Balsa USA Kits?

[OhioMike]

I was wondering what the feeling is on these kits, especially the SE5A or the Spad XIII ones. I was going to start a 1/4 scale SE5A from scratch, but a kit would i believe be less work. Thanks in advance.
Mike

[Martin Irvine]

How important is a scale outline? The BalsaUSA kits are often "tweaked" to improve flying charateristics, or ground handling. Some are better than others in this regard. (I would imagine the SE5A wouldn't need any tweaking.)

Martin

[cooper998]

I have built numerous BalsaUSA kits in the past and have three kits sitting around in the "to Build" pile. They are probably the best value for an "almost scale" WW1 plane. If you look at the pricing of some of the "Scale" kits such as Proctor and Arizona Models, BalsaUSA is a true bargain. Yes you have to deal with simpler instructions and be able to read plans but with some patience and determination you can produce an excellent semi-scale representation.
If you are going to convert one of the planes mentioned I would suggest the SE5 over the Spad due to the reduced overall weight and the ease of constructing a battery hatch into the top of the fuselage. Another choice would be the Dynaflite Se5, but I understand that the wood quality is very poor ever since Great Planes took them over.

cooper998

[dusty IV]

First and last Balsa USA kit I bought just recently was awful. The balsa was rock hard and die cut with a dull die. The rib stampings were so bad I couldn't use them.

These days Laser cut seems to be it. No more die cut for me. But maybe I just got an end of run kit but I won't be back.

[OhioMike]

Yea....Another Great planes kit, the Taylorcraft is also reported to have that difficulty as well, "Rock hard Maple" parts. Balsa USA's web site says on the SE5A, "Fall out die cut parts". Guillows used to say that to, and we know what their die cut looks like, at least with the older kits! I've seen Proctors web site and what they charge for kits. Their worth it as some would say, but my budget says hell no! Even what Balsa USA charges for their kits, they should at least have quality "Die cut parts"! Oh, well. Cooper, what was the quality of the wood cutting in your kit?

[cooper998]

First I need to respond to dusty IV,
BalsaUSA is a stand up company and supports their product extensively. If at any time there is a problem with materials or workmanship they will replace it. I had a problem with my N28 kit having severely warped leading edge pieces, after e-mailing BUSA and explaining my situation they offered to send replacements but warned they may also be slightly warped due to shrinkage and moisture changes after milling. They offered to send some unmilled pieces at no cost if I preffered.
OhioMike,
I built a T-Craft from the GP kit and almost stopped building it when trying to build the wing. The ribs were not die cut all the way through in some places and the wood while hard was also very dry and brittle. I eventually did finish it and is now in my ready fleet. On my N28, Eindecker40 &80, Northstar, and 1/4 Scale Cub the die cutting was all very good to excellent, with most parts easily removed without breakage. If I had anything to really complain about it's probably the disparity between the plans and instructions. Sometimes the plans are different from the instructions but a little time thinking and it all works out. I am an old school builder having grown up building the Guillows and Sterling kits of the past so for me anything else is pretty easy.
While Lazer cut kits are a luxury most people want nowadays, the skills learned making things fit is something that will stay with me forever.

By the way, I have no connection with BalsaUSA other than being a satisfied customer.
cooper998

[KOMET 44]

I also agree with copper998.Only thing I have to add is that B-USA use's lots of lumber.Almost all of the planes come out tail heavy.On customer service,IT IS SECOND TO NONE :D .

KOMET44

[cyclops2]

Nobody is " giving " kits away in the + 72" WS sizes.

Time to switch to solid blue foam Billets by Dow. I had to. The 7' x 2' x 1' solid piece cost $ 55. I bought the largest set of cheap plans that looked correct and had Staples blow them up to what I wanted. 80" WS A-10. Had 3 sets made so I could cut full sized frame stations where I wanted them. Also allowed full size ribs everywhere else. Bonus was scraps to build a couple of Piper L -3's.

You DO HAVE to use a tablesaw to cut the full span slots for spars. 2 minutes. Put spar material in the slots, pencil line. Etc.

You could put ply doublers in for landing gear boxes.
Heck, you can cut the body in 1/2 full length and add a lightened spine for strength.
I finsh sand with a 33 Grit and a 80 Grit --6' sanding board of each.

$55 dollar ........A-10 .. 80" WS....Solid foam, all foam parts = 4 1/2 pounds.

