First Flight Done! 1/5 Scale CMP Zero - I need a LARGE Japenese Pilot ...

[LBJ]

for a fifth scale zero! This is the CMP model and it's just gorgeous out of the box. Going with the next-bigger motor than the Jenny, a 110x80 I think it is. Supposed to be a 60 to 80 cc gas equivalent. Not sure how the batts are going to mount yet, probably have to take the wing off every flight. They may go in the cowl. Dunno. LG will be a sturdy set of retracts loaned from a friend if they fit. Otherwise, will be looking at 2 other manufacturers. That's the gas tank which appears to be glass. The wings are quite nice at first look. 83 inches. It should be a nice model when completed. Dead flat overall finish. Very nice for only $299! You couldn't even think of this for that price too many years ago. Unbelievable.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0535.jpg

[dlinegar]

Got my 1/5 scale full body (15") pilot from these folks:

http://www.inzpan.com/Scale_Pilots_s/125.htm

From order to my door (in Toronto, Canada) was 1 week, impressive. More impressive was the scale details on the pilot. (I got a GA Pilot for my PZL Wilga) and I needed the GA headset, sun-glasses and seat belts.

Also you may want to have a peek at their scale cockpit accessories. They are the knees-bees...!

Cheers,

-derick-

[LBJ]

I didn't see any japenese pilots there. Just the same guy with that S.E. grin on his face. LMAO. Thanks for the link!

[LBJ]

Haven't had much progress to report. Got the cowl and exhaust pipes attached. Still waiting on the motor mount from Tower I will attempt to use. This is the Turnigy 80-100-180 which is the biggest motor they have, I believe. 60cc to 80cc gas equivalent. Will run a 22x8 prop and 100 amp Turnigy SC on three 4S 3750 packs. they missed the scale detail for the exhaust. The stacks are supposed to be right over those scabbed on plates that were to protect the skin from the heat of the exhaust. Looks close, but not close enough. I need to shorten the stacks some more, most likely. A bit too long. that's the mount that came with the kit for the gas engine setup under the motor. Might use it in the end. Will have to test the metal mount first. The motor sits pretty close to where it will be in the finished job. I have a 3 inch spinner ordered from TruTurn which will be a fairly close look for the Zero. Had to have it recut for the 22 inch prop, but they only charge $10 for that service. Looks like most of the stuff will go inside fuselage under the wing. But, I will work it as it comes. More later.

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[Ron101]

Ace's of iron has a 1/4 pilot.. might be to big

http://www.acesofiron.com/4th_scale.htm

I would use the blue box toys pilot they look great!!

I get them on Ebay.. do a searh for blue box toys pilots

or dragon pilots...1/6 scale and really nice

I have a shelf full of them over my head

Ron

[LBJ]

I ordered an Aces of Iron 1/4 Scale Jap Pilot. He may be a bit large, but if I can find a way to stuff him in I will. I hate pilot that's ANY too small. Yes, I amy have to go to the toy store and look for an action figure. Thanks for the tip. LBJ

[LBJ]

Got a bit more done on the Zero. I finally had to go out an buy a drill press to get the motor mount drilled like I needed it. All I need now is the tru-turn spinner which should be in any day. We ran the same motor on a P-51 the other day with a 22x10 prop and it is literally too much to hang onto. It will pull out of your hands! No snit! It took off like a rocket with a 20 pound plane.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0049.jpg
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[N99JH]

How long ago did you buy this motor? I looked at Hobby King website and could not find it?

Joshua

[LBJ]

I think it came in about 2 weeks ago. They have them, just don't pay attention to the pics. It's the 80-100-180 or 60cc to 80cc gas equivalent.

http://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=5139&Product_Name=HXT_80-100-A_180Kv_Brushless_Outrunner_(eq:_70-55)

[rocketman47]

There just aren't that many large Japanese people in general! :D

[tommyeflight89]

There just aren't that many large Japanese people in general! :D
lmao.. The second I saw the title I was going to say something like that.
This one will need to be custom made for sure. Perhaps a hybrid cross-breed. ;)

[LBJ]

Bit more work on the battery tray.

On the pilot, if I could get my brother to carve one for me, he could do a great job. He did a characture carving of a friend that was perfect.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0070.jpg

[LBJ]

Got my spinner in from Tru Turn today. Looks fair. Needs to be more rounded on the front, but this is off the shelf stuff. To make a special run spinner would cost a ton of money. I haven't seen anyone with a better look, even Dave Brown. Tru Turn does great work and the cut the spinner for a large prop, and bored it for a 12mm shaft. It would have looked better if it could have somehow been back inside the cowl a bit like the original, but that's a whole 'nother matter of impossibility! I think it will look a lot better painted flat black and in the air.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0076.jpg
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[LBJ]

It's not the best looking pilot, but it's done! Hahahahaha

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0081.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0082.jpg

[eflightray]

Did you check out these from your Still Looking for Large Japanese Pilot (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=948829) thread, posts #6 & #7.

