Vladimir Supra buliding instructions

[POF]

I got my Vladimir Supra :) But is there anywhere I can download some official buliding instructions for it? I'm sure that it isn't too complicated - but I would like to read it if it's there.

[dhauch]

sorry no instructions, but here is how i do the pushrods.
http://www.git-r-built.com/newsmgr/templates/grbNews.asp?articleid=33&zoneid=1
note- there was no ballast tube i nthis plane.

i have some other Supra radio install pics on my site.

feel free to contact if you have any questions, would be glad to help.

dh

[Stan Myers]

I got my Vladimir Supra :) But is there anywhere I can download some official buliding instructions for it? I'm sure that it isn't too complicated - but I would like to read it if it's there.

Dave mailed these to me and I'm sure he won't mind me passing them on. If you follow exactly you will have the smoothest rods, no binding it all,at all,ut all.

1) The rear edge of the rear rudder mounting ring is .0625" forward of the rear of the boom.
2) The rear edge of the stab/elevator carrier is 5.825" forward of the rear of the boom at the bottom of the carrier.
3) The front of the rudder push rod tube slot is 5.840" forward of the rear of the boom and is 1.950" long towards the rear.
4) The front of the elevator push rod tube is 11.60 forward of the rear of the boom and is 2.70" long also to the rear.

I used an Exacto small rat tail file to bevel both openings so as to provide a smooth surface for the tubes to nest into and I used the black filled CA to glue the tubes at the rear area of the of the boom.

The ballast tube is 21.00" long measured on the inside and sticks out 1.940"from the rear edge of the canopy at the top of the fuse. The single foam push rod tube support disc is just aft of the ballast tube in the boom approx. 5.60" behind the front edge of the boom. The notches for the pushrod tubes are at a 45 degree angle above the disc centerline.

REMEMBER to dry fit everything more than once to insure smooth push rod operation. I glued the disc first, then the tubes at the rear, always checking for smooth and free operation at every step.

The front of the tow hook opening is 7.540" rear of the rear edge of the canopy on the fuse bottom.

The opening on the top of the pylon is now .830 aft of the front bolt and is 2.22" long.

I think this will get you started. I will resend the pics later today or this evening. Remember, a little patience up front will reward you with a good result.

[POF]

Thanks a lot! Its very helpful with all these pictures.

A friend of mine send me this: http://www.hilaunch.com/Supra%20Inst.htm

[dhauch]

post removed

[Wildewinds]

Perfect timing with this thread as I am currently building my Supra. Those measurements really help me out.

Does anyone know max flap deflection with the stock setup? I know a few people have used a control horn on the bottom to get 90 degrees.

[kkw]

hi,
i don't mind any of my emails being passed on, but i never sent these measurments to anyone.

dave hauch
Dave Hauch - Dave Corven. You only seem to share a Christian name Dave. Stan's post states measurements received from Dave Corven.

[dhauch]

sorry, i didn't read to good.

dh

[POF]

Reading Larry Lollys description http://www.hilaunch.com/Supra%20Inst.htm I find:
"Then place a piece of masking tape under the wing outside the pylon mount. Mark a line 3.6" and 3.8" from the leading edge. Mount the wing and using a 90-degree triangle, transfer the 3.8" mark to the bottom of the fuselage, and grind the access hole for the tow hook so that the towhook centers it's travel at the 3.8" mark." (3.82 = 96,5mm)

But when I do this on Mark Drelas drawing http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/supra/all%20PDFs/supra_fuse.pdf
I get 3.23" (82 mm)

So where do I put my hook :confused:

[Robglover]

Reading Larry Lollys description http://www.hilaunch.com/Supra%20Inst.htm I find:
"Then place a piece of masking tape under the wing outside the pylon mount. Mark a line 3.6" and 3.8" from the leading edge. Mount the wing and using a 90-degree triangle, transfer the 3.8" mark to the bottom of the fuselage, and grind the access hole for the tow hook so that the towhook centers it's travel at the 3.8" mark." (3.82 = 96,5mm)

But when I do this on Mark Drelas drawing http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/supra/all%20PDFs/supra_fuse.pdf
I get 3.23" (82 mm)

So where do I put my hook :confused:


Larry is describing his setup for a Vladimir Supra kit. The charles river site information is for the scratch built Drela version. Which version do you have?

[Stan Myers]

Reading Larry Lollys description http://www.hilaunch.com/Supra%20Inst.htm I find:
"Then place a piece of masking tape under the wing outside the pylon mount. Mark a line 3.6" and 3.8" from the leading edge. Mount the wing and using a 90-degree triangle, transfer the 3.8" mark to the bottom of the fuselage, and grind the access hole for the tow hook so that the towhook centers it's travel at the 3.8" mark." (3.82 = 96,5mm)

But when I do this on Mark Drelas drawing http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/supra/all%20PDFs/supra_fuse.pdf
I get 3.23" (82 mm)

So where do I put my hook :confused:

As you know the actual placement of the tow hook is dependent on your flying(launching style) style. The cut out in the fuse starts 190mm from where the rear of the nose cone contacts the pod. The back side of the tow hook shank is 203mm from the same point of measurement. You will find this to be an excellent start for first launches. This position will allow you to make all the rearward adjustments to suit your c/g (and/or) your launching style.

