Frequencies used in Planes

[magnat]

I was Running my RC Car at the local park when a Gentleman informed me that the Model Plane Club in the area had Two Planes Crash in the last few weeks..

My Car Runs on a 29.mhz AM Crystal that came with the car when I bought it..

The Distance between my Car and the Plane was Over 1 Km...

Can Some one List me the Flight Frequencies used in Australia as I am Sure that the reserved Frequencies for Planes was 36mhz and over??

I have agreed with the Gentleman to cancel my Radio Control Car meets until such times as we can work out what is causing their planes to crash..

No one I race my cars with uses a Spectrum or any highpowered transmitter.. there all 2-channel Pistol Grips with a range of 100m or less...

[nator_au]

The 2Ch pistol grip radios are on the AM band arent they?

Some cheapo RTF planes might run 27mhz radios, not sure about 29mhz though.

One could assume that almost everyone at a flying club would have proper radio equipment which is on FM 36mhz.

I think FM 40mhz is also allowable in Australia.

I also dont know much about AM radios for flying. I have a 2channel AM set, but am not sure about frequencies etc.

Im pretty sure that your radios wouldn't be interfering with rc planes.

After all that, myt post wasnt really that helpful... sorry :)

Someone else will be able to fill in the gaps for you.

[merc-blue]

clubs requirer proper 36Mhz FM radios all properly checked your 29mhz AM wont go near them

[rcozstyle]

Hi
I am one of the few that still own a 29meg am 4 channel radio, 36meg has been available since the early 80's or before, so I doubt you would be to blame for the crashes, It is more likely someone in the club turned on without using the frequency board. I am sure if you are the reason they would understand that you did not do knowingly. If i use my 29meg radio it wont be anywhere near places where cars or boats might be used.

Gary

[magnat]

But thats Just what I cant Understand, is , There over a Kilometre way even as the crow flies, so I cant see it happening.. I mean my car would have glitched if They were on the same frequency but it didnt happen?

This is why I use my car along way from where they fly..
I make sure all my friends use their Cars well away from the Model Club for this reason but the guy seemed fairly concerned that we did cause it..

[rcozstyle]

But thats Just what I cant Understand, is , There over a Kilometre way even as the crow flies, so I cant see it happening.. I mean my car would have glitched if They were on the same frequency but it didnt happen?

This is why I use my car along way from where they fly..
I make sure all my friends use their Cars well away from the Model Club for this reason but the guy seemed fairly concerned that we did cause it..

Hi Magnat
1or 2kms not that far. in this hobby, if the plane was closer to you than its own transmitter could of been enough, your car would not have been that far from you. But like I said before it would seem unlikely that the other radio's were 29meg.

[steve wenban]

4klm is the distance set by the MASNSW for close field operations this could be considered for all forms of RC operation 29mhz AM is still used for airborne operations so seperation distance must be taken into account ,you may only have 500mtr range on the ground but straight up the sky is the limit.
SteveW FWIW

[magnat]

Thanks Steve..
We will take this on Board and Move to a location thats 5 K away.. from there Airfield just to be absolutely certain that it isnt causing the issue..

Mind you, there is a hill in between us and the airfield but there are plenty of other locations for us to run our cars but only a very small airfield for them to fly the planes...

I think the Council may also be trying to get the Airfield shut down as they put a Bike path right next to the Field and people are concerned a Plane could crash and kill them... so It wouldnt suprise me if there isnt some Geriatric moron operating a Controller just so the model Air club cant run any more..

I mean the Berrima District Airclub has been there for over 18 years!
and then the Council shoves a Bike Path right next to the Airfield.. talk about town planning gone wrong...


Edit : the Planes Own Pilot would have been way closer then us..
We Always make sure our Controller face away from the airfield at all times..
and Most Use a 27Mhz Crystal... its only recently we have had people using a 29.mhz Crystal..
Even though the possibility is remote we always Make sure that the risk is minimal..

Its the first time in a Year we have had a problem.. so today Could have been a freak Occurance or there could have been some one on the bike path with an RC..

Who knows.. but as I said, we will move to over 5 k's away for Our Car meets and see what happens...

[fleetmaster]

Like the others have already said,serious aeromodellers wouldn't risk using 27 or 29 meg.It's just not worth the risk.

