Sea Plane Suggestions

[Carl]

I would like to build an seaplane similar to the Pond Side but with ailerons and I am looking for some suggestions. Can ailerons be incorporated in the Pond Side?

I would like to use the 10 cell cp2400’s that I am using in my E3D and also my Speedy Bee that is almost done.

Thanks

Carl

[Paul Susbauer]

Just add ailerons to it. Its not too difficult to do.

--Paul

[Megowcoupe]

I've got an old Pilot kit, that I keep eyeing. This airplane was intended for a 25 so a 10 cell CP 2400 is kind of appropriate. I see two problems with the kit based on looking at the plans- they've incorporated a hideous amount of downthrust- perhaps 15 degrees or so. This has got to be nuts, note that a Pondscum doesn't use anywhere near that.
Second problem- the kit needs major lightening- be prepared to hack a lot of holes and go to thinner sheeting. But I've always liked the looks of this airplane. Then there is the Spectra, but that needs to be scaled down.

Sam

[John Zook]

I have been flying my Puddlemaster( Pondside) for a few years now using an MM w/ 2.5:1 box and 8 cells. This produces plenty of power. I really think that 10 cells and the motor / grbx needed to go with it is too much. Mine flies just fine with what I'm using.
John Z.

[LJH]

I have about 25 flights on my Pondside. I powered mine with a Astro 05 cobalt, 8X4 APC E-prop, and 8X3000 hydriydes. This seems to be a bit of over kill in the power department but it is what I had around. 10X2400's wound definatly be over kill and a bit on the heavy side. There is a huge thread if you do a search for "Pondside". Lots of ideas including alerons. Take a look. Sam, I had to use, what looks to me, a huge amount of up-thrust to get my Pondside to behave itself when you gave it a good bunch of throttle. Neat little plane that is very easy to build.


Cheers,
Jim

[Dereck]

Hi Carl
Never could resist chatting over Pondsides! I'm on my third - two Ace Puddlemasters, which is the same design but a kit that belongs in the hands of collectors compared to Hobby Hangar's laser cut PS for somewhat less $$$.

Present one has an AF035 / 7 x 2000 / 7 x 4 APC sport prop. This is over 200W on a fresh pack, and produces a sparkling take off. It's all a bit sick right now - went to fly off a buddy's lakeside property and we think I landed on the neighbourhood turtle!

Problem with ten cells, especially of the 2400 size, is that the increased weight makes the hull ride lower in the water, which takes more power to get up and on step. I've seen a Pondside so "improved" that it could only taxy around in the water and never approached taking off. It's not the sort of problem landplane fliers have to worry over, apart from maybe flattening lightweight foam tyres :).

The upthrust thing is something you have to live with. Having the prop so way high up is not good for prop-like matters, but essential to miss the water. So, you have to live with the prop's location. One trick is to learn to smoothly open the throttle rather than slamming it open, both in flight and on the water. Whacking on all the power at once causes the nose to dive in both cases - I used to handlaunch mine over land by winding in some "up" trim to handle a distressing tendency to dive at the ground until things got into flying balance.

Ailerons. First off, you'd need to lose most of the dihedral and figure out the new, shorter float strut length to compensate for the wing being lower. Then comes hanging the ailerons onto the wing, with a drive that keeps the inside of the wing dry.

You'd end up with a model that aerobatics like a boat with wings and a hefty battery well below the wing.

Folk will tell you I'm one of the best, or worst, for messing with designs. That the PS is the only kit I've built three of absolutely box-stock might tell you it works fine. I thought of ailerons, but all three did "splash and go" fine on rudder, so I just never bothered to mess with something that worked.

My first two had Speed 600 motors, huge old Futaba frame rate ESCs and did fine on 7 & 8 cell packs, it doesn't need fancy gear to deliver. I think my lowest power ever used to ROW was around 6 cells at probably 20A into a 7 x 5 APC on a Graupner ferrite.

The Pondside / Puddlemasters owners' club thread was one of the longest around !

Hope that helps

D

[Slope Nut]

Why not go with something more scale? If you build from plans, you could build a Canadair, I am nearly done constructing mine, and its built for water flight.

[Megowcoupe]

Jim

I think I may be really wacko...I originally flew an Ace Pondscum on an old Enya 15 swinging an 8 x 4 which I suspect is more power than most e-versions have. I still went to a few degrees of upthrust- I know I reduced from what was called for on the plan, plus I had to increase the motor pylon height. As far as I recall, the airplane flew fine as long as you didn't slam the throttle around. My biggest grumble was a stall speed that I thought was kind of high- and this was at an empty weight of a good 6 oz. less than the e-versions. My airplane eventually bought the pond when the el-cheapo duct tape I used to secure the hatch came unglued and stuck in the prop. The airbrake effect (and startled pilot) managed not to recover from the spin that was induced and the wing broke up when it hit the drink. I've still got the fuse and some wing ribs using a different airfoil I want to try- plus I'll go to a twin- I got inspired by that long thread when I rebuild it. Needless to say, this version will be electric. So how many folks can say that they've built an electric design as glow, and then reconverted it to electric...like I said, wacko...


