Batteries for Indoor Pattern [Archive]

matchlessaero

Jun 06, 2006, 10:48 AM

I have been working on trying different batteries for my Sentinel F3P. I am running motor that has a 2S wind, so my goal has been to find 2s packs with a high enough discharge rate for uplines and maneuvers like the KE Loops that were in the ETOC compulsory maneuvers, while also having a light enough weight to maintain a light flying weight. While I only need enough duration for the routine, a little more duration is not a terribly bad thing.

As I mentioned in my Sentinel thread, I'm running an Uttam Mighty Midget Gold Double 2S with a GWS 6-3 prop. I am running both packs as they came from the supplier with two small velcro squares for attachment and a JST plug.

The first pack I found is the Apache/Etec 2s 300mah. The AUW of this pack is 19 grams as I run it (stock with a JST connector) Performance is good with this pack, uplines are good but slow unless I carry good momentum into them. Duration is more than enough to do an F3P routine. When I run the pack down, I'm putting back an average of 260 mah.

I also just recieved a 'Twenty' 2S 300mah pack from Hobby Lobby to test. The AUW of this pack is 20 grams, again with a JST connector installed. Performance is excellent with this pack and uplines are very strong. Duration is again more than enough to do an F3P routine. When I run the pack down, I'm putting back an average of 230 mah.

I'm also testing some other packs, but I don't have enough runs on them to give any good data or feel.

So far, I'm most impressed by the performance of the 'Twenty' brand pack. I know I can reduce the weight on it by shortening the leads (which are heavier than necessary wire).

Bryan Davison

Jun 06, 2006, 11:24 AM

I've been using the VampPowerBatts packs, and been extremely pleased with them. Im currently using the 2 cell 620mah packs on all my indoor stuff.

The VampPowerBatts 2cell 620mah batteries weigh in at 30.9g which in my opinion is FANTASTIC. And since its a 620, the runtimes are very long.

Honestly, Im willing to sacrifice on the weight to get the performance I want. Even with these packs, my plane's all up is still under 6oz.

Jerry Combs

Jun 06, 2006, 02:48 PM

I have 4 of the Polyquest "Twenty" 2S 300mAh packs, I had one puff on me on the 3rd flight but the others have been good and have a lot more punch than my E-Tec 2S 450mAh packs.

Jerry

Trisquire

Jun 06, 2006, 03:38 PM

Jerry,

Are those the packs you use on your Ballerina?

Tom.

racerxky

Jun 06, 2006, 04:07 PM

I have a ThunderPower 2S 430 on order to test. It's supposed to weigh in at 23g with the JST plug. These are 15C cells and put out more amps that most motors in this class can handle. They have the same chemistry as the larger 'Pro-Lite' packs.

I am using the TP 2S 730mah pack now and it provides very long run times and ample power to turn a 9x4.5 with strong uplines. 34g. It's a good outdoor pack for practice when the wind is light.

I have a Vampower 3S 620. It's really too heavy for indoors but outside its a blast with an 8x4 prop. Unlimited verticle, better than the 2S packs.

The Vampower packs have much to recommend them. Cheap, reliable, light for the capacity and good performers. Too bad there isn't a 3-400mah pack in that range.

Jerry Combs

Jun 06, 2006, 06:09 PM

Tom,

They are the batteries that I use on the 25" sized Ballerina that has a Westport on it. The micro Ballerina uses a 160mAh pack.

Jerry

racerxky

Jun 07, 2006, 12:32 PM

Brand | Cells | Capacity (mah) | Weight (g) | C Rating | Current | Taps? | Price* | Link**

