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Old Jul 15, 2011, 01:54 PM
Drifting off the reservation..
JumpySticks's Avatar
USA, LA, Broussard
Joined Jan 2011
2,296 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
There is a 50 min. S/S/C firmware version... i tested it, but wasn't given the go ahead to release it. Since one of the vendors has installed it, I may be able to post this if I have the latest release version. It has limited use for the small #11, unless you are using an external battery pack and greater than 4GB flash card. I think it was developed for the jumbo version.
I would love to try this out on one of my jumbos if you can see fit.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 02:47 PM
Just thumbing through...
victapilot's Avatar
United States, SC, Simpsonville
Joined Feb 2009
4,427 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
They have been bugged... SEVERAL times by me! They are working on new 1080p camera design, so fixing this firmware bug is not likely on the top of their priority list right now. They are a small company... we need to be patient!
1080p seems attractive, but 60FPS would be better for AV, and a lot of the folks on the Gopro threads agree. I suppose they did some market research - good luck to them!
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 03:39 PM
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Nederland, Gelderland, Meteren
Joined Dec 2010
202 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by xamindar View Post
KeesvR, either one will probably work fine. Totally up to you. They will both give the same results unless there is something else wrong with one.
Thanks.

The strange thing for me is that the Sandisk class 2 gives a better result as the Kingston class 4.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 03:54 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,711 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by victapilot View Post
1080p seems attractive, but 60FPS would be better for AV, and a lot of the folks on the Gopro threads agree. I suppose they did some market research - good luck to them!
I don't know how much market research they did other than to see other cameras with this capability and they felt the need to come out with one also to stay in the hunt. They DID ask my opinion on the subject, though... here's my feedback to them:
"I understand your wanting to get into the 1080p market with a lower priced camera... that's a niche that needs to be filled by a capable camera. The #13 is not that camera as you have mentioned. You may have read my comments on the sample video from it that was posted in my thread a while back. They had to drop the frame rate down to 15 fps to keep from dropping frames, but that results in “jumpy” video. If you can do 30 fps with no dropped frames, you will have a big advantage right there. And it has exposure shifts and vignetting issues as well. A good CMOS/lens module to get uniform exposure across the entire frame with good color control may be the biggest hurdle, but not impossible. And a way to toggle from 1080p @ 30fps to 720p @ 60 fps would make this camera have a very high demand, even if price point is a little higher, I think. I’ll be very interested to see what you can come up with."

If they had a CMOS/lens module that could cover the full 1920x1080 HD frame size at 30 fps with no dropped frames and not have vignetting any worse than the current #11, then a separate video mode that would subsample the center 1280x720 pixel frame size at 60 fps would be possible with no dropped frames (lower average video bit rate) and produce a superior video in this size/price range! I don't really have much desire for the full 1080p HD videos... the file sizes alone make this a bit unwieldy, and a jumbo size would be necessary in any event to hold a big enough battery for a reasonable recording time (which would likely be similar to the current normal #11.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 03:59 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,711 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeesvR View Post
Thanks.

The strange thing for me is that the Sandisk class 2 gives a better result as the Kingston class 4.
Many vendors have under-rated there memory card speed for some unknown reason. The Sandisk test result would easily qualify that card to be labelled CL4. Ditto for the Transcend CL6 cards... they have easily met CL10 data rates in every test I've seen posted here, and they recently started to advertise CL10 cards at the same price as the proior CL6 cards (which tells me the cards are the same card with a new label).

Bottom line is you can't draw very many valid conclusions from the card speed Class ratings other than their MINIMUM sequential read/write speed, and then only for "name brand" cards. Some brands barely meet the minimum and some greatly exceed them. And most generic brands are not to be trusted at all.
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Last edited by Tom Frank; Jul 15, 2011 at 04:17 PM. Reason: spelling
Old Jul 15, 2011, 04:08 PM
Registered User
Nederland, Gelderland, Meteren
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202 Posts
Thanks Tom, this cleared it up for me
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 04:12 PM
Drifting off the reservation..
JumpySticks's Avatar
USA, LA, Broussard
Joined Jan 2011
2,296 Posts
1080p files are too big.
Yes, 60fps would be more desirable than 1080p, and would still be smaller files than the 1080p...I think...
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 04:25 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,711 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by JumpySticks View Post
1080p files are too big.
Yes, 60fps would be more desirable than 1080p, and would still be smaller files than the 1080p...I think...
Yep... the 1080p HD frames have 2.25 times as many pixels as 720p HD frames, so if they had the same amount of data per pixel (on average) the 1080p files should still be a little larger at 30 fps than 720p files at 60 fps.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 04:55 PM
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starhubber's Avatar
Singapore, Singapore
Joined Jul 2011
16 Posts
Hi Tom. Thank you for clearing my doubts. I would try to test out the cam with my 8G Sandisk but Singapore is a very small country and it is quite ridiculous to drive more than 90 minutes unless there is heavy traffic jam.Guess I will need to come up with the special usb cable before posting the result of 50 S/S/C firmware.
It would be great to have another firmware to choose from. Can you do me a favour by asking the developer the possibility to flash v2 firmware on the current v3 batch. I was shocked when Diana told me this was not possible.

Thank you in advance
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Last edited by starhubber; Jul 15, 2011 at 05:08 PM.
Old Jul 15, 2011, 05:10 PM
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visioneer_one's Avatar
St. Thomas, VI
Joined May 2001
132 Posts
So... I ordered a jumbo #11 while ago. Received it, then kicked myself because I'd forgotten to order good memory cards!

I've shot a couple of test videos using an CL2 card from an old cellphone. Quality was decent, at long as there wasn't much movement in frame.

