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Old Apr 27, 2012, 08:27 PM
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Eddie P's Avatar
United States, NV, Reno
Joined Mar 2000
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I noticed those "active gun ports" as well No free rides on this one, everyone has a job to do. The way I see it the model has a front inlet FSA of about 85 percent, measuring from the apex of the lip. Include the gun ports, the gear doors when open and you have a lot more actually, probably a bit over 100 percent.

I re-routed some of the servo leads from the front of the model and taped them nicely along the inlet. Also I made a splitter to house the wing servo leads (8 servo wires in all so it could get very messy). The splitter is as narrow as possible and is shaped like a symmetrical wing, the wires run inside and lay very flat. I had to organize them so they would fit and route into the splitter easily, it took a little head scratching but it fits and is "field usable" in other words not too hard to get wires in and out in a hurry while talking to others and multi-tasking.

I'm breaking in my packs as I write, so my two new 6s packs for this model will be ready to fly when I'm finally ready.

For the first flights I have my flaps set on a 5 second actuation time and my speed brakes set for a 1 second actuation time. Speed brakes - you need them when you need them and you don't want them when you don't need them so they are a little faster. I notice the stock ARF servos work "ok" but on a few occasions I notice the "reversed" servos have a small twitch to them at the far end of the travel. So fortunately I was able to program my radio to eliminate that area of the servo range (90 percent gives smooth operation on one of the servos) so I don't get the occasional "twitch" from those suspect servos after slight programming changes. They seem to be working smoothly (relatively) after some amount of "burn in", letting the servos receive RX signal and work occasionally.

Oh yeah, one more thing on the splitter - I don't want anyone to think this is "necessary" IMHO. This is just me having a little fun customizing and optimizing the ARF. As seen, they fly fine enough with just wires dangling but this is one way to reduce ducting losses and improve performance just a little.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 09:56 PM
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United States, TN, Jackson
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GREAT job, Eddie!!!...I chose the lazy route and used a soldering iron to make reliefs in the fuselage to accept the wires...I then used aluminum tape and secured the wires to the sides of the fuselage...The forward steering servo/door servo/retract servo wires are just taped to the side as I couldn't get down in the cramped space to remove foam making the wires flush...Since I carry my planes in one piece I didn't want to make the effort of a streamlined hollow tube to place the wing wires...Again, great job!!!....Here is a pic of my inlet---Pretty close to being clean as a whistle!!!

Kevin
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 10:42 PM
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Wow Kevin it doesn't get any cleaner than that. Nice work! Sometimes I bring my whole fleet along for a ride so I need mine to break down. But if I didn't need to I'd have rather done what you did - cleaner, easier and better.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 10:52 PM
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Wow Kevin it doesn't get any cleaner than that. Nice work! Sometimes I bring my whole fleet along for a ride so I need mine to break down. But if I didn't need to I'd have rather done what you did - cleaner, easier and better.
I dunno about better!!!..Definately EASIER!!!......With my setup if I loose a servo in the wing I actually have MORE work ahead of me to change it than with your setup...Unless I cheat and solder the servo wires in on the replacement servo......I admire the work and thought that you have put into your Sabre...

I have a pretty large SUV so I can stack, rack, and pack quite a few planes for a days flying...I HATE taking planes apart!!!...Digs into my flying time...... Plus, the flying field is only 10 minutes away so I can go home, unload, get another supply of planes, and head out to the field for more flying!!!...I'm VERY fortunate in that regard......

Kevin
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 11:09 PM
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I have a Yukon XL but I have a couple big planes too that throw a wrench into the plan I know what you mean though, I prefer single piece airplanes of this size. My nearly 10 year old El Bandito is the same size and nearly always a one piece airplane; it's a serious hassle to take apart between air lines, tubes, hardware, etc. It's so, so very much better to leave that one alone and just stack her on the bigger models! Funny thing is, the El Bandito can be taken apart completely - two piece fuselage splits ant the fan-thrust tube joint, stabs and tail come off, the wings come off - a great traveling planer and all very easy to do if you have the necessity and time, but it's like putting a puzzle back together so I avoid it when I can. When I'm able to with the Sabre I certainly will leave it in one piece too.
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Old Apr 27, 2012, 11:40 PM
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I have a heart condition that I was born with...The last straw was in 98 degree heat with high humidity I took my 111cc Sukhoi to the flying field...I put it together and was so exhausted after doing so I just sat in a lawn chair for a few hours waiting for the sun to go down...I packed up, left, and later sold the plane...I no longer have any large planes or turbines that require a ton of work to get in the air...I also went and got my heart repaired so things aren't as bad as they used to be...But I still can't exert myself too hard in high heat/humidity conditions...

Kevin
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 12:39 AM
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Well done getting the heart fixed! Still, something to be said about high fun factor, low hassle models. I think some of my most enjoyable models have been the simplest ones that I always fly. My little Parkzone T-28 foamie (and even my lowly xagi) is about one of the most enjoyable little models I've ever owned - nothing to write on and on about or show off in the pits - but simply because it's given me so many enjoyable flights with little maintenance.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 12:55 AM
deltas are cool
AIR SALLY's Avatar
Tehachapi ,CA.
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i did a splitter for my mig it works great for keeping the wires out of the air and fan rotor
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 08:11 PM
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Canada, ON, L'Orignal
Joined Nov 2010
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Yeah I have a little Hobby King T-45 (64mm) and it's the same. Just a joy to fly around the park. No hassles, no stress and loads of fun. Same goes for my 64mm Stinger - but it's a lot smaller and substantially quicker. So the heart gets going when I fly that one.

But I just love 90mm jets and F-86's. This F-86 is just about the perfect 90mm for me.

