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Old Jan 29, 2013, 11:45 AM
The Prez....... again
kenh3497's Avatar
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I have DraftSite on my PC at home. I cuss it every time I try to use it. Now with that said I've never set down and tried to learn it from scratch. THAT is what I should do instead of spending so much time on these forums. At one point in time I had a CAD program that I could use. It was a DOS based system and of course moving to windows kind of put that one out the window. You could run it in windows, but it seemed kind of "buggy".

I may give DraftSite another go. My problem is, I want to skip steps and get to the finished product NOW, yesterday would be better DraftSite does have a tutorial I should sit down and read. I'll just have to bite the bullet and print some of it so I can read and draw at the same time.

Ken
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Old Jan 29, 2013, 11:51 AM
Just Me
United States, OR, Salem
Joined Apr 2006
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Ken,

They also have many videos that, while boring at times, do give you a great "Insight" to "DraftSight" I've viewed many of them and have learned a great deal from them about the program.

Don
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Old Jan 29, 2013, 04:46 PM
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Joined Dec 1996
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Latest version of DesignCAD is at http://www.imsidesign.com/Products/D...7/Default.aspx

I bought my first DesignCAD back when it came on two 3.5" discs. Used it on an Ollivetti PC bought circa 1989, with a dot matrix printer. Though not a pro, I have a fair model aircraft plan drawing background and found it not all that hard to adapt to DCAD. Still have a copy of my first ever plan, laid out to an English mag's freeby pull out plan size and shape, 'tiled' from that dot matrix printer.

Idle thoughts. I always have drawn my plans up like they appear in model mags. The one time I tried 3D, my brain hurt and a week trying to draw a cube - no idea what size - sent me back to what I knew. Yes, it must be wonderful to do a 3D drawing and somehow deduce the formers, ribs and other wotzits from it, but I don't really need to. I once got my hands on a copy of AutoCAD, I think - an older version of whatever program reigns the CAD world. Again, a week to draw a line, though at least I knew how long it was.

According to the Spousal Unit, I have a rare and disturbing ability to RTFM (Read The Flippin' Manual) and my first DCAD actually came with one! Which may have helped me get to grips with the program. Now, after all these years, I'll buy the odd upgrade - am still using V19 that's about four years old and they're up to V22. But why bother with spending to replace something that works?

DCAD doesn't call it that, but has tiled printing. You can put a border or corner marks on each printed sheet and overlap the tile's printing, makes it a snip to paste together a wing or fuselage build plan. I keep a package of legal sized paper handy, sometimes it allows me to cut down on the number of sheets needed to print out a piece of a design.

If you have either a shopping urge or prefer a freeby, try http://www.doublecad.com/ for programs ranging from 'eye watering' to free in price.

CAD'ing is not impossible, but if you've no background or experience, be prepared to RTFM and start from the first page.

D
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Old Mar 06, 2013, 05:19 PM
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Has anyone had any experiance with Cleveland Designed Plans? I'm planning a world war 1 project{Rumpler C.4} in 1/6 scale...84''span. It's supposed to be one of their better sets of plans in their gold edition category.
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Old Mar 06, 2013, 05:43 PM
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I remember a DC-3 in the Smithsonian (in the mall) supposedly built from Cleveland PLans...It is/was a cutaway and was awesome.
I don't know how much was from the plans or the builder, but it looked great.

Some of their plans are designed for rubber, then enlarged to different scales.

That's not a lot of help, I know,but it's all I got..lol
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Old Mar 08, 2013, 04:59 PM
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Cleavland plans have the popular perception of being the "quality scale plans" of the era (30-40's) just before mine (50's to present). Dad and all his friends built Comet kits, but really wanted Cleavland. However, it has been my experience that the legend did not then,nor does it now , deliver, as far as reliably accurate (to prototype) model plans go.

I've been really amazed at the models designs from a company also from the Pre-WWII era. The scale accuracy is some of the best I've seen. The more examples i see the more I like them. They are of rather small format, at 1/16 scale, but people certainly could do worse! The name of th e outfit was Peerless. I'm begining to think it may have been a truth in advertizing thing. The cool thing about accuracy is that it never gets old or becomes outdated.