Somebody needs to use a new material ?

[RRS]

Just came across this thread, and for what it's worth thought I'd jump in...if it's not too late, that is.

I am building the BUSA's SE5a. It's all framed, about ready to cover except for some - yet to figure out - scale details, etc. Based on my kit I'd be happy to offer my comments/thoughts relative to it's contents, construction, etc, if anyone is interested and considering getting this kit.

[cooper998]

RRS,
Feel free to post your findings, the more people learn about building the better. Nowadays people usually do not have time to build a plane and want instant gratification with an ARF. BalsaUSA as well as a few choice other kit manufacturers may soon disappear unless we continue to build their products. I personally own enough kits to keep me busy for many years but will always buy more if the subject interests me.
What power are you planning for the SE5a? any progress pics??

cooper998

[Greg D]

not cheap but you get what you pay for http://www.scalercmodels.com/ww1kits.html http://www.arizonamodels.com/spad-13.html http://www.3seabees.com/planes.html#arfs

[RRS]

cooper998,
Tks for the encouragement. I don't usually make a practice of commenting on my builds or thoughts on kits with which I've had experience. But when I came across this thread I felt my observations and experience in building BUSA's SE5 might be helpful. I share your thoughts about the longevity of (good) model mfgrs, our need for us builders to continue supporting them, etc.

Over the years BUSA has had a reputation (at least from what I've seen and read) of having good and not so good kits. I've been kit (and scratch) building since the 40s and feel I'm fairly well versed in different constructions, etc. My first BUSA kit was their 1/3 Sopwith Pup which I built in 1980 and flew for 19 yrs before being 'shot' down. It was not the best of kits. To name a few things: poor balsa and die cutting, warped plywood and balsa, balsa and redwood spars, etc. Had to change out much of the wood. But, the finished plane was a joy to fly!

When I was at the '05 Toledo Show I bought their SE5, but didn't start it until '06 (hadn't even open the box (!)). When I did start my build I was pleasantly surprised. The plans and instruction booklet were well done. I had only a few questions but these were answered when I re-read everything. However, there were a few places where they could have been a little clearer.

The stick balsa was medium to hard, but quite well selected for it's applications. A few had small (not objectionable) bows. Sheet balsa hardness varied from medium to hard. I didn't use some sheets as they were harder than I like to use. Two of the trailing edge (sheet) strips also had varying degree of bow (which couldn't be straightened) and I had to cut new ones. Of the (5) shaped balsa wing leading edges furnished, two were OK, but three had varying degrees of bow. I was able to straighten two by steaming, but the remaining piece (quite hard), which was used for the wings' center section leading edges, required cross grain saw cuts (about 3/8" deep) every 2 in., or so, to relieve the bow. Then after firmly aligning and pinning in place against a heavy 'carpenter's' straight edge, small pieces of 1/8 balsa were then glued across each saw cut. Once the glue dried the entire section was then straight. Die cutting (balsa and ply parts) was excellent.

The balsa sheets used for the diecut ribs were of mostly hard stock, so in order to save weight I cut 'lightening' holes in most all the the ribs and all the 'false' ribs to reduce the overall weight. Weighing all the ribs before and after the holes, I found it saved a total of 2-1/2 ozs(!). In addition, I also tried to evenly balance the weight of each wing's balsa parts/material (ribs, spars, sticks, etc) as well as the stab.
Not really necessary, but it gives one a better abiulity to achieving final a/c balance, etc.

Two sheets of thin (1/64) ply are used for the decking (rear cockpit to nose). However, one piece was thicker - and of a different grade - than the other (I mic'ed them); so, rather than having to edge sand a lot where they join (to 'hide' the thickness difference), I used new 1/64 stock on hand that matched the other 1/64 kit piece.

The cowl cover construction is rather delicate - not too sturdy. Care must be taken to ensure that it's integrity is not comprimised while constructing. Since I wanted to have my engine completely cowled, I had to make sure the cowl would entirely cover the engine without having to cut out anything, or from the fuselage sides to accomodate the engine's exhaust or carb. After careful measurements of possible engines, I selected the Fuji BT-32. (I didn't get the EI because I felt I would need the magneto weight). It fits completely inside the compartment with the exhaust exiting the underside. Modifications had to be made to the fuselage's engine mount and the cowl framework to add strength, etc. I have (and are) also made a number of other mods which I hope will give it a more realistic appearance while at the same time won't hinder it's (excellent) flying qualities.