[steve wenban]

Idont want to disagree but 29mhz is still used not only for slope but power and eletrics 27mhz has long been relegated to surface models and CB radio's . Please consider the 4 klm seperation.
SteveW

[magnat]

Like you said Steve, it is a Possibility..
I do know that Nitro Buggies use 29meg from the Factory and there are plenty of Back yard Modellers in the area...
But the Guy who glitched was on a 36Meg, so the chance is remote..

We wont operate next weekend and I will contact the Head of the Aero Club and find out if the Planes didnt spaz out.. it could be, that since the area is expanding and Telecomunication Repeaters are going up everywhere that it could be them interfering with the planes..

we will work things out.. but it is strange that it happened today and hasn't happened before. Some people think they are trying to blame us for their bad piloting but I highly doubt it..

[gouch]

Some people think they are trying to blame us for their bad piloting but I highly doubt it..

I wouldn't doubt it at all ! :D

NO WAY are your 29 or even 27 stuff messing with their planes (assuming they are on 36 mhz). I reckon they are either just looking for poor excuses for their crashes, or simply wondering if you guys are running the same 36 mhz frequencies for your ground use....the latter is fair enough.

I was told a surprising thing (to me) by a long term member of my club a few weeks back. In about 10 years, he reckons he could count on one hand the crashes ACTUALLY attributed to true radio interference (except from someone simply turning on the same channel at the field)

You said the club had two crashes in the past few weeks? HA, aren't they a club of flying "geniuses" :p

We had two go in yesterday, I have been in the club for about 4 months, flying twice a week, and I reckon I have seen about 10 planes go in, and two helis, none due to "interference"
Of the total I have personally seen crash, two were airframe failures. All the rest where simply self admitted dumb thumbs. Well, except the mid air I had with another flyer and tore half the stab off his plane. :eek: I ended up with nothing but a red mark on one blade of my prop....which I wiped off with a rag and continued on :D

Only one crash could be attributed to transmission issues, but it is hard for ANY RX to work when the battery wire comes out of it!! The rest where good old dumb thumbs!

Cheers
Paul

P.S I am STILL yet to hear of anyone anywhere who has a spektrum radio, get a single glitch.......not even a teeny one. I want one of those!

[OzDragonFlyer]

and don't overlook that FM is inherently far superior to AM in terms of spurious signal rejection. It's totally ludicrous blaming a 27/29mhz am tx for glitches on a 36mhz rx.

[magnat]

The Term they used was " Shot Down"

Gathering from what this indicates is the Air Craft was Banking on an Angle, then the Plane refused to take commands from the Controller..

We Just happen to be in line Ball of where the Plane apparently stopped recieving signals
I mean it could have been some 5 Year Old kid with a Nikko Toy at the Holiday inn Near the run way for all we can tell.. The planes are not even in line of sight even at 400 feet as we are on the other side of a Crest in the hill...

I am how ever seeking further knowledge from a Radio Certifier and have asked him to let me know what the chances are that plane's Reciever could have picked up our signal..

I mean out of the 20 people that were flying on the day 1 Guy got "Shot Down" on 2 different Frequencies.. there was only 2 people at the Netball courts with 29meg AM controllers and the chances of them both having the same Crystal is remote...

The other thing that I could think that would have shot the Plane down is there is a Railway line near by, and If the trains are using an FM Signal, would the Frequency they use interfere with the Planes??

I mean RC Cars and RC Boats come from the Factory with 27 and 29 am Crystals.. They wouldn't be foolish enough surely to release RC cars with frequencies Planes have ??

[olmod]

I mean RC Cars and RC Boats come from the Factory with 27 and 29 am Crystals.. They wouldn't be foolish enough surely to release RC cars with frequencies Planes have ??
I dont think so,but aircraft still keep using the shared with water craft frequencies instead of the aircraft only ones :p go figure that one out.

[fleetmaster]

I dont think so,but aircraft still keep using the shared with water craft frequencies instead of the aircraft only ones :p go figure that one out.
Like i said earlier,if they were serious about not being shot down,they'd be on the right frequencies in the first place.
It's no good blaming others for their laziness.
If you operate a plane on 27/29 meg,YOU KNOW FULLY WELL that boats and cars are on that band. :censored:
It could have been some one a block away testing his sytem in his garage unknowingly shooting the planes down.
If it was the same pilot,perhaps his tx is at fault?? :o

[fleetmaster]

Also,aircraft SHOULD BE on EVEN frequencies.
I use 36.45 on my boats,so best that no-one flies on that one.
I'm the one on the correct xtal,so don't complain to me if you crash,in fact,if i run aground.You will be hunted and shot down,LMFAO.!@!