You owe it to yourself to check them out if you can. Hip Pocket Aerodynamics site has a number of them for down load viewing and printout. Kind of a hassel to join the dedicated plans forum (in excess of the normal join of the modeling forums) but well worth it. Also some interesting and copious tech data, etc. That in itself makes it worthwhile. Might also want to check out the plans and scale drawings by a fellow named Bell. IMHO, he's oft better than Peerless, but he's more modern. His forte is stick and tissue rubber scale but has done some facinationg work in solid scale modesl. All of which can be utilized and resized for R/C scale modelling.
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Old Mar 08, 2013, 05:42 PM
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As packard pursuit pointed out, disappointment can result from intense comparison.
I have the philosophy that they can't ALL be wrong, so I collect as many plans as possible,(or 3 views), and overlay them,and "average" the details..(sometimes they ARE all wrong)

I'm not quite the 'absolute' scale nut,so it works for me.

If you have a plane or plan in mind, share it, there's a lot of experience here, willing to help.

Oh darn-you already did.....the Rumpler ! sorry-...mind in gear, THEN mouth ! I'll be back.
http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2958

Check european plans suppliers-German plane plans are popular. he he he
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Old Mar 09, 2013, 10:37 AM
The Prez....... again
kenh3497's Avatar
United States, IA, Rockwell
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I guess the only way to get truly scale plans is to go direct to the factory and get them. Now if you only had a time machine to go back and get them with.

Ken
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Old Mar 09, 2013, 11:50 AM
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The Smithsonian has all those plans...Contact them and request 3 views.It takes a little time, they have many requests, and slow,Old people filling orders( Inside joke),ha ha, but they are accurate.renditions.
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Old Mar 09, 2013, 04:17 PM
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Collecting real aircraft drawings( usually parts and assembly drawings) are available IF you are truly interested. Some of us have been doing so for years. The internet is making it easier than ever. However, as in any endeavor, it takes specific work/effort to locate them. They are not going to drop right into your lap, 99 times out of 100 attemps! If your are serious about accurate building data you have be serious about looking. One of the biggest challenges I've come to realized is in learning to ask the right questions And let's not forget patience.

When you find the real deal, you may be shocked as to what you are being shown! Again, model wisdom is not always real aircraft wisdom. You may be startled at how simple/complex the real thing is/was, compared to whatever you 've convinced yourself it must be.
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Old Mar 09, 2013, 05:24 PM
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If you've only seen and built models,it's surprising how little you know about the full scale one.

I used to think all wing ribs looked like "Cub" wing ribs...That is SO not so !

I'm lucky to have a network of friends cultured over many years who help me find what I need.
Patience is a big part of it,as is hard work. I want to spend time at the Golden Age Air Museum caressing their 'in the bones' Monocoupe...A fair trade off is a donation to the Museum...With that,they may let me measure, photograph, and copy some parts.
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Old Mar 09, 2013, 10:34 PM
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Top one appears to be Piper rib. Would fit anything from a J-3 to Tripacer or Super Cub. Note that it is not a Clark Yairfoil., but rather USA 35B

Largest one appears to be a late Ryan/Mahoney type, probably Broaham. Note how thin the caps are cut for the wing spars. and that it is a Clark Y. Spirit ofSt Louis has exact same section, with the larger spar openings as shown, but has only a single diagonal forward of the main spar.

Lower would be pure guess and is possibly a glider section, given its airyer structure.

Would guess some of the others appear to be WWI types. Long skinny one Wright bros.??
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Old Mar 10, 2013, 05:04 AM
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Well done, Grasshopper ! you have learned well.
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Old Mar 10, 2013, 05:08 AM
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Well done, Grasshopper ! you have learned well.

Next test will have the placards covered...Ha ha.
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Old Mar 10, 2013, 06:04 AM
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And that brings us back to the deadly term "Drawings" of which the original must only have numerical indications of sizes rather than a line representation?

Otherwise we're back to base material inaccuracies - expansion and contraction of paper etc.

Regards Ian.
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