Springer Class R/c Boats [Archive]

boater_5026

May 26, 2006, 10:52 PM

The North West R/C Ship Modelers - Home of the Original Springer
Home Page:
http://nwrcsm.freeyellow.com/

Springer Plan:
http://nwrcsm.freeyellow.com/springer.PDF

Building a Springer:
http://nwrcsm.freeyellow.com/BuildingSpringer.pdf

Story Behind the Springer:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5534985&postcount=10
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6006767&postcount=48

The San Francisco Model Yacht Club - Springer Class "Limited" Plans & Info
Home Page:
http://sfmyc.org/

Springer Examples:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6125097&postcount=98

Springer Plans:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6127002&postcount=99
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6128077&postcount=101
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6135072&postcount=106

Springer Notes:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9992032&postcount=4165

Umi_Ryuzuki

May 26, 2006, 11:09 PM

Hey those are my pics... well a few of them anyway. :rolleyes: :p

Which pond is that with all the rocks in it?
It looks like a challenging place to sail?

:D
.
.
.
Quickie instructions for construction... (http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12453789&postcount=3) :)
.
.
.

Aerominded

May 26, 2006, 11:10 PM

straty

May 27, 2006, 06:41 AM

why are they called springers

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:08 AM

Hey those are my pics... well a few of them anyway. :rolleyes: :p

Which pond is that with all the rocks in it?
It looks like a challenging place to sail?

:D

Hey Umi_Ryuzuki, I just wanted to put the pictures and information all in one place so it would be easy for people to find out about these great little boats.

Which pond is that with all the rocks in it? Wish I knew, I think it is somewhere in Washington. The North West R/c Ship Modelers, they are the people that came up with the Springer design. Their website is The North West R/c Ship Modelers (http://nwrcsm.freeyellow.com/index.html)

It looks like a challenging place to sail? Yes it sure does look like a challenging place to sail, even more challenging with a barge or two. But the way the Springer boats are built I'm sure they could handle a hit or two on the rocks.

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:17 AM

Nice pictures!!! I'm going to have to add a Springer to the list! They are popular in my club (SFMYC) with lots of Springer events on the calendar... I'm going to have to join the fun! :)

I really like the looks of the one in "Photo 26" do drawings for that superstructure exist / are they available?

also, really like the looks of the fuel dock in "photo 27"! :) D'oh! forgot the name of the boat! "Ink-something"! :o

Hello Aerominded, all the credit needs to be given to the the North West R/c Ship Modelers. They are the people I got these pictures from, they also are the ones that came up with these great boats. The best part about these boats they are easy to build too.

I really like the looks of the one in "Photo 26" do drawings for that superstructure exist / are they available? Yes that is a good looking boat as for drawings for the superstructure I dont know if they exist.

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:21 AM

why are they called springers

From what I understand they are named after these people, I dont know the story behind it. But if someone does know the story about how these boats came to be please share it with the rest of us.

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:37 AM

Here is a starting point for designing the superstructure. :)

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:38 AM

Another design.

boater_5026

May 27, 2006, 09:41 AM

Another design I found.

LtDoc

May 27, 2006, 11:03 AM

Looks very much like a boat 'Uncle Sam' came up with in WWII.
- 'Doc

Chrysler tug boat, USN.

Aerominded

May 27, 2006, 02:25 PM

Thanks for the starting point on the super structure Boater! the drawings and illustration will be very useful!

What thickness of wood is typically used on these models? Pictures look like the hulls are @ 3/8" pine sides with 1/8" plywood bottoms?

Also what can be said about the 1:1 tugs? they look like maybe they are utility types used mainly around the docks?

Thanks! :)

jerryj98501

May 27, 2006, 04:17 PM

The pond with the rocks looks like the pond in Spokane that the Spokane group uses. I think it is in front of a Public Utilities Building, I remember competing in the Tidewater Cup there. Yes it is interesting navagating the course with rocks to watch out for also. Jerry J

boater_5026

Jun 10, 2006, 01:39 PM

2 more photos.

boater_5026

Jun 10, 2006, 01:52 PM

The hull sides are 1/2" or 3/4" material. Not real critical. Just make sure it is beefy enough to anchor some bits on the deck.

The bottom is 1/8" doorskin.

The skeg is 1/2" or 3/8 depends on the shaft tube you use. It is attach to the bottom of the hull with epoxy and couple of screws from inside the hull.

If you want you can add the deck curve it is about 1/2".

green-boat

Jun 10, 2006, 02:52 PM

The crane on the barge in the second picture, was that scratchbuilt or was it a kit.