Overall, and except for the above difficiencies, I think BUSA has a great kit. It has been/is fun to build. Have never had a need or request for any picture posting, so never have done any. Suppose I could learn, though :-) Hope this hasn't been too long...

Dick

[Martin Irvine]

Thanks for the insight into the BalsaUSA SE5A kit Dick. I wonder how much weight a scratch builder could save.......

Martin

[Greg D]

I would think as they are designed for fuel and the associated vibration you could shave ALOT of weight out of one building for Epower. Might find a thread in the electric conversion forum. Or at least alot of ideas.

[RRS]

Wouldn't think this kit would make for a good electric conversion project. Like Greg said you would need (and could) take out a lot weight. As designed it's for big engines with higher wing loadings, etc. Might as well start from scratch













































Agree with Greg D. You would need to (and can) lighten everything. But first, you would need to re-design the entire structure carefully planning for your choice of materials, etc. Not an easy task I should think. Might as well just start from 'scratch' :-) and spend your time building something to fit your taste rather than be always trying to adapt, etc. Just my thoughts...

[RRS]

Whoops! What happened?

[trident58]

I've built 2 Balsa USA kits: the 1/4 scale Nieuport 28 (gas powered) and the 40-sized Eindecker (E-conversion with AXI 2826/12). Both were a whole lot of fun to build. With an RCS 140, the Nieuport came out at 13.5 lbs, and I didn't do anything to try and reduce weight. There are a lot of places you could save some weight. The Eindecker had a lot of wood removed from the fuse sides, built-up tail, and drilled-out ribs, and with the 12 3300 NIMH cells, came out at 5 lbs, 9 oz, about the same as the glow version. I'm currently planning on converting another one of their larger kits to E-power. I have an AXI 4130/20 looking for a home, and I'm contemplating putting it in a 1/4 scale Cub, Taube 90, Eindecker 90, or Citabria Pro.
I think the BUSA kits lend themselves to E-conversion quite well, if you don't mind the extra work of drilling out parts and replacing some wood.
Jon

[JLLayton]

I have built two BUSA kits (SE-5 and a Pup to Camel conversion) and I have no complaints. I currently have the Spad on hand. The wood quality is good in all three kits, the die cutting was good (the parts did fall out in most cases) and the plans and instructions are very good.
I have two friends who have built the Nieport 17 & 28, and 1/3 pup. Both liked the kits and enjoyed the construction. The only negative comment was the 1/3 Pup which is a much older design and harder to build. All of these planes have good flying qualities.
Whenever I had questions, I reached them easily by phone and got very good guidance from them.
I would recommend their stuff to anyone who likes to build. Btw, I have no connection to BUSA, I just like their stuff.

[Kenny Sharp]

I just won a Balsa USA SE5a 1/4 scale kit at a raffle at the Scale Masters Qualifier here in Mass. :D

What luck!
I just happened to be flying a 49 1/2 in. wingspan SE5a in the competition, so this was a real treat. :)

My 7 lb. 2 oz. SE5a is electric. It has Hacker C5010L w/6.7gb a Jedi 90 amp esc, an 8s2p Prolite lipo, and a 17x8 APC prop cut down to 16x8. This setup gives me around 1350-1500 watts.

It flies great and I can't wait to start building this new 1/4 scale kit.
I'll be sure and convert this to electric, and I'm thinking something like 10s or 12s lipo power and aim for 3-3.5 KW. That should do it I think.
I'll start a build thread because I'll need lots of help. ;)

Good to hear such good things about this kit and the company.
I'm looking forward to this. :)

[ExRAFbod]

This post is a little old but here's my two centsworth.

The Balsa USA SE5a is not true scale as stated in other posts. Their SE5a Profile is simply wrong. The engine area is more suited to the SE5 than the Wolesley Viper-powered SE5a. I added the lower radiator 'chin' and made the whole front section more like the thing.

Plusses. BUSA support is good. They will try to answer questions to the best of their lability to get you flying.
Replacement of defective parts is quick.

Minuses. Their documentation is a joke (full of grammatical mistakes and spelling blunders) and looks like it was written by a fouryearold. Bad illustrations too so picking out detail is impossible.
Bad design of the "sprung undercarriage" is apparent. The cockpit and fittings details are rudimentary and detract from the overall effect. Poor attempt at a Lewis Machinegun too.
Not quite sure of the correct leading edge profile so will have to finish that so it looks reasonable.

