Walnut Scale Beech Staggerwing

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 03:37 PM

I have the Dumas kit. Has anyone else built up this model?
It is a 17" wingspan model. The Dumas balsa seems better quality than the Guillows.

The plane has a nice wide fuselage to fit the gear into and two wings which should help the wing loading if they are not to close together. Fairly narrow chord however.

I havn't decided on the powerplant but the short list is Astro Firefly (4:1), Wes DC5-2.4 (8:1), Wes DC1717 (11.8:1), GWS 4.8-7.4 motor DD or w/ 4:1 planetary.

I will probally go 3 ch w/ ailerons. Should I put the ailerons on the top or bottom wing? Don't know if I'm quite up to linking ailerons on both wings.

I'll post a few photos after I get a bit more framed up

Gordon Johnson · Dec 29, 2003, 04:12 PM

This plane is on my list to build. I have the Clevland plans and will do a scratch built. I've heard that ailerons should go on the "main" wing on a biplane and people seem to say this is the top wing on planes that have a larger upper wing, and that it is further forward. However, on this plane the wings are the same size, and the lower wing is further forward. So, I don't know. On my foamie FF conversion I've cut out the ailerons on the top wing and figure I can always add the lower wings with a linkage too.

You might check out the Classic Biplane conversion thread
The wing span is 19.75 and area is 111 sq.in. It's a bit larger, and maybe a bit heavier. But, people have converted it with the Firefly with good luck, which would be my choice. So, I think you are on the right track. See Post #32 for dimensions. Note that more than a year later mine is not built yet.

What is the wing area at 18"? You are correct the wings are kind of narrow. Use the 80% wing area rule to get the effective area.

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 05:34 PM

Thanks Gordon,
Each wing area looks to be about 42sq. in. including fuselage area. Both wings appear identical.
The plans show both wingtip diehedral as well as at the fuselage junction with the aileron extending into the wingtip. So I'm taking a pause to figure this one out.

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 06:04 PM

Fuselage Framing Underway

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 06:06 PM

Fuse, Vert Stab, Horiz Stab, Elevator and Wingtips

The wing has me scratching my head a bit!

harryo · Dec 29, 2003, 06:27 PM

DAMN!?!?!

You weren't kidding! That thing is tiny!

-=h=-

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 06:48 PM

No Apparent Dihedral, but Too Many Ailerons!

Back to work on the wings.....

Janusz Jawien · Dec 29, 2003, 07:01 PM

Hi RocketRob,
I think that it will be a good idea to check posts under Acrobipe - it has similar wingspan. There is a lots of thoughts about Firefly that can be related to your model.
My Acrobipe flies on 2 340 lipos with GWS DD motor and 3x3 prop
Lots of power and fun! The airlons on lower wing are more than enough !
I hope that it helps!
Janusz

harryo · Dec 29, 2003, 07:07 PM

Keep us posted buddy! She's lookin awesome!

-=h=-

Gordon Johnson · Dec 29, 2003, 08:50 PM

Yeah, no dihedral. On my foamie FF conversion there is dihedral and I need to figure out how to remove it and then replace the stiffness in the wings without making them look ugly.

BTW, there is a great book on Amazon, "The Staggerwing Story". It's a good read and has lots of original drawings and plans.

Gordon

Martin Hunter · Dec 29, 2003, 09:00 PM

Keep those pics coming, Rob.

I've got the Cleveland plans in the 32" size but may scale them down for some micro action as well as the biggie.

Martin

Tim Wolff · Dec 29, 2003, 10:24 PM

How is the quality of the Dumas kit? Laser cutting, parts fit, instructions...etc? I'm considering doing a couple of the Dumas dime scale warbirds for actuators.

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 10:42 PM

No dihedral- flat wings!
Life is good, not only did I play hookey today but my wife had dance class tonight!

I weighed the Gws motor bare at 16.8gms and the Astro Firefly weighs 16.3 gms w/ 4:1 box and 19 with the little Gunther prop and spinner. Since this thing is soo small with only 84 sqin of wing area I think I will try the Astro on 3s2p Kokam 140's or 3s1p Etec 250's. I can always install the big bore GWS motor if it needs more oomph.

Todays Progress

RocketRob · Dec 29, 2003, 10:49 PM

I've been impressed with the quality of the kit. Good wood, good drawings and instructions, and the laser cutting sure saves a bunch of time. They have a Cessna 337 which might be a bit of a challenge also.

robs · Dec 30, 2003, 07:49 AM

Looks great. What do you plan on covering it with? Please post picks of the covering process, as that look especially daunting to me.

Dec 29, 2003, 03:37 PM	#1
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	Walnut Scale Beech Staggerwing I have the Dumas kit. Has anyone else built up this model? It is a 17" wingspan model. The Dumas balsa seems better quality than the Guillows. The plane has a nice wide fuselage to fit the gear into and two wings which should help the wing loading if they are not to close together. Fairly narrow chord however. I havn't decided on the powerplant but the short list is Astro Firefly (4:1), Wes DC5-2.4 (8:1), Wes DC1717 (11.8:1), GWS 4.8-7.4 motor DD or w/ 4:1 planetary. I will probally go 3 ch w/ ailerons. Should I put the ailerons on the top or bottom wing? Don't know if I'm quite up to linking ailerons on both wings. I'll post a few photos after I get a bit more framed up Last edited by RocketRob; Dec 29, 2003 at 03:40 PM.

