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Old Jul 29, 2013, 11:44 AM
Registered User
Calgary Alberta, Canada
Joined Feb 2008
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Eurgle winch

I am very happy with my eurgle winch. However last day I was out it started to slow down then stop working? I have put in my replacement already, but now I am curious what may have gone wrong? And whether it is feasible work on it?

Andrew
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Old Jul 29, 2013, 02:41 PM
toyboatskipper
Germany, BW, Stuttgart
Joined Mar 2012
47 Posts
Quote:
I am very happy with my eurgle winch
I am sorry, but maybe you will write "I was very ...." in future times.

Eurgle winches are not unknown for sudden death due to electronic failure.

Regards
Thomas
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Old Jul 29, 2013, 06:32 PM
Guz
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Tempe, AZ
Joined Dec 2005
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Yep, that is the typical method of failure for Eurgles. It's dead, as in "He's dead Jim! You take his tricorder. I'll take his wallet." dead.

I don't recommend them anymore.
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Old Jul 30, 2013, 05:19 AM
toyboatskipper
Germany, BW, Stuttgart
Joined Mar 2012
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Its a pity, otherwise, as long as they are working, they are quite good at low cost. Some say for that low price they just buy a number of them and just replace when one died - but to me that is waste of material and even you can have a sack of spares it can ruin a complete race event due to failure and resulting trouble. Just for recrational-sparetime-skippers that can be neglected.
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Old Jul 30, 2013, 10:00 AM
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Barbados
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Never had the pleasure of owning one,but every post i've ever read says it's dead.I wonder if there's somewone like the aircraft guys who could mod it for reliability all we need is one smart guy who knows more than me.
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Old Jul 30, 2013, 10:35 AM
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Joined Mar 2007
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Seems what is left and working: RGM's not cheap or light but absoute working. But d'ont forget armwinches based on Hitec family...7955 or ealier like 5755 ect works fine trimmed for 180 degrees movement and with 1:2 exchange.
I've used them for years now without any mishaps.
My present boat is though too narrow for a armwinch so now I have joined the RGMfamily. (Croatian Kantun)
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Old Jul 30, 2013, 03:44 PM
Guz
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Tempe, AZ
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Hobbyking has two large Vigor drum winches (each different torque). I got them in, but just haven't had time to run them through their paces.
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Old Jul 31, 2013, 03:33 AM
OlivierFRA100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airplay View Post
Seems what is left and working: RGM's not cheap or light but absoute working. But d'ont forget armwinches based on Hitec family...7955 or ealier like 5755 ect works fine trimmed for 180 degrees movement and with 1:2 exchange.
I've used them for years now without any mishaps.
My present boat is though too narrow for a armwinch so now I have joined the RGMfamily. (Croatian Kantun)
+1, but I have an armwinch in my BP, quite narrow too ;-)
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Old Jul 31, 2013, 05:11 AM
toyboatskipper
Germany, BW, Stuttgart
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Never had the pleasure of owning one,but every post i've ever read says it's dead.I wonder if there's somewone like the aircraft guys who could mod it for reliability all we need is one smart guy who knows more than me.
From what I have heard about it and from what I know from similar failures experienced with several different types of servos (observed and in some cases also by myself) it is more or less simply a matter of too much current for the used electronic parts. It can occur quite quickly but also can last for a while and seems to work perfectly…
There are two possible scenes: One the motor collapse mainly caused by overheating and the dying motor in result can also kill the electronic by short circuits. Second is the electronic amplifier section which is not able to handle the amount of current and resulting heat.

Then you also can have just simply bad production constructions as well: I know of small servos where the cables are placed right over the amplifier parts. After some time they start to melt…

This pic is from a german forum Network and shows perfectly a bad package situation in a very small servo for wings:



Normally most servos works well over some time as long as the servo is not under heavy load for longer time but only for short moments and maybe also cooled by air ventilation e.g. used as only light stressed ruder servo in an glider. But used as servo for big flaps it will collapse after some time due to amount of current per time and resulting overheating.
And when servos are used as sail winch (and much worse as sail servo with long sheeting arm) the times of heavy loads are longer than some electronic concepts are designed for….

Probably the Eurgle winches would "just" need a redesign of their electronic and/or motor to make them stronger – not in term of power (it is already surprisingly powerful) but in lifetime under load.

Sometimes you get what you pay for – and there is a reason behind things you get for just little money compared to much more costly items.
(But not always the more expensive items beware you from negative experiences…)

Very often there are motors in use with only very simple construction and their life time is very limited. For example not all motors have solid brushes made out of carbon but are simply made out of very thin metal sheet. After some time the "brushes" are just gone or melting and causing short circuit thus killing the electronic. I know that this happened with expensive german servos, where due to the small size no other kind of motor could be used - so said by the manufacturer. These servos had been very good as long as they work but from point of construction they have a limited time of life – but where do you find any information about that? And would you buy a servo where the manufacturer says working time about 80 cycles under load? Its like a car – no car will last for all times without need for replacements parts even on very structural parts. Some will last longer, some not. And again, it can be but must not a matter of money you pay for it… ,-)

So for Eurgle: Spent them a stronger motor and a stronger electronic and it will be better. At least I have not heard of gear failures up to now ,-) But perhaps these parts would not fit to the existing case and would need new toolings for a new case....
Sometimes it is also not a matter that a manufactorer does not care about it but that he simply do not get what he would need for such type of servo. Maybe does not get that parts in such small numbers for his manufacturing and even if he could the price would be much higher than right now and makes the product unattractive (but maybe just on first sight...)


Regards
Thomas
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Old Jul 31, 2013, 09:15 AM
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Barbados
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Thanks Thomas for your overview,hopefully we can get a Toyota winch cheap last forever and never needs parts.
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Old Jul 31, 2013, 06:23 PM
Rusty
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Auckland, New Zealand
Joined Feb 2006
862 Posts
There are two things that will extend the life of your winch. Each are simple and low cost and yet very rarely seen?!

Use a Stollery Power Lever on an arm winch.

Limit peak overload currents with a Polyswitch.
If the fuse is sized to only trip on sustained overload it will help protect the electronics without impeding too much on performance. On removal of load the fuse auto resets and you are off again.
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Old Aug 04, 2013, 06:40 AM
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Joined Feb 2008
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Eurgle Sail Winch

Hi Guys
I use a Eurgle Sail Winch 16D_22YMB in a IOM racing yacht
First I used a 2 cell lipo 7.4 volts and killed 4 of them because that is the way the boat was set up when I bought it.
I checked and found winch was good to around 7 volts
But the lipo when charged was more like 8volts
So I now use a 6 volt nmh which when charged is 7 and so far have not damaged the winch in 12 months
Enjoy your sailing Garry
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Old Aug 04, 2013, 08:14 AM
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Blackpool, Lancs
Joined Feb 2006
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Good point about the voltage. Some components are more picky than others.
Assuming that the motor and position sensor are OK, and it "just" the electronics that have died, if mounting the electronics in an external box is feasible then the board out of any servo will do the required control, just needing a modest amount of power circuit to drive the motor. I used to make speed controls that way before better ones came on the market.
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