Etec|2|300|19.0|15|4.5| No | $17 | link (http://www.bphobbies.com/view.asp?id=A0320069&pid=V268197)
Poly-Quest "Twenty"|2|300|20.0|20|6| No |$16 |link (http://www.hobby-lobby.com/polyquest.htm)
Hyperion 20C|2|300|20.0|20|6| No |$16 |link (http://www.allerc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2042)
Kolkam|2|340|22.0|||?||
BadDogs|2|360|??|20|7.2| ?? |?? |
Hyperion 20C|2|400|27.0|20|8| No |$17 |[url=http://www.allerc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2603]link (]link[/url)
Poly-Quest "Twenty"|2|400|31.1|20|8| No |$17 |link (http://www.hobby-lobby.com/polyquest.htm)
Etec|2|450|24.7|10|4.5| No | $16 | link (http://www.bphobbies.com/view.asp?id=V127351&pid=U493125)
BadDogs|2|460|??|20|9.6| ?? |?? |
Thunder Power|2|480|23.0|15|7.2| No |$28 | [URL=http://cheapbatterypacks.com/main.asp?sid=590452&pgid=tp&sort=PL#prodtop]link (]link[/url)
Vampower Pro|2|620|30.9|10|6.2| Yes |$20 |link (http://www.vampowerpro.com/batteries/pop620mah.htm)
Vampower Pro|3|620|44.9|10|6.2| Yes |$28 |link (http://www.vampowerpro.com/batteries/pop620mah.htm)
Thunder Power|2|730|34.0|15|10.95| No |$31 | link (http://cheapbatterypacks.com/main.asp?sid=590452&pgid=tp&sort=PL#prodtop)

* Prices are based on the best price I could find and rounded to the nearest dollar.
** I do not endorse any particular reseller I am linking to here.
*** The Table is sorted by capacity and then by weight.

I'll try to keep this up to date as this duscussion continues.

Trisquire

Jun 07, 2006, 12:46 PM

Battery wise, I typically listen to 'everydayflyer' in the Batteries and Chargers forum. Charles likes VAMPowers. He doesn't think as highly of Kokams.

Nice chart by the way.

Tom

fwilly

Jun 07, 2006, 01:17 PM

You can knock a gram off the etec 300 weight if you build it from bare cells, and build light. I'm sure the same is true for the other batteries.

matchlessaero

Jun 07, 2006, 01:26 PM

I agree Fwilly. The 'Twenty' pack I got has wire for something more like a 15-20 amp setup... I plan to pull re-wire it with wiring more appropriate for the application. I think I can save a gram or two that way...

Racer, thats a good chart. BTW, the Etec battery is available from Cooper Fuels, however I don't know of a link for their site.

Anyone have a Kokam 2s 340 to weigh and add to the chart?

Trisquire

Jun 07, 2006, 01:55 PM

I was curious if modellers are concerned with cell balancing in this particular size category? Packs in these small sizes usually don't come with balancer taps and leads.
Tom

Bryan Davison

Jun 07, 2006, 02:06 PM

I dont normally balance them, but the VampPower packs come with balancing leads...and their weight is included in the 30.9g

racerxky

Jun 07, 2006, 03:39 PM

Hyperion also has some 20C 300mah packs; 20g, $16

link (http://cheapbatterypacks.com/main.asp?sid=569779&pgid=tp&sort=V20#prodtop)

I have no experience with these but I can say that their motors and chargers are good. Basically Identical specs to the Poly-Quest 'Twenty'

racerxky

Jun 07, 2006, 04:02 PM

Racer, thats a good chart. BTW, the Etec battery is available from Cooper Fuels, however I don't know of a link for their site.

Thanks :) . I found them on BPHobbies. Lots of sites have the ETec cells but not many cary the 300mah packs.

Jerry Combs

Jun 07, 2006, 04:07 PM

Just weighed my batteries:

Polyquest "twenty" 300 mAh 2 cell with stock wiring and deans micro 20 grams
Polyquest "twenty" 400 mAh 2 cell with stock wiring and deans micro 28 grams
Kolkam 340 mAh 2 cell with stock wiring and JST 22 grams

Jerry

fwilly

Jun 07, 2006, 06:21 PM

I manually balance my packs. I got 4 brand new etec 300 cells that were all way off, one by .3v from the other. I've got two others that I have been abusing above 20c for a while, and they are staying balanced. Its alway a good idea to check.

matchlessaero

Jun 21, 2006, 05:34 PM

Balsa Products (Balsapr.com) just listed the 200 and 400mah 2s Apache lipos as available for sale with pretty reasonable prices.

fwilly

Jun 22, 2006, 09:40 PM

Did you mean 300 and 400mah? Can't find any 200s. Some 20c 200s would be sweet though.

matchlessaero

Jun 22, 2006, 09:55 PM

Yup... Sorry bout that..... BTW, I know where to get you some 200's if ya need 'em.

