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Old Apr 20, 2014, 08:03 AM
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Help!
TT-25 Tips and Use

Hello all! I have had some questions, and seen some concerns in threads about the use of the TT-25s, and the best way to mount, and use them.

This thread will be dedicated to tips, tricks, and getting the most out of the TT-25

First a quick description of the TT-25:

The TT-25 is a revolution in how sound for your RC aircraft or ground vehicle is made! The TT-25 is not a speaker, but a new product that turns your whole airplane into the speaker! Almost half the weight, smaller size, better bass response, and NO NEED TO CUT HOLES to install speakers!

Up to 108db from a single TT-25 at 1M on only 12V and 0.5A! Open air measurement, with a piece of foam attached to the face as the sound producing surface.

I have done hours and hours of testing to ensure the best possible output, and longevity of the TT-25.

General information on volume, tone, and mounting:

Volume:
Material type, density and thickness all have an impact on volume as well as tone, although it may not be as dramatic as some may expect. During testing we have tested these against the Max2-SPL extensively. In every tests, close, and distant, the TT-25 comes out on top volume wise. In some cases, it may be as little as 2db, in others it may be a more dramatic 10db increase. This seems to be the case on materials ranging from EPO/EPP/EPS foam to balsa and covering.

The 108db max measured was considerably higher than anything measured from the Max2-SPL. Second hand reports from customers with other systems report that a single TT-25 is only slightly lower in output than the 4" speaker. We cannot confirm this, as we have done no direct comparisons with other systems, but we have tried quality 4" speakers on the MrRCSound V4.1 and can say for certain that a single TT-25 beats the 4" speaker hands down in volume output, and is a fraction of the size and weight.

Additionally, peak volume tends to drop fast when the speaker is not pointed directly at you, since the TT-25 causes a large part of the airframe/body to act as a resonator, the sound is much more even, and will give a greater impression of overall volumes from all angles.

Tone/Quality:
Tone and quality is affected by material type, density, and thickness, but again, not as much as some may expect. Tone on a TT-25 in a foam airframe is considerably deeper than the tone from a Max2-SPL. From our tests, the tone and quality of a single TT-25 is good, we have heard reports of significantly improved quality when using two TT-25s. This may be the case, although both instillations sound good to us. From our tests the quality is better on the TT-25 than the Max2-SPL, which is good as well. Making sure you have it mounted in a good location helps with the quality of the sound, but to our ears the TT-25 is on top for quality of sound as well.

Install:
Install of the TT-25 is strait forward. If possible mount the TT-25 so it is on an outside surface of the fuselage/body. This will allow that surface to resonate into the open air. Mounting deep within the fuselage or body will reduce overall output.

Specific tips for mounting and testing:

Placement:
The TT-25 requires a space of at least 1"x1" that is relatively flat, and on an surface that allows it to resonate to he outside air. The larger the surface area the better resonance, and the better the output. Again we are talking about small increases 3-4db at 1M, but every little bit counts. A larger area of 3"x3" will give slightly better, noticeable, output over a 1"x1" surface.

Material Type:
As stated before, tone and volume do depend on material type, but the overall changed is not as dramatic as some may believe. Normally lighter, less dense material such as balsa will yield high volume output, but a lower tone, and maybe some loss in quality. To increase bass tone, you may want to put a piece of foam about 1/4" to 1/2" thick between the balsa and the TT-25 for mounting.

For foam, a general rule of thumb is a db loss of 2-3db per 1/4" of thickness. So 1" of foam may be 6-9db lower than 1/4". However, this trade off also allows for a deeper tone. For a good mix, I have found 1/4" -1/2" of foam for mounting is optimal. If your fuselage/body has thick foam, conceder trimming it down to 1/4"-1/2" for an area around the TT-25. The larger this area, the better the output.

Mounting:
Mounting the TT-25s is critical to good sound production. The front ring must have a good solid seal to a relatively flat surface, and there must be room abound it for it to move slightly. Make sure none of the sides are rubbing on anything, as this could hinder sound production. The pre applied 3M adhesive is very good, we have tested it for over 3 hours of run time. However some reports of the TT-25 not adhering well have been reported. This may be due to the type of foam or material, a painted surface, contaminants, or just plain too smooth. It is advisable to remove paint, and roughen the mounting surface.

Should the 3M adhesive fail to stick, don't panic. Simply peel the 3M adhesive off the TT-25 to expose the clear plastic ring. Put a bead of foam safe CA around the ring, and spray the mounting surface with CA accelerator if possible. Align the TT-25 and press firmly to the mounting surface and hold for a few seconds. Once the CA has dried it creates a tight bond, but can also be removed if you need to move the TT-25 in the future.

Feel free to post your tips, hints, and experiences with the TT-25 here. The more info we have, the better.