[LBJ]

EFlightTray,

Yes, I actually bought the Aces Of Iron jap pilot. He is just too big. By the way, that one you show on the right as 1/5 scale is 1/4 scale. That's the one I bought. They don't make a 1/5 scale Jap pilot. I wonder how you show that to be a smaller scale under the pilot picture?

The "Officer and Gentlemen" brand pilot might not be bad, but he needs to be painted better than they did that one for sure. Just looks completely goofy the way they have him. I quit my job last week so I am looking at not spending so much till I come up with another job. I had this one on hand so I used him.

I can finish this Zero out since I have bought just about everything I need to complete. Still waiting on the struts from Robart. Installing the retracts will be an interesting venture since I have never done air retracts before. Plus, I have to redo what they have setup at CMP to get them to be raked out forward for ground stability. Fun.

[Abbeville Pilot]

I would like to make a suggestion about that motor. I have a good deal of experience with it. It is a low cost motor, but needs a little bit of an upgrade to get it right. It will save you a lot of headaches. 1st thing is to change out the bearings in it, if I recall there is a total of 3 bearings(in the mm range, don't recall the OD). Two having different outside diameters. My bearings failed on the 3rd flight, luckly that was all that was damaged. Boca Bearings is a good source for bearings. Next that motor needs a good deal of cooling, even with an open cowling, my motor got so hot that the glue holding the magnets melted, and the magnets started to slide towards the rear of the motor rubbing against the rear of the motor base adding friction and heat to compound the problem even worse.
After the bearings were replaced and the cooling increased it was problem free.
If you open up the cowl flaps you could get more air flow inside.

[Geoff Dryer]

Question for Abbeville Pilot. How hard was it too get the HXT 100-180 motor apart and change the bearings? I replaced the bearings in the largest Hyperion motor and it was a pain.

[Abbeville Pilot]

Question for Abbeville Pilot. How hard was it too get the HXT 100-180 motor apart and change the bearings? I replaced the bearings in the largest Hyperion motor and it was a pain.

It has metric set screws that are easily removed. Once all the setscrews are loose or out, it takes a bit of effort to remove the outer rotor since the magnets are quite strong, then I used an aluminum shaft with a drill press to remove the bearings from the stator. Careful with the windings.
When installing the new bearings make sure they go in evenly, a flat surface helps.

[LBJ]

Abbevillepilot,

I can't argue with your comments. We already had an identical motor throw the rear bearing on the first flight in a 1/5 scale P-51. Before the first flight actually, but he flew it anyway. It was just a matter of time before they shelled however. Good call. I will change them out before flight.

Might open the flaps up too. It should get some good air thru that wide open pneumonia hole though.

I have a few more hoops to jump thru before flight anyway, no hurry.

[Ed Couch]

Abbeville

I agree with the bearing accessment. I recently replaced all bearing as the after bearing failed on the second flight and made an awful noise for danged sure. Bearings are 12 X 21 X 5mm (2) for the front and a 12 X 24 X 5mm bearing for the after end. I was amazed on how quickly the bearing could be changed using a wooden dowel to press out the bearings with a gentle tap of a brass hammer against the dowel end. Reassembly was simple as well and only used a wooden block and a couple of sockets that fit the outer races and taped them back into place. Reassembly took only about 15 minutes. I found the proper bearings in ceramics for 10 bucks each for the front and 15 bucks for the rear. Replacement stock bearings were about 10 for 15 dollars. Worth the replacement, you bet. Runs very smooth in its present configuration. I have also been running the 80 by 85 mm motors on the stock bearings and have had no problems to date. Wish the stock configuration had run longer but stuff happens and I've seen Hackers go up in smoke on first run as well. HC offered to replace if shipped back but I decided to do the bearings myself. Looking forward to seeing Lane's beast in the air. I'll be one behind the stick and its always fun as he builds a beautiful bird. ed

[LBJ]

I finally got my struts in from Robart. Took them over a month to build them. About 10 inches long. Those are spring air clones made by a guy in the local area over 15 years ago. I borrowed them from Ed Couch for the Zero. I will have to remake the retract fairings since the setup is a bit different than the original design. I could have been done with this one if not for the long wait from Robart. Now I can glue the wing together and get on with the fianl details. Might get to fly it before it REALLY gets cold around here.
12-13-08
Added the fairings today since it was too windy to fly and I still have the CG to get right. A little grey paint and they will be good to go.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0015-1.jpg
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[MAF]

Looking great, I have the 72" CMP zero with a Hacker up the front and it flies great.

