Good first glider for flatlanders

[Markman]

I have been flying for about a year and have a couple of glow-powered planes. I've always been interested in gliders however and I'm looking to get my first one this Winter. I live in the land of flat (Illinois) so slope is not a real viable option. Bit I do get out to Colorado from time to time so if there is a model that does OK on a slope that would be great. I'd like a portable ARF (I'm not into building yet)type that could be up/high started and even hand/discus launched. What are my options, suggestions. I'd like to keep the cost down as well.

Thanks in advance.

Mark

[ICTHRMLS]

Originally posted by Markman
I'd like a portable ARF (I'm not into building yet)type that could be up/high started and even hand/discus launched. What are my options, suggestions. I'd like to keep the cost down as well.


Gee... you don't want much do ya??? ;) Seriously, you need to whittle down your wish list. Thermal gliders can slope fairly well but slopers don't make great flatland thermal hunters. Discus launched ships tend to be pricey ($300.00) and small - aka handlaunch @ 60" or so. This will be portable but again it is a handlaunch and they can be frustrating to the novice thermaler. A 2-meter ship gets you more wing without too much tranportation problems providing you can buy a two piece wing version..... these tend to be the most affordable as well. An open class ship will slope & thermal well but are a pain to lug around even with a two or three piece wing. Sorry - there are very few if any one size fits all gliders. Post your price range and you'll get more definitive suggestions. :cool:

[Michael Heer]

For an ARF glider a few guys in our club have been very happy with the Spirit Elite from Tower Hobby. It is a full house plane with ailerons and flaps and so it uses six micro servos. If you want a simplier plane they sell a polyhedral Spirit ARF for about $30.00 less. It is rudder/elevator only but not considered as a good a flier by those who have flown both. They are both two meter planes. Check them out on Tower's website.

[Markman]

OK...maybe I was asking for a lot:D I just want the most for my money. My price range is going to probably be under $150 for the plane, not including radio stuff. I'd want an ARF or very close. I think that the majority (90%) of the time I will be flying from a no-slope area but I'd also have the opportunity to fly from some decent sized slopes from time to time. I'd also really like to try a discus launch but that sounds like I might need a different plane for that. I guess it comes down to a smaller, 2 meter or less, plane that can be transported easily and could be launched effectively using a small hi-start. What are some good choices?

Thanks.

Mark

[Ollie]

Small size, hand launch or discus launched gliders will cost you for a decent performing ARF and the micro radio gear to fit in it. The most bang for a buck is in a 2-meter, 2 channel ARF that takes standard size radio gear. With that in mind, the Spirit and the Aspire are about the best of a very few choices. There is little to choose between them. Either can be flown on the slope with light to moderate winds but, they are not particularly aerobatic. Both can be hand launched but not discus launched. Their wing loadings will not result in very good hand launch performance. They will be at their best on a highstart and are capable of very long flights with a skilled thermal flier at the controls.

Another possibility is to buy a used plane that someone else has built. That's like buying a used car. You won't know what hidden defects lie under the skin. The best guarantee is to know the integrity of the seller and the history of the item in question.

When you start building there will be much wider choices and those choices will include much better performing planes.

[Jim Osterling]

My son and I went in together on the 2m arf by Hangar 9 - the Aspire. It's a good quality flier for a $100 at the LHS. We use a high start in a field near the house and a winch at the club.

First time out at the club was windy and the plane handled it well considering it weighs only 32 oz (less than advertised)...am thinking about putting in a ballast box however as we're getting into the windy season down here.

Good luck with your endeavors.

[onlyfingers]

Why not look at the MAD Higlander. It's an EPP foam plane, and it shows up on lists of sloping planes now and then. I've got one, but have never tried sloping.
It's a 2m plane, with a one-piece polyhedral wing. Cost: about $70 for the kit (pretty far from ARF), and maybe $40 in glue, covering, and building supplies. Plus radio and servos.

[tempest411]

Maple Leaf Icon:p

[sprice50]

The Spirit Elite is a perfect choice. It thermals well, can slope in light too moderate conditions and has great control due to the ailerons and flaps.

Shaun

[sprice50]

Take a look at the Spirit Elite post on the 14 nov in thermal

[RandyK1]

Check out the planes on this site: http://www.arthobby.com/gliders.html all are within your price range and all are ARF, and best of all (because your new to glider's) thay sell replacement parts!!. These gliders are the BEST that I have found for this price range!! I think thay fill all of your need's. Hope this help's ya some.........R........:) as you can see, I also live in THE FLAT STATE

[GaryO]

Second the reference to the Art Hobby site. Have been watching some of these models fly all fall and they fly GREAT!! The Spirits and the Aspires simply don"t compare so save your money.

Off the winch or high start they perform very well. They also have been working well at Eagle Butte for sloping (I'm told). Workmanship is impressive, and the wings come apart.

The workmanship is outstanding. Give a look and see what $150 will buy. I'm into HLG now, but they will be my thermal/slope planes.


