Tactic 2.4ghz radio

[tsenecal]

I just picked up my Tactic 2.4ghz Pistol radio from the post office.

It is the radio that comes in the UL-1 by aquacraft.

Tower Hobbies is selling a combo package with the TX and RX in one set for $80.98 plus shipping.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0161p?&I=LZ0503

separate RXs are $24.99
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXWJN2&P=ML

when it arrived it was in two white cardboard boxes a tiny one for the RX, and a mid-to-small sized one for the TX. definitely look like OEM style "repair/replacement" type packaging. no instructions, no info, nothing.

I am buying this to test as a replacement for my "hundreds" of 2 channel am pistol TXs I have collected over the years. see photo 1 for an example.

the TX is basically the same size as any other pistol TX, but of course it has a stubby 4" antenna indicative of the 2.4ghz tech. (see photo 2) One nice addition is a steering rate trim nob for setting the sensitivity of the steering.

the RX is considerably smaller than the original am RX, and is considerably thinner than a spektrum 2.4ghz RX 1"x1.75"x.375" (see photo 3) (the Losi is a re-badged Spektrum 3 channel RX)

also note the RX antennas:

am: 19"
spektrum: 3"
tactic: 0"


the box(es) did not include any kind of instruction manual.

I was able to figure out what direction the servo connectors plug into the RX from some photos in the UL-1 thread taken by HogHappy, the signal goes towards the center of the case.

It took me several seconds to figure out the "bind" button on the RX (a requirement for 2.4ghz systems). I added batteries to the TX (4AA) and plugged the ESC and servo into the RX on the test boat. I turned on the TX, then the ESC, and the lights on the ESC flashed indicating no signal was being received by the ESC. I noticed a tiny hole on the RX labeled "bind". I had a thought. I pushed a ballpoint pen into the hole for a couple of seconds, and an led on the RX started flashing. I held the pen until the led went solid. bingo, the RX and TX are bound.

There is no bind button on the TX, which indicates to me that you should bind the TX and RX at home in the workshop, not out at the lake where 30 other TXs might be putting out a stronger signal.

I will post again when I have tested the setup in the test boat.

later

Tim

[patmat2350]

A little info in the UL-1 manual:
http://manuals.hobbico.com/aqu/aqub20-manual.pdf

I hope the radio has usable reverse! (unlike their AM radios...)

[tsenecal]

Patmat,

thanks for the link.

Upon closer inspection, the Receiver has keyed slots for the servos (for futaba style connectors) so the necessity to lookup the servo orientation was not really necessary, I seem to be going blind, the slots were not noticed until I attempted to install a futaba servo.

I did look in the manual, but found no info on the actual radio configuration (binding, etc) in the manual. (perhaps i am going blind there as well, forgive me if i am mistaken).

the test boat is one of my little 16" jetboats, it doesn't need reverse... :)

I suppose i should test it in several boats?

Tim

[tsenecal]

by the way, there are 8 pistols in the first photo... all i found in the first run through the "workshop".

on my second pass I found 4 more....

should i try for a third pass?

[Rex R]

nope you're not going blind, there is no info on how to bind tx/rx in the ul1 manual. however...now that you've explained it I can point folks here :) thanks.
rex

[tsenecal]

so, I was able to get off work a little early today, and i ran my test boat number one at the pond (see picture for a shot of which boat it is). All tests ran 100%. I mounted the receiver beneath and beside the driver (under the black plastic "cockpit" area), well above the water line. no interference, no issues with de-binding, rock solid. I ran the boat for a good ten minutes, and drove it to the other side of the pond, until i was uncomfortable with not being able to see the boat's orientation, probably 200 to 250 feet.

next test boat is an equally small 15" plastic 41' USCG UTB, with a 250 size brushed motor, and a 10 amp ESC running off a 4 cell AA alkaline battery pack. the motor and handmade stuffing tube should generate a considerable amount of EFI noise.


third boat will be my wood built up midwest lobster boat.

later

Tim

[reptileman]

:D I got mine today...It's nice i took it apart and stretched the steering and throttle springs to make for a softer feel and also put a pice of silicone fuel line on the trigger it feels much better now.

[patmat2350]

but does it have any reverse?????
can't wait for the test results!

[reptileman]

It has farward , reverse ....steering and throttle trims... REV switch for steering and throttle...and steering EPA so you can use max steering or turn down for less steering.

[tsenecal]

Patmat,

The transmitter throttle trigger is spring loaded for neutral, but it has forward and reverse movement to the trigger, similar to all the futaba pistol TXs i have. I will let you know how it runs with the lobster boat which has a cc mamba brushless ESC with 100% limits on both forward and reverse, and the 41' UTB, which has an Msonik marine ECO brushed controller. I don't expect to find any issues.

The jetboat wasn't a good test of reverse because its cc mamba is programmed to allow only 10% reverse at max reverse throttle (a jetboat ain't gonna work in reverse).

I did test the EPA adjustment for the steering on the jetboat, and with it at max, the turning circle of the jetboat was about 2 feet (tight little cookies), at minimum, the turning circle was about 20 feet.