I have my c/g exactly 92mm from leading edge and with the tow hook where I have told you my plane will rotate immediately out of my hand when launching from a from a hi start that is pulling 25#'s with a 5-7mph wind. My hi start will pull 35#'s but we have had 7-11mph winds almost the whole month of July and I haven't needed to pull the full 35#'s. . If you are using a winch you should be able to move the hook a little further back, but you certainly won't get into trouble of the launch with my settings

[POF]

Robglover:
Mine is a Vladimir Supra kit.

Stan:
Thanks - it couldn't be more precise. After measuring on my Supra it seems like you have your hook position 9 mm in front of the position Larry describes. And with the hook from Vladimir I'm able to have both your position and Larry’s position.

[markdrela]

But when I do this on Mark Drelas drawing http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/supra/all%20PDFs/supra_fuse.pdf
I get 3.23" (82 mm)

The PDF was made before I finally settled on the hook position. Below is the info for my bagged Supra as it's currently flying. The moldie might be different, dunno.

BTW, the Supra page at CRRC will soon be updated with additional documents made after the page was first put up, including all the control throws and my Evo program.



Supra setup Mark Drela 15 Aug 05
===========

Decalage
--------
With -2 camber setting (full reflex), the nearly-flat
rear bottom of wing and the stab are parallel.

CG position
-----------
3.6" (91.5mm) behind center LE

Tow ring position
-----------------
3.8" (96.5mm) behind center LE (on a line perpendicular to wing bottom)

Note: This is a fairly far aft hook position, which will probably require
adding a touch of down elevator for the throw to prevent a stall at the
top of the initial rotation. Once the glider settles down in the climb,
the down-trim can be removed. I add the launch down-trim via an
easy to reach slider (slider E on my Royal Evo). A switch would also work.

[Wildewinds]

My carbon Supra had its first flight today. CG at 3.6." The tow hook base was centered at 3.8." However, if the base is "centered" it really isn't centered since the tow hook can move all the way back, but not all the way forwards as the lock down bolt gets in the way. So, if you really want to center it at 3.8", take the movement of the towhook into account.

That being said... with my cg at 3.6" and the tow hook at the furthest forward position of my "centered" towhook base, it launches awesome.

[markdrela]

My carbon Supra had its first flight today. CG at 3.6." The tow hook base was centered at 3.8." However, if the base is "centered" it really isn't centered since the tow hook can move all the way back, but not all the way forwards as the lock down bolt gets in the way. So, if you really want to center it at 3.8", take the movement of the towhook into account.
I'm not sure what you're describing here. On my glider, the contact point between the hook and the ring is 3.8" from the center LE. This contact point is all that matters when defining the hook position.

[ClayH]

I think that Mike is saying that if you want equal movement front and back from 3.8", instead of centering the entire tow hook slider at 3.8" consider that the nut inside the fuse cuts down the movement of the towhook forwards. So measure how much total movement the tow hook allows,and center that midpoint at 3.8". I think. :D

Clay

[Wildewinds]

Yeah, what Clay said.

<--- n00b

[POF]

Deleted...

[POF]

I'm soon going to cut the hole in the mid section for the servowirering going to the fuse. I can see where the main spar is, but I'm not sure where to cut without cutting into something vitale. Is there something connected between the two mounting hole?

[Stan Myers]

I'm soon going to cut the hole in the mid section for the servowirering going to the fuse. I can see where the main spar is, but I'm not sure where to cut without cutting into something vitale. Is there something connected between the two mounting hole?

There is nothing between the two holes

Stan

[POF]

There is nothing between the two holes

Stan

Is there no connection between the main spar and the holes? How are the forces transfered from the wing (main spar) to the fuse?

[Stan Myers]

Is there no connection between the main spar and the holes? How are the forces transfered from the wing (main spar) to the fuse?

It works

[POF]

It works
I think so too :D I appreciate you help – thanks.

So now I got my Volz Wing-Maxx HP glued in for flaps. The original drawings show a -2, +3 and +50 degree position for the flaps. The -2 degree position looks like an airfoil without any deflection.

I’m sure that I have read somewhere that the airfoil is designed in the speed position (-2 degree) and the +3 degree position is for normal flight, but I was not able to find that text again. Any comments?

What deflections are you guys using for the different flight phases for the Supra?

[Wildewinds]

What deflections are you guys using for the different flight phases for the Supra?

I'd like to know the same.

[nuevo]

I found this on the Kennedy Composites Supra page..

http://kennedycomposites.com/images/supra/wing340mold.pdf

[markdrela]

What deflections are you guys using for the different flight phases for the Supra?
The Supra page now has additional info on control throws and other stuff:
http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/supra/supra.htm

[POF]

Thanks Mark, I have to study this in details.

[POF]

After flying my Supra #160 I would like to thank all that help with ideas and instructions. I believe Supra is the best glider I ever flown. (Except for a full size Nimbus 4 :D ). And thanks to the 8 buzzards that made my maiden flight to something special :) .