Sam

[Carl]

Thanks for all the wonderful comments about the Pond Side. I am going to put it on the Christmas wish list. If Mrs. Clause dosn't come through it will still find a way on to the work bench. Where is the best place to find a lonesome PS?

I will go 8 cells with it. Probally using 3000 NiMetals. I guess if I want to fly with 10 cells I will put floats on my Speedy Bee. Found a pair of Clancy floats at the local hobby shop for 1/2 price.

I will build the PS stock to start with and will see about changes in the future. A little kit bashing never hurt anyone.

Thanks again for the infromation.

Carl

[Dereck]

Hi Sam
Your mentioning a PS on slime - used to go to a great waterplane meet just off the Chesapeake Bay and we got three Puddlemasters on E and one on G at one of them. One of the Es was handlaunched, with a glider wing on it - didn't ask, no-one told!

Anyway, the oily one - Enya, around an 11. Noisiest durn thing I've ever heard, even more annoying than a last year's IMAC ship. Owner had virtually been given it at a club bring and buy! Durn thing flew, but he came up to me and offered that he wished his flew as nice as mine did.

That was PM #2 on a Graupner S600 and around 7 cells too.

Anyone care to own up to knowing someone who built Scott H's ten cell 'bigger' version Puddleside? It was published in that little rag out of the NW corner - whatever it's called nowadays.

Must fix mine up sometime. Back in England, where you get that sort of thing, I used to do "slide and go's" on wet grass. It'd stay down and sliding along on the grass following a gentle power on alighting, with full power. Needed a heft pull to get it off, never failed to get applause at fly-ins doing that one.

Regards

Dereck

[Rhondas]

Hi Carl
Never could resist chatting over Pondsides! I'm on my third - two Ace Puddlemasters, which is the same design but a kit that belongs in the hands of collectors compared to Hobby Hangar's laser cut PS for somewhat less $$$.

Present one has an AF035 / 7 x 2000 / 7 x 4 APC sport prop. This is over 200W on a fresh pack, and produces a sparkling take off. It's all a bit sick right now - went to fly off a buddy's lakeside property and we think I landed on the neighbourhood turtle!

Problem with ten cells, especially of the 2400 size, is that the increased weight makes the hull ride lower in the water, which takes more power to get up and on step. I've seen a Pondside so "improved" that it could only taxy around in the water and never approached taking off. It's not the sort of problem landplane fliers have to worry over, apart from maybe flattening lightweight foam tyres :).

The upthrust thing is something you have to live with. Having the prop so way high up is not good for prop-like matters, but essential to miss the water. So, you have to live with the prop's location. One trick is to learn to smoothly open the throttle rather than slamming it open, both in flight and on the water. Whacking on all the power at once causes the nose to dive in both cases - I used to handlaunch mine over land by winding in some "up" trim to handle a distressing tendency to dive at the ground until things got into flying balance.

Ailerons. First off, you'd need to lose most of the dihedral and figure out the new, shorter float strut length to compensate for the wing being lower. Then comes hanging the ailerons onto the wing, with a drive that keeps the inside of the wing dry.

You'd end up with a model that aerobatics like a boat with wings and a hefty battery well below the wing.

Folk will tell you I'm one of the best, or worst, for messing with designs. That the PS is the only kit I've built three of absolutely box-stock might tell you it works fine. I thought of ailerons, but all three did "splash and go" fine on rudder, so I just never bothered to mess with something that worked.

My first two had Speed 600 motors, huge old Futaba frame rate ESCs and did fine on 7 & 8 cell packs, it doesn't need fancy gear to deliver. I think my lowest power ever used to ROW was around 6 cells at probably 20A into a 7 x 5 APC on a Graupner ferrite.

The Pondside / Puddlemasters owners' club thread was one of the longest around !

Hope that helps

D





pond side or puddle master
where can I find the kit :(

[Rich Uravitch]

The Hobby Hangar Pondside kit, as well as its land-based cousin, the Electric Scout, now comes with aileron conversion instructions. www.hobbyhangar.com

[Dereck]

Ye gods - when did this get unearthed from! :eek:

At a club meet last night, met up with the guy who my old Pondside finally ended up with - the model suffered badly when I had the misfortune to "splash and go" on top of a neighbourhood turtle at a buddy's lakeside pad!

New owner has fitted ailerons, but hadn't brought the model along - I'll have to try and get some photos of it now it's been upgraded. The next one is how it flies with that RE dihedral and ailerons ...

Having said that, I've had three - two Ace PMs and a HH PS - and all were built straight out the box, which is an all-time record for me! The last one had an Astro 035 on seven big old SCR1700 cells, did nearly 12 mins mostly of splash and go's, and was a honey to build and fly. Right now, I have no water access, but sometime down the road a lake will open in up in my life - and there'll be a frantic scrabble to get and build another PS. I've kept the AF035 and its ESC, just in case ...