Aerominded

Jun 10, 2006, 07:03 PM

Thanks Boater!!! :)

remondo

Aug 19, 2006, 08:34 PM

hey these things look fun! just found this thread and those tugs look real simple to build, I may have a go at one myself and customise it to my liking.

keith S

Aug 20, 2006, 10:04 AM

green-boate Photo is at Bellevue, WA ( home of the original Springers). The barge is scratch built.
remondo They are a lot of fun. Kind of equivilent to stock car racing with everyone on an even keel as it were!

boater_5026

Aug 21, 2006, 02:40 PM

6 volt motor battery.

Single shaft drive (no Kort nozzles).

3 bladed prop, max diameter 40 mm.

Single rudder, max 4 sq", single piece design
(salmon tail allowed).

Minimum weight of 8 1/2 lbs.

Push kness at least 2 1/2" high (above the deck)
mounted on the bow at 7" centers.

Removable spring type door stops on each push
knee no higher than deck level.

1" long 3/32 brass tube centered on rear edge of
the stern to hold a 1/16" wire for the ID flag.

der kapitan

Aug 27, 2006, 08:36 PM

boater5026 said:

6 volt motor battery.

Single shaft drive (no Kort nozzles).

3 bladed prop, max diameter 40 mm.

Single rudder, max 4 sq", single piece design
(salmon tail allowed).

Minimum weight of 8 1/2 lbs.

Push kness at least 2 1/2" high (above the deck)
mounted on the bow at 7" centers.

Removable spring type door stops on each push
knee no higher than deck level.

1" long 3/32 brass tube centered on rear edge of
the stern to hold a 1/16" wire for the ID flag.

Hi Boater,

I heard mention of these Springer tugs from an older gent living somewhere near the San Francisco area, who visited me this summer. He left me a club schedule, and indeed there were a lot of Springer events.Today was my first venture into Dock Talk, and there was a big thread on these tugs.

The concept is really neat, a one-design contest tug, easily built and rigged
with a budget in mind. And the top can be as pretty or as ugly as one wishes.I think I might do one in fiberglass, as the rules don't say that they HAVE to be wood.

A question though, what's the thing with the spring door stops, what do they do? I couldn't figure what they're for.

Before I start on one, is there anything more that I need to know?

JayElTee

Aug 30, 2006, 04:13 PM

Der Kapitan mentioned that he ran across more Springer info on Dock Talk.
I'm a real newby around here and I'm interested in Springers. Where/what is dock talk? Who would like to talk some more about these neat little one-class tugs.

How big is the optimum 6-volt motor? Can someone recommend a brand? Does this boat require just a two-channel radio?

What is the thickness of the sides of something like this? What sort of wood is good for the bottom? The superstructure should be a lot of fun to design and build -- there are a lot of photos on this forum so suggestions abound.

I'm going to be house-bound for a few weeks (surgery, not house arrest :-) ) so I'll have some time to do something beside surf the net.

Thanks for any info anyone would like to provide.

Be well, all,

John Terrell

der kapitan

Aug 30, 2006, 08:04 PM

JayElTee said:

Der Kapitan mentioned that he ran across more Springer info on Dock Talk.
I'm a real newby around here and I'm interested in Springers. Where/what is dock talk? Who would like to talk some more about these neat little one-class tugs.

How big is the optimum 6-volt motor? Can someone recommend a brand? Does this boat require just a two-channel radio?

What is the thickness of the sides of something like this? What sort of wood is good for the bottom? The superstructure should be a lot of fun to design and build -- there are a lot of photos on this forum so suggestions abound.

I'm going to be house-bound for a few weeks (surgery, not house arrest :-) ) so I'll have some time to do something beside surf the net.

John Terrell

Hi John,

I've only been surfing the RC Groups forum for a short time, So I'm a bit short on answers for you.

Dock Talk is the forum that you're presently on. Another one is Scale Boats,
which you can switch to by clicking on that title at the top of the page.

I had been on the Scale Boats forum, and stumbled upon Dock Talk by accident a few days ago.

The springer tug is what is currently attracting my interest, and I'm still gathering information on what it takes to build one. Apparently, all of the
information is here on these pages, all we need to do is dig for the data.

remondo

Aug 31, 2006, 02:11 PM

Have you seen the pdf files previously posted in this forum. My next build will be a springer, they look real fun! I will use it as a rescue boat probably but also just use it for messing about with.

-Remi

der kapitan

Aug 31, 2006, 02:29 PM

remondo said:

Have you seen the pdf files previously posted in this forum. My next build will be a springer, they look real fun! I will use it as a rescue boat probably but also just use it for messing about with.

Remi

Hi Remi,

Yes, I saw the pdf's, but got better printouts from some images that
Umi Ryuzuki had posted. Using them, I've made a full-size profile pattern
from which I'll make a plug, and fabricate a fiberglass mold off of it.