Alexandre Cruz

Jun 22, 2006, 11:25 PM

I do have a Hyperion pack 2S 300 20C but they do not discharge at this rate. When I tried to use them on 5A drawing motor the ESC (phoenix 10) has cut-off the motor and when using on 4A they do not last as long as Poly Quest. The weight is the same and also thought they were the same cells, but they aren´t (at least mine).
Are there any 200/250mAh 20C cells?

Jerry Combs

Jun 22, 2006, 11:55 PM

Alexandre,

According to Gordon Johnson's battery test page ( http://home.comcast.net/~gordon-johnson/batteries.htm ) the new Atomic Workshop 220's are 18C. They should be available from Bob Selman Designs soon. http://www.bsdmicrorc.com/ I hope to get some of these soon to try.

Jerry

Eagleburger

Jun 23, 2006, 04:54 AM

Commonsense 500mah 2S packs weigh 26g and hold their voltage well up to 7 amps. I have five of these packs and like them a lot.

Vamooska

Jun 27, 2006, 11:50 AM

Hi guys...just thought I would chime in. Thanks for all of the positive comments. We are in the process of getting some smaller packs in the mill for you gym junkies. :D . I think something around 400-420ma in the 12C continuous. Is there a reason to even try to get the 20C cont in the smaller units? PLease let us know.

As you guys probably already know, the 620's come with self adhesive precut velcro and taps. I also throw in a cool vinyl sticker. Tell you hobby shops they need em and if they contact me, place an order....you too will win.
I am getting a referral credit program together to help make the hobby even cheaper.

What else do you guys need from us?

Vammy

matchlessaero

Jun 27, 2006, 11:57 AM

Vammy, there is a definite need for 2S packs that weigh in at the 15-20 gram range. There are a couple of packs that fit that description and provide high discharge rates, but there is always room for more.

Trisquire

Jun 27, 2006, 12:09 PM

Some connector flexibility would be nice. I prefer Mini Deans on the charger lead, and a TP connector on the balancer lead.

Tom

racerxky

Jun 27, 2006, 02:59 PM

I would like to see 15C packs in that size.

The Axi 2204 can pull 6 amps at full throttle. On a 620 at 10C thats fine but you would be stressing a 10C 400mah pack. The average draw is probably more like 3-4A though. 15C pack gives you some headroom if you push it a bit hard. For the smaller motors I dont think its as much of a problem.

I have stuck with the JST plugs because everyone's equipment around here is JST as well so I can borrow a pack or use their charger. Also Im lazy and want to avoid the soldering.

Denile

Jun 27, 2006, 03:14 PM

Does someone know what current the JST's can handle. For some reason I thought they were for lower current applications, < 3A, is that incorrect. I will probably switch too them if they are good at 6A. I currently use the mini deans but find them a pain to unplug, ( I cutoff 4 fingers, they reattached them but they dont work so well ).

Robert

Malves

Jun 27, 2006, 04:02 PM

Is there a reason to even try to get the 20C cont in the smaller units? PLease let us know.

The majority of motors (2204/5, Park300, CDRs, and even the Euro motors that are coming) that are used for indoor flying will top at 8-9A burst.

fwilly

Jun 27, 2006, 04:51 PM

Is there a reason to even try to get the 20C cont in the smaller units? PLease let us know.

Less weight...

The F3P pattern only lasts a couple minutes, so duration isn't an issue.

Vamooska

Jun 27, 2006, 05:02 PM

Tom, I am afraid those battles have been fought by me and I have lost. I tried to get all or most major players on the same page connector-wise. Not one stepped up. What I have done is this...I use a very common Molex plug which part numbers can be provided.

I will be checking into getting Vampower Gold Rate series in the the lower capacities.

JST (BEC) connectors can handle 8 amps ok...go above that for a continuous and expect failures. You may not get failures...just expect them.

The reason I ask about 20 C is that if you only need them for a couple of minutes then maybe it would lend value to the pack...if you are not into competition....prolly not.

Vammy

Bryan Davison

Jun 28, 2006, 02:22 PM

Still waiting to hear when that 9CAP lipo is coming out...I want one for my Tx.

VampPowerBatts ROCK!!!!

Jurgen Heilig

Jul 03, 2006, 01:08 PM

...
JST (BEC) connectors can handle 8 amps ok...go above that for a continuous and expect failures. You may not get failures...just expect them.
...
Vammy

Connector systems tested:

http://www.elektromodellflug.de/hochstromst/hochstromstecker.htm

The JST are good for 5A continuous / 8A peak currents (in new condition). However, the drop in voltage compared to the Micro-Deans is very noticeable.

