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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:13 AM
Registered User
New Jersey, USA
Joined May 2003
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Majority Rule

I see our U.S. Federal Government to be entrenched in madness. My own State of New Jersey struggles to find new ways of raping it's own residents. I also believe the 2-party system of Republicans and Democrats have morphed into a good-guy & bad-guy game playing to maintain their own status quo and to support "their" way of life.
Our Government of, by the people and for the people, has changed to; by certain people and for certain people, with the purpose of controlling it's people rather than endorsing freedom, with responsibility, of the people.

My biggest problem, in a Democracy, is that 51% is considered a majority. I find this form of decision making to be frightening as there is too much room for error.

What I would like to see, and this is my question: Would our country be better off if the Majority Rule percentage were to be 95% ?

The first response I would expect to hear is: "You'd never get anything done". To which I respond: Perhaps only the right things would be done.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:23 AM
Out of Time
United States, TX
Joined Jul 2003
1,092 Posts
What I think you don't understand is that we are not a "Majority Rule" country.
What we are is a "Minority Rule" country.

If you doubt that, take a look at the crazy jurymandering of how district lines are drawn in order to make sure that minorities have control of entire urban areas.
Here's Sheila Jackson Lee's district map, and if you know the area, you can see that it's drawn to include as many minority areas as possible while leaving out non-minority areas.
http://www.jacksonlee.house.gov/district-map.shtml

I'm in favor of drawing district maps the way states and counties are drawn.
But these political districts are done in such a way as to make sure that minorities "get their fair share", and that means giving them control over the majority.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:31 AM
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New Jersey, USA
Joined May 2003
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If that were true, Ron Paul would be in the White House with no support.

I do see your frustration.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:50 AM
It's 5 O'clock Somewhere
RumRunner_1492's Avatar
Dayton, OH
Joined Feb 2006
417 Posts
We are not a majority rule country nor a democracy. We are a representative republic. That is very different from a majority rule government.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:53 AM
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New Jersey, USA
Joined May 2003
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I understand the difference. I support the republic, but don't see it.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 09:55 AM
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peterp1964's Avatar
Joined Oct 2005
659 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by David A Ramsey
I understand the difference. I support the republic, but don't see it.
start a secession movement ! or move to Teeksus !!
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 10:04 AM
Targeted and... FIRING !
D B Cooper's Avatar
United States, MI, Eastpointe
Joined Aug 2007
670 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by David A Ramsey
I see our U.S. Federal Government to be entrenched in madness. My own State of New Jersey struggles to find new ways of raping it's own residents. I also believe the 2-party system of Republicans and Democrats have morphed into a good-guy & bad-guy game playing to maintain their own status quo and to support "their" way of life.
Our Government of, by the people and for the people, has changed to; by certain people and for certain people, with the purpose of controlling it's people rather than endorsing freedom, with responsibility, of the people.

My biggest problem, in a Democracy, is that 51% is considered a majority. I find this form of decision making to be frightening as there is too much room for error.

What I would like to see, and this is my question: Would our country be better off if the Majority Rule percentage were to be 95% ?

The first response I would expect to hear is: "You'd never get anything done". To which I respond: Perhaps only the right things would be done.
I think the decisions would be much more responsible if they at least required 51% of the people expected to pay the bill be in favor of it. The single biggest thing that's fundamentally screwing things up is the de-couplig of taxation and representation.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 10:04 AM
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Japan
Joined Jun 2008
183 Posts
My vote goes to going back to a monarchy... It's the same level of cronism, corruption and incompetence, but at least you are not lied into believing that you can change things with a vote...

(meanwhile, beheading has proved to be quite effective)

(understand that however stupid my comment might look, it's not a troll but an honest belief)
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 10:10 AM
Out of Time
United States, TX
Joined Jul 2003
1,092 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by David A Ramsey
I understand the difference. I support the republic, but don't see it.
It's easy to see why you don't see it because of the way political district lines are drawn.

I do see the "intent" of trying to encourage representative districts that give minorities a bigger say, but the "result" is far different (another grand example of government "unintended consequences").

The intent is for minorities to have a seat at the table where important issues are discussed in Washington, but the result is that they elect people who disregard everything else except the focused agenda of whatever minority elected them at the time.
So without proper representation, minorities would have no say in anything, but the way it is now, minorities are running roughshod over the majority of the country.
The evidence for that is a healthcare bill that would ignore the wishes of 90% of this country in order to cater to the 10% who could be taken care of in many other ways that wouldn't harm the 90%.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 11:14 AM
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New Jersey, USA
Joined May 2003
1,987 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by D B Cooper
I think the decisions would be much more responsible if they at least required 51% of the people expected to pay the bill be in favor of it. The single biggest thing that's fundamentally screwing things up is the de-couplig of taxation and representation.

So if you want it, you pay for it ... also meaning if I don't want it, I don't get it and I don't pay for it. That works for me.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 11:27 AM
Registered User
New Jersey, USA
Joined May 2003
1,987 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Highflight
It's easy to see why you don't see it because of the way political district lines are drawn.


So without proper representation, minorities would have no say in anything, but the way it is now, minorities are running roughshod over the majority of the country.
The evidence for that is a healthcare bill that would ignore the wishes of 90% of this country in order to cater to the 10% who could be taken care of in many other ways that wouldn't harm the 90%.
I see your point. If the majority are "users", we're in deep trouble. Does look like we're heading in that direction, but right now they don't have to work that hard.
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Last edited by David A Ramsey; Sep 02, 2009 at 03:42 PM.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 12:39 PM
I got too many hobbies!
BRETT65's Avatar
United States, OK, Oklahoma City
Joined May 2009
51 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by peterp1964
start a secession movement ! or move to Teeksus !!

Where are you headed after the Republican governor moves in up there?
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 01:13 PM
An itch?. Scratch build.
eflightray's Avatar
South Wales U.K.
Joined Mar 2003
12,867 Posts
"My biggest problem, in a Democracy, is that 51% is considered a majority. I find this form of decision making to be frightening as there is too much room for error."

Worse to come.

That 51% is usually 51% of those that voted. So if only 50% of registered voters bothered to vote..................that majority is by 25% of the voters.

There has to be a better way.
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 01:17 PM
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United States, NC, Surf City
Joined Oct 2003
388 Posts
"Democracy is the worst form of govenment -- except for all the others." Winston Churchill
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Old Sep 02, 2009, 02:18 PM
Hi ya! Car ride!?
Sport Flyer's Avatar
Portage La Prairie, Manitoba Canada
Joined Sep 2003
733 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by G_de_Coligny
My vote goes to going back to a monarchy... It's the same level of cronism, corruption and incompetence, but at least you are not lied into believing that you can change things with a vote...

(meanwhile, beheading has proved to be quite effective)

(understand that however stupid my comment might look, it's not a troll but an honest belief)
Considering all the power you give your president and his cabinet, you essentially have one; you just get to change kings every four years.

I like the idea of 2/3rd rule as it increases the need for compromise without allowing the fringe elements to holdup the process.
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