I already have a workboat-type hull that is used to rescue the model
yacht guys when they sail too close toward sunset. That's when the wind dies, and leaves them out in the middle of the pond.

Like you said, a perfect boat to mess about with, or start a one-design class for club fun---.

keith S

Aug 31, 2006, 02:51 PM

The spring door stops are used by those playing polo/soccer with the tugs. They help hold the ball in place and prevent any serious damage to the other boats. ;) :rolleyes:
As far as the sides go, some use 3/8th " solid wood ( pine or other cheap/lite variety) or ply of varrious thickness. Easy to build and even funner to play with. They make great rescue boats with the flat fronts they get a hold of a stranded vessel quite well. Used mine to rescue a merchant vessel in Canada last year when all the "big" tugs couldn't get the job done! :D

Jameso5

Aug 31, 2006, 06:25 PM

I too got hooked on these things about a month ago. They are simple to build and cheap if you have stuff laying around. Ater building the large one I had to have one for the pool. The small one uses the guts out of an old 1\4 scale servo.
Jim

Umi_Ryuzuki

Aug 31, 2006, 07:43 PM

You guys have to remember, that the competitions for both the springer, and polo tugs rely on the specifications being followed, and that all the tugs are practically the same. If you soup them up, they won't qualify for the events that were designed around them.

;)

Aerominded

Aug 31, 2006, 08:01 PM

Nice looking Springer, James!

still on my build list!

As mentioned above, the SFMYC has an active schedule for the Springers (in San Francisco)... Nice folks running them too- I hope to join the Springer fun soon!

:)

Jameso5

Sep 01, 2006, 03:30 PM

Thanks, Aerominded

I built mine for fun use, but maybe I can get some intrest in the local club and start a springer class. Maybe I can get greeseaships (aka: cardboard man) as he is in my area to build one out of cardboard, what a challange!

der kapitan: Let us now how that fiberglass mold comes out.

patmat2350

Sep 01, 2006, 03:51 PM

Got me a Springer on the ways now... built the hull last night, deck today, will 'glass it over. Gotta demo it for the club 1 week from now!

Pat M

der kapitan

Sep 01, 2006, 06:52 PM

Jameso5 said:"

Thanks, Aerominded

I built mine for fun use, but maybe I can get some intrest in the local club and start a springer class. Maybe I can get greeseaships (aka: cardboard man) as he is in my area to build one out of cardboard, what a challange!

der kapitan: Let us now how that fiberglass mold comes out."

Hi James,

Our club meeting is tomorrow night, and I'm going to run the concept past the members and see what happens. I know that at least four or more would go for it, whether I made a glass hull or not.

At the moment, I have the hull pattern on my desk, and if I get time, I'll cut
out some clear pine to start a plug. It looks like there is plenty of interest in this forum alone, so it's a go anyway.

It's reassuring that Pat could whack out the basics in one evening with no
problems. And he's a very busy guy---.

patmat2350

Sep 01, 2006, 08:05 PM

Just a matter of priorities Karl! (and I got those pre-nups in the bag too).

Here's the status for tonight.

Sides are cut per plan from 3/16" luan ply.
Bottom is 3/32" balsa (this is all extra stuff lying around).
Since the balsa is kind of weak, I have braces inside.
Deck is 1/8" Masonite with more ribs... note bracket to mount servo UNDER deck. Stringers inside hull set the deck flush, no bulwarks on this one. Deck will get glassed to save the Masonite.
Stuffing tube is plain brass sandwiched into the skeg. Skeg is screw mounted to bottom, and reinforced with fiberglass.
First layer of glass is on the bottom, nice easy surface!

Pat M

der kapitan

Sep 01, 2006, 10:14 PM

patmat2350 said:

"Just a matter of priorities Karl! (and I got those pre-nups in the bag too).

Here's the status for tonight.

Sides are cut per plan from 3/16" luan ply.
Bottom is 3/32" balsa (this is all extra stuff lying around).
Since the balsa is kind of weak, I have braces inside.
Deck is 1/8" Masonite with more ribs... note bracket to mount servo UNDER deck. Stringers inside hull set the deck flush, no bulwarks on this one. Deck will get glassed to save the Masonite.
Stuffing tube is plain brass sandwiched into the skeg. Skeg is screw mounted to bottom, and reinforced with fiberglass.
First layer of glass is on the bottom, nice easy surface!"

Hi Pat,

You make it look so easy that you may fool some guys reading this forum into tackling it.