:) Jürgen

racerxky

Jul 20, 2006, 06:03 PM

Hobby Lobby has a sale on those Polyquest packs this week, I snagged a couple of 2 cell 300mah packs for $13 a piece. Sale ends friday.

matchlessaero

Jul 20, 2006, 07:26 PM

Thanks for the heads up Racer!

BTW, I think AllERC.com has a similar sale on as well.

racerxky

Sep 06, 2006, 12:52 PM

I updated the battery chart (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5585318&postcount=7) to include the 20C Hyperion 400mah packs.

Vamooska

Sep 06, 2006, 01:11 PM

Byan, the 9C Vampowers shipped and are on the way to me. :D

richard boyd

Oct 03, 2006, 10:20 AM

hi ,have anyone tried poly rc? the 300mah,6amp20-30c,22grams or the 400mah ,8amp 20-30c 25grams. im using thunder power 430 but these have been highly reguarded as the best on the market.

rapghsi

Oct 03, 2006, 01:20 PM

i use polyqest 300 mah and my battery weight is 18 gr.
i have removed covers and used 22 awg wire.

diablo2006

Oct 15, 2006, 12:04 PM

Buy Tanic packs, they really are the best packs for models. Loads of german indoor champions use them and they come in a huge range of capacities.

Go to www.unlimitedrc.co.uk

Ive had two of them 1 for my shockflyer and one for my EF extra

RickNT

Oct 16, 2006, 03:44 PM

Diablo,

At the supplied link there is no usefull indoor-pack to be seen.
Smallest pack is a 2S 780 pack with a blistering weight of 49 grams.

Maybe some german indoor flyers use them for practising outside in windy conditions.

Rick

TRuss

Oct 16, 2006, 04:02 PM

I've got a Tanic 3S 390, and a TP 3S480. I like the the TP much better as it is considerable smaller and lighter. My Yak Shockie loves it.

racerxky

Nov 20, 2006, 12:47 AM

tim_mellor

Nov 20, 2006, 12:54 AM

Check the weights for these on my weight chart (snip below) I found the info on a posting somewhere here but have forgotten where. Certainly worth including in the mix. They are actually coming in Badged Baddogs not Dualsky, also Dualsky don't show them on their site.

Tim

3d_Crazy

Nov 20, 2006, 04:06 PM

Anyone got info on the new Dualsky 360mah packs? 2DogRC (http://2dogrc.com/ecommerce/os/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=55_95&products_id=2064) has them for sale but no specs are posted. Post info and I'll add it to the chart (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5585318&postcount=7)

Just let me know what you would like to know. I need to take pictures of the 2-cell 360 and 460 and get them on the site. I'll also put them on the scale.

http://e-foamies.com/store/catalog/index.php?cPath=27

Tim

racerxky

Nov 20, 2006, 04:37 PM

No wait, thats the three cell. Whats the weight on the two cell packs and do they have balancer taps?

aglenn

Nov 20, 2006, 05:17 PM

The 2 cell 360's that i have are coming in at 20 grams with micro deans and the balancer.

Team Castle Creations
Team 2DogRc

tim_mellor

Nov 20, 2006, 05:38 PM

No wait, thats the three cell. Whats the weight on the two cell packs and do they have balancer taps?

Info is above in my earlier post , the source for the weights was Mr 2Dogs in a posting about the JR Indoor event so it should be correct. And yes they have balance tabs, but you could remove them and save some weight too ;)

Tim

AirNerd

Nov 21, 2006, 12:14 AM

Hey guys...I work at Tanic and I have been able to get the 390 3S down to 37 G's so a 2S would be 25-26 G's

I special build all of my own packs for lightness, no taps 1 layer of shrink, minimal tape...ect.

Chris

tim_mellor

Nov 21, 2006, 12:33 AM

Hi Chris,

whats the C rating on the 390's? or any other small ones in the range? I will add them to my chart as well.

Tim

AirNerd

Nov 21, 2006, 10:11 AM

The 390 & 470 are our smallest packs, and both rate at 15-20C, I will get some weights in a bit.