[rcozstyle]

there was only 2 people at the Netball courts with 29meg AM controllers and the chances of them both having the same Crystal is remote...

The other thing that I could think that would have shot the Plane down is there is a Railway line near by, and If the trains are using an FM Signal, would the Frequency they use interfere with the Planes??


Hi Magnat
From what you have just said in your post is lots of metal, metal railway line and I would guess maybe metal fence near the netball, All that metal can cause radio interference.

Gary

[rcozstyle]

Also,aircraft SHOULD BE on EVEN frequencies.
!

Have you ever tried to get even numbered Crystals?.
I cant remember of seeing any.

[olmod]

They are available from HYQ/Bright star,any frequency you want.

[gouch]

When two planes can and do fly in the same air space with the pilots side by side using 20 khz seperation, there is no way that 29 or 27 mhz will have any effect on this.
As long as you guys are using the frequencies you are allowed, then the problem is with them, and them only. I still put my money on other reasons for the crashes.
Someone yelling "interference" is their way of saying "oh poop, I have no idea, so now my plane will crash somewhere" :D


This is what the MAAA say about odd and even frequencies on the 36 meg band

The odd numbered frequencies, that is those with channel numbers 601, 603, 605 etc., are for use by model aircraft AND watercraft. The even numbered frequencies, that is those with channel numbers 602, 604, 606 etc., are for use by model aircraft only.

[olmod]

Yep thats correct but no one takes any notice ,shops stock odd # and at club fields they use odd# also,like i said go figure :p

[magnat]

Well After Checking with a person who certifies RC Plane and Helicopter Gear, His words were

"If the Pilot is Silly enough to use a 29Mhz Crystal then he deserves to be shot down as he is using a frequency that is considered General"

"If the Club is allowing Pilots to use 29Mhz Crystals then they run the risk of getting sued by Farmer Jones who is knocked off his ride on lawn mower by an Aircraft being flown with insufficient gear, they are supposed to use the designated frequencies that is 36Mhz FM to avoid the risk of having cross frequency Glitching"


So Boats are a Bigger risk then cars are...

Only a Complete and utter Wack Job would use a 36Mhz Crystal in a car anyway..

27mhz am is apparently ungoverned and thats why RC Car companies send out cars in the 27am frequency..

[gouch]

Yep thats correct but no one takes any notice ,shops stock odd # and at club fields they use odd# also,like i said go figure :p


Yep, I agree, it makes no sense? Our club has the odd number key setup as well.

Whos idea was it to set up clubs for odd numbers in the first place if it's also for boats, yet the even numbers seem to be a frequecny that isn't being utilised at all????

As the "converted" would say the answer is "spektrum" :)

[fleetmaster]

Have you ever tried to get even numbered Crystals?.
I cant remember of seeing any.
Can't say i have,but i did make the enquiries before running my boats on 36 meg.Found that i needed to use odd numbers,checked that my xtals were that type,and off a-boating i went.
It does seem ridiculous that shops don't keep many even no.s
Perhaps the importers/distributors are either unaware,or simply don't care?
There aren't really that many of us boaties on 36 meg I guess anyhow?
Most probably use pistol grip 29 meg wheel radios.
I like the throttle detents like a real boat! :p

[Smokin' Beaver]

Sounds to me like the old codger who worded you up would do the same to a kid with a 25m range r/c toy.
Just looking for someone to blame, create a stir or bignote himself.
So now next time he tries it on - ask him all the techo questions to see if he knows what he's on about.
That will be fun - 'shooting' him down & watching his reaction when he realizes he's just crapping on with no real knowlwdge.
I'd tell him to go & get his mates who were hit and bring their wreckage along to prove their claim. Instead of blaming everyone within a 4km radius.

I'll bet a weeks wages it was some dropkick who accidentally switched their tx on at his field.

I have a 27.145mhz am buggy and ran it right beside my 36.050 plane and - OH MY GOD!!!!......not a thing....

I have been shot down once before & whilst it was annoying - I accept it as part of flying.
Even real 1:1 planes fall out of the sky.
And further to that, I just missed out on a real-life fatal flight once (the mining plane that flew from W.A. & crashed in Queensland) - didn't stop me from getting on a plane again.
So I'm qualified to tell folks like that bloke to go jump - find something real to get upset about - not a damn model.

Phil