Question for scratch builders

[TOWHOOK]

I have a quick question. I am getting ready to start cutting out frames for a project, and the plan I have shows usual frame sections with a hidden line representing the top of the deck. Do I cut my frames to the top of the deck or to the top of the bulwarks?

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

That might be the deck line back at frame 9 or 10, but I don't
get the impression that the dashed line is the deck line at the bow.

I typically cut my frames to the deck line minus the thickness of
my finish deck material and the sub deck. (plywood thickness)

If you are building on a Keel, don't forget to add some frame thickness
at the center line so that you can cut a slot to mount the frame over the
keel. :)

[tghsmith]

depends on how you are going to plank the hull, I would cut the frames with a notch to put in a stringer at the top of the deck and a stub up to the top of the bulwark(you can always cut away the stubs after the hull is planked and resined. if you are going to fiberglass the hull check out how pat handled the bulwark on his tug DEARBORN...

[TOWHOOK]

That might be the deck line back at frame 9 or 10, but I don't
get the impression that the dashed line is the deck line at the bow.

I typically cut my frames to the deck line minus the thickness of
my finish deck material and the sub deck. (plywood thickness)

If you are building on a Keel, don't forget to add some frame thickness
at the center line so that you can cut a slot to mount the frame over the
keel. :)


Thanks Umi, You have always been a great help when I have had questions. :D

The hidden line shown in the picture is the deck on the forecastle, it steps down to the main cargo deck elsewhere on the plan. The pic is just a small snippet. ;) The plan I am working from is the Sydney Express Container Ship from Marine Modeling. I got inspired after I found an old build thread by TK-20 over in England

[TOWHOOK]

depends on how you are going to plank the hull, I would cut the frames with a notch to put in a stringer at the top of the deck and a stub up to the top of the bulwark(you can always cut away the stubs after the hull is planked and resined. if you are going to fiberglass the hull check out how pat handled the bulwark on his tug DEARBORN...

Thanks for the help I'll check out Pat's thread....its been a long time since I read that. Very cool build from what I remember. :cool:

[patmat2350]

The picture is clipped, so I can't tell what the dashed line is, but I'm quite sure it's NOT the deck.
Most all decks would be cambered, and would not be indicated in the "body plan" (the view above). Profile view may show the centerline of the deck as a line floating above "edge of deck".
The bulwarks often are showed on the body plan, but I don't see them in your picture... so they may be defined elsewhere.

But to answer your actual question- "Depends"!
Many model kits do extend the frames above deck to provide a strong support for the bulwarks. For a timbered boat, this is accurate-- the stanchions would be extensions of some of the frames. This can be a problem on a model of a steel boat, as those stanchions would be thin plates or similar, not whatever 1/8" or 1/4" plywood works out to be. So on my last two "steel" tugs, I stopped the frames below deck, and built up the bulwarks after applying the deck, using thin styrene stock to make the stanchions.

This can be tricky too. On Dearborn, the bulwarks were built up from fiberglass over formers screwed to the deck. On YTL-710, the bulwarks are thin ply set into a rabbet at deck's edge-- had to think about this BEFORE applying the deck!
http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=38687&start=45#p258223

Pat M

[TOWHOOK]

Thanks Pat, I see what you mean. I had planned on cutting to the deck and then doing the bulwarks to start with, but I figured I had better ask those "in the know" first. I know on the build that TK-20 did, it looked like he also cut to the deck...I would ask him about all of this since I am going to be building the same ship, but I don't think he is on this forum any longer.

here is the link to his build:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=558150&highlight=sydney+express

[tigerbay]

To add to the confusion. The line may be there to show the deck camber, not the position of the deck. On a modern steel ship this may well be a straight line, and not a curve.

But I am no expert.

[norgale]

I would say cut your frames to the top of the plan and disreguard the dotted line for now. If the frames turn out to be too high it's a lot easier to trim them down that it is to add to them if they are too short. Also the bulwarks will be much stronger and easier to build if the frames for them are already there. I should have done that with the Athena but I didn't. I will on the next boat I build. Pete