C

3d_Crazy

Nov 21, 2006, 03:18 PM

Here is information on the 2Dogrc.com Bad Dogz 360 & 460 2-cell Batteries:

Bad Dogz 360 2-cell
Weight: 21.1g with wires and balancing tap (no connector)

http://e-foamies.com/store/catalog/images/BD3602S_72dpi_web.jpg

Bad Dogz 460 2-cell
Weight: 27.1g with wires and balancing tap (no connector)

http://e-foamies.com/store/catalog/images/BD4602S_72dpi_web.jpg

http://e-foamies.com/store/catalog/index.php?cPath=27

Tim
http://e-foamies.com

AirNerd

Nov 23, 2006, 12:59 PM

These are Tanic 390"s and470"s on the scales naked...add about 4-8 grams so they are safe to handle. :)

fwilly

Nov 23, 2006, 03:24 PM

Atomic Workshop Cyclone 300 (http://www.atomicworkshop.co.uk/ProductDetail.asp?ProductType=BAT)

These look intersting. 20c 300mah cells that weigh 8.1g :cool:

tim_mellor

Nov 23, 2006, 04:50 PM

Atomic Workshop Cyclone 300 (http://www.atomicworkshop.co.uk/ProductDetail.asp?ProductType=BAT)

These look intersting. 20c 300mah cells that weigh 8.1g :cool:

Just OUCH on the price

AirNerd

Nov 23, 2006, 05:21 PM

Shoot...the Tanic 390 only weighs 11 g's each, with almost 100 more mah at the same C rating.

Around $10 a cell I think.

fwilly

Nov 23, 2006, 05:22 PM

I'm not sure how the USD compares to the £, so I didn't catch the sticker shock.

tim_mellor

Nov 23, 2006, 06:09 PM

USD to pounds about 2:1 so $32 USD for 2S300 the Hyperions I sell are under $20USD/pack including 11%GST.

If you are into free flight the little electronic motor control is cute on that site.

Tim

edoc

Nov 29, 2006, 06:02 PM

How many amps do you need for Indoor Pattern?
I just tested the FR 250 and was surprised at the amps it can handle for its 6.25 gram per cell weight. A 2S pack with Deans micro should come in at 14 grams max. It can handle 4 amps plus.

Graphs:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=573141&page=5&pp=15

Tim

tim_mellor

Nov 29, 2006, 09:25 PM

Hi Tim,

depends on the setup but 6A peak would be on the money for 2S maybe a little lower for a light 3S setup. But the average would be a lot lower, the downside to getting to small will be the voltage of the cells at the higher currents. 17-18g 2S seems to be on the money at present but if you were building micro 3D those little ones look good.

Tim

edoc

Nov 30, 2006, 12:05 AM

Hi Tim,
What pack will do 6 amps at 17 grams?

Tim

tim_mellor

Nov 30, 2006, 02:08 AM

Hyperion 2S300's are what I am using at present I ran some crude sustained 6A tests (results are a little further back in this thread) and they seemed OK at that level.

On my little Mini VTO they don't even warm up to the touch during a full run on an F3P motor/prop at 120g.

Check out the equipment list on the first page for batteries, I have listed them and other including C ratings.

Tim

edoc

Nov 30, 2006, 09:56 AM

Yes, I have been following the table. Very helpful. Maybe adding the Full River 250 would help those of us flying smaller stuff.

Thanks
Tim

crossup

Nov 30, 2006, 07:33 PM

Been using the 460 2DogRC packs for several weeks now, more than 50cycles most with loads over 25C and they are still taking full capacity or more.
Had one pack down to 2.5V approx/cell and it seems to have recovered 100% which is the first I've had one that low without hurting capacity.
My "big" load is a Rimfire with 9x4.7 GWS, think it pullls 13.5A WOT, have some 800mah 15C packs that get medium warm on this motor. The 2DogRC packs stay
pretty much at ambient despite working much harder.
No doubt in my mind, these cells are loafing at 10-15C and I believe the 30C burst rating

Anyone got info on the new Dualsky 360mah packs? 2DogRC (http://2dogrc.com/ecommerce/os/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=55_95&products_id=2064) has them for sale but no specs are posted. Post info and I'll add it to the chart (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5585318&postcount=7)

crossup

Nov 30, 2006, 07:38 PM

For the 2 cell guys I run the 2S460 on a 21T CustomCDROM Billet Bullet 20mm motor.
Running the GWS 9x5HD prop it pulls 5.05A which doesnt seem to raise the pack temp ANY even if you fly it to the bitter end of the power(thats when most heating occurs, at the end of the pack).
I forget the voltage under load but I do remember being VERY pleased. Pretty much threw my KOKAM packs in the trash(yes I know how to dispose properly) after testing these.

