March 2006

[Johnnie Paul]

Someone had to start one..."so let it be written (wave of hand) so let it be done..."

Johnnie

[Johnnie Paul]

Nothing special here, as I'm not much for 3D or acrobatics...but this is just too cool:

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/F3P-AM_Martin.wmv

video courtesy of Jurgen Heilig

Johnnie

[GLIDERGIDER]

This morning I hooked up with the Rocket to trade some foam. So I'm looking forward to seeing him put that one together. Jim also showed me his hover machine, and he even let me try it out. Wow, that's a nice machine, but its more then I can handle. Too windy really and too small a space this morning for a real test. I think Jim will be posting a picture of the result of my test flight. The soft landing required a step ladder.
Dave

[dee-grose]

Dave, you going thermalling tomorrow? We got north winds again, but kinda light, huh? Launchcode has been wrong before though (fingers crossed).

[GLIDERGIDER]

Andy,
I'm out all weekend (family bidness). Winds do look light, perfect for the lightweight electrics. And for the Thermal guys too. Maybe you should cycle the batteries on the OLY99 and give her a go.

I encouage everone to wander over to the Thermal flying field tomorrow. Some big 10 foot sailplanes will be about as high as you've ever seen a model get.
Have fun this weekend,
Dave

Dave, you going thermalling tomorrow? We got north winds again, but kinda light, huh? Launchcode has been wrong before though (fingers crossed).

[UAGrad2001]

Where is the Thermal Flying Field?

[dee-grose]

The NASF guys fly out at Sharon Johnston Park. It is out Winchester Road about 10 or 15 minutes...out near New Market.

Edit: Better yet...here's a Google Earth placemark for the field.

[UAGrad2001]

So what exactly does the "kv" of a motor mean. Don, anyone??? How is it relevant as far as putting together a ESC, motor, battery, prop, thrust setup.

Thanks.

[GLIDERGIDER]

Andy
Thanks for the Google Earth file. I do want to encourage each of you to watch the thermal guys fly their sleak airplanes. With this invitation comes a couple of rules. Only AMA members are allowed to fly during the meetings of this group. If you do plan to fly, please remember to check frequencys with all the fliers. The sailplanes flown by this group cost in the neighborhood of $1k & more. Radio frequency control is accomplished by each individual knowing the members & knowing the frequency conficits. Altitudes of 2000 ft can be achieved when the thermals are popping. Radio conflicts @ that altitude will result in terrific impacts.
Thanks for the bandwidth.
More details on time of meeting tomorrow can be obtained by sending Jon Stone a PM.
Dave

[nitro125]

where exactly at inside sharon johnston park is the spot where you gus fly??? its a very big park

[Miderror]

So what exactly does the "kv" of a motor mean. Don, anyone??? How is it relevant as far as putting together a ESC, motor, battery, prop, thrust setup.

Thanks.

Kv is known as generator constant,dynamo constant or voltage constant and is expressed as RPM/VOLT.
With brushed motors it is checked by spinning the motor with a drill or other motor to work as a generator and the RPM it takes to produce 1volt is the Kv.
With brushless motors I think you have to use a rectifier to get back to DCv.

You can also run the motor with no load at 2 different voltages and take the RPMs. Plug the values into this: (RPM1-RPM2)/(Voltage1-Voltage2)=Kv Works but is not as accurate.
(this is all from Astro Bob in "Electric Motor Handbook")

Samples:
Compare one Kv to another the higher of the two with turn a smaller prop for a given target amp draw and cell count.

Compare one Kv to another the lower of the two will run on more cells for a given amp draw and prop.

I will try to get I more clearly when I have a bit more time.

Hope this helps a little and does not hender.

Don

[dee-grose]

Nitro, I placed the placemark about at the spot where you park. Basically, the field is on the west side of the lake.

[nitro125]

I cant open that file because i dont have earth google. My computer is too outdated to even download it. hahaha But ii should be able to see the planes in the air right? If i can see them then i will just follow the planes. hahah

[dee-grose]

Here ya go, Nitro!