Dec 29, 2003, 06:04 PM	#4
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	Fuselage Framing Underway Attached Thumbnails 99.0 KB · Views: 2940

Dec 29, 2003, 06:06 PM	#5
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	Fuse, Vert Stab, Horiz Stab, Elevator and Wingtips The wing has me scratching my head a bit! Attached Thumbnails 95.6 KB · Views: 2849

Dec 29, 2003, 06:48 PM	#7
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	No Apparent Dihedral, but Too Many Ailerons! Back to work on the wings..... Attached Thumbnails 28.4 KB · Views: 2848

Dec 29, 2003, 07:07 PM	#9
harryo Mmmm... crunchy balsa. Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 490	More motivation... Keep us posted buddy! She's lookin awesome! -=h=- Attached Thumbnails 93.9 KB · Views: 2876

Dec 29, 2003, 04:12 PM	#2
Gordon Johnson Printed Tissue Fanatic Join Date: May 2001 Location: Boston, Mass Posts: 5,425	This plane is on my list to build. I have the Clevland plans and will do a scratch built. I've heard that ailerons should go on the "main" wing on a biplane and people seem to say this is the top wing on planes that have a larger upper wing, and that it is further forward. However, on this plane the wings are the same size, and the lower wing is further forward. So, I don't know. On my foamie FF conversion I've cut out the ailerons on the top wing and figure I can always add the lower wings with a linkage too. You might check out the Classic Biplane conversion thread The wing span is 19.75 and area is 111 sq.in. It's a bit larger, and maybe a bit heavier. But, people have converted it with the Firefly with good luck, which would be my choice. So, I think you are on the right track. See Post #32 for dimensions. Note that more than a year later mine is not built yet. What is the wing area at 18"? You are correct the wings are kind of narrow. Use the 80% wing area rule to get the effective area.

Dec 29, 2003, 05:34 PM	#3
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	Thanks Gordon, Each wing area looks to be about 42sq. in. including fuselage area. Both wings appear identical. The plans show both wingtip diehedral as well as at the fuselage junction with the aileron extending into the wingtip. So I'm taking a pause to figure this one out.

Dec 29, 2003, 06:27 PM	#6
harryo Mmmm... crunchy balsa. Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 490	DAMN!?!?! You weren't kidding! That thing is tiny! -=h=-

Dec 29, 2003, 07:01 PM	#8
Janusz Jawien Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Los Angeles Van Nuys, California, United States Posts: 928	Hi RocketRob, I think that it will be a good idea to check posts under Acrobipe - it has similar wingspan. There is a lots of thoughts about Firefly that can be related to your model. My Acrobipe flies on 2 340 lipos with GWS DD motor and 3x3 prop Lots of power and fun! The airlons on lower wing are more than enough ! I hope that it helps! Janusz

Dec 29, 2003, 08:50 PM	#10
Gordon Johnson Printed Tissue Fanatic Join Date: May 2001 Location: Boston, Mass Posts: 5,425	Yeah, no dihedral. On my foamie FF conversion there is dihedral and I need to figure out how to remove it and then replace the stiffness in the wings without making them look ugly. BTW, there is a great book on Amazon, "The Staggerwing Story". It's a good read and has lots of original drawings and plans. Gordon

Dec 29, 2003, 09:00 PM	#11
Martin Hunter Leave me alone! Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Kamloops, BC, Canada Posts: 15,109	Keep those pics coming, Rob. I've got the Cleveland plans in the 32" size but may scale them down for some micro action as well as the biggie. Martin

Dec 29, 2003, 10:24 PM	#12
Tim Wolff Pedestrian! Don't Shoot Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Lambertville, Michigan, United States Posts: 4,968	How is the quality of the Dumas kit? Laser cutting, parts fit, instructions...etc? I'm considering doing a couple of the Dumas dime scale warbirds for actuators.

Dec 29, 2003, 10:42 PM	#13
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	No dihedral- flat wings! Life is good, not only did I play hookey today but my wife had dance class tonight! I weighed the Gws motor bare at 16.8gms and the Astro Firefly weighs 16.3 gms w/ 4:1 box and 19 with the little Gunther prop and spinner. Since this thing is soo small with only 84 sqin of wing area I think I will try the Astro on 3s2p Kokam 140's or 3s1p Etec 250's. I can always install the big bore GWS motor if it needs more oomph. Todays Progress

Dec 29, 2003, 10:49 PM	#14
RocketRob Size Matters! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Francisco Bay Area Posts: 2,485	I've been impressed with the quality of the kit. Good wood, good drawings and instructions, and the laser cutting sure saves a bunch of time. They have a Cessna 337 which might be a bit of a challenge also. Attached Thumbnails 99.6 KB · Views: 2894 Last edited by RocketRob; Dec 29, 2003 at 10:51 PM.

Dec 30, 2003, 07:49 AM	#15
robs Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Dutchess Co, NY Posts: 543	Looks great. What do you plan on covering it with? Please post picks of the covering process, as that look especially daunting to me.

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