Salvage Parts for Cybird P2/ Thunder Roc

[nmallia]

Dear friends

I have bought a Thunder Roc 3ch bird, after changing servos, esc & reciever i managed a couple of sucessful flights. It was even chased by crows on the last flight...unfortunatly one of the three crow picking on my bird actualy made contact, unbalaced my bird and down it came like a rock! Unfortunatly i have no video of this.

I am now looking for a wing and also a battery box.

I am ready to buy even broken wings, since im ready to try and salvage parts from an other broken wing to make one healthy one. So if anyone of you guys has either a broken Cybird P2, Eastern Dragon, HX Bird or Thunder roc i will be more than happy to give you cash for the parts i need.

Best Regards

Nicholas
(Currently in Brussels)

[Heavy Chevy]

Dear friends

I have bought a Thunder Roc 3ch bird, after changing servos, esc & reciever i managed a couple of sucessful flights. It was even chased by crows on the last flight...unfortunatly one of the three crow picking on my bird actualy made contact, unbalaced my bird and down it came like a rock! Unfortunatly i have no video of this.

I am now looking for a wing and also a battery box.

I am ready to buy even broken wings, since im ready to try and salvage parts from an other broken wing to make one healthy one. So if anyone of you guys has either a broken Cybird P2, Eastern Dragon, HX Bird or Thunder roc i will be more than happy to give you cash for the parts i need.

Best Regards

Nicholas
(Currently in Brussels)

Any luck with wings? I have a thunder Roc 3ch and I need wings. I'm thinking about attempting to make my own so that I don't have to go on a wild goose chase for them. I figure I will try to model them off of the wings from the ifly vamp....but sort of a more heavy duty version. This way....they will be super easy to build and to reproduce. Then, I can build a fleet for flight ;)

[NChronister]

You can definitely make your own wings, and don't feel you have to follow the original too closely. You can take the metal wing posts out, and replace them with solid 3 mm spars. This will make the wing much simpler to construct and more durable than using hollow tubes. This results in a stiffer, more efficient wing, but it will cause the motor to run at a lower, less efficient RPM. You can solve this by either:

1. Using a spar less than 3 mm diameter in the 3 mm hole.
2. Using a smaller wingspan (which results in a faster but more difficult to fly ornithopter).
3. Somehow changing the gear ratio,
4. or reducing the flapping angle.
5. Using an outrunner motor.

When I built my own ornithopter using a Cybird gearbox I used option #2.

[Heavy Chevy]

You can definitely make your own wings, and don't feel you have to follow the original too closely. You can take the metal wing posts out, and replace them with solid 3 mm spars. This will make the wing much simpler to construct and more durable than using hollow tubes. This results in a stiffer, more efficient wing, but it will cause the motor to run at a lower, less efficient RPM. You can solve this by either:

1. Using a spar less than 3 mm diameter in the 3 mm hole.
2. Using a smaller wingspan (which results in a faster but more difficult to fly ornithopter).
3. Somehow changing the gear ratio,
4. or reducing the flapping angle.
5. Using an outrunner motor.

When I built my own ornithopter using a Cybird gearbox I used option #2.

Those look fantastic!! Nicely done ;)

I am currently working on my new wings. I'm using the cloth from the old wings. I was using rods from a kite kit but then I discovered CF arrows, (that can be purchased at Walmart), are very lightweight, hallow and extremely strong. They cost about $8 each. If these work out, I will post a video explanation of what I did......you should too to help people out. It seems to me that many people needed new wings and eventually gave up and gutted their birds ;p

Really, your wings look superb! I will for sure take mental note of your tips, thank you!!!