[Jim_Marconnet]

This morning I hooked up with the Rocket to trade some foam. So I'm looking forward to seeing him put that one together. Jim also showed me his hover machine, and he even let me try it out. Wow, that's a nice machine, but its more then I can handle. Too windy really and too small a space this morning for a real test. I think Jim will be posting a picture of the result of my test flight. The soft landing required a step ladder.
Dave
Huge thanks to you Dave for getting me so well set up this am with foam and information. Plus the demonstration flight you made of yours and then showing me a little about what to do and not do with my Atmopod.

I went to R/C Hobbies today for a motor, but I came out empty-handed. Somebody recently bought the one 300 direct drive motor/props/hubs he had. And he had nothing clearly appropriate in brushless, regardless of price. So I guess I'll look around on-line.

One thing Rick told me was that flying wings like this (I took in the plan drawn out on the blue foam that Dave so graciously made for me) only work well with small-diameter, high-rpm props (like you are already using!). He said they just wallow about in the air with large slowflyer props. And that ducted fans don't work well in that application either.

I had been thinking of using something like a GWS 300 motor with C gearbox (which I happen to have on hand) with a prop towards the smaller end of the size range in their prop chart. Guess I could try it. But I saw how well Dave's flew this am and don't want to mess up a good design with the wrong motor/prop.

Or I have a larger Himax brushless outrunner with 18 amp brushless ESC I bought some time ago for my SS, but it's really for a 3S Lipo and a larger diameter prop.

What to do? What to do. Probably nothing till I get a motor in hand!

[Miderror]

"One thing Rick told me was that flying wings like this (I took in the plan drawn out on the blue foam that Dave so graciously made for me) only work well with small-diameter, high-rpm props (like you are already using!). He said they just wallow about in the air with large slowflyer props. And that ducted fans don't work well in that application either."

That's not ture. It all depends on the appliction. My slinger uses a slowfly prop. There are some some guys flying foamy wings with GWS gearboxed 350s
with unlimited vertical and good handling. The price that is paid is more wt.(tightens the flight envelop) and more to break. The direct drive was chosen
simplicity and durability. We have had many hits with just the loose of a 98cent prop. No busted housing,bent shafts or $2 props.
We did SlowStick combat for a few years and I have piles of these parts from it.
Hope this sheds some light on the what and why of the wing.

If you need a motor I might dig one up.
PM me if so.

Don

[Jim_Marconnet]

... We did SlowStick combat for a few years and I have piles of these parts from it.
Hope this sheds some light on the what and why of the wing.

If you need a motor I might dig one up.
PM me if so.

Don
Thanks so much for completely clearing this up for me!
PM sent.
Jim

[Jim_Marconnet]

This morning I hooked up with the Rocket to trade some foam. So I'm looking forward to seeing him put that one together. Jim also showed me his hover machine, and he even let me try it out. Wow, that's a nice machine, but its more then I can handle. Too windy really and too small a space this morning for a real test. I think Jim will be posting a picture of the result of my test flight. The soft landing required a step ladder.
Dave
Soft landing photo below! Thanks for the flying tips too

[Johnnie Paul]

As for the aluminum shell radio boxes from last months thread...I looked long and hard at the selection at Harbor Freight, and settled on the box from Lowes. The boxes at Lowes were $.02 cheaper and about 20 times the quality...I'm glad I held out.

Johnnie

[UAGrad2001]

Don,
Back on this post: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5093517&postcount=82

You showed me a setup for a slinger. I assume that is a brushed 400 motor. Right? What prop is that in the pic? What type of gear is on the motor (A,B,C,D,1,or2)? I know you have a brushless setup on your current slinger. What is the full setup and do you recommend any other brushless setups as well.

Thanks.
Christopher

[Johnnie Paul]

sLowes knows...

...and I still have room, but I will not put much more than this in the case.

Johnnie

[Ultralight]

Check out the lipo fire videos. Everyone be safe.

http://www.utahflyers.org/


Jason

[ghee-grose]

Now that's some impressive Lipo fires!!!!

[GLIDERGIDER]

Jason,
Thanks for sharing that Utah site. There are some great videos. In addition to the lipo fire vids, (which are a learning experience), there is a foam cutting vid and some combat videos too. All of them are good.
Thanks,
Dave

Check out the lipo fire videos. Everyone be safe.
http://www.utahflyers.org/
Jason

[Mars Flyer]

Did anyone else go to the swapmeet? I was there for a short time and saw Jon Stone. It was mostly old gas stuff you see at most swapmeets. Rick had some stuff there.