Gary

[RandyK1]

GaryO, Just so you know, Art hobby also has HLG's and DLG's. And the wings do come apart, some are 2 pc wings and some are 3 pc wings. Also thay carry electric powered sailplane's. I will be getting one of these next!........R..........:D.

[culiv]

If you have never flown sailplanes you might want to go with a basic setup such as the Spirit (not the Elite) or Gentle Lady to get the hang of it. The Spirit Elite is intended more for experienced pilots.

One draw back that the standard Spirit or Gentle Lady is that the supplied wing it is great for learning to soar, but lacking for more advanced pilots. You can remedy that (once you get the hang of soaring) by purchasing a wing upgrade for either plane from RA Cores (see below). These are EPP wings with a little construction necessary. Cost is listed at $35.

Also, if you are interested in electric power for launch instead of high starts, consider the GP Spectra (same plane as the spirit but w/ electric motor) since it is also available as an ARF.

RA Cores wing upgrades (http://www.racores.com/current_products.html#2MWings)

[BMatthews]

Just a few thoughts that may apply in your case.

First, you shouldn't have any trouble flying an aileron model with your previous experience so far but you may find that you need to be "flying" the model so much that your thermal hunting senses will take longer to develop. The simpler poly ships with their free flight like stability demand less of the flyer and let them concentrate on whatching the model for thermal sign. Also the poly ships tend to be much easier to fly once in the thermal.

But..... a lot of this user freindliness comes at the expense of wind penetration ability. The poly models often use a higher lift, higher drag airfoil. This makes them easier to fly and manage the glide speed when out at the limits of vision but it also means you can't follow a thermal as far downwind as you'd like if it's blowing fairly hard.

But..... while most of the aileron birds with their speedy airfoils will penetrate well but you'll find the slow speed and sink range suffers a little when you're scratching for lift. These models have a narrower drag bucket that they like to be kept in. This means the model needs to fly a little bit faster than you'd think a glider should fly. It's not a lot but if you make the mistake of "slow means minimum sink" then you may find you've fallen off the edge and the model performs like a gut shot duck. The fix is easy, just breath forward on the stick and trade off about 10 feet of altitude for the speed the model needs to get back onto the step.

But..... if it's always windy in Illinois then you're going to be better off with one of the aileron birds and live with the longer/steeper thermal school learning curve. It'll be less frustrating than flying a Gentle Lady in 15 to 20 mph winds where you hardly dare let the model get downwind at all. Be honest with yourself here. Most people don't fly POWER models at these wind speeds. If you have enough calmer weather then the poly ships are a real option and should not be overlooked. Flying gliders is probably one of the easier model types to learn.... But learning to fly gliders AND find and use thermals at the same time can be one of the harder things you will do in modeling. But the rewards of a "free" climbout make it all worthwhile. It's sort of like fishing.

Finally. Big always flies better. But DLG is fun in a small package. But...... you can't mix the two. 60 inches is about as big as you dare make a DLG just because the outside wingtip will hit the ground in launching if it's any bigger. But the 60 inch models are much more difficult to learn to thermal with. Go for the 2 meter or even 100 inch glider and learn to fly the thermals. The bigger models also let you range out much farther than a DLG or HLG just due to the size. It's bloody hard to see what a 60 inch model is doing when you are flying a 1/4 mile away where a larger bird is well in visual range at that distance and flying effectively. Ensuring that you've got a 2 or even 3 piece wing will take a lot of the pain out of storage and transport.

Later on go for the DLG for portable fun. As a bonus many of the DLG's would be a nice moderate condition sloper with 6 or 8 oz of ballast added. Just watch out for the landings that can be quite hard depending on the slope conditions.

So you see there's a lot of compromises when choosing a sailplane. You'll have to ask yourself to be a little less demanding and move in one direction only to get the best performance.

[culiv]

Ah, the voice of experience. Thanks BMatthews. You did a much better job of explaining what I was trying to. As a still learning glider guider I wanted to pass along that there was more to soaring than just flying. You hit it dead on. Thanks.

[Mark Miller]

Check out my offerings at http://www.isthmusmodels.com. Lots of great choices with much more to come soon. Check out the NEWS page for future offerings.

Cheers,

Mark Miller
Isthmus Model Co.

[Rifleman]

Although I am late jumping in here, I do have a sense of balance on this one....and my direction is not to an ARF....if you are going to jump in, then take a small building lesson with it....you will savour your flying so much more and will be more careful if you have some heart in the bird..........my choice if you are a raw rookie, would be to turn to the Gentle Lady, as suggested already, but if you have a bit of stick time and really want a plane that can accomodate the flat and the slope, take a run at the Sophisticated Lady.....just engineer a bit more strength in the T-tail with a reduction in weight........its a fine plane in either arena.....I have flown one at both locales and done well with this design......no ailerons but spoilers can be very helpful once this thing starts to look small.