Good to hear you're still selling this kit, Rich.

Regards

Dereck

[gouda]

Has anyone ever seen a kit of a Lake? lake Ampfibian that is...

[Megowcoupe]

There was a Pilot kit- a bit heavy and out of production and kind of pricey- I sold one off a while back.

[GregG]

Wow, This is a blast from the past (2002). I've moved it to Waterplanes.
:D

[Rocketman1092]

The Twin Aventura from Hobby Lobby has ailerons. http://hobby-lobby.com/aventura_twin.htm

[Joel K. Scholz]

Here is a design that uses an astro .05 on 9x GP3300 . fully aerobatic . I can send you a file if you like.

[Joel K. Scholz]

Her is another using a Monster Max on 9 x 3300.

[Demon-Leather]

Well,.. at least really rare ones do! :rolleyes: :D Here's a Kool one, and a great flyer. The Sablatnig SF-4 was a WWI Tri-wing floatplane. It had very nice aerodynamic lines too. Lubomir Kountny designed this one for rubber-powered f/f. it is an incredibly stable flyer and will easilly ROW. Enlarged to about a 34-36" span it should be a great electric R/C plane. You could probably get awat with a geared 280-300-350 inexpensive set-up, or go all out with one of those brushless screamers. All the shots you see in the photos are of the actual model, and the final one is the free-plans that came in the December 1992 issue of Aeromodeller. I couldn't fit the whole plan in the scanner. The span is 19", so an enlargement of around 180% would be about perfect... could be larger if you like, the structure is substantial enough. Just a thought. Bob :D

[Rhondas]

I would like to build an seaplane similar to the Pond Side but with ailerons and I am looking for some suggestions. Can ailerons be incorporated in the Pond Side?

I would like to use the 10 cell cp2400’s that I am using in my E3D and also my Speedy Bee that is almost done.

Thanks

Carl
hanger9 sells the pondside with alerons if you want so .

[IWC]

www.hobbyhangar sells a pondside (48" span)

[IWC]

www.hobbyhangar.com sells a ponside (48" span)

[Demon-Leather]

That's Guarenteed to make any onlooker express themselves with "OH S--T!!!" (or at least thats the pattern that's been developing :rolleyes: :D Watch the video for yourself, and make sure there are no children in the room, or that You can mind your mumblings! :D Bob
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=376351
PS; If you follow the thread, the"newer" version is even more incredible! Bob

[iluvtoflyrc]

Does anybody have a suggestion for a aerobatic seaplane? Something with a symmetrical airfoil?

[theKM]

Twinkle (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=359979) is a very capable little waterplane. Aerobatic and all that fun stuff. Without peer for its adaptability... that is... until the hydroplanes that Demon-Lether just linked to arrived. Now all I can say is that it's very capable and still looks like an aeroplane ;)

[meatbomber]

i've seen folks sticking floats on Shockflyers :) that's about as aerobatic as it gets !

[Demon-Leather]

I guess You'd call these "shock-Flyers" with floats glued on.. but if you want outragous off/on water/air acrobatics...this would be the way to go, I think. They seem to fly anywhere, on the street, water, grass.... and You GOTTA love unlimited vertical right off the water! (well I did, anyway! :D) Bob

"seeing IS believing!"..
Broadband
http://www.michaelconnally.com/images/vids/hfh.wmv

Dial-up
http://www.michaelconnally.com/images/vids/hfl.wmv

Don't forget to close your mouth after viewing.....:rolleyes:

[theKM]

...Twinkle can fly vertical right off the water/ground too! :(

:rolleyes:


I gave Mr Leather a free plan of the Twinkle with the promise of a "titanic" Twinkle, and I've seen nothing of a build yet. ;)

(only thing the hydro boats can do that the Twinkle can't is hover) :D

[Demon-Leather]

Hasn't forgotton... just got a bit side-tracked. I was playing with some foamie stuff, but got called on finishing My PA-25 Build the the only guy that actually "built-along" with Me on My no-plans build thread.(TooTall)
So,.. I put the foam away, and finished the center section of the wing last week & wrote the article, posted photos etc etc,. Now, I need to finish one more wing panel and the wing build is complete, then, the landing gear,.. some odds & ends, and the airframe is through. However, I got side-tracked yet again when the wheel bearing went out on the wife's Taurus... so I'm having a wonderful time with that on my back in the driveway. :rolleyes:
You might not seen anything yet, but I'm getting things ready in the wings... even building a CDROM motor for it :D Not much luck with that %$#@! BP 10 ESC I bought. All I can get it to do is "beep" & get hot! :mad: Bob
Sorry,.. another one of those classic "Demon leather long-winded rants" :D

[Rocketman1092]

Shock flyers with floats? Better not let the electronics touch the water, or you'd have a real SHOCK flyer! :D