Andrew
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Last edited by MrRCFlying; Apr 20, 2014 at 09:49 AM.
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Old Apr 21, 2014, 04:30 PM
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Pub Head's Avatar
Joined Oct 2011
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My brother and I have 2 each of the original speakers but decided to pick up 2 each of these new ones. So far we have installed one each in our fms p47s just behind the firewall. Volume and tone are good. As soon as weather improves we will get a two plane flight up and see how they sound in the air....with a two plane formation should sound pretty amazing. The other two we have are going in our me109 and fw190 that should be flight ready in a week. The adhesive needs help as we did find that the speakers will vibrate loose from the foam fuse. A tad of epoxy has stopped that. We'll keep you posted:-)
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Old Apr 22, 2014, 05:35 AM
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United States, FL, Kissimmee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
Install:
Install of the TT-25 is strait forward. If possible mount the TT-25 so it is on an outside surface of the fuselage/body. This will allow that surface to resonate into the open air. Mounting deep within the fuselage or body will reduce overall output.
Andrew, please post photos of mounting the TT-25 outside surface of the fuselage/body.
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Old Apr 22, 2014, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by czorzella View Post
Andrew, please post photos of mounting the TT-25 outside surface of the fuselage/body.
Let me clarify that statement. The inside part of an outside surface. Arg.... Still does not make sense.....

Umm... Not a surface that has no access to the outside, so no cross members buried within the fuselage, etc. You want to mount them to the to a inside surface that resonates to the outside air. So not actually placed on the outside of the aircraft.

Let me re-word that in the tips so it makes more sense. If I can. LOL

Andrew
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Old Apr 22, 2014, 06:17 AM
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United States, FL, Kissimmee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
Let me clarify that statement. The inside part of an outside surface. Arg.... Still does not make sense.....

Umm... Not a surface that has no access to the outside, so no cross members buried within the fuselage, etc. You want to mount them to the to a inside surface that resonates to the outside air. So not actually placed on the outside of the aircraft.

Let me re-word that in the tips so it makes more sense. If I can. LOL

Andrew
LOL, pretty confusing but understandable. Thanks!
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Old Apr 27, 2014, 11:31 AM
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Hong Kong, Hong Kong Island, Central And Western District
Joined Jun 2008
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Ok. I ordered the v4.1 car truck card with the vague intention of installing it with TT25s into my RC trucks and cars.
i havent really thought it through though...has anyone any tips on whether or not TT25 could be used effectively onto a lexan plastic truck or car body? any installation tips?
thx
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Old Apr 27, 2014, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Levendis View Post
Ok. I ordered the v4.1 car truck card with the vague intention of installing it with TT25s into my RC trucks and cars.
i havent really thought it through though...has anyone any tips on whether or not TT25 could be used effectively onto a lexan plastic truck or car body? any installation tips?
thx
Glue a piece of foam about 3X3 on to the underside of the body, then mount the TT-25 to it. Probably use CA for mounting, as it will be vibrating up and down, so it may loosen easier. Doing this increase the db by a couple, and improved the tone.

Andrew
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Old Apr 27, 2014, 04:57 PM
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United States, FL, Hollywood
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I used epoxy with my A320 Airbus. So far no problems using two speakers. I want 4 speakers now that I know the jetliner can handle it.
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Old May 03, 2014, 08:09 AM
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Balsa and Built Up Planes

Hey everyone,
There have been some questions about TT-25 use in Balsa and Built Up planes. I have done some limited testing in a Balsa box, and a built up wing, but have not been able to do a whole lot more as 99% of my planes are foam. On the tests I have done, the results were very good, but there have been a couple of cases that were reported that the built up plane was so tightly assembled that it did not transmit the sound as well as the foam counterparts.

A good friend of mine has done some further testing, with some very encouraging results, and has come up with an alternate method for built up planes. This seems to have worked out VERY well for him, and wished me to pass it along. Here are his findings with a couple of pictures.

"I have some amazing results here regarding the placement of transducers in a balsa model. Attached are some pics showing where to mount them. I can further explain it also.

These pics are with 2 transducers mounted in either side of an Extra 300 wing for testing. We cut out only the bottom ultracote and attached the foam to the top on the inside of the wing with CA. It acts as a huge diaphragm. We also glued the balsa frame inside to the ultra cote so that it should never loosen up the covering from the vibration. You'll notice that the foam does not touch any of the frame inside. I believe this is the key to how to get the most out of these models. By attaching the foam to the covering, and not restricting the covering or going through any wood, you get great transfer of sound! I believe you can do this on a fuselage also by peeling a square of the planking out from behind the ultracote and leaving the covering intact, and putting the foam square in its place, but not letting the foam be tied to the frame. Ultracote is strong enough because it is stretched, and should never break, even with the weight of the transducer. Our tests in the wing were done with the transducer upside down vibrating the top of the wing. No vids were taken, but there were great results.

The results were about 93 to 94 db at idle and 103 db average at high throttle , with peaks at 106 db. The biggest thing is that it sounded like a larger airplane engine with these things in there, bass out the ying-yang!

