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Old Jul 08, 2004, 03:11 PM
Jos Truyen
Guest
n/a Posts
Ball bearing problems

I like flying with small acro trainers.

I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg - APC 12 x
6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the engine
lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
accepted no warranty.

I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in. A few
weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did come
apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.

As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.

Can there be a common reason ?

Thanks for anny comment.


Old Jul 08, 2004, 03:11 PM
Vance Howard
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

Jos Truyen wrote:
> I like flying with small acro trainers.
>
> I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg - APC 12 x
> 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the engine
> lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
> damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
> accepted no warranty.
>
> I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in. A few
> weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did come
> apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
>
> As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
>
> Can there be a common reason ?
>
> Thanks for anny comment.
>
>

15% nitro runs hot. Were you running your engines too lean? The chrome
plating either got too hot, or you got hold of defective engines.
Old Jul 08, 2004, 03:26 PM
Registered User
papamac's Avatar
seattle, WA
Joined Mar 2004
257 Posts
you should only be running 15% in high performance or cold weather applications. with a trainer type of aircraft you only need 5% and tune it a little rich on the ground as it will lean out once you are airborn.
papamac is offline Find More Posts by papamac
Old Jul 08, 2004, 05:01 PM
Permanently Banned
San Jose Ca / RSA flyer
Joined May 2003
8,030 Posts
MAYBE NOT ENOUGH LUBE IN THE COOL-POWER FUEL ( or maybe no lube )

Run the engine slobbering rich and check for oil-residue from muffler. You'll see the problem
hall woo is offline Find More Posts by hall woo
Old Jul 08, 2004, 05:11 PM
James D Jones
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

Vance Howard wrote:
> Jos Truyen wrote:
>
>> I like flying with small acro trainers.
>>
>> I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg -
>> APC 12 x 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction.
>> Suddenly the engine lost some power. Reason : several balls in the
>> rear ball bearing where damaged, and the particles did ruin the
>> engine. OS (Graupner Germany) accepted no warranty.
>>
>> I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung
>> in. A few weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above.
>> Chrome did come apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
>>
>> As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
>>
>> Can there be a common reason ?
>>

> 15% nitro runs hot. Were you running your engines too lean? The
> chrome plating either got too hot, or you got hold of defective
> engines.


The last I heard, Cool Power used about 16% all-synthetic oil. Your
2-stroke engines are probably better off using fuel containing at least
18% oil with at least a small amount being castor oil. The castor oil
adds a margin of safety in case of a lean, too hot run.

Jim - AMA 501383

Old Jul 08, 2004, 07:11 PM
Paul McIntosh
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

This seems to be more and more common with engines running Cool Power. I
just sold 4 sets of ceramic bearings to some heli fliers using the OS 50
SX-H engines who had exactly the same problem. My advice would be to make
sure you use a rear bearing with a high speed plastic retainer and run a
fuel other than Cool Power.

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Jos Truyen" <jos.truyen1@pandora.be> wrote in message
news:FEgHc.178660$D66.8691743@phobos.telenet-ops.be...
> I like flying with small acro trainers.
>
> I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg - APC 12

x
> 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the engine
> lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
> damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
> accepted no warranty.
>
> I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in. A

few
> weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did come
> apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
>
> As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
>
> Can there be a common reason ?
>
> Thanks for anny comment.
>
>



Old Jul 08, 2004, 11:11 PM
Andrew Noll
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

the 50 sx is a ringed engine....unlike the abc engines that must be run in 2
cycle to come up to temp for proper piston cylinder fit a ringed engine
should be broke in 4 cycle at first then after a few tanks to 4 cycle
breaking into 2 cycle (plenty rich) I suspect a lack of lube and a 12 x 6
prop seams to be on the large side (too high of load...too much heat) for
this engine it might be ok after breaking in on a smaller prop, by running a
smaller prop for break in it will run at a higher rpm and what comes with
that is a lighter load with more fuel that come with more oil which carries
away the heat as well as more lubrication I have read the Os manual and
see that they recommend a 12 x 6 but personal experience with my 50 sx has
shown that a 11 x 6 is a much better choice for this engine... mine is 3
years old and I have run 11 gallons of power master 15 % thru it and it
still has original bearings and is still as strong and smooth as ever....I
ran the first 3 tanks in full 4 cycle then the next 5 in a 2 - 4 break and
since then in a semi rich 2 cycle all with apc 11x6



"Paul McIntosh" <paul@mcintoshcentral.com> wrote in message
news:C0kHc.4441$Fc7.813851@stones.force9.net...
> This seems to be more and more common with engines running Cool Power. I
> just sold 4 sets of ceramic bearings to some heli fliers using the OS 50
> SX-H engines who had exactly the same problem. My advice would be to make
> sure you use a rear bearing with a high speed plastic retainer and run a
> fuel other than Cool Power.
>
> --
> Paul McIntosh
> http://www.rc-bearings.com
> "Jos Truyen" <jos.truyen1@pandora.be> wrote in message
> news:FEgHc.178660$D66.8691743@phobos.telenet-ops.be...
> > I like flying with small acro trainers.
> >
> > I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg - APC

12
> x
> > 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the engine
> > lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
> > damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
> > accepted no warranty.
> >
> > I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in. A

> few
> > weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did come
> > apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
> >
> > As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
> >
> > Can there be a common reason ?
> >
> > Thanks for anny comment.
> >
> >

>
>



Old Jul 09, 2004, 01:11 AM
Geoff Sanders
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

This is speculation on my part, but it appears that you are in Belguim, so do
you perchance have engines designed for use with 0% nitro, which will have
higher compression than an engine designed for nitro? 15% nitro in a high
compression engine swinging a large prop, and using inadequate oil in the mix is
bound to spell disaster.