Been taking my time with my own build so I have gone out of my way to build a representative aircraft of the RFC's 24 Squadron which flew from Matigny in France 1917-1918 instead of the ugly 95th Aero Squadron version. Power is an Enya R155 Glow 4-Stroke. Compass and temp gauges work. The Enya is mounted vertically so is completely hidden. When finished the exhaust system will be functional too. Glow Starter and Radio switches are hidden in a panel underneath, behind the front U/C Legs. Fuel delivery is via the Radiator Cap. Flying wires are functional and tensionable. Undercart is bungee sprung. Cockpit Coaming is calf leather and anchored by brass ferrules and Irish thread. Radio is Futaba 2.4mhz FASST. Radiator grille is soldered brass strip.

[R101]

I built the BUSA 1/4 scale Nieuport 28 for electric power last year.
No complaints with the kit, it went together with no problems.

It does deviate from scale a bit, the main deviation being the wing section, but it is one of the best and easiest to fly models I have had.



http://www.weaver19.eclipse.co.uk/Nieuport%20at%20field%202-06-07.jpg

[Bladerunner1955]

Balsa USA Fokker D7 just finished, your Nieuport 28 is beautiful!

[R101]

What a beauty !
Can you give some details on the power/weight etc please

When's the maiden flight?

[Bladerunner1955]

What a beauty !
Can you give some details on the power/weight etc please

When's the maiden flight?
Thank You, the maiden is going to be tomorrow morning if the weather permits. Looks like rain here in Huntington Beach today though???? The AXI is a 5330/24 on 10 cells and swings a 22/12 zinger prop that I smoothed out a little. Finished weight is 23.5 pounds. The power system is the same as the Neiuport 17 in the clip I have attached with this responce. Do you have a clip of your beautiful Neiuport 28 flying by any chance. I just picked up a Balsa USA Neiuport 28 that is already built and just needs to be converted to electric power, I'll see if I stick a couple shots of it in here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMhmjQ8uXVE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kgpmq0y_iDk

[Bladerunner1955]

Flew the Fokker D7 this morning and all went very good. these are fun to fly. Didn't do anything fancy just flew it around and around. It came off the ground so fast. I will leave it on the ground a little longer tomorrow to make it look a little more scale. The AXI 5330/24 electric motor flew it great. Here are a couple photos from this morning.

[R101]

Congratulations on the maiden flight - is that a scale colour scheme on the Fokker?
Are you using 2.4GHZ gear?

A short video of the Nieuport 28 -

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=7cCy4oRA5tU

[Greg Gimlick]

I built the BUSA 1/4 scale Nieuport 28 for electric power last year.
No complaints with the kit, it went together with no problems.


What's your power setup and all up flying weight? Great looking plane!

[R101]

Axi 5330/F3A
8S LiPo
18x10 APCe
Weight is 12 lbs

Radio is Spektrum, but I have lost faith in the gear after losing 2 scale models last weekend

[jollyroger]

A number of fellow clubmembers and I visited BUSA last May and were treated like royalty. We got a tour of Ron Busch's hangar at Tri Cities Airport in Menomenee and spent well over an hour looking over his Cub and Aircoupe.
A tour through the "factory" revealed how the kits were cut as well as some of the ingenius tools built for bending wires for landing gear, making dimension stock and cutting parts. Also got a look at the warehouse full of balsa! Talk about drool time....
As it were everybody had a great time and Ron Busch and his associates answered any questions we had as well. I purchased the .40 size Eindecker as it will be my first BUSA kit build. The smaller 1/6 scale Pup and Fokker D-VIII are acouple more kits I would like to build. So far haven't seen any of the two 1/6 scale builds on any RC websites..
I guess nobody has the perfect balsa all the time. It's part of building with organic materials. Wood can be very forgiving or it can be a nightmare to work with as there are always unexpected problems from the supply side of hte business. They did show some sample of new balsa stock they were receiving back in April at Toledo and it looked very good.
These guys pay huge shipping costs to get the best balsa possible from South America, and sometimes you do get some bad wood, but they always make it right.
just my .02 worth.