I guess the name of the game is to use what's laying loose around the shop, and have at it. A lot of potential fun for not a lot of money---.

patmat2350

Sep 01, 2006, 11:23 PM

HEY!
In post #3 in this thread, see the radio behind the Springer with the flag?
What is that thing, and how come it has FOUR sticks?
(looks like a JR 6 channel)

PM

green-boat

Sep 01, 2006, 11:34 PM

Good eye!!!!!!!!

keith S

Sep 01, 2006, 11:54 PM

It is a modified Spektrum radio used to run the "Mustang", a twin screw tug built by Mel Suzle of NW R/C Ship Modelers. The radio is a conversion that Mel did him self.

patmat2350

Sep 02, 2006, 12:05 AM

OK Keith, you're not getting off that easy... would this be the unit Umi was referring to in another thread? And we HAVE to know, just how did he do it?

keith S

Sep 02, 2006, 12:14 AM

Yes it is and you would have to ask Mel just how he did that. He is an electronics person and likes to do that kind of thing.

der kapitan

Sep 02, 2006, 11:44 AM

Amazing what people can come up with when they have the know-how, but as for me,
I have enough trouble handling just TWO sticks---.

Umi_Ryuzuki

Sep 02, 2006, 12:06 PM

OK Keith, you're not getting off that easy... would this be the unit Umi was referring to in another thread? And we HAVE to know, just how did he do it?

It is, and it isn't...
Mine only has one side modified for dual sticks... :cool:

Mel removes, and replaces the gimbles with two custom made gimbles and centering pin, and he also adds a center support between the new gimbles. He then adds "futaba" style spring plates to return the sticks to center. Most of the mod is physical.
The only real electronic mod, if it can be considered electronic, is moving the potentiometer from the bottom of the gimble box to the side, and wiring it back to the trim board.

Like Cliff Shaw, who originally did mine, Mel says he isn't doing this for other people. :(

Kmot

Sep 02, 2006, 12:51 PM

Like Cliff Shaw, who originally did mine, Mel says he isn't doing this for other people.

Interesting. It is too bad. Sounds like an easy conversion for someone who is in the know, and an easy way to make hobby bucks because there are lots of people who would pay to have this work done.

Oh well! :p

Aerominded

Sep 02, 2006, 02:47 PM

Yep, I'm still looking for my next boat radio and would love for it to be set up with the twin stick... :rolleyes:

thecontinental

Sep 02, 2006, 03:35 PM

why are they called springers

Because they are named after a handsome fellow who built the originals (me).

thecontinental

Sep 02, 2006, 03:37 PM

From what I understand they are named after these people, I dont know the story behind it. But if someone does know the story about how these boats came to be please share it with the rest of us.

That's my mom, my dad and my sister at what looks like Bellevue pond several years ago. Basically the story is that a bunch of guys in my club (NWRCSM) wanted to built scratch but didn't have the means. So my dad and I cut out some "kit" pieces and gave them at at meetings. Apparently they've really taken off since I've been out of the hobby :eek: In fact in the first few pictures you see the one that is black hulled, white house with twin stacks? I built that and sold it it Tom Stevens of NWRCSM who painted it and repowered it. The actually ORIGINAL boat itself is in my dad's storage unit collecting dust in Seattle, it's based off a tug he had back in the 60's or 70's named the Ellrington.

der kapitan

Sep 02, 2006, 03:44 PM

Massey

Sep 02, 2006, 03:53 PM

I think that I am going to build one as well. Maybe I could get my club guys to build one too so we can do springer contests.

Massey

thecontinental

Sep 02, 2006, 03:57 PM

thecontinental said:

"That's my mom, my dad and my sister at what looks like Bellevue pond several years ago. Basically the story is that a bunch of guys in my club (NWRCSM) wanted to built scratch but didn't have the means. So my dad and I cut out some "kit" pieces and gave them out at meetings. Apparently they've really taken off since I've been out of the hobby :eek: In fact in the first few pictures you see the one that is black hulled, white house with twin stacks? I built that and sold it it Tom Stevens of NWRCSM who painted it and repowered it. The actually ORIGINAL boat itself is in my dad's storage unit collecting dust in Seattle, it's based off a tug he had back in the 60's or 70's named the Ellrington."

Hi all,

So now we know.

Yup. I suspect Keith S. is a guy I remember from NWRCSM and if so he can verify this. I just can't believe all you guys have them now and like them, that's fantastic :eek: Also, I think I saw somebody say the SF model yacht club has competitions with these, if they read this, were are these meets? I am in school in the Bay Area and I'd like to check it out. All my boats are in storage back in Seattle as I don't have time for them but someday I'd like to break them out again.

patmat2350

Sep 02, 2006, 05:13 PM

Contact Ken Valk at the SFMYC, he knows all about the action!
kenvalk at pacbell.net

Pat Matthews

patmat2350

Sep 02, 2006, 09:53 PM

Day 3:
Progress slow... pre-nups include yard duty for me. But still managed to attach deck, glass everything (ready for final sanding!), and built deck house. In the spirit of Springer Simplicity, windows and doors will be painted on.