I maidened my Gym Swallow Super Sport this afternoon in a considerable breeze. This is a Gym Swallow with a shortened, flatbottom, aileron wing and the rchotdeals "BP-12-like" brushless with a 3 cell 1500 mAh LiPo. It zipped around pretty good and handled the 7 gusting to 14 mph wind OK. It should be nice with a smaller 3 cell or perhaps a 2 cell in lesser winds.

Rob

[Jim_Marconnet]

Did anyone else go to the swapmeet? I was there for a short time and saw Jon Stone. It was mostly old gas stuff you see at most swapmeets. Rick had some stuff there.

I maidened my Gym Swallow Super Sport this afternoon in a considerable breeze. This is a Gym Swallow with a shortened, flatbottom, aileron wing and the rchotdeals "BP-12-like" brushless with a 3 cell 1500 mAh LiPo. It zipped around pretty good and handled the 7 gusting to 14 mph wind OK. It should be nice with a smaller 3 cell or perhaps a 2 cell in lesser winds.

Rob
I thought mildly about going, but did not. I talked to Rick briefly back at the store after the swap meet. He and Pat went with some stuff, as you saw. He said there was a really small crowd there this year, and the place cleared out a lot noonish, so they left and went back to the shop.

Glad your maiden went well, even with the wind.

On my way into town I thought it might have been you I saw at the track at Horizon, but it was someone else.

NDD field was really lonely when I was there, except for some kite flyers. It figures on such a windy day in March!

As I indicated elsewhere, I maidened my DBPS today, but mostly discovered problems. Of course had I waited, those same problems would have still been there later, just still be undiscovered. Glad yours went better.

[Mars Flyer]

I thought mildly about going, but did not. I talked to Rick briefly back at the store after the swap meet. He and Pat went with some stuff, as you saw. He said there was a really small crowd there this year, and the place cleared out a lot noonish, so they left and went back to the shop.

Glad your maiden went well, even with the wind.

On my way into town I thought it might have been you I saw at the track at Horizon, but it was someone else.

NDD field was really lonely when I was there, except for some kite flyers. It figures on such a windy day in March!

As I indicated elsewhere, I maidened my DBPS today, but mostly discovered problems. Of course had I waited, those same problems would have still been there later, just still be undiscovered. Glad yours went better.

Jim,

The swapmeet was a bit of a disappointment. The highlight was the stuff Rick brought. He had some good deals on CA and some ARFs sort of like his grand opening. A $30 Tiger Moth 400 is hard to beat.

We must have just missed each other at NDD. I got there about 5pm.

I think you have figured out that a thorough pre-flight check is essential. I always do all of my programming and deflection checks on the bench. There are frequently issues like you had that show up then. I am still not quite comfortable with the elevon mix programming on my Optic 6, especially when something needs to be reversed, but I'm getting the hang of it. I'm nearing completion on my Wedgie wing and will have to confront that puzzle again.

At NDD yesterday I had an interesting failure on the Slow Stick. The screws that hold the motor in its mount came out. I was "kite flying" having a good time and simply lost power. I thought the battery had died but the motor had just come loose and backed up enough that the gears didn't contact. I guess I need to check those screws occasionally :p

Hang in there. Good weather and long, calm, lazy evenings are just around the corner.

Rob

[Moonbeam Six]

Rob,

I'm looking forward to seeing your "GymSwallow on steroids."

I emailed Roger for a status of his projects. It would be good to have three GS in the air at once.

No flying for me lately. :(

MB6

[Ken Fidler]

Jim,

The swapmeet was a bit of a disappointment. The highlight was the stuff Rick brought. He had some good deals on CA and some ARFs sort of like his grand opening. A $30 Tiger Moth 400 is hard to beat.


Rob

For me, the swap meet was great! :) I sold everything I brought by 12:00- all my motors, kits, mufflers, and assoc. It took me 10 minutes after setting up to sell all my gas motors; one guy cleared me out. :) :)

I