MAF

[LBJ]

Test pilot Ed Couch (on left) flew my Zero today on 2 great flights. We had been waiting on a day like today. Sunny, light wind, 55 degrees F or so. Everything went smooth as silk. About 5 minutes each flight. I don't have a real pro camera here, just a snap shot job. Inflight pics aren't too good, but you get the idea. These flights were on three 4S 3700 Rhinos but I have two 5S 4900 Rhinos on order from Hobby King. It will fly fine on 10 S. I can also add my 6S to one 5S 4900 and go that way too. Glad I went ahead and changed out the bearings before flight. Made sense to do that and the ceramic bearings were smooth as can be. $50 well spent. I am very pleased with the first flights. Only comments I got were on the spinner. I agree it is not quite correct for the Zero. I understand that Dave Platt has one that is correct. This one is as close as Tru Turn had.

I need to add that Ed did a great job on the sticks. Smooth takeoffs and landings. Did some long, slow and 4 point rolls and big turns that looked good in the air. Great job Ed!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/numskin/IMG_0096.jpg
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[Abbeville Pilot]

Congrats on your successful flight and the pictures look great. I especially liked the one with the P-51 and the Zero together. Did you happen to check the motor to see how hot it was after landing? I'm curious to know if the ceramic bearings helped with reducing the heat as well.

[LBJ]

I put my hand on the motor and it felt warm, but not hot. The prop free turned MUCH smoother than the old bearings, that's for sure. That's just one less thing to worry about.

We put 2150 MAH charge back into the battery after the first flight.

[Abbeville Pilot]

Thats great LBJ, I wish you continued success.

[LBJ]

Thanks, Abbeville pilot!

A fellow builder told me that Dave Platt has a "real scale" Zero spinner with round nose so I ordered one today. It will be the final detail to "lock" the Zero look in. I can use the one on the model on something else. Other than that and sanding down the wing to match the fuselage in roughness, I am done. KMP P-38 next. Twin Turnigy 60's.

Dave Platt says on his site, "You never really finish a scale model, you just quit working on it." How true.

[aLLANCITO]

Abbeville

I agree with the bearing accessment. I recently replaced all bearing as the after bearing failed on the second flight and made an awful noise for danged sure. Bearings are 12 X 21 X 5mm (2) for the front and a 12 X 24 X 5mm bearing for the after end. I was amazed on how quickly the bearing could be changed using a wooden dowel to press out the bearings with a gentle tap of a brass hammer against the dowel end. Reassembly was simple as well and only used a wooden block and a couple of sockets that fit the outer races and taped them back into place. Reassembly took only about 15 minutes. I found the proper bearings in ceramics for 10 bucks each for the front and 15 bucks for the rear. Replacement stock bearings were about 10 for 15 dollars. Worth the replacement, you bet. Runs very smooth in its present configuration. I have also been running the 80 by 85 mm motors on the stock bearings and have had no problems to date. Wish the stock configuration had run longer but stuff happens and I've seen Hackers go up in smoke on first run as well. HC offered to replace if shipped back but I decided to do the bearings myself. Looking forward to seeing Lane's beast in the air. I'll be one behind the stick and its always fun as he builds a beautiful bird. ed

Ed I found the bearings in www.bocabearings.com but they have dozens to select from. I think the stainless/ceramic option is the way to go but what bearings and maybe actual part numbers did you use. Also where you purchased from would be a help as well please.

[Ed Couch]

https://www.vxb.com/

Bearing company I purchased them from. Sizes are as noted in earlier post. Prices also as noted. Part # 7408 (2) for front bearing and #7786 (1) for aft bearing. Hope the info helps. ed

[sevcav]

Hi, I have been following your thread, but in regards to 1/5th scale I am uncertain. Is this the 50 size or 54" wingspan version or the 120 size with 71" wingspan?

Thanks for any information.

Cav

[Ed Couch]

Vehicle is over 80 inchs in span. This one ain't your normal run of the mill toy. I would hate to try and fly a 72 inch span vehicle with the power and weight of this one. The model is 150 size CMP Zero. ed

[LBJ]

And coincidentally, I weighed the parts yesterday since I never got around to that before. It weighs in at 21.5 pounds ready to fly. That's spring scales and not quite as accurate as digital but fairly close. It's actually about 83 inches.

