Model Solutions sound module

[patmat2350]

I'll be reviewing a new sound module shortly… have it in possession, just need some quality time with it. But I'll start the thread now so you can see what's coming.

It's from a new outfit in Canada, Model Solutions, http://www.modelsolutions.ca/ (http://www.modelsolutions.ca/) . Really a one-man operation, but the product looks top notch- a professionally designed board and interface software with a large but complete manual. I have yet to turn it on!

The product is not inexpensive- CAN $169- but its flexibility may well justify the cost against other digital sound products (especially if you need to buy multiple modules for all your desired sounds).

What's it got?

- Ability to record and playback 10 sound clips OF YOUR CHOICE with up to 350 seconds of total sound;

- High power audio output;

- 4 additional switched outputs for activating other devices;

- 16 button keypad to attach to one channel of your Tx;

- Ability to program two additional outputs to turn on with any given sound clip (like flash a strobe for gun fire when the gun sound is above a certain volume threshold);

- Programmable for momentary/latched operation on all switches;

- Loss of signal and low battery alarms that can be connected to any given sound;

- Remote volume control- cool!

- PC software so you can program the board with your own sounds and settings;

- A small sound library is included (KMOT- includes "PT-109" engine sound with start-up cycle!), but you can also use your own recordings or clips;

- Speed sensitive engine sound, and software to help you generate your own variable speed sounds.

The one challenge I see so far is that the product requires some electronics and computer savvy… not much really, but digitally challenged modelers may be intimidated by the tech jargon in the manual.

More later!

Pat Matthews

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

Hmm,
Will it attach to the gear or flaps channel of the DX6?

And they do seem to be retailing the Mtroniks ESC. Good news for the
Canadian members of the board. :)

[patmat2350]

Don't know Umi- would have the same reqs as an MCD Switch-8. Didn't we figure that one out a while ago? I fergit.

BTW, the subject unit is a SFX4-3. They have another unit, only 8 sounds and two lamp flasher outputs, SFX4-2, which can be operated by remote switches (no decoder chunk). So if you have a static display or RR layout, just use panel switches to activate. Or if you already have an MCD switcher, use that to activate the lower cost SFX4-2.

PM

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

Don't know Umi- would have the same reqs as an MCD Switch-8. Didn't we figure that one out a while ago? I fergit.

...

PM

yeah,... had to be a proportional channel... :o

[Kmot]

Sounds (no pun) most interesting!!!!!!!!! :)

[Kmot]

Up to ten sound clips, including a semi-proportional engine sound, may be stored in one module and two sounds may be played simultaneously.

Pat, I would like to know what you think about the semi-proportional engine sound characteristic.

[patmat2350]

Don't know much yet, but seems like it ought to work fine. Not sure that we don't have this with some of the other systems anyway.
Instead of taking one engine sound sample and squeezing it in time variably to speed it up, this system takes a base (slow) sample, and creates seven more clips each slightly faster than the last. Then, depending on throttle position, it plays an appropriate speed. Maybe on a very slow throttle run-up you might notice some steps, but I doubt it.
We'll see! (I mean, we'll hear...)

PM

[patmat2350]

Also, since each clip has length, I wonder if you'll notice when it breaks out of one in the middle and jumps to the beginning of the next...

PM

[Kmot]

Something very interesting I just saw in the software manual. The PT-109 startup sequence takes 29.62 seconds. I am wondering if it starts each engine individually during the sequence? That would be very cool.

[patmat2350]

3 starts? If not, the package includes some sound file editing software... I imagine one could overlay and stagger the clips into one file that has sequential starts.

PM

[Kmot]

$169 is actually a resonable price:

169.00 CAD = 146.217 USD
Canada Dollars United States Dollars
1 CAD = 0.865187 USD 1 USD = 1.15582 CAD

I have the JJC sound module $80 and a slave unit and cable $60, $140 total, and combined it has 4 sounds and no other features. This unit, in contrast, has 8 sounds and multiple programmability and possibly many more sounds. It is worth it, as long as it works as claimed.

[Aerominded]

Hummmm, sound is next on my list of things to add to my boats...

Looking forward to your futher thoughts on this one, Pat- 'sounds' good so far! :)

[DavidHarrison]

Some corrections :
The SFX4-2 switched interface version DOES have proportional engine sound.

The PT109 sound DOES include all three engines starting up - you can hear them wind up, then fire into action. Very deep, throbbing sound - very satisfying!

You CAN use a flaps channel. I have my keypad attched to the flaps channel of my Futaba Skysport 6 TX. As long as it is a proportional channel (stick or flaps) it will work.

You can have as many engine sounds as you like - up to the maximum ten, but only ONE can be associated with the proportional engine feature.

Yes, if you move the throttle stick slowly you will hear the individual steps -
but typically you don't.

There are EIGHT additonal engine steps (not seven) in the forward direction and two steps in reverse (you don't need to go full speed in reverse) - if you do you'll likely sink your boat!

Our prices are VERY reasonable when compared with competing high end units from Robbe and Graupner. Both of these are more expensive, neither have very limited programmability and are limited to 5 or 6 sounds!