I'm trying to decide between something similar to Eddie's splitter or Kevins tape method?? I'd like to be able to remove the wings. Stops a lot of car and hangar rash - but I can see this one is going to be a "pain in the big one" every time.

I'll post some photos later tonight.
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Old Apr 28, 2012, 08:16 PM
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Yeah I have a little Hobby King T-45 (64mm) and it's the same. Just a joy to fly around the park. No hassles, no stress and loads of fun. Same goes for my 64mm Stinger - but it's a lot smaller and substantially quicker. So the heart gets going when I fly that one.

But I just love 90mm jets and F-86's. This F-86 is just about the perfect 90mm for me.

I'm trying to decide between something similar to Eddie's splitter or Kevins tape method?? I'd like to be able to remove the wings. Stops a lot of car and hangar rash - but I can see this one is going to be a "pain in the big one" every time.

I'll post some photos later tonight.
If you are going to take this one apart you need to do what Eddie did...I can't see any other alternative if you plan on taking this plane apart...

Kevin
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 12:08 AM
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Pueblo, Colorado
Joined Jul 2005
602 Posts
I like the splinter idea, but I also think the fan needs as much uninterupted air as possible..I did the "tape it down" method and my power went way the heck up..
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 12:13 AM
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Yeah thanks Kevin. I keep looking at it too but it always ends up back at the splitter option if you want to remove the wings. I can't make up my mind yet . I'm going to take one more look at maybe routing the wires aft behind the thrust tube but I suspect the end result will be the same. I'll probably just leave the wings on and be done with it.

Finished my nose gear door mod tonight. I opted for a piece of 0.025 light weight pushrod wire formed into a loop (actually it's more the shape of the omega symbol) and two small pieces of push rod tube, hot glued to the door. The tube allows the wire to pivot a little during open/close, otherwise it hangs up on the leg and jams. This option allows you to pinch the wire loop a little to pop it out of the tubes and disconnect the door from the nose leg.

It was a pain to setup properly and took a few prototypes to get it figured out. Not my best work - I still have a small gap between the fwd and the aft doors, and the colour is all wrong (the metallic silver I have isn't right but it's all I've got). At least it's a bit more scale now.

Here's a few pics.
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 05:35 AM
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As far as wires vs splitter - if you want your wings removable the splitter, thought requiring some work, is minimally invasive if you make it into an thin airfoil shape. Very little drag, might even be less drag than lots of wires on the ducting surface under a tape job.
...

Anybody ever have a limit switch break on their gear? My nose gear ran until the motor stopped from the over amp protection apparently as the down lock metal block inside the retract went all the way aft. The trunion no longer had a down lock. so the result was a nose leg that just rotated freely which ever way it felt like. I took apart the gear to look and indeed the limit switch had come off and then was crushed by the lock when it went all the way to the stop.

Also one of my "ARF" aileron servos has shown signs of being too weak for flight - I was ready to maiden tomorrow (even with the nose gear manually locked down and the retract action taken out of service). I was testing all the controls for proper throws and I noticed the right side aileron would not center - at all. In fact it was jumping teeth and could be manually pushed and pulled.

So everyone who bought the kit can say "ha ha, we told you so!" But nothing lost really, I have spare servos and it's a 10 minute fix as I'll snip the wires and solder a new one in place (a better one). So far everything else has worked perfectly and I really thought I was set for flight tomorrow. Well this is RC airplanes in a nut shell though. It will get sorted.

Oh, to back up previous reports on checking everything out - when I balanced my fan I pulled the whole unit to inspect and noticed one of the fan mount blocks was barely attached. Check everything. A quick fix up front will save lots of hassles later!
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 06:42 AM
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United States, NM, Farmington
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Nice mods so far. Good stuff. Vanderbrander nice job on the gear door. Would you mind giving some dimensions for the sections on that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanderbrander View Post
Yeah thanks Kevin. I keep looking at it too but it always ends up back at the splitter option if you want to remove the wings. I can't make up my mind yet . I'm going to take one more look at maybe routing the wires aft behind the thrust tube but I suspect the end result will be the same. I'll probably just leave the wings on and be done with it.

Finished my nose gear door mod tonight. I opted for a piece of 0.025 light weight pushrod wire formed into a loop (actually it's more the shape of the omega symbol) and two small pieces of push rod tube, hot glued to the door. The tube allows the wire to pivot a little during open/close, otherwise it hangs up on the leg and jams. This option allows you to pinch the wire loop a little to pop it out of the tubes and disconnect the door from the nose leg.

It was a pain to setup properly and took a few prototypes to get it figured out. Not my best work - I still have a small gap between the fwd and the aft doors, and the colour is all wrong (the metallic silver I have isn't right but it's all I've got). At least it's a bit more scale now.

Here's a few pics.
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Old Apr 29, 2012, 11:46 AM
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Yep---You could have more drag with the wires taped to the sides as the raised "bumps" would definately cause a separation of airflow in the duct... Mine is a compromise---I used a soldering iron to make reliefs in the foam of the fuselage to accept the wing wires...Those wires when taped down are completely flush with the duct...The wires in the nose I couldn't get the soldering iron in the tight space to get the wires flush...I just mashed them into the foam to get the wires as flush as possible and taped them down...

With the airfoiled splitter I can see minimal duct obstruction and minimal drag consequences...Not enough to see any measurable differences in thrust over no wiring exposed if your splitter is made with a rounded nose and a sharp trailing edge...If you were an engineer you could see a slight rise in pressure at the site of the splitter which could be eliminated by "area ruling" the duct at that point...This would be getting very picky by the n'th degree and not worth that amount of effort!!!...Eddies splitter looks like it will do its job very well...

Great job on the nose door, Vander!!!...Did you do anything different over the way this mod was shown earlier in the thread besides the Omega wire???....Yours seems to fit VERY flush....Well done!!!

Kevin
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