My new CL6 cards showed up today

I formatted both of them as FAT32 - one each with the previously-mentioned block sizes of 4096K and 32768K, as I'd like to see the actual quality and filesize differences.

BTW one of my cards came with a USB reader-dongle. I'm glad I formatted the cards with them in the dongle as opposed to in the camera, as they got quite hot during the process!

I also flashed the No Timestamp / Continuous Recording firmware. Followed Tom's instructions to the letter... no problems at all.

Hopefully we'll have some wind tomorrow. Looking forward to sticking it onto one of my slope planes !
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 05:22 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,711 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by starhubber View Post
Hi Tom. Thank you for clearing my doubts. I would try to test out the cam with my 8G Sandisk but Singapore is a very small country and it is quite ridiculous to drive more than 90 minutes unless there is heavy traffic jam.Guess I will need to come up with the special usb cable before posting the result of 50 S/S/C firmware.
It would be great to have another firmware to choose from. Can you do me a favour by asking the developer the possibility to flash v2 firmware on the current v3 batch. I was shocked when Diana told me this was not possible.

Thank you in advance
I'm trying to keep the firmware designations as Release 1 (Rel1, the original versions, now obsolete) and Release 2 (Rel2, the current versions). There are several versions of Rel 2 firmware available with different functions, and all the #11 cameras (small and jumbo) run the same firmware.

Release 2 firmware versions are available for download with descriptions of what they do via the link in the FAQs in post #3. So I don't know what you are asking about. There is no special firmware that works on just one version that I am aware of. All of the cameras currently being shipped (original and jumbo size) are running Rel 2 firmware to my knowledge.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 05:36 PM
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starhubber's Avatar
Singapore, Singapore
Joined Jul 2011
16 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
I'm trying to keep the firmware designations as Release 1 (Rel1, the original versions, now obsolete) and Release 2 (Rel2, the current versions). There are several version of Rel 2 firmware available, and all the #11 (small and jumbo) run the same firmware.

Release 2 firmware versions are available for download with descriptions of what they do via the link in the FAQs in post #3. So I don't know what you are asking about. There is no special firmware that works on just one version that I am aware of. All of the cameras currently being shipped (original and jumbo size) are running Rel 2 firmware to my knowledge.
When I approached Diana for a cam, 50S/S/C firmware was not made known to me. The default firmware that the manufacturer would load was the Rel 2 4Gb continuous without date/time stamp. I needed the date/time stamp feature so I've asked her whether she would be able to load 20S/S/C firmware. She said it was not possible.

If you are using this cam as a car dvr, the firmware with 50S/S/C will suit the bill. You do not need a jumbo since the cam is connected to car charger.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 06:46 PM
Dance the skies...
Tom Frank's Avatar
United States, MA, Walpole
Joined Dec 2003
17,711 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by starhubber View Post
When I approached Diana for a cam, 50S/S/C firmware was not made known to me. The default firmware that the manufacturer would load was the Rel 2 4Gb continuous without date/time stamp. I needed the date/time stamp feature so I've asked her whether she would be able to load 20S/S/C firmware. She said it was not possible.

If you are using this cam as a car dvr, the firmware with 50S/S/C will suit the bill. You do not need a jumbo since the cam is connected to car charger.
I think Diana was confused. There is a firmware (available here) here that has the date stmp in the video, with 20 min. S/S/C/ It's called "recover time". There's also "remove time" which is 20 min S/S/C, and "continuous" with no date, but it has a bug and does not restart a new recording after the mandatory 4GB file limit S/S/C.
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Old Jul 15, 2011, 07:30 PM
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bobflyman's Avatar
Southwest England
Joined Nov 2010
330 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Frank View Post
Bob, that was an awesome paraglider flight! I didn't see a scale on the map... how far did you travel? I've done one tandem paraglider flight, but seeing a full size light aircraft flying past BELOW me would have really freaked me out. I wonder if he saw you??
Thanks Tom. Ooops I've just seen the FAQ comment about only posting vids about rc model flying! That said, I enjoyed the solo light aircraft flight posted recently and others too that are slightly off topic.

Flight was only 30k ish, 1 hour 20 mins, but my best cross country in the UK so far and it was quite a buzz boating about for a good while at cloud base. 5,200 feet is similar to my previous best UK height. Previous best distance was about 10k in the UK. UK record is close to 200k. I was in France last month and did a 37k through the Provence Alps. (Also a best for me.) The record in France is something like 300k !

The light aircraft did freak me out a bit too and I also wondered if he'd seen me. I heard the noise of his engine before I saw him. Paragliders are slow flyers and can't avoid anything. I thought about reporting an airprox, but to be honest, I didn't really feel endangered , I just hope he had seen and avoided me. Not as bad as being overflown at 100 feet or so by a helicopter which happened to me once. I filed an airprox for that one, and the inquiry found 'my safety was not ensured'. One step below being endangered. A paraglider will often turn into a bag of washing in that kind of turbulence. I was lucky though, and nothing happened?
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Last edited by bobflyman; Jul 15, 2011 at 07:53 PM.
Old Jul 15, 2011, 08:31 PM
AMA #903699
Tony_Fletcher's Avatar
USA, VA, Alexandria
Joined Mar 2008
924 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by simonbryant View Post
Tony,

Just out of interest why did you have the camera mounted to the underside of your cap, on top of the cap peak would of been better surely?
My first attempt was attaching the cam to the very top of my headset, but that was too high and all I shot was the headliner of the plane.

I decided on the bottom of my cap for no other reason than to keep that one piece of Velcro hidden when not filming.
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