Pat M

Aerominded

Sep 02, 2006, 09:56 PM

Aerominded

Sep 02, 2006, 09:58 PM

Looking great Pat!

patmat2350

Sep 02, 2006, 10:00 PM

I just heard that Wood Boats on Parade is canceled, due to insufficient resources (event organizing)... better check with Ken Valk.

Pat M

p.s., Thanks!

thecontinental

Sep 02, 2006, 10:18 PM

Yep, the SFMYC is on Spreckles Lake in Golden Gate Park... I'm not sure when the next Springer event is going to be but if you are in the SF Bay Area, be sure to stop by on Saturday Oct 28 between 9 and 5 and check out "Wooden Boats on Parade V" - the RC wooden sail and powerboat display and parade...

(sorry didn't mean to hijack the thread! :o I'm sure there will be wooden springers there!!! :) )

Yeah I'm in the city from time to time as well as work out of Alameda, so I'd like to check that out. I enjoyed the time I spent building models, but I just plain don't have the time anymore unfortunatly.

Aerominded

Sep 02, 2006, 10:24 PM

I hope it wasn't cancelled... :confused: showed up in the latest "Nautical News" (the newsletter of the SFMYC) that I recieved just this week in the mail...

Aerominded

Sep 02, 2006, 10:36 PM

thecontinental

Sep 03, 2006, 12:20 AM

Ahh, here it is in the Sept issue of the Nautical News:

Sunday 9/3 at 0920 "second Springer contest"
Sunday 9/24 at 0900 "third Springer contest"

two Springer events in 1 month and I think this is fairly typical of the SF Springer fleet's activity level...

I HAVE TO BUILD ONE!!! :)

Yeah I just checked their website then emailed the commodore to see if it was alright if I stopped by for the 24th. I just wish I had some of my boats down here! :D

patmat2350

Sep 04, 2006, 09:10 PM

Day 4: Yard work all day. Doesn't the woman know the meaning of the Sabbath??
Day 5: Making up for lost time. Mostly just painted today, but still more to do (can you believe there was no blue paint in my whole house?)

Pat M

Aerominded

Sep 04, 2006, 10:19 PM

Humm, looking a lot like a Coastie scheme, Pat! ;)

Soclarke

Sep 13, 2006, 01:54 PM

Hey Patmat,

Looks great! Have any updates for us?

Can you tell me a bit about the power system you've chosen?

****************
Happy Landings
Scott

patmat2350

Sep 14, 2006, 06:47 AM

Sure. I have two 6v packs made of full C-size NiMH cells, nice ballast.
Motor is the 600 out of a Bristol Bay mounted to an old MFA Como "Olympus" belt drive, about 3:1 iirc. Drives a 35mm plastic prop, a little less than the 1.5" diameter allowed. Boat goes nicely, but no rocket... less reduction might be good.
Only drove it a short bit last weekend, appear to have had an ESC incident... :mad:

Pat M

Spader

Sep 14, 2006, 08:48 AM

Well, it seems that I just found new boat for my brand new equipement. It looks like great first wooden boat project!

Spader

Sep 15, 2006, 04:18 AM

My contribution, curve values converted in centimeters, for us europeans. :D

P.S. It is XLS file, so, when downloaded, rename extension to xls. :rolleyes:
(It wouldn't go up otherwise). :(

BrianRickman

Sep 18, 2006, 10:37 AM

I started building a Springer on Friday night. I have the hull done now (including paint), and a good start on the deck. This thing really goes together fast. Mine won't be competition legal because I'm going to power it with a pair of paddle wheels, but that's OK. This is a just-for-fun project to run in the pond near where I work. I'll post some pictures once I get the paddle wheels made up as that's the only really unique part of my build.

Spader

Sep 19, 2006, 07:49 AM

I am starting this evening. We got large wood shop here that cut to size, so I bought 12mm ply for sides, 2mm balsa for bottom, I maybe add some reinforcement here. Since it is cut to size I only need to cut out curvature. :)

jerryj98501

Sep 19, 2006, 03:21 PM

Brian, Are you going to make it a side paddler or stern with a split wheel? Keep us informed as it is an interesting idea for an entry boat that will be a little different. Jerry J

BrianRickman

Sep 19, 2006, 03:49 PM

It will be a side paddler. That way I can turn it by running the two motors at different speeds. I will do that via an elevon mixer and a pair of ESCs. This appeals to me as it means the only moving parts inside the boat will be the motors; no servos or linkage to adjust.

The motors will be GWS EPS-100s. These are Speed 280 motors with gear boxes. Currently on sale at http://bphobbies.com for about $7 each. I'm expecting that each motor will pull about 2 amps at full throttle. I will change the size and/or number of paddles until the boat runs nicely without overheating the motors.