If you want only one or two sounds, these units are overkill, but if you want extreme flexibility, programmability, reload any sounds you like (unique in the world!) and a ton of other features, then these modules win hands down!

See our competeitive comparison document at :

http://www.modelsolutions.ca/docs/SoundModuleCompetitiveComparison.pdf

David Harrison
Owner and Chief Product Developer
Model Solutions of Canada
www.modelsolutions.ca

[Kmot]

Hah-hah! I just came back and see David has posted here. :)

Welcome David! Your product is most welcome as well.

Guys, I e-mailed Model Solutions of Canada today and asked for some sound bytes. I have received them, and came back here to post that yes indeed, the PT has sequential start-up. It floored me, to be honest. :D

The difference between the JJC module and the MSoC module is night and day. I am most definitely sold on this product!

[patmat2350]

Kmot- I think you lucked out, as Dave is also a PT fan... so you get good PT noises!
But now you'll also need to put little strobes in your twin 50's...

PM

[Kmot]

Hmmm......... lol!! :D

[toesup]

Sounds (sorry) like an interesting unit... I might be tempted for an up and coming project.. ;)

Does anyone have any experience of what the Can / US Customs are likely to add to the purchase price in import duty on such an item?..

[patmat2350]

So far, everything I've purchased from way up North just came across in the mail with no issues.

PM

[Kmot]

Same here. What's Customs/Import Duty? Isn't that a UK thing? :D

[DavidHarrison]

Her's a little background as to how this product came about.

I built my own very detailed 1/20 scale PT109 in the spring/summer of 2005.

I looked around for sound modules but was very dissapointed to find what there was out there - nothing came even close to what I was looking for.
I also felt it not only a nuisance but very costly to pay say $50 for one sound and then another $50 for another etc. - hence the need for a product that stored multiple sound clips.

So being a professional software and electronics engineeer I set about designing one. Having studied the competition, which in some cases are pretty appalling - some of you will agree, I realised there would be significant interest in the R/C community at large. So I engineered it to be manufacturable and, as far as I could, easy to use. With any complex feature set on anything, there is a bit of a learning curve, but hopefully modellers will only need a day or two to become effective with it.

So it took about 1000 hours and 18 months to develop it.

My company, Model Solutions of Canada, was created to market and manufacture it. It has since evolved to include switching units, RFI suppression components, and the very nice line of UK Mtroniks ESCs.

Please recognize this company name and not just "Model Solutions" as there are several other companies out there that are called "Model Solutions", but have nothing whatever to do with R/C.

For the technically inclined, here is some data about it :

Microcontroller - 8 bit RISC ATMEL AVR
Sound storage - 32Mbit (4MByte) Flash memory chip
Audio output stage - Class D PWM full H bridge - very efficient
9W at 12V, 12W at 14V into 9 ohms.
This is VERY loud!

Cheers,
David

[toesup]

What's Customs/Import Duty? Isn't that a UK thing?

Ohhhhhh...'OUCH'....

When i was back in GB i had bits and pieces sent from the US and got charged import duty by customs every time.. even on the box of silk flowers and the wifes shoes that she had to send accross for our wedding!..

I assumed that as 'something' crossed an international border... :o

[DavidHarrison]

Customs/Import duty is what nearly every country has.
With NAFTA (North American Free Trade Agreement), goods manufactured in either Canada and the US (also Mexico) can cross the border free of import duty, but not necessarily Federal or State sales taxes. Depending on the customs inspector who allows the package through, you may or may not get clobbered with taxes.

I import a lot of my components from the US and aIways have to pay Canadian GST (Goods and Services Tax - our Federal sales tax). On the other hand sometimes I import from the UK and most times don't have to pay anything - like I said, it all depends on what side of the bed the customs inspector got out that morning!

Cheers,
David

[DavidHarrison]

I am sorry to inform you all that I have closed down my company,
Model Solutions of Canada.

I still plan to bring my very unique and feature rich sound module to market, but under different circumstances.

I will keep this forum posted when it is alive again.

Regards,
David Harrison

[Kmot]

Shoot! :(

I was going to buy one. Hobby budget has just been very tight lately. I do hope you come back again!

[DavidHarrison]

All is not lost. We are back in business, but have suspended sales of the modules temporarlily while we work with manufacturers to get them made in volume. I will keep you posted when they are available for sale again.

Cheers,
David Harrison

[Kmot]

That's great news David! :)

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

Is it okay to make suggestions, or perhaps this is a question.

I got the impression that the original sound module would play a length of time and then need to be retriggered, or reset. So if someone looped a desiel engine sound, it would play till the end, however long that was allowed.

Can the engine part of your sound module loop a 5-10 second sound byte, and just play that continuously? Or is it limited to playing a given lenght of time.

I would prefer a short loop as an option or feature.

Good to hear you are not out of business, and that there will continue to be options for adding sound to RC models.