KatManDEW

Dec 03, 2006, 03:01 PM

Unless I'm missing something, it looks to me like the TP 480's are hard to beat, except for price, and no balancing taps.

I really like light weight setups, but for a 2-3 gram weight penalty on a plane in the 6 ounce range, I like the idea of 60% more run time.

pmackenzie

Dec 03, 2006, 03:08 PM

True about the TP480 being hard to beat.
The Polyquest 20C 300's have just as much if not a bit more "punch" than the TP480, are a few grams lighter, but at the expense of some duration.
8 or so minutes instead of 11-12 in my experience.
Pat MacKenzie

KatManDEW

Dec 03, 2006, 11:15 PM

The Hobby-Lobby website lists the Polyquest's at 0.8 ounces, which is 22.7 grams, which is about what the TP's weigh. I don't know if that includes a connector. What do yours weigh?

As cheap as they are, I might try one, but not if it doesn't weigh at least a couple grams less.

racerxky

Dec 03, 2006, 11:31 PM

My scale says they are 0.7oz or 20g. This is with full length leads and a Deans micro connector. I have some of the Hyperion cells and they weigh the same thing. My TP 480 with Deans micro connector weighs 5 grams more. No Velcro on any of the packs.

I have yet to test my Polyquest cells. Soon as I get a new ESC it will be done.

pmackenzie

Dec 03, 2006, 11:35 PM

The PQ 2S300 pack weighs 20.4 grams, the TP 2S480 is 25.6 grams.
Both have a piece of Velcro and Deans 3 pin connector.
Wire length is about the same, about 3/4"
The extra punch might just be the 5 grams of weight saved, but my sense is that the ESC doesn't hit the soft LVC as often with the PQ pack.
Pat MacKenzie

tim_mellor

Dec 04, 2006, 12:10 AM

My Hyperions 2S300's are under 18g each with velcro and mini deans on 30mm wire. At 150g it may not be as much of a problem but closer to 100g it is a 7-8% weight penalty. The modern 20C 300's give a much better voltage than the older 480's

Tim

KatManDEW

Dec 04, 2006, 09:24 AM

I ordered a couple of the Hyperions to try. Thanks for the info.

KatManDEW

Dec 11, 2006, 08:48 PM

My Hyperions 2S300's are under 18g each with velcro and mini deans on 30mm wire.

My milage always varies :) When I first took them out of the package, I was impressed by the size, even though my calibrated arm was telling me otherwise. I trimmed the wires to equal length of those on the TP 480's. No Velcro on either pack.

Aio_1

Dec 12, 2006, 03:25 AM

I just received another couple of 2s 300mAh Hyperion packs and it looks like they've changed the assembly of the pack. The two I just got are assembled differently but neither appears to be a repair or anything. One is the same as the other packs I've got but the other seems to have a strip of stiff plastic sheet wrapped around the cells (for added impact protection?) inside the heat shrink. I haven't weighed them but I'd expect the weight to be up a couple of grams.

Are your cells like this? If the ends of the pack are rounded then it sounds like you got this second style of assembly.

Aidan

richard boyd

Dec 12, 2006, 04:13 AM

Aidan ,i think i had the same problem,batterys were ok,have you ever tried the 300 or 400 polyrc batterys they are as light but seem to give you that extra va va vuum.I read somewhere on this thread that jst can handle up to 8amps think we are being mislead in fact they only handle 4.5-5 amp most 300 + size motors have a requirement of 6 amps.take the time to change to micro deans.PS ANY FLYING IN DUBLIN OVER THE HOLIDAYS

Eagleburger

Dec 12, 2006, 05:43 AM

Aio_1

Dec 12, 2006, 05:47 AM

Hi Richard,

I might just strip the pack with the plastic and re-cover it with just heat shrink to match the others (which I weighed as 19g with about 40mm of cable and a micro deans). I'm very impressed with the Hyperion VX300 cells. If I remember correctly when I initially tested mine they delivered 6A at 3.5V fresh dropping to about 5.5A at 3.2V after say 15s. I doubt the Polyquest cells can do better. I switched to micro deans a couple of months ago and I really like them. I had been using 2mm bullet connectors which can handle plenty current but are a little heavy and less convenient to solder and use.
Not sure if there's anything going on in Dublin over Christmas. There might be an event of some kind in ALSAA in February or March like last year but I don't think it's organised as yet.