I will use a six cell 3000 Mah NIMH RC car battery for power (about $20). Should be able to run for at least 45 minutes per charge, probably much longer then that at scale-like reduced throttle settings.

The motors, battery, and radio have all been ordered. I'm hoping they will arrive by this weekend.

Aerominded

Sep 19, 2006, 07:12 PM

I am about to make some templates for cutting the sides of my Springer hull and need some clarification on how the boats are measured (I don't want to have a Springer that doesn't pass measurement! :eek: )

On sheet 2 of 2 of the plans above, there are measurments at 1" stations and a comment that says 'Hull "Side Profile" Requirement' but, on the same sheet, it suggests that the 1" stations are "typical" and also states that the dimensions at each station are "typical"...

"Typical" to me means that there is some range in the measurements... is this they way the Springer rule is generally interpreted? the implication that the hull can be less than 18" also makes the hull side profile "requirement" a little 'soft'. Are the boats measured with a template or do they just have to look right and not exceed the max length and beam measurements?

Not trying to be nit-picky, just want to make sure I build a "Springer"! :)

Thanks!

patmat2350

Sep 19, 2006, 07:39 PM

I can just see the officials using a profile gage on each Springer, to make sure no NASCAR style cheatin' is going on!
But "typical" on a drawing doesn't say anything about tolerance, it is shorthand for "repeat as necessary". Like showing a 1" spacing ONCE, then saying "typical" means every other frame is spaced the same.
Pat M

Aerominded

Sep 19, 2006, 07:54 PM

Got it, that makes good sense! :) so your's is per the drawings, 18", etc.?

Thanks Pat!

JayElTee

Sep 20, 2006, 02:32 PM

I recently wrote to the current president of the San Francisco Model Yachting Association (home of the Springer) requesting some info.

Here's what I sent:

"I've been poking around the net, gathering up all the info I can find on your one-class Springer.

A look at your web site suggests that Ken Reilly is the fellow I should be speaking with but there wasn't an email address provided for Ken. Maybe you could pass this on to him?

My interest in the Springer is that it looks buildable, adaptable to a whole lot of topside modifications, and it's NEW! Well, new to us, at any rate.

I've seen the plans and the rules published with the plans. I've also seen other remarks about the boat, "8.5 pound weight limit," etc. One account suggests that door bumpers have to be added for a certain purpose and there seems to be general confusion as to what the "real deal" could be.

Some of us here in the Hudson River Valley are interested in playing in your game but, before a whole bunch of organizations develop a whole bunch of parameters surrounding these little boats, it would be good to know who has the real (or original) set of rules outlining the Springer Class Boats.

I'd appreciate a copy that I might be able to share with some of my friends and in certain places (HobbyLobby Dock Talk) online.

I've begun building my Springer and am looking forward to having a good time with that fun-looking boat -- whether I learn what the rules are or not. I respect what you folks have gotten underweigh out there and would like to help keep it as clean as possible as the interest in the boat moves across the country."

Jim Forbes wrote back and told me he'd pass my request along to Ken Reilly who handles this sort of stuff. As soon as I hear from Ken I'll pass any new info along to the rest of you Springer fans.

Fair winds,

John Terrell

der kapitan

Sep 20, 2006, 03:30 PM

JayElTee said:

"I recently wrote to the current president of the San Francisco Model Yachting Association (home of the Springer) requesting some info.

Jim Forbes wrote back and told me he'd pass my request along to Ken Reilly who handles this sort of stuff. As soon as I hear from Ken I'll pass any new info along to the rest of you Springer fans."

Hi John,

I've been following this thread for some time, gathering information as it comes up on the springers, probably just like the rest of those interested parties.

In reading your note, the mention of "Ken Reilly" set off all kinds of bells and lights here.

Back in April, I did some business with him, and he sent me a box of what I assumed to be photos and videos. The box was put on the coffee table in my library, and sort of forgotten, as there was a lot of work in front of me already.

It was consigned to leisurely viewing later- that is, until an hour or so ago.

I opened the box, took out the photos and two VCR's and noticed something underneath. At the bottom was a full-size detailed drawing of a springer tug,
complete with running gear, deck fittings, and about seven suggested cabin and deck layouts. Also a copy of the rules, etc.

So all of this has been under my nose since April---.

JayElTee

Sep 20, 2006, 06:57 PM

Wow! You were sitting on a bunch of pretty good stuff it would seem.

Any chance we could share some of those goodies? Of course, I'd be more than willing to reimburse you for copying and shipping expenses. Could be some fun.

Chat with you soon.

