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        Discussion Whats up with no ailerons on trainers?

#1 stuball56 Aug 30, 2012 07:31 PM

Whats up with no ailerons on trainers?
 
I am learning, so far only on RF. I have built a Polaris, but am getting a trainer first. So why are there trainers with 3 channels? Rudder and elevator only, no ailerons? Seems like if you trained and learned on a 3 channel, then when you go to 4 you wont have a clue on how to control the aircraft using ailerons. I just think for me, anyway, it is far better to have a trainer that is a full 4 channels. I am torn between the Flyzone Switch or the Nexstar Mini EP. Both have thier advantages and disadvantages. I really like both actualy.

#2 C₄H₁₀ Aug 30, 2012 07:53 PM

This could get interesting... :cool:

The rudder on a 3-channel trainer with adequate dihedral actually achieves pretty much the same effect as ailerons. The yawing action directly produces a bank. In fact, many trainers can be rolled over completely using rudder alone.

When the functions on the radio are placed on the correct sticks, transitioning to an aileron plane is pretty simple. A lot of people make the mistake of thinking there's an "aileron" stick and a "rudder" stick and this results in them placing rudder on the left stick (in Mode 2) even when they're flying a rudder-only ship where the rudder is the primary roll control.

#3 pda4you Aug 30, 2012 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuball56 (Post 22597804)
I am learning, so far only on RF. I have built a Polaris, but am getting a trainer first. So why are there trainers with 3 channels? Rudder and elevator only, no ailerons? Seems like if you trained and learned on a 3 channel, then when you go to 4 you wont have a clue on how to control the aircraft using ailerons. I just think for me, anyway, it is far better to have a trainer that is a full 4 channels. I am torn between the Flyzone Switch or the Nexstar Mini EP. Both have thier advantages and disadvantages. I really like both actualy.

Because they are cheaper. :)

Add another to your list - the Apprentice.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...-radio-EFL2725

If you want a bit smaller the Alpha would be good too:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/products...rt-pnp-EFL2875

Mike

#4 Glacier Girl Aug 30, 2012 08:07 PM

Or you end up like I did. I learned with a three channel Cub, with rudder and elevator on the right stick. Learning ailerons wasn't that bad of a thing, as the ailerons were on the right stick, and the rudder got moved to the left.

I still dumb thumb on occasion on the ground during taxi. I'll revert to thinking the rudder is back on the right stick and I'll be hammering on the right stick trying to turn the bird.

Banks like heck but won't turn worth a darn.

#5 Rockin Robbins Aug 30, 2012 08:09 PM

Another one! I'm taking a break from this one. C4H10, you're the one. You can handle it better than I can. http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/a...thumbsup-1.gif

I'm outta this one.

#6 cfircav8r Aug 30, 2012 08:12 PM

Aileron equiped planes tend to have a quicker roll response and less self righting ability. When you increase the self righting ability by increasing wing dihedral and incidence you start to make the ailerons less effective and the rudder more effective. Most small trainers are designed to easly self right and therefore the rudder is the most effective means of control. It also is less costly and easier to manufacture. Adding ailerons to a small light weight wing require added strengthening and therefore weight as well as more complexity.

#7 twn Chen Aug 30, 2012 09:00 PM

3-channel (rudder, elevator and throttle) trainer with dihedral makes it simple, and give you one more second for correcting it back when you over control your trainer. It could correct back gradually by itself if you don't bank it too hard, and it's easy to repair at least.

Chen

#8 rtbates Sep 04, 2012 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuball56 (Post 22597804)
I am learning, so far only on RF. I have built a Polaris, but am getting a trainer first. So why are there trainers with 3 channels? Rudder and elevator only, no ailerons? Seems like if you trained and learned on a 3 channel, then when you go to 4 you wont have a clue on how to control the aircraft using ailerons. I just think for me, anyway, it is far better to have a trainer that is a full 4 channels. I am torn between the Flyzone Switch or the Nexstar Mini EP. Both have thier advantages and disadvantages. I really like both actualy.

Please do a little research. There's a clue out there IF YOU LOOK...So far you're missing even a hint of a clue, NO offence...

#9 jasmine2501 Sep 04, 2012 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins (Post 22598149)
Another one! I'm taking a break from this one. C4H10, you're the one. You can handle it better than I can. http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/a...thumbsup-1.gif

I'm outta this one.

Nobody will ever give me an honest answer why they do this, but I'm fascinated by these questions. Not so much by the answers, but by the popularity. You would think there could never be such a thing as a popular question, because once it's been answered ten thousand times, there is no point in anyone ever asking it again, and yet, those questions which have the most answers available right on Google, still seem to be wicked popular questions to ask. It doesn't make any sense.

So, please enlighten us... why did you ask this question? Was it a matter of getting an answer specifically for you, or did you have trouble finding the answer, or what?

My personal take on the phenomenon is that people are simply trying to start a conversation in which they are the focus of the group. Sometimes that's a good way to introduce yourself to the community... but it doesn't make a great first impression.

#10 ny_hawk Sep 04, 2012 05:16 PM

It's a typical noob question which is why it gets asked all the time..

The answers are more whacky IMO.

Full scale planes don't offer "3 channel" training...

#11 jasmine2501 Sep 04, 2012 05:21 PM

That's because riding on your average three channel plane would make Chuck Yeager puke :popcorn:

#12 ny_hawk Sep 04, 2012 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasmine2501 (Post 22641119)
That's because riding on your average three channel plane would make Chuck Yeager puke :popcorn:

I'll go along with that...

#13 cfircav8r Sep 04, 2012 06:23 PM

That and no one learns without training.

#14 Rockin Robbins Sep 04, 2012 06:30 PM

Well, part of the reason is the different rhythm of a radio control airplane compared to a full size plane. The other week there was a crash of a commercial jet liner. They were stalling and crashing for five minutes and never realized it. Crashing an RC plane takes a second and a half and the entire flight is over in five minutes most of the time.

Roll rates on full size planes are sedate compared to RC planes. We simply have things happening 10 to a hundred times faster. That means that what works for training a full size pilot just won't work for RC. It's like waltzing to Led Zeppelin or Firewind.:D

#15 stuball56 Sep 04, 2012 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasmine2501 (Post 22640347)
Nobody will ever give me an honest answer why they do this, but I'm fascinated by these questions. Not so much by the answers, but by the popularity. You would think there could never be such a thing as a popular question, because once it's been answered ten thousand times, there is no point in anyone ever asking it again, and yet, those questions which have the most answers available right on Google, still seem to be wicked popular questions to ask. It doesn't make any sense.

So, please enlighten us... why did you ask this question? Was it a matter of getting an answer specifically for you, or did you have trouble finding the answer, or what?

My personal take on the phenomenon is that people are simply trying to start a conversation in which they are the focus of the group. Sometimes that's a good way to introduce yourself to the community... but it doesn't make a great first impression.

And I can't figure out for the life of me what value of any kind your post adds. Why did you post it? Why did you take so much time out of your life to post such unhelpful drivel? Why don't you "enlighten" us, you know it all genius you. And finaly, why don't you go fly a KITE?
Edit: Oh, I see "Rocket Programmer" as your title, so that explains it, you ARE way smarter than anyone else.


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