[Kmot]

Umi, I read the manual and it does a continuous loop.

http://www.modelsolutions.ca/docs/SFXPCSWManual.pdf

Playing a Sound Clip and Looping
Once a valid Sound Clip has been opened, it can be played using the Play, Stop and Pause
Controls. These buttons have DVD Player like icons as shown in Figure 2.
Figure 3 – Sound Clip Play Control Buttons
Stop Play Pause
Once a Sound Clip is playing, and it reaches its end, it will loop continuously from its Loop Start
Point to its Loop End Point. The Loop Start Point can be set while playing or paused by clicking
the Set Loop Button. If you want to set the Loop Start Time precisely, you can enter
the time to 4 decimal places in the Loop Start text box. In this current release the Loop End Point is
the same as the end of the Sound Clip. This looping feature emulates closely the actual behaviour of
the SFX4 module.

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

oooh,... so when will these be available again?

:p

[DavidHarrison]

I have finally heard from the manufacturer I sent a unit to some months ago for evaluation that they want to go ahead into volume robotic SMD manufacturing. This will likely reduce the size and maybe cost. They will be manufacturing, marketing and selling under their own brand under licence from me as well as myself selling under my own brand. I will announce the manufacturer and brand name in due course as our licencing and legal agreements proceed.

Expected new availability is year end 2007 or early 2008. I will keep this thread posted.

Regarding looping, the latest modules are end user configurable to have any sound either play once only, as for a voice announcement or song, or to loop continuously as for engine sounds, guns etc.

Thanks guys for all your interest in this very unique product.

Regards,

David Harrison
Model Solutions of Canada

[Kmot]

Sweet! :)

[DavidHarrison]

My current sound modules are available for ordering again, although I have increased the prices. I have been advised by severll perople that my prices were way too low. So the Premium unit is now $199.95, the Super unit is $159.95. Sorry about this, but making the current units by hand is a lengthy and tedious process and ordering parts in small quantities is costly.

I look forward to being able to offer the mass produced units just as soon as they are available.

Regards,
David
Model Solutions of Canada

BTW, we will soon be a corporation so the company will be
Model Solutions of Canada Ltd.

[Kmot]

David, did the deal with the volume manufacturer fall through? I see you are still assembling the units by hand.

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

I think we are just waiting on availability, since the shut down to move production.

:cool:

[DavidHarrison]

Folks, the volume manufacturing deal hasn't dissappeared, it has only just started. These things take a long while to get organized. The manufacturer (to be announced) will be making them under licence from me, so there are licensing, royalties etc. to work out. They will not be just a manufacturing house. I am also working on a new lineup of sound modules, some of which will be very simple to set up.

Looking forward to serving you all who have expressed interest my products in this forum.

[herrmill]

Cool topic, Pat!

David, may I ask what is the size of the sound module you currently have as well as the simpler modules you have planned for the future? I build in several different scale & am interested in knowing how small they come. Thanks.

Chuck

[DavidHarrison]

Size of current modules is 2.75" x 3.225" x 0.75" high.

Can't say the size of the future modules since I am only in the early stages of development. But they will almost certainly be a lot smaller since they will use all SMD (Surface Mount Devices). Also some will have only one or two sounds and will have a one-button setup.

Cheers to you all.

[herrmill]

David,

Thanks. That size will work well in several of the boats I've got.

You'll sell quite a few if you offer a smaller version that fits inside a 2" wtc for 1/72 subs & comes with diesel, diving claxon & sonar effects. Am certain Mike Caswell will keep you busy with his new venture & I'll even buy a few for my own use. :)

Chuck

[DavidHarrison]

Not really related to this thread, but since all you folks are interested in model boats, my own PT109 is for sale. Here's what's included :

1/20 scale (48" long) Dumas PT109 with LOTS of enhancements.

3 x Graupner Speed 700 BB Neodymium magnet motors.
3 x Mtroniks 40A Speed controllers
Working navigation lights and searchlight.
Premium sound system.
Flashing lamps at ends of gun barrels.
Rear 20mm cannon rotates under servo control.
Full radio - Futaba Skysport 6 - 6 channel with 16 button keypad.
Four electric torpedoes with counter-rotating props!! - mostly finished.
Completely scratch built working torpedo tubes!!
Some bits and pieces for CO2 based torpedo fire control system - needs finishing.
Display stand and wooden cart.

Future possible enhancements the buyer could do - replace power plant with three brushless motors and replace gel battery with lithium polymer.

Ideally the buyer would pick up in person (Ottawa, Ontario, Canada).

I could conceivably ship it, but a custom crate would have to be designed and built and the shipping cost would likely be prohibitive.

I've sunk (bad choice of word ;-) about $2000 into it, so I'm looking for serious offers around the $1200 mark. All packing and transportation costs to be borne by the buyer.

It is also going up on E-Bay, so if you want to pre-empt that???

Cheers, David

[tim slocum]

How's the sound system...OK? ;) Just kidding.

[Kmot]

Sounds like a bargain to me. Someone is going to get a good deal.

[Haskell_alan]

David,
Any new news on you sound module. I need one for my new model Nautilus Submarine.
Cheers,
Alan