Fair winds,

John Terrell

Aerominded

Sep 20, 2006, 07:24 PM

What are most people using for running gear/ propellors / batteries / Etc on these? looking for 'off the shelf' suggestions. :)

Thanks!

der kapitan

Sep 20, 2006, 08:17 PM

JayElTee said:

'Wow! You were sitting on a bunch of pretty good stuff it would seem.

Any chance we could share some of those goodies? Of course, I'd be more than willing to reimburse you for copying and shipping expenses. Could be some fun."

Hi John,

Yeah, I feel a little sheepish about it, too. Ken Reilly doesn't have a computer at the moment, so I phoned him to extend a thank-you. He said that I should feel free to distribute the drawing, etc, to anyone who has an interest in the Springers.

The plan consists of two 24" x 36" sheets, the first being a plan & profile, and
general arrangement of the running gear. The second is a set of templates to build the hull, mounts, equipment trays, etc. Pretty decently drawn, too. Then there are some 8 1/2" x 11" sheets, which have more details, and about
a dozen different suggested cabin profiles. I previously said there were seven,
so I miscounted.

All in all, a pretty handy batch of stuff. I'll try to get some prices on the copywork and shipping during the next several days. If interested, contact me offline.

boater_5026

Sep 21, 2006, 12:20 AM

der kapitan said:

The plan consists of two 24" x 36" sheets, the first being a plan & profile, and
general arrangement of the running gear. The second is a set of templates to build the hull, mounts, equipment trays, etc. Pretty decently drawn, too. Then there are some 8 1/2" x 11" sheets, which have more details, and about
a dozen different suggested cabin profiles. I previously said there were seven,
so I miscounted.

All in all, a pretty handy batch of stuff. I'll try to get some prices on the copywork and shipping during the next several days. If interested, contact me offline.

Hi der kapitan,

Just a suggestion, you might want to consider having all the documents scanned and make them available online. This would be better than having to deal with the hassles of copywork and shipping. Also the information would be easily obtainable to anyone who would like to build a Springer Boat. :D

der kapitan

Sep 21, 2006, 08:16 AM

boater_5026 said:

"Just a suggestion, you might want to consider having all the documents scanned and make them available online. This would be better than having to deal with the hassles of copywork and shipping. Also the information would be easily obtainable to anyone who would like to build a Springer Boat."

Hi Boater,

Scanning the large drawings requires taking them to a shop that can do them. While there is a place in my area than can do the work, this kind of stuff isn't free. I don't want to be stuck with the bill for someone else's convenience, and neither would you.

As what I have here is basically elective information, I can't see many of the guys out there clamoring for stuff that they have already downloaded. They
seem to have been happily building their boats with little or no trouble without
it anyway.

Spader

Sep 21, 2006, 08:50 AM

I didn't see any problem with that plan already here, and I even had to convert measures to metric system. Although, beginner like me will always encounter some problems. :)

keith S

Sep 21, 2006, 12:14 PM

For those who have not tried this yet, go to the NW R/C Ship Modelers site (home of the original Springers) www.shipmodelers.com and click on the Springers plan link. You can always copy from there.

boater_5026

Sep 21, 2006, 03:33 PM

Scanning the large drawings requires taking them to a shop that can do them. While there is a place in my area than can do the work, this kind of stuff isn't free. I don't want to be stuck with the bill for someone else's convenience, and neither would you.

As what I have here is basically elective information, I can't see many of the guys out there clamoring for stuff that they have already downloaded. They
seem to have been happily building their boats with little or no trouble without
it anyway.

Hi der kapitan,

Can you scan the 8 1/2" x 11" sheets which have details about the different cabin profiles? And send them to people by e-mail.

der kapitan

Sep 21, 2006, 05:05 PM

boater_5026 said:

"Hi der kapitan,

Can you scan the 8 1/2" x 11" sheets which have details about the different cabin profiles? And send them to people by e-mail."

Hi Boater,

Yes I think I can. I have a flatbed scanner, and I'll see if I can get them down to a size that'll not take forever to download.

I'm not exactly an expert in manipulating these things, but will give it a try tonight. Right now, I have to start supper, as whoever gets home first, has
to cook. And as I work from home---.

rlboats2003

Sep 22, 2006, 08:07 AM

Der Kapatian

If you want ,I could stop over pick up the 8.5 * 11 and get them scanned at work. The Kinko's that I made the group of prints for you can scan large drawings in preperation to copy at 1:1 or any reduction or increase the only limit is the paper size. I just need to find out if that scan can be made into a cd or put on a 1 gig flash drive. The best would be to reduce the scan to 8.5 *11 that way these could be made into 8.5*11 print out and then identify a mangnification ratio so that others could take the electronic or a photocopy into Kinko style store and punch in the increase. Similiar to what Payson did in his boat building books.

