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        Discussion what balancer is top notch?

#1 reptileman Apr 18, 2008 09:28 AM

what balancer is top notch?
 
Hi maybe somebody can give me some good advise here... I have a ICE charger and i am looking for very good lipo balancer..... what's really good out there that will work with the ice?

THANKS

#2 RC Accessory Apr 18, 2008 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Hi maybe somebody can give me some good advise here... I have a ICE charger and i am looking for very good lipo balancer..... what's really good out there that will work with the ice?

THANKS

e-Station PB-6 or the TME Balancer. Both have high discharge rates, 500 and 450 mah respectively. More lipo brands are compatible with the e-Station PB-6.
http://www.rcaccessory.com/index.asp...TS&Category=11

#3 Emaxx_Quebec Apr 18, 2008 10:31 AM

I have the ICE And I use Hyp LBA10 balancer.LBA10
Wire them together and balance during the charge.
It work well for me.
New Hyperion EOS LBA10 Net with A123 - The Most Powerful, Versatile Balance-Safety Adapter for Lithium Packs - Max 6S, 10A rating - Network 2 units for 7S~12S balancing

#4 reptileman Apr 18, 2008 10:34 AM

Hi guy's how about the flight power V balence?
Is this any good?

THANKS

#5 RC Accessory Apr 18, 2008 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Hi guy's how about the flight power V balence?
Is this any good?

THANKS

The V Balancer has had supposedly reported issues with over heating. The other issue is that it does not have various balancing wires for certain brand taps, requiring you to make your own.

The Hyperion LBA10 is a good balancer, but it has a very low bleed rate, 120 mah. It does however support all the lipo brands like the Bantam e-Station PB-6 does.

The TME balancer has a unique feature where you can connect it to your PC with the optional cable kit so you can see the individual cell voltages on your PC.

The Hyperion, TME and e-Station balancers also support both Lipo's and A123's.

My first choice is the e-Station PB-6, then the TME. I have used both extensively. The e-Station is by far the easiest to use. The Hyperion being the most difficult.

The TME is the least expensive, then the Hyperion, with the e-Station PB-6 being the most expensive of the group.

#6 coro Apr 18, 2008 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Hi guy's how about the flight power V balence?
Is this any good?

Its new for me, or I have not noticed that before.
I have read the manual and as far, as good.
Seems to me that it works equally to LBA10, but this one is different (4 leds and placed elsewhere than LBA10), so this one is not OEM relabelled Hyperion just as many others are.
Anyway, there is no accuracy specified, but there is 5mV resolution which is good. Safety disconnect is specified very precise at 4.21V+-10mV, so it is good..

I found no maximum bleeding specified.
It should not matter if charger can see cell voltages and modify the charge current depending on them, however :-( : I see no uplink, data port for charger, so I consider this device misses that, very important feature?
It is a pitty then.

By the way, more users than me, are using LBA10A data port (that which should be connected to charger), to connect it to my PC and take voltage graphs.

#7 reptileman Apr 18, 2008 11:48 AM

Thing is i also want something EASY to use and the LBA10 instructions look like it's very complacated to use.... After reading the Flight power V it seems much more user friendly.... If it could over heat and has pronlems...maybe i could put some vent holes in the casing to make it cool down better?

Also hows a blinky work is it any good?

#8 coro Apr 18, 2008 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Thing is i also want something EASY to use and the LBA10 instructions look like it's very complacated to use.... After reading the Flight power V it seems much more user friendly....

As I have read them, it seems to me that the use of FP and LBA is exactly equal..
-Connect battery right.
-See how it blinks. If it goes dark(sleeping), wake it up by button press.
-IF You want to charge or discharge thru balancer, press the button to activate connection.
Hmm... and that is all.

Perhaps You get confused by possibility to link two LBA balancers to balance 12s pack.. Well, just ignore that part.
And PC or charger connection - ignore that as well.

Last difference, A123 mode:
LBA10_A can be switched between Lipo(green led with "Lipo" label) and A123 mode(red led with "A123 label"), by holding the button for 5 seconds. Setting is permanently stored so You do it only once.(if You are not using both types of packs). And there is really nothing more to do..
It dont seem to me being any complex, but it is possible that manual tries to explain all too detailed and seem long and complex. Seems, but is not.

#9 coro Apr 18, 2008 12:34 PM

By the way, the thread title asks for Top notch balancer...
Well, there is one unit that is beautifull and seems technicaly great.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/n...roduct_id=2311
However, for $300, all it can do in real, is to balance the pack. With good and healthy pack, it really means nothing to do, just as any other $40 one .. :-)

Common class to Elprog one, moving energy between cells, instead of simply turning it into heat just as all ordinary balancers do, but this without the display (and without data connection to charger which degrades its function much!), is Schulze: http://www.schulze-elektronik-gmbh.de/LiPoProB-e.htm

Well..., both those units seems great.
But that are just colours, price and marketing words, and I have never seen pure technical test verifying accuracy and functions of them, just like those cheap ones were tested hundred times.

The real balance, not meaning just a simple voltage comparison, is measurable only in full charge state. The best way to charge has been implemented quite a long time ago, in FMA Direct chargers.
Use cheap Cellpro 4s and You have "Top notch" balancer. Really.
There is also new 10s 10Amps version of Cellpro, so You can decide how big Your Lipo packs are. (It is not reasonable power-wise to charge high series cellcount Lipo pack at once, for packs of 11s to 20s better split that pack, and use two separate chargers.)

