttle curve and such. All of the little quads I've flown have had no need for those settings so they've just been in Acro mode. First I better just get confident flying as is.

Yeah I've watched Warthox videos a many of times. He's just in his own league! I don't know of anyone on the planet that can fly quite like that. It's just insane!
Saw someone wire up their quad on strings ( suspended by opposite arm to the wall ) so he could practice flips indoors with the quad in a crash-resistant tether. In one night they were able to get good enough that they could do it in the wild without crashing the next day.
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 06:55 PM
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United States, AZ, Phoenix
Joined May 2012
799 Posts
Hi Chris

Think you could give me a hand specking out some HK parts for Quad copter? It needs to be able to lift my GoPro comfortably. I have about 4 months or so building foamies and i'm a geek so the kk2 board should be no issue.

Motor -
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...er_1100kv.html OR
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ner_700kv.html

Frame
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ame_680mm.html

KK2 Board

I can figure out the battery myself

The Esc I need help with. Looking for cheap yet usable.

Thanks
Nightstone
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 07:11 PM
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jlcamp7's Avatar
United States, WV, Hurricane
Joined Jan 2010
3,132 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by brontide View Post
Saw someone wire up their quad on strings ( suspended by opposite arm to the wall ) so he could practice flips indoors with the quad in a crash-resistant tether. In one night they were able to get good enough that they could do it in the wild without crashing the next day.
Hmm very interesting. Pretty nifty idea. I'm gonna look for a video. Would be neat to see.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 11:23 AM
Tri-Quad-Hexa-Octo-copters!!
United States, TX, San Antonio
Joined Feb 2007
14,404 Posts
Gents,
The Flight Training for Multicopters section in the Quadrocopter and Tricopter Info Mega Link Index has the links to the Warhox instructional flip videos and some other helpful info.
Cheers,
Jim

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlcamp7 View Post
Hmm very interesting. Pretty nifty idea. I'm gonna look for a video. Would be neat to see.
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