If you trust me to borrow them for about a 24 hour period I should be able to make something happen. That is a large dawing for an 18 * 8 hull unless he is showing a fully built up springer with superstructure.

Then it just addition to the thread.

Having Fun In WNY,
Rich

der kapitan

Sep 22, 2006, 01:06 PM

rlboats2003 said:

"If you trust me to borrow them for about a 24 hour period I should be able to make something happen. That is a large dawing for an 18 x 8 hull unless he is showing a fully built up springer with superstructure."

Hi Rich,

Feel free to borrow them.

I already went down to Kinko's and had some top sheets done. I elected to not copy the second plan sheet, as it is templates, and thus basically a repetition of what's on the first sheet.

I scanned the 8 1/2 x 11's with no problem, but couldn't shrink them into a
downloadable size. What I got would take over ten minutes to download per
sheet.

If you have resources at your office to get this stuff up onto the net for the benefit of these other guys, please do so.

Of course I trust you Rich, I still have your footie sailboat data---.

rlboats2003

Sep 22, 2006, 02:00 PM

Der Kapatian

We have a new photocopier that scans a picture and turns it in to a PDF file that is internet friendly for sending. The 8.5 * 11 will be a piece of cake. I was at kinko's today on company business and discused the digital scanner used in the process for print enlargement. It can be off loaded after the scan, while the copy is being made, There were no "digitial dudes" there when I was there to discuss median required for capture, I will call about that. Will call you over the weekend about borrowing the info. Should be able to get the 8.5*11 up quickly, the two larger ones I need some guidance on.

Have a fun Friday,
Rich

Umi_Ryuzuki

Sep 22, 2006, 02:26 PM

Editing images for launching rigs, I noticed I had an image of another springer... :p

Aerominded

Sep 22, 2006, 02:33 PM

Hee hee, some of those Springers are just plain silly! :p ;)

der kapitan

Sep 22, 2006, 04:48 PM

Aerominded said:

"Hee hee, some of those Springers are just plain silly!"

Hi Aero,

Yes, that was certainly a "magic Garden" all right. Somewhere in this thread,
there is a Springer with an outhouse superstructure.

Aerominded

Sep 22, 2006, 04:55 PM

Yep, saw that one and there is a picture of one with a hot tub too! too funny! Just goes to show what a fun group Springer drivers are! I'm going to try to buy the lumber for mine this weekend! :)

Aerominded

Sep 23, 2006, 10:11 PM

No thoughts on motor, gear box, ESC, prop combinations on the Springer?

Better to go with a bigger motor like Pat M. on 6 volts or something like a geared SP 400?

Looking for torque and duration...

I hopefully will be cutting wood and glueing up the hull tomorrow! :)

Boatfox

Sep 24, 2006, 01:07 AM

What are most people using for running gear/ propellors / batteries / Etc on these? looking for 'off the shelf' suggestions. :)

No thoughts on motor, gear box, ESC, prop combinations on the Springer?
Better to go with a bigger motor like Pat M. on 6 volts or something like a geared SP 400?
Looking for torque and duration...
I hopefully will be cutting wood and glueing up the hull tomorrow!

Thanks!

If you are trying to build a "springer" then you must use a standard
Single shaft drive (no Kort nozzles).

3 bladed prop, max diameter 1 1/2" (40 mm.)

Single flat rudder, max 4 sq", single piece design
(salmon tail allowed).

Minimum weight of 8 1/2 lbs.

I could be wrong, but I thought they wanted a ROAR legal can motor...Maybe I imagined that. Anyone know for sure?
The ESC can be whatever you want.
If you are building a Springer "style" boat...then anything goes.

der kapitan

Sep 24, 2006, 11:06 AM

Boatfox said:

"I could be wrong, but I thought they wanted a ROAR legal can motor...Maybe I imagined that. Anyone know for sure?
The ESC can be whatever you want.
If you are building a Springer "style" boat...then anything goes."

Hi Boatfox,

In sorting through the Springer rules, just about everthing is spelled out in no uncertain terms. However, you're right on the drive train. I haven't seen any specifics on what motor is or isn't allowed.

I suppose the max of six volts would kinda limit the use of a hot-wound motor
being installed, as run time, cooling, etc. would be affected.

Aerominded

Sep 24, 2006, 05:06 PM

Yea, I want a 'true' Springer so I can participate in the events... :) there were a couple of them at the recent tug regatta in S.F. but I didn't think to ask the guys there what they had under the hood! :rolleyes:

I understand the rules about prop size and voltage limits, etc... I just don't know about the best motor/gearbox combination produces the best results with those constraints! :)

By the way, what is a salmon tail? Is that a 'wedge' along the trailing edge of the rudder or is it like an end plate on the top and bottom of the rudder?

Thanks! :)