:)

[NChronister]

Did you compare the actual weight of the arrow shafts to the weight of the original wing spars? Because of the much larger diameter, these spars might be overkill. The arrow shaft that I have weighs 16.5 grams and is 75 cm long. The same length of 3 mm carbon rod weighs only 7.375 grams and is plenty stiff for Cybird use. Arrow shafts would work well in the larger, scratch-built ornithopter that you're going to build next. :)

For anyone who doesn't want to support one of the giant corporations that have been destroying our country, you can buy a wider selection of hollow spars (tapered ones even) from Hang-Em High Fabrics or CST:

http://ecom.citystar.com/hang-em-high/ushop/
http://www.cstsales.com/Hollow_Carbon_Rods.html

[Heavy Chevy]

Did you compare the actual weight of the arrow shafts to the weight of the original wing spars? Because of the much larger diameter, these spars might be overkill. The arrow shaft that I have weighs 16.5 grams and is 75 cm long. The same length of 3 mm carbon rod weighs only 7.375 grams and is plenty stiff for Cybird use. Arrow shafts would work well in the larger, scratch-built ornithopter that you're going to build next. :)

For anyone who doesn't want to support one of the giant corporations that have been destroying our country, you can buy a wider selection of hollow spars (tapered ones even) from Hang-Em High Fabrics or CST:

http://ecom.citystar.com/hang-em-high/ushop/
http://www.cstsales.com/Hollow_Carbon_Rods.html

Yup, you're right, they are overkill. Once you get up to almost top speed, they cause the gears to become offset.

So my next question is: How do you get the metal pins out of the base of the support arm? I'm trying to get one out but I'm having no luck. I'm wondering if you cut the metal pin of and then drilled the rest out?

I picked up a black nylon cape at the sally anne for less than $2. It will make several wings and maybe a kite ;) It will also attract the ravens which are abundant in Whitehorse.

[NChronister]

You're in Whitehorse? Cool.

I got the pin out by the following method:

1. Remove the wing lever assembly from the flapping mechanism, by taking off the e-clip and sliding out the axle.
2. Put the wing lever into a vise, with the pin hole facing up.
3. Cut a short piece of 1/32" music wire (slightly smaller diameter than the 1 mm rod you're trying to displace).
4. Hold the wire with pliers so that it's lined up with the hole.
5. Tap it with a hammer until it pushes the other wire out.

Notice one end of the pin may be recessed slightly and that is the side to go after if you want to make the job a little easier. Sometimes this works better than others.

Good wing fabric here: http://ecom.citystar.com/hang-em-high/ushop/

Look for the 1/2 ounce polycarbonate coated polyester

[Heavy Chevy]

You're in Whitehorse? Cool.

I got the pin out by the following method:

1. Remove the wing lever assembly from the flapping mechanism, by taking off the e-clip and sliding out the axle.
2. Put the wing lever into a vise, with the pin hole facing up.
3. Cut a short piece of 1/32" music wire (slightly smaller diameter than the 1 mm rod you're trying to displace).
4. Hold the wire with pliers so that it's lined up with the hole.
5. Tap it with a hammer until it pushes the other wire out.

Notice one end of the pin may be recessed slightly and that is the side to go after if you want to make the job a little easier. Sometimes this works better than others.

Good wing fabric here: http://ecom.citystar.com/hang-em-high/ushop/

Look for the 1/2 ounce polycarbonate coated polyester

Thanks for the directions but I just can't get them out, I have no vise having just moved to Whitehorse.
Here's a video of what I've done....it's been very frustrating but I really want to see this thing fly and all in all, it has been fun too ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RG23kUDvRl0

[OrniGuy2]

Pretty cool video bud...you're pretty funny too. Hope the test flight works out...maybe you can video your first flights and show us how well the wings worked...looks like you did a great job...good luck!

[Heavy Chevy]

Pretty cool video bud...you're pretty funny too. Hope the test flight works out...maybe you can video your first flights and show us how well the wings worked...looks like you did a great job...good luck!

Thanks. I'll for sure try to get some footage of how it goes. It all depends on if my girlfriend wants to come out to the park with me.....she reads while I fly my fleet ;)

Would be a shame to have it in the air just to crash it and break the wings, again, and to have not taped it.

Cross your fingers.......

[Heavy Chevy]

Pretty cool video bud...you're pretty funny too. Hope the test flight works out...maybe you can video your first flights and show us how well the wings worked...looks like you did a great job...good luck!

Here it is!! The wings worked!!

WOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Very satisfying to get it airborn, I really needed that ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QoekWl-geE&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ercgroups%2Ecom%2Fforums%2F showthread%2Ephp%3Ft%3D822285%26page%3D7%26highlig ht%3Dcybird%2Bwings%2Bheavy%2Bchevy&feature=player_embedded

I just finished fixing the next problem so hopefully now I can enjoy flying this thing for a while.....

:)

[OrniGuy2]

Congrats on your successful flight...great job!

[Heavy Chevy]

Well, my thunder Roc was problem after problem......One of my main gears broke, I repaired it, it broke, I repaired it, it broke......sigh.

Until I find a new gear, it's out of commission.

So, I scored a used cybird P1 off of ebay. I do not have a 72mAh transmitter needed for it so what I've done is to transfer the guts of the Thunder Roc 3 ch to the cybird P1. I am using the gear box and frame from the P1, and the brain and servos from the TR. I'm also going to try it with the new wings from the P1 and the enlarged tail wing from the TR....(it's about 2" longer and wider).

Will post a vid soon.

:)

[Machy2k]

Hey Heavy; Are you putting the elevator on it
Or keeping it 2 channel?
Have fun man...

[Heavy Chevy]

Hey Heavy; Are you putting the elevator on it
Or keeping it 2 channel?
Have fun man...

I'm putting the elevator on it and going 3 ch. I'll let you know how it goes

[Heavy Chevy]

Well, My P1 with all of the Thunder Roc stuff just wouldn't fly. I suspect that it is too heavy. It just can't seem to pull itself up and through the air.

What I'm working on now are two things:

1. I've realized that the P1 outer gears that rotate the arms are the same size as the Thunder Roc gears inside of the gear box only that they are metal and not plastic. Realizing this, I went to work.....One of the two gears is done and works well. I am still having the same problem with the other gear, (the one that is two gears in one). I tried using 4min epoxy, specially formulated for metal......what a let down!! Crazy glue did a better job but still didn't last. Right now, I am currently glueing the gear with industrial "LePage PL Premium 3 times stronger than ordinary adhesives" glue and if this can't hold it, nothing will......correct me if I'm wrong.

2. I have a back up Storm Launcher for parts.....it runs off of a 7.4V, 740mAh 2cell lipo that can be made even lighter than stock cybird with a bit of work. The storm launcher turns by transferring power from motor to motor.....(I forget the proper name for this right now). So, I'm going to try using my SL guts in my P1 and we will see if it flies. I am sending both sets of SL wires, (from the two motors), to the one motor on the P1. The SL servo is used for turning left and right......seems to favor right more than left...oh well. The SL has awesome range and is tried, tested and true. The only thing with this is that Up and down on the transmitter will be how to turn left and right with the bird.....doesn't if it works.

We'll see how it all goes and I'll post later.

[Heavy Chevy]

Hey guys,

I have a question:

Can the gear box from a P1 handle the bigger wings of a P2 if it was made to fit the frame?

[Heavy Chevy]

Hey Heavy; Are you putting the elevator on it
Or keeping it 2 channel?
Have fun man...


Actually, when I unplugged the elevator servo connector, I no longer had power at all so, unless there's a way around this, I have to keep it three channel.

Anyways, my local shop had two Thunder Roc's, (the last he had), and he's had them for a while, so I scored them for $168 CDN....not bad at all.

So now I have One good TR and one for parts plus my original TR with a broken gear leaving it not flyable. I'm thinking that with the unflyable TR, I will cut the frame and attach the back end of it to the frame of my P1 and use the larger wings of the TR. Can the gearbox of a P1 handle this larger wingspan of a P2/TR??

Here is what I'm thinking, specifically illustrations 1-10 of the "cybird P1.6"

http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.geocities.jp%2Fcybird _life%2Fcybird%2Fcybird_haku%2Fcybird_haku.html&langpair=ja%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF8

So what do you all think about compatibility of the P1 gearbox with the wings of a P2/TR? Will this work or will it eat more gears in no time?

:)

[Machy2k]

So what do you all think about compatibility of the P1 gearbox with the wings of a P2/TR? Will this work or will it eat more gears in no time?

:)[/QUOTE]

Hev; I think it will probably eat gears, of course, that is not a reason not to try.
You may be fine because the P1 gearbox should be running slower to flap the big wings, (let's hope).
My theory about the gears in these P1 and p2 birds is that they are all old product now and the plasticizer in the gears is leaving, so they are all brittle.
It is a shame that we cannot get metal gears, and who knows what materials are used in the knockoff bird's gearboxes...
Petey...

[Heavy Chevy]

So what do you all think about compatibility of the P1 gearbox with the wings of a P2/TR? Will this work or will it eat more gears in no time?

:)

Hev; I think it will probably eat gears, of course, that is not a reason not to try.
You may be fine because the P1 gearbox should be running slower to flap the big wings, (let's hope).
My theory about the gears in these P1 and p2 birds is that they are all old product now and the plasticizer in the gears is leaving, so they are all brittle.
It is a shame that we cannot get metal gears, and who knows what materials are used in the knockoff bird's gearboxes...
Petey...[/QUOTE]

Yes, a shame we can't get metal gears :(

Sorry, what is plasticizer?

[Machy2k]

Plasticizer is a chemical in plastic which helps plastic stay flexible, and it will wear out over time.
I had a radio controlled snowmobile years ago (which was cool as heck) and the instructions made you boil the glass filled nylon parts, every season to prevent the cold from making them brittle and then have the parts break (What boiling the parts did was distribute the Plasticizer evenly through the parts).
I had gear failure on my first Cybird p1 after 4-5 flight's, which I assume was new in the box when I got it, (but not new according to date of manufacture).
I know for a fact that the factory's in China that made Cybirds for the Korean designer's, still made them after the Korean company folded.
I do not know if the P1's are made to this day, so I believe that if you get a new in the box P1, that the gears will fail because they are in fact a couple of years old and the parts (gears) are not as flexible.
I also assume it has to be worse for the knockoffs like the Thunder Roc...
Petey...

[Heavy Chevy]

Yeah, that is a shame. Maybe I can get some and put it on? Now that is wishful thinking; I'm sure it's an awful chemical really not suitable for the home.

Either way, I've got a TR stock and a TR hybrid with the P1 gear box waiting for the wind to go away so that I can set them free!!

:)

[Heavy Chevy]

You're in Whitehorse? Cool.

I got the pin out by the following method:

1. Remove the wing lever assembly from the flapping mechanism, by taking off the e-clip and sliding out the axle.
2. Put the wing lever into a vise, with the pin hole facing up.
3. Cut a short piece of 1/32" music wire (slightly smaller diameter than the 1 mm rod you're trying to displace).
4. Hold the wire with pliers so that it's lined up with the hole.
5. Tap it with a hammer until it pushes the other wire out.

Notice one end of the pin may be recessed slightly and that is the side to go after if you want to make the job a little easier. Sometimes this works better than others.

Good wing fabric here: http://ecom.citystar.com/hang-em-high/ushop/

Look for the 1/2 ounce polycarbonate coated polyester

I finally understand this now......the problem was that the TR does not have that little lock pin or they filled the hole. The P1 has it clearly visible; it was a sinch to get out and now the black wings are fitted in properly.....feels good to finally get that done right.

Now I just need metal gears for the the P1 and P2.

[Heavy Chevy]

Plasticizer is a chemical in plastic which helps plastic stay flexible, and it will wear out over time.
I had a radio controlled snowmobile years ago (which was cool as heck) and the instructions made you boil the glass filled nylon parts, every season to prevent the cold from making them brittle and then have the parts break (What boiling the parts did was distribute the Plasticizer evenly through the parts).
I had gear failure on my first Cybird p1 after 4-5 flight's, which I assume was new in the box when I got it, (but not new according to date of manufacture).
I know for a fact that the factory's in China that made Cybirds for the Korean designer's, still made them after the Korean company folded.
I do not know if the P1's are made to this day, so I believe that if you get a new in the box P1, that the gears will fail because they are in fact a couple of years old and the parts (gears) are not as flexible.
I also assume it has to be worse for the knockoffs like the Thunder Roc...
Petey...

I see.......I sure wish they'd just make them all metal from the get go and be done with it. It would be worth paying more for but you know them, always have to keep the costs down.

Thanks for explaining all of that.

:)