EPA is something the cheap $60 futaba pistols don't have.

[patmat2350]

What I'm concerned about is the issue found on Aquacraft AM radios, with a built-in, uncorrectable bias towards Forward, and little "usable" Reverse. An oscilloscope can measure the bias... but it will also show up as a difficult or non-existent reverse, depending on which ESC is used.

[Hoghappy]

I can't add to the reverse questions but I will say I've been using this in the UL-1 for over a month now and have at least 20-25 miles on it and it has not hiccuped on time.

I love the thing. :D

Crash

[reptileman]

What I'm concerned about is the issue found on Aquacraft AM radios, with a built-in, uncorrectable bias towards Forward, and little "usable" Reverse. An oscilloscope can measure the bias... but it will also show up as a difficult or non-existent reverse, depending on which ESC is used.
Hi good point it seems like the trigger throw is less than the farward pull but when i go in reverse with it in my traxxas slash it still makes it go pretty fast in reverse but no ware neer 100% i would say like 50% But that was without resetting my ESC if now i reset my ESC with the tactic radio when programing it for reverse when you push the trigger in reverse it should set up the ESC to go 100% full speed in reverse...just the trigger pull will be a little less...Only way to know how it works for sure would be to hook a servo to the 2nd slot for the throttle and see how far it goes farward and then see how far the servo moves when put in reverse...maybe i will do this today if i can.

[reptileman]

Ok i tested the Tactic and it don't have 100% reverse...I tested it on my ESC as the new Tactic when installed in my slash in reverse the esc's full reverse light did not come on...so here is a mod i did to make the reverse throw on the trigger the normal 100% throw.
Hope this helps everyone.

[Mel279]

does anyone knows how far can the signal go of this tactic Tx?

[Kmot]

Good mod reptileman.

[tsenecal]

Due to relatively cold weather the last few weekends, and the necessity to burn my saturdays looking for houses, I was only able to get back to testing the tactic today.

test boat number two is pictured below. it has a 180 size brushed motor from a slot car for its motor, and an msonic eco marine ESC. It also has a brass stuffing shaft and propshaft that are a simple sleeve type arrangement. ie, it is electrically noisy. It is also a boat that in its past life had use of reverse.


all testing was done at the same pond as the jetboat, on a completely calm day. because the last several days were in the 60s, there was no ice on the pond, allowing me to test the full range of the radio.

I was able to run the boat with very consistent throttle response throughout the throttle range, both forward and reverse (see note below). I ran the boat for a minimum of 25 minutes (boat runs for 45min on a charge) There were no issues with the boat suffering interference, and the boat got far enough away that I was unable to see it, I had to stop the boat and walk to the other side of the pond to resume testing.

I have included a photo of approximate distance before I gave up and had to walk to the boat. based on scale in the lower corner, I think it is almost 600 feet. please note, i stopped because I couldn't see the boat, not because the radio. in photo, red dot is my location, green dot is boat.

I feel the boat had more precise response to the radio with the 2.4ghz setup than the 75mhz. I get the feeling the 2.4ghz is like PCM in that there are more discrete steps encoded in the signal than with the AM system. like i said before, reverse with the mod was excellent.

the mod to the transmitter for reverse was accomplished with a simpler modification to the transmitter than what reptileman did. I filed down the end of the throttle trigger where the reverse guard interfered with the molded nub on the "barrel" area. the guard has been shortened about 1/8th inch. there is still enough guard left to use for reverse, but it allows for full movement of the trigger. I will post pictures if anyone wants me to. I will admit that it is pretty stupid of Tactic/Aquacraft to have allowed such a simple design element as that little nub to reduce the effectiveness of the radio so greatly.

[tsenecal]

Okay, last boat taken out for a test run....


boat number 3 is a 24" midwest lobster boat, with an AXI 2212 silver brushless outrunner, and CC mamba ESC.

nothing really to say here, same as the other two: no problem running the boat. no issues with interference, no de-linking, no problems running the boat around the entire lake. due to the size of this boat, I was able to keep the boat in sight for the entire time, and was able to control it the entire time. ran the boat for 15 to 20 minutes. This boat has been run with 2.4ghz systems for its entire life (Spektrum 6100e, Assan X8R6, and now tactic RX324) and all have performed equally well.

for pictures of the test boat, a build log exists here: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=860031

Tim

[Hoghappy]

I just got a 2nd receiver to put in a new boat using the same transmitter. I already figure that the transmitters (rudder) setting will need to be readjusted each time; but can this transmitter be bound to 2 different receivers at the same time like my DX3R or do I have to rebind each time I change from one to the other?

What the?

Hey...I thought I was posting this in the OSE forum....shazam....I'm back at RCGroups! :eek:

[tsenecal]

Hoghappy,

your question:
can this transmitter be bound to 2 different receivers at the same time like my DX3R?

short answer:
yes

long answer:
I now own 2 of these transmitters and nine (!!!) of these receivers. everything is working as expected.