So , i guess it was a success, so we are trying it in the P51 fuselage next , buy removing the planking and gluing it to the covering from the inside. I couldn't even get close to these results anywhere on the frame."

Thank you Greg for your work and input on this!

Andrew
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Old May 05, 2014, 08:38 AM
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United States, IN, Granville
Joined May 2008
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Will the TT-25 speakers work with the original sound unit ? I have
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Old May 05, 2014, 08:47 AM
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United States, OH, Hilliard
Joined Jan 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRCFlying View Post
Hey everyone,
There have been some questions about TT-25 use in Balsa and Built Up planes. I have done some limited testing in a Balsa box, and a built up wing, but have not been able to do a whole lot more as 99% of my planes are foam. On the tests I have done, the results were very good, but there have been a couple of cases that were reported that the built up plane was so tightly assembled that it did not transmit the sound as well as the foam counterparts.

A good friend of mine has done some further testing, with some very encouraging results, and has come up with an alternate method for built up planes. This seems to have worked out VERY well for him, and wished me to pass it along. Here are his findings with a couple of pictures.

"I have some amazing results here regarding the placement of transducers in a balsa model. Attached are some pics showing where to mount them. I can further explain it also.

These pics are with 2 transducers mounted in either side of an Extra 300 wing for testing. We cut out only the bottom ultracote and attached the foam to the top on the inside of the wing with CA. It acts as a huge diaphragm. We also glued the balsa frame inside to the ultra cote so that it should never loosen up the covering from the vibration. You'll notice that the foam does not touch any of the frame inside. I believe this is the key to how to get the most out of these models. By attaching the foam to the covering, and not restricting the covering or going through any wood, you get great transfer of sound! I believe you can do this on a fuselage also by peeling a square of the planking out from behind the ultracote and leaving the covering intact, and putting the foam square in its place, but not letting the foam be tied to the frame. Ultracote is strong enough because it is stretched, and should never break, even with the weight of the transducer. Our tests in the wing were done with the transducer upside down vibrating the top of the wing. No vids were taken, but there were great results.

The results were about 93 to 94 db at idle and 103 db average at high throttle , with peaks at 106 db. The biggest thing is that it sounded like a larger airplane engine with these things in there, bass out the ying-yang!

So , i guess it was a success, so we are trying it in the P51 fuselage next , buy removing the planking and gluing it to the covering from the inside. I couldn't even get close to these results anywhere on the frame."

Thank you Greg for your work and input on this!

Andrew
You are welcome, anytime!
Greg
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Old May 07, 2014, 07:28 AM
It's watts for dinner
United States, GA, Marietta
Joined Oct 2011
946 Posts
Power question - will the volume be the same using a smaller dedicated 3S lipo to power the sound, vs. powering directly of a 6S main battery?

And if there is not a material volume difference, would a 3S-1100 be sufficient to power a 4.1 with 2 TT-25s? How about if expanded to 4 TT-25s via an exta amp?

I ask because I just ordered my first MrRCSound setup to go in a 1700mm FMS Corsair.

I also noted when I received the airframe, that there appears to be cutouts on the left and right side of the fuse under the battery hatch that look like ideal locations for transducers. They may need to be expanded a bit horizontally and maybe thinned out a fraction for optimal sound based on what I have read here.

Thanks!
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Old May 07, 2014, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjw985 View Post
Power question - will the volume be the same using a smaller dedicated 3S lipo to power the sound, vs. powering directly of a 6S main battery?

And if there is not a material volume difference, would a 3S-1100 be sufficient to power a 4.1 with 2 TT-25s? How about if expanded to 4 TT-25s via an exta amp?

I ask because I just ordered my first MrRCSound setup to go in a 1700mm FMS Corsair.

I also noted when I received the airframe, that there appears to be cutouts on the left and right side of the fuse under the battery hatch that look like ideal locations for transducers. They may need to be expanded a bit horizontally and maybe thinned out a fraction for optimal sound based on what I have read here.

Thanks!
Good Morning!
The system is self regulated to use 12v. That means no matter the voltage input from between 3S to 8S, the system still only pulls 12v. So with 2 TT-25s it will pull 12v and about 1.6A give or take. A 3S 1100 would work fine for powering that, yes. I use 1200mah packs on the cars and trucks I have with 2-TT25s, as the car needs a 2S for the main pack. You should get a good 15 minutes out of it at least. Probably more. By adding the additional amplifier, it still draws 12v, but amps go up to about 3.2A give or take. At that point you may want to conceder going up to a 1500mah or so.

Andrew
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Old May 07, 2014, 11:34 AM
It's watts for dinner
United States, GA, Marietta
Joined Oct 2011
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Great information, and thank you for the prompt response!
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Old May 08, 2014, 08:15 PM
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Here is a new video I did today to answer questions about the installing of the TT-25s, and the V4.1 system.

Installing the MrRCSound V4.1 and TT-25s. (16 min 55 sec)


Andrew
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