[Greg Gimlick]

Axi 5330/F3A
8S LiPo
18x10 APCe
Weight is 12 lbs

Radio is Spektrum, but I have lost faith in the gear after losing 2 scale models last weekend

Thanks for the info, I had one of these kits and never built it so I ended up selling it....but I keep thinking and it would have to be electric.

You're the second person I've talked to in the last week who said the same thing about their Spektrum radio. I hate to hear that as I'm waffling which way I'm going to go with 2.4 Ghz. I'm flying a Royal Evo converted with an XPS system and also flying a Spektrum DX7 trying to decide. I haven't had any problems with either one and I love my Multiplex radio so I'd like to go that way, but the XPS forum is full of horror stories too. In my large planes I have started using receiver packs made of two A123 1100 mah cells and run thru a regulator to try to avoid any voltage drops under load.

Sorry to hear of your trouble.

[Bladerunner1955]

Axi 5330/F3A
8S LiPo
18x10 APCe
Weight is 12 lbs

Radio is Spektrum, but I have lost faith in the gear after losing 2 scale models last weekend
I am sure you were running a seperate reciever pack,right? I always use reciever packs and stay away from ANY bec set ups. I go overboard on the packs and use 5 cells and about 2500 mah size packs. I have been using Spectrum in all of my electrics and have very good luck. Let us know if you were using a reciever pack. Sorry to hear of any loss of a plane due to radio problem but it really hurts when it is something scale.
Blade

[Bladerunner1955]

Congratulations on the maiden flight - is that a scale colour scheme on the Fokker?
Are you using 2.4GHZ gear?

A short video of the Nieuport 28 -

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=7cCy4oRA5tU
Not really the most scale guy out here but I did see some photos of a D7 with the same color set up but not with the skull on the side of the red body, I just like the skull I saw on another D7 and just had to have one on mine. I guess it is the old biker in me coming out.
And thanks for the clip. Just perfect, seeing the take off and landing tells alot. Thanks again. from Blade

[R101]

I was using a UBEC which I was led to believe was the way to go, as it would always supply a steady 5v, so what is the argument against the use of BECs?

[jollyroger]

I was using a UBEC which I was led to believe was the way to go, as it would always supply a steady 5v, so what is the argument against the use of BECs?
I believe he means the BEC in the speed control. I use a couple UBEC's and have no problems with them at all. I also have a Hyperion Titan 50 ESC that incorporates a 4A switch mode BEC.
The switch mode BEC/ESC combination may be the other way to go if another battery pack is not feasable. Right now I'm still using 72Mhz equipment so I don't have that particular problem.
It appears that Horizon Hobby is working on a solution and some of the new receivers have modifications to prevent these dropouts.
Still I don't see any reason not to give these new systems a try as long as one takes the necessary precautions or makes sure they have the latest versions.
At our field we have a mysterious interference problem that comes and goes and has brought down several planes and almost shot mine down. There is an abandoned landfill close by and there has been some speculation a wireless monitoring system is being used.

[Bladerunner1955]

I was using a UBEC which I was led to believe was the way to go, as it would always supply a steady 5v, so what is the argument against the use of BECs?
losing 2 scale models last weekend

[Greg Gimlick]

I've used UBEC's in the past without a problem, but many folks don't understand the difference in how these devices work compared to normal BEC employed in controllers. The Ubec and those by Castle Creations are switching devices and not linear as used in controllers.

The caution here when using any BEC is to be sure they can supply the current required by your servos.

XPS recommends not using any sort of BEC device regardless of type. They advocate separate receiver batteries only, but I don't necessarily agree with that. When using a Ubec or Castle Creations BEC you're pretty much using it as a voltage regulator as long as it's of sufficient capacity for the load.

Take this with a grain of salt too because I'm no electrical engineer :-)

[IH8VTEC]

I have a Balsa USA Phaeton 90 that is die cut very well. It was hard to tell but the obvious clue was no scorch marks. Pieces were falling out of the sheets. No crush job here.

I emailed Balsa USA last week for any suggestions on lightning the airframe for an E conversion, haven't heard back yet. Anyone have any tips?