Paul McIntosh, you surely know whether OS and Magnum suppliy European engines
with higher compression than US engines. Let us know!

Geoff Sanders



Old Jul 09, 2004, 03:11 AM
Paul McIntosh
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

Therein lies the difference. You used Powermaster which has a very good lube
package.

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Andrew Noll" <nollandrew@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:SOSdnYSBALana3Dd4p2dnA@comcast.com...
> the 50 sx is a ringed engine....unlike the abc engines that must be run in

2
> cycle to come up to temp for proper piston cylinder fit a ringed engine
> should be broke in 4 cycle at first then after a few tanks to 4 cycle
> breaking into 2 cycle (plenty rich) I suspect a lack of lube and a 12 x 6
> prop seams to be on the large side (too high of load...too much heat) for
> this engine it might be ok after breaking in on a smaller prop, by running

a
> smaller prop for break in it will run at a higher rpm and what comes with
> that is a lighter load with more fuel that come with more oil which

carries
> away the heat as well as more lubrication I have read the Os manual and
> see that they recommend a 12 x 6 but personal experience with my 50 sx

has
> shown that a 11 x 6 is a much better choice for this engine... mine is 3
> years old and I have run 11 gallons of power master 15 % thru it and it
> still has original bearings and is still as strong and smooth as ever....I
> ran the first 3 tanks in full 4 cycle then the next 5 in a 2 - 4 break and
> since then in a semi rich 2 cycle all with apc 11x6
>
>
>
> "Paul McIntosh" <paul@mcintoshcentral.com> wrote in message
> news:C0kHc.4441$Fc7.813851@stones.force9.net...
> > This seems to be more and more common with engines running Cool Power.

I
> > just sold 4 sets of ceramic bearings to some heli fliers using the OS 50
> > SX-H engines who had exactly the same problem. My advice would be to

make
> > sure you use a rear bearing with a high speed plastic retainer and run a
> > fuel other than Cool Power.
> >
> > --
> > Paul McIntosh
> > http://www.rc-bearings.com
> > "Jos Truyen" <jos.truyen1@pandora.be> wrote in message
> > news:FEgHc.178660$D66.8691743@phobos.telenet-ops.be...
> > > I like flying with small acro trainers.
> > >
> > > I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg -

APC
> 12
> > x
> > > 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the

engine
> > > lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
> > > damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
> > > accepted no warranty.
> > >
> > > I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in.

A
> > few
> > > weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did

come
> > > apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
> > >
> > > As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
> > >
> > > Can there be a common reason ?
> > >
> > > Thanks for anny comment.
> > >
> > >

> >
> >

>
>



Old Jul 09, 2004, 03:11 AM
Paul McIntosh
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

They are all the same. Many of the Brits complain about the performance on
low/no nitro fuels with the Japanese and Chinese engines. Many of them are
now seeing that the engines are designed for the mass market (US).

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Geoff Sanders" <AMA11285@hevanet.com> wrote in message
news:40EE1BF5.DDDEC06B@hevanet.com...
> This is speculation on my part, but it appears that you are in Belguim, so

do
> you perchance have engines designed for use with 0% nitro, which will have
> higher compression than an engine designed for nitro? 15% nitro in a high
> compression engine swinging a large prop, and using inadequate oil in the

mix is
> bound to spell disaster.
>
> Paul McIntosh, you surely know whether OS and Magnum suppliy European

engines
> with higher compression than US engines. Let us know!
>
> Geoff Sanders
>
>
>



Old Jul 11, 2004, 01:11 PM
Paul McIntosh
Guest
n/a Posts
Re: Ball bearing problems

Just another thought. If the chrome came off the balls, they you have a
real big problem! The balls are solid chrome-steel, not plated!

--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Jos Truyen" <jos.truyen1@pandora.be> wrote in message
news:FEgHc.178660$D66.8691743@phobos.telenet-ops.be...
> I like flying with small acro trainers.
>
> I used a OS 50 SX for several months on a Soprano (1,55m - 2,6 kg - APC 12

x
> 6 - Cool Power 15 % Nitro) with great satisfaction. Suddenly the engine
> lost some power. Reason : several balls in the rear ball bearing where
> damaged, and the particles did ruin the engine. OS (Graupner Germany)
> accepted no warranty.
>
> I replaced the OS by a Magnum XLS 46. Performed well after runnung in. A

few
> weeks later : sudden power loss and same story as above. Chrome did come
> apart of the balls of the rear ball bearing.
>
> As far as I heard, this happens very seldom.
>
> Can there be a common reason ?
>
> Thanks for anny comment.
>
>



 


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