#10 reptileman Apr 18, 2008 01:53 PM

Hi I looked into this one and downloaded there instructions ...I think this one is the best one for me. :D

http://www.maxamps.com/MA-Method-Balancer.htm

#11 RC Accessory Apr 18, 2008 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Hi I looked into this one and downloaded there instructions ...I think this one is the best one for me. :D

http://www.maxamps.com/MA-Method-Balancer.htm

Never saw that one before. for that money you can get a FMA CellPro charger or 2 of just about everything else.

Looks cool though.

#12 Smyk Apr 18, 2008 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coro
By the way, the thread title asks for Top notch balancer...
Well, there is one unit that is beautifull and seems technicaly great.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/n...roduct_id=2311
However, for $300, all it can do in real, is to balance the pack. With good and healthy pack, it really means nothing to do, just as any other $40 one .. :-)

Common class to Elprog one, moving energy between cells, instead of simply turning it into heat just as all ordinary balancers do, but this without the display (and without data connection to charger which degrades its function much!), is Schulze: http://www.schulze-elektronik-gmbh.de/LiPoProB-e.htm

Well..., both those units seems great.
But that are just colours, price and marketing words, and I have never seen pure technical test verifying accuracy and functions of them, just like those cheap ones were tested hundred times.

The real balance, not meaning just a simple voltage comparison, is measurable only in full charge state. The best way to charge has been implemented quite a long time ago, in FMA Direct chargers.
Use cheap Cellpro 4s and You have "Top notch" balancer. Really.
There is also new 10s 10Amps version of Cellpro, so You can decide how big Your Lipo packs are. (It is not reasonable power-wise to charge high series cellcount Lipo pack at once, for packs of 11s to 20s better split that pack, and use two separate chargers.)

Coro

Thanks for mentioning new EQUALizer from Elprog
Did you see this thread?
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=849912

Well
the most important fact of bleeders is that they will bleed off valuable capacity of good cells to match voltage of the lowest cell in the pack.
If one cell is lugging against the rest in 12 cell pack 11 of them will loose together lots of energy. Charging the only one being behind takes small fraction of that energy and saves lots of time. This is probably a main principal of Elprogs new balancer.
On the other hand EQUALizer is a compromise between old and new to match practical solution for current Pulsar 2 users. It works.
EQUALizer is compatible with Accumatic chargers as well.

I do admire FMA chargers
At one point probably I will try to compare performance of the 10S one with a speed and accuracy of Elprog stuff and how much energy is lost between full charge from FMA charger against swapping energy concept on Elprog balancer.
After about 2 months of intensive testing Elprog duet seems to take the abuse effortlessly.
I have had tested 3 EQUALizers on the same battery packs and all the measurements came out identical to the last .001V on the PC and .01V on the LCD screen.
NOW
Is there any thread showing how the balancing process to charge lower cells occurs on FMA chargers? Do they have variable current or use variable pulse length toward the end of balancing procedure? Any hint would help.
I will go to the FMA site now to check it

regards

ZM

#13 kgfly Apr 19, 2008 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reptileman
Hi I looked into this one and downloaded there instructions ...I think this one is the best one for me. :D

http://www.maxamps.com/MA-Method-Balancer.htm

Doesn't seem significantly different to the other bleed-style balancers. Only 6A max charge-through current and 247mA balance current.

I agree that depending on what size packs you want to charge, you would be better off spending $75 on a Cellpro4s than $50 or more any balancer.

#14 PylonRacer Apr 19, 2008 01:18 PM

http://www.pfmdistribution.com/ - No Gimmicks!

For years we have sat quietly aside watching the proponents of "pack balancing" spew forth misinformation. The truth is that a properly matched pack will not require balancing. Yes, we're sure this is a shock to many of you who have fallen for the balancing gimmick. Yes, Apogee was the first to put commercial grade plugs on all packs due to customer demand. We've had and seen enough.

Pack balancing is a gimmick perpetuated by companies who make balancers, and by other companies who do not match battery cells within the pack. A properly matched pack will not require balancing, and in fact will mask a failing cell. Balancing is a band aid for companies who lack the proper equipment to do cell matching. All Apogee packs have been cell matched since the day we started.

Due to misinformation, more packs have been damaged during balancing than have been helped. If you insist on balancing a pack (If it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, and you sleep better at night, have at it), please, please, only balance fully charged packs.

Why only balance fully charged packs? All properly matched cells are mated together so that the high and low voltages will coincide. There may be mid-point voltage variances. Balancing a partially charged pack can cause the high and low voltages to become unbalanced. Again, please, if you insist on the balancing gimmick, please only balance fully charged packs.

#15 write2dgray May 13, 2008 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PylonRacer
http://www.pfmdistribution.com/ - No Gimmicks!

For years we have sat quietly aside watching the proponents of "pack balancing" spew forth misinformation. The truth is that a properly matched pack will not require balancing. Yes, we're sure this is a shock to many of you who have fallen for the balancing gimmick. Yes, Apogee was the first to put commercial grade plugs on all packs due to customer demand. We've had and seen enough.

Pack balancing is a gimmick perpetuated by companies who make balancers, and by other companies who do not match battery cells within the pack. A properly matched pack will not require balancing, and in fact will mask a failing cell. Balancing is a band aid for companies who lack the proper equipment to do cell matching. All Apogee packs have been cell matched since the day we started.

Due to misinformation, more packs have been damaged during balancing than have been helped. If you insist on balancing a pack (If it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, and you sleep better at night, have at it), please, please, only balance fully charged packs.

Why only balance fully charged packs? All properly matched cells are mated together so that the high and low voltages will coincide. There may be mid-point voltage variances. Balancing a partially charged pack can cause the high and low voltages to become unbalanced. Again, please, if you insist on the balancing gimmick, please only balance fully charged packs.

That's an interesting and controversial quote direct from Apogee's website.


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