[ExRAFbod]

Finished finally, this model weighs in at exactly 20lbs and the balance point is exactly where it should be. A lot of brass went into the front end so no additional weights were required.
Here's is a little of what went into it.
"Major Tynes", the pilot, is from scrapbox block balsa and he actually commanded 24 Sqdn at the time.
His flying Kit is real leather and the wings on his coat are RFC and the RFC Lettering on the Wings is actually readable.
The 'white' around the Helmet is dried Dubbin.
His goggles come down over the eyes for flight and are based on early 1914 aviator styles (so the elastic is functional).
His Flying Harness Straps are leather and serve to hold him in place (he's removable too).
While I am sure you are aware, the model is not 100% Scale, it still looks right.
I have also taken some liberties with the Cockpit Instrumentation and colouring. Aged SE5as tended to go very orangey around the Cockpit due to the varnish used at the time weathering so I just used Orange Butyrate Paint.
The Sidepanel Lacing on the Fuselage contains 504 small dressmaking pins per side along each Longeron.
To simulate the lacing, the pins are threaded with Irish Linen Thread and the whole thing covered over to reduce drag as was done on the Shuttleworth Collection SE5a. Looks right too.
I cleaned out the local hobbyshop's supply of small brass eyelets with which to secure the Tandy Leather Cockpit Coaming.
The Centre Cabane Struts are wound (with Worldtex Stripping) as the real aircraft were.
The Verey Cartridges are .22 Cal Rimfires (fired), as is the barrel of the Engine Priming Pump and the Fuel Selector dial.
The Pocketwatch/Clock (Pic 406) next to the Priming Pump says 5.55 which is right twice a day....timely enough for an evening sortie or a dawn patrol.
The Starter Dynamo is made from a .32 Auto Pistol Cartridge, the Crank Rotates too (see picture 406 near Starboard Exhaust).
The Directional Indicator is a combination of .22, .32 and 30-06 Cartridge Brass.
The Map Case contains two actual folded maps of the Amiens and Matigny Areas of Northern France and are legible (24 Sqn's Patrol Area). The Mapcase has a latch to prevent maps flying off by themselves.
The stirrup/foot panels on either side of the Fuselage are brass rimmed (Kickstrips).
The Foster Mount Rail is soldered brass and the entire mount detaches as does the Lewis Gun. Its barrel and breech is aluminium.
I remade the Radiator Louvres from soldered brass to make them a bit stronger. They should have been aluminium but I can't weld aly.
Covering is Worldtex throughout (as are the markings).
The Exhausts are brass tubes fitting into Aluminium Tubing.
Model Fuel is pumped in through the Radiator Cap and the fuel is pressurised via the custom exhaust piping under the Cowl.
The Glowplug Connector, Charge Lead and Receiver Switch are mounted behind the Front U/C Crossbar at the Fuselage Underside (not the U/C Axle) and is covered by a hatch that closes (when the glow lead is disconnected) by prop blast otherwise the connections are hidden. Small rare earth magnets hold it closed.
The Choke for the Enya is a lever extended to be reachable from the Underside Cooling Vents without showing and the NVA has been modified to accept an Allen Key so that it does not poke out either.
Lots of details were left out but overall it is still recognisable as representative of the SE5a.
http://www.telusplanet.net/public/kblaine/Pictures/Last3.jpg
http://www.telusplanet.net/public/kblaine/Pictures/Last2.jpg

[Grant Lord]

i have built two of their kits.... the wood isn't the best (kinda funny considering there name) and as stated many are not true scale... but if you spend some time you can make a nice flying airplane that is fairly close.

not my first choice for my next project, but i would build another one of their planes :)

Grant

[jollyroger]

I just finnished my Fokker E III and the wood was very high in quality and die cutting. I have no complaints there, just what seems as missing a section on wing construction.
As for some of their planes not being entirely scale, it is done especially in the stabilzer, rudder and elevator size in order to provide better control authority. There is one build on the .90 size Eindecker where the builder actually made the rudder and elevator to scale size and found the plane to be difficult to control.
The long and short of it is that when it comes to scaling a plane down for R/C, not all of the structure can be scaled likewise. It's a matter of the effect the air molecules have on the surfaces of small and or scale aircraft. Sometimes license has to be taken in order for the builder/flyer to experience a successful experience with a scale kit.
cheers

[Ron]

Have a 1/4 sized Pup by BUSA...a little on the heavy side, but overall quality isn't really bad...I suppose if I was real nit picky, I could find lots of little things, but one thing for sure...it sure flies nice....and close to scale is good enough for me...I'm not into "competition" if everyone agrees that it looks like Pup in flight and sitting on the flight line, then it's done it's job as far as I'm concerned..going to do a 1/6 sized one after I finish the DR1