[sevcav]

Thank you for the information, I have been eying what is apparently the little brother at Nitro models.

Cav

[diver don]

https://www.vxb.com/

Bearing company I purchased them from. Sizes are as noted in earlier post. Prices also as noted. Part # 7408 (2) for front bearing and #7786 (1) for aft bearing. Hope the info helps. ed

Ed,

Just a quick question.

I too have this motor for a 1/3 scale Balsa USA Sopwith Pup and want to make the bearing change-out.

You identified the rear bearing as a 12x24x5 but the part number shows a 12x24x 6???

Will that make a difference?

Thanks,

Don

[Ed Couch]

Don

Sorry for that but I believe it is a 5 mm bearing as initially identified. Sorry for the error on my part but honestly the 6 mm should also work as well. ed

[diver don]

Thanks Ed,

They arrived today with the 6 so we shall see when I tear it apart.

I couldn't find a 5 on their web site but I'm sure it will work out.

Thanks again,

Don

[LBJ]

Guys and Gals,

Need a new left wing section for the Big CMP Zero. It snapped in on final approach about 3 feet off the ground. Pretty much "lunched the lefty." Made a loud crunch when the wing hit. When a 20 pound bird quits flying it just goes "crunch." Ouch!

I E-Mailed Nitro where I bought it but have to see what they say. Anyone seen any parts for that bird?

[steve1814]

LBJ,


I know this is kinda mute point, but have you seen this 1/5 scale pilot:

link (http://centuryjet.com/product_info.php/cPath/46_38_36_33/products_id/40)

You can get him in a bust as well

http://centuryjet.com/images/Japanese-Full-Body-Pilot.jpg

Cheers,
Steve

[LBJ]

No, I must admit I missed that one. Looks good. Priced about right, painted. I may get him for the Zero now that it's back flying. thanks for the link, Steve.

[steve1814]

Got my spinner in from Tru Turn today. Looks fair. Needs to be more rounded on the front, but this is off the shelf stuff. To make a special run spinner would cost a ton of money. I haven't seen anyone with a better look, even Dave Brown. Tru Turn does great work and the cut the spinner for a large prop, and bored it for a 12mm shaft. It would have looked better if it could have somehow been back inside the cowl a bit like the original, but that's a whole 'nother matter of impossibility! I think it will look a lot better painted flat black and in the air.


LBJ,

What size is that spinner?

[LBJ]

I'd have to get it and measure it first. I ended up with a Dave Platt Zero spinner that is very good scale. You have to cut your own prop opening however. I'll get a pic and give measurements of it and the Tru turn.

[steve1814]

You guys should see the new TGY 80-100 180Kv motor. It has Koyo sealed bearings in it for the shaft, and a huge 70mm bearing (yes, 70mm OD 65mm ID) on the back to handle the cantilever weight of the motor. I had a heck of a time getting it apart, it is a total re-design, but I eventually got it disassembled and checked out. The berings (all 3 on the shaft and the big one) run true, but I put an extra ceramic one in the front as it has space for it - I left the 3 koyos in place. Thing turns nice in the hand - we'll have to see what happens when I put some power on it...:D

Cheers,
Steve

[LBJ]

Is this the one with the screws around the outside of the can? The one they show on the ads? Sounds pretty solid.

[steve1814]

Is this the one with the screws around the outside of the can? The one they show on the ads? Sounds pretty solid.

Yeah, the one with the screws - the rears screws need to come off to get the shaft out, but the fronts can stay.

Cheers,
Steve

[LBJ]

Can you take it apart again and get some pics? LOL. Kidding of course. I have two brand new 80-100's just sitting there. Crap. Wish I had the new ones. Glad to hear they are making improvements.

[steve1814]

after I re-assmbled the motor, I thought to myself that I should have taken pictures, but I thought that no one would be really interested:p

I guess I can snap soime pictures when I install it in the Zero...

Cheers,
Steve

[steve1814]

LBJ,

Here are a couple shots of the bearing in the rear, along with the 89mm spinner I got for my Zero..

Cheers,
Steve

[LBJ]

That's something! What Zero are you using it on? Is that the Platt spinner?

[steve1814]

That's something! What Zero are you using it on? Is that the Platt spinner?

The CMPro Zero:D. The spinner is the 89mm from Airborne models (http://www.airborne-models.com/html/AccessoriesGroup.asp?AGroupID=2) (The Worlds Models) you can get them in 3 colors.

Also picked up the Retracts from century Jet with the individual up/down speed adjust

Cheers,
Steve