Aidan

Mad Scientist

Dec 12, 2006, 05:28 PM

I've been running the PQ "TWENTY" 3s400's pretty hard in my 10oz bipe and I'm very impressed in how well they hold up.

still4given

Dec 12, 2006, 05:28 PM

Have any of you tried these HXT batts? (https://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2134) They are 19g. I don't have any of this model but all of the other packs I've tried from them have been very good.

Blessings, Terry

tim_mellor

Dec 12, 2006, 05:57 PM

My milage always varies :) When I first took them out of the package, I was impressed by the size, even though my calibrated arm was telling me otherwise. I trimmed the wires to equal length of those on the TP 480's. No Velcro on either pack.

Hi,

the heatshrink and the cable will be the weight difference.

Once you drop the heatshrink the terminals on the cells are still well taped and protected plus the cells are glued together. Shorten the cable (weigh some and be amazed at the weight) to the bare minimum needed and thats what I got. Mine were weighed on a scale that I have calibrated weights for so it should be accurate to better than .1g.

Tim

crossup

Dec 14, 2006, 12:04 AM

I'll try to womp up some test info this weekend.

Do you have rpm or thrust data?

KatManDEW

Dec 14, 2006, 12:37 AM

I ordered one of the HXT packs. Amazing price.....

I get some RPM figures with the different packs when I get the HXT pack..

KatManDEW

Dec 14, 2006, 10:26 PM

I ran a quick tach on the Hyperion 300 and the TP 480, with a Purpil Peril and a 8x4 DD prop. Both packs yielded right around 7100 RPM hot off the charger, and around 7000 RPM after a few seconds at full throttle.

I've been using micro Deans for a couple years. Only way to fly.

pmackenzie

Dec 17, 2006, 07:23 PM

FYI, HL has the 20 gram PQ 300 20C packs on sale.
3S is out of stock, but the 2S are going for $12.

( There is a banner at the top of the page)

Pat MacKenzie

KatManDEW

Dec 17, 2006, 09:26 PM

I ordered a 2s PQ 300 20C pack, a 2s Bad Dogs 360, and a 2s Etec 300 HD.

KatManDEW

Dec 21, 2006, 08:46 PM

I got the ETec 300 and Polyquest "Twenty" 300 packs. With stock wires shortened to two inches, and mini Deans connectors, the ETec is 19.14 grams, and the Polyquest is 21.01 grams.

The Polyquest has some plastic at the ends of the pack that are adding to the weight. Both packs, like the other packs in the ~300 mah range, are remarkably small physically, but the ETecs are amazingly tiny.

I'll get RPM figures when I get the other packs.

KatManDEW

Dec 22, 2006, 02:41 PM

Still haven't received the HXT pack or the Bad Dogs pack, but I tach'd the E-Tec and Polyquest. The Polyquest was similar to the others, at around 7100 hot off the charger, and ~7000 after a few seconds. The E-Tec was around 7000 hot off the charger, and 6900 after that. The E-Tec got noticably warm, quickly.

I got a little higher numbers with the Hyperion and Thunder Power this time, maybe because they have a couple cycles on them.

It will take a few cycles and some flight time on all of them before I make my decision, but so far the Polyquest looks like a front runner for power-to-weight in my mind.

Aio_1

Dec 22, 2006, 03:26 PM

I think the Polyquest "20" packs and Hyperion VX packs both use the same cells (correct me if you're sure I'm wrong!) and I've certainly found that the Hyperion VX300 cells hold voltage extremely well up to 6A thus providing excellent power to weight. It also gives me better confidence in their ability to handle 20C+. I don't take manufacturers claims at face value since they're often very optimistic but these cells do seem okay at 20C and I may even try them up towards 30C for short bursts.

Aidan

usedhippo

Dec 22, 2006, 06:58 PM

here is a picture of my gigantic battery. it is composed of 2 130 mah 10-12c cells. i have them soldered in paralel to keep the voltage at 3.7. it weighs approximatly 8 grams.

crossup

Dec 22, 2006, 10:04 PM

hehe, wrong weekend but here it is:
CustomCDR Billet Bullet 20MM wound 21t 26g Y- my first wind
GWS 10x4.7!!!! can you say torque roll? :)
BadDog 2S 460 mini Deans (oh yeah, JST pair as an adapter..probably .2v more drop-need to fix that) w/balancing plug on 1" lead, main leads 4" silicone, strapping tape, heat shrink etc 28g!!! ouch but in their defense, a PolyQuest 20C 3s400XP pack weights the same 40g these cells weight in a 3S config and thats without a balancing port on the PQ pak vs with port on BD and I would suppose 60mah more go time.

80 deg F 100' elevation
Astroflight Wattmeter
Globee Intellitach
Hot pack rest v = 8.32

Initial run approx 6.75A 7.35v 4600+ RPM ( 5 sec-15)
Steadies at 6.45A 7.1V 4460 RPM (20- 40 sec)
5.5 6.7v 4200 RPM after 60 sec
At this point it will go for a while but even though motor only gets to 100 deg F at flux ring(I'm afraid to IR temp the stator :D) and the pack is just starting to warm, its obviously a huge load to run continuously in a static mode.
In my application, a Ikarus YAK at 6.3oz hovering is at 1/2-2/3 stick, very strong initial punchouts but overall poor vertical speed. Same motor with 7x3.5 on 3 cell nearly rips the wings off vertical! yet takes a lot of throttle to hover.
Thats pretty much due to how the power comes on...the 2 cell delivers very flat, torquey power and the 3 cell is much "peakier" with the real zip right up near full stick. And yes I know that due to the way its propped, not the cell count.
As you might expect, with unloading, voltages stay much higher and hover power is there right to just a minute before the pack hits the "wall" which is usually around 375mah for me. I've done some KEWL tail slides flying the pack into the ground so to speak :D.
Also dont forget these packs like to warmup before giving up the good stuff, in the test above the pack isnt given a chance to develop that "bounce" . That effect is strong enough that one can get the same performence burst shown above a second time with even flatter(better)output.
BTW, this particular pack has at least 30 flights on it and started life with its first discharge to 2.5v/cell. Think that hurt it? well maybe but it consistantly out performs its sister packs which were gently cycled the first three discharges.
My recommendation with these cells: run 2 cell apps at 15C max cause you spend more time at higher throttle settings and 3 cell apps at 25C max

Looking forward to see how Katmandew's 360's test out...

I'll try to womp up some test info this weekend.

KatManDEW

Dec 22, 2006, 11:38 PM

here is a picture of my gigantic battery

I have a two cell 130mah pack for my Micro Yak (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=607122&pp=15), but it's wired in series. I have a 160mah and 220mah on order to try with the µYak.

Great report crossup. I need to fix my watt meter so I can get some electrodical info with my RPM tests.

crossup

Dec 23, 2006, 08:46 AM

Thanks KatManDew, just wish it were a little more pertainent. But I dont have reasonable access to any indoor site so I fly what I call outdoor F3A/3D and therefore have gear for that. But I'm working my way down with foamies- started with a 10+oz GP Flatout Extra(read overpowered brick) now flying a 2 cell IKARUS YAK at 6oz and a larger sub 10 oz. 400"sq Jimmie Wade bipe and headed for 4oz next
However, I just received my Eflite Park 250 motor so now I at least have a decent F3A motor to test with. Guess I need to order some 360 paks. Only other problem is what to build... after seeing Jeff Pfier's IKARUS F3A all tricked out, I'm tempted to finish mine. Then again I could do a Bling Bling...

KatManDEW

Dec 23, 2006, 01:50 PM

still4given

Dec 23, 2006, 03:50 PM

I got the HXT pack. It's a pig. 27.06 grams with balancing connector and no ESC connector.

Which IKARUS F3A is Jeff Pfier's? The 4 ounce one with Mighty Midget motor?

I really like my F3A's. They're real popular where I fly indoors.

Which HXT pack did you buy? Is it this one? (https://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2134) They claim 19g. When you say no ESC connector, are you talking about a JST plug? I always swap those out for micro Deans anyway. I have these (https://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2096) and these (https://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2051) and these (https://www.unitedhobbies.com/UNITEDHOBBIES/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=2050) and these (http://) and they all weigh what they were advertised to weigh. I wonder why that one is heavier?