Is this possible with rudder and elevator

[jolin]

Flying a plane with elevator and rudder channels I have been wondering if the following manuver is possible. Start a loop but at the top of the loop when the plane is inverted and keeping the throttle at full, move the elevator to neutral or slightly down (actual movement is up at that point}. Would the plane fly inverted? If so, and with full throttle, would either a completion of the inside loop or a full outside loop be possible shortly thereafter depending on which way the elevator is positioned? If theoretically possible I was wondering if my slo stick or beaver might be able to do it and if the wings would stand up to the pressure of an outside loop? Could it be done with a crazy Max?

If flying inverted was possible but the pressure on the wings was considered too much for either loops would the plane right itself by using right or left rudder? If not how would be the best way to right the airplane?

What would happen that you could not recover from inverted flight without ailerons?

[SheldonYoung]

If you get to the top of a loop and apply down elevator the airplane should continue on into level flight. To get out of it release the elevator to complete the rest of the loop or roll out of it. The Crazy Max will probably do it, but it's might not a good idea with a plane like the Beaver (you'll have to look and see if the wings can take the stress in that direction).

[William A]

Posted by jolin
What would happen that you could not recover from inverted flight without ailerons? You get funny looking scrapes on top of your wings from landing on the shed roof :rolleyes:

Also posted by jolin
If not how would be the best way to right the airplane? With as much dihedral as the Slowstick has, it's kinda tough to keep it upside down as it is.
Get it up there plenty high and give it shot !

[jolin]

Originally posted by SheldonYoung
If you get to the top of a loop and apply down elevator the airplane should continue on into level flight. To get out of it release the elevator to complete the rest of the loop or roll out of it. The Crazy Max will probably do it, but it's might not a good idea with a plane like the Beaver (you'll have to look and see if the wings can take the stress in that direction).

[sheerLuck]

I can do it for short periods of time with my Tipsy and my Pico FD, both reinforced somewhat. I can only finish by finishing the inside loop. The Crazy Max is aerobatic and does it with one wing tied behind it's fuselage....it can complete it any old direction.

Larry

[William A]

Ditto what Larry said about the CM :)
(missed that the first time around)

[Ahawk]

Originally posted by jolin
Flying a plane with elevator and rudder channels I have been wondering if the following manuver is possible. Start a loop but at the top of the loop when the plane is inverted and keeping the throttle at full, move the elevator to neutral or slightly down (actual movement is up at that point}. Would the plane fly inverted? If so, and with full throttle, would either a completion of the inside loop or a full outside loop be possible shortly thereafter depending on which way the elevator is positioned? If theoretically possible I was wondering if my slo stick or beaver might be able to do it and if the wings would stand up to the pressure of an outside loop? Could it be done with a crazy Max?

If flying inverted was possible but the pressure on the wings was considered too much for either loops would the plane right itself by using right or left rudder? If not how would be the best way to right the airplane?

What would happen that you could not recover from inverted flight without ailerons?

I do it all the time with my slowstick! The problem is that with that much dihedral, you are fighting to keep it inverted the whole time. On a full charge I can usually push an outside loop, (once inverted) but it is very dirty and not clean. The only problem I can think of flying the slowstick inverted is you need to be kinda high to do it, the reason? The stock rudder isn't usually effective enough to right the plane quickly so you usually need to do a half loop from inverted to get out of it.

Yes, my slowstick is "stock". I use 7 and 8 cell packs.

-Adam

[alvinm]

Be carefull with the beaver,it will go inverted by either looping it or simply down elevator untill your inverted.The problem is that you build up some serious speed in the process and my wings have collapsed from about 200 ft.If you can glue a carbon rod across the width of the wing and make sure your struts are very secure you can do it.Sometimes I can stall the plane and if it falls
upside down I can invert it with less air speed.Make sure you have good altitude because it doesn't roll out too quickly.

[BillK]

I did this move with my Slow Stick today. Stock 300c-d motor and a 8.4v 1000 mah NimH battery. When I got to the top of the loop I gave some down elevator and stayed flying straight and inverted for around 10-15 seconds and then completed the loop.

[ronvandy]

Is there a good reference or thread for the range of possible manuevers with rudder/elevator/throttle only?


Ron Vanden Bossche

[Fly]

I've done complete figure 8s inverted with my Slow Stick (but it isn't pretty!). It takes pretty fresh batteries and full throttle and nearly full down elevator to hold altitude.

The strangest thing is turning while inverted. With ailerons. a left or right stick rolls the plane the same inverted or not. However with dihedral coupled rudder rolls, the effect is just weird. It takes a strong rudder in the opposite direction to get the roll started and then the opposite rudder to hold the bank angle. You really need to throw the tail over to get it to turn and then hold it opposite to hold the turn.

It won't roll out of inverted flight. I have to complete the last half of the loop to get out. After a few minutes inverted on 8x700 Maxell cells or parallel Q830 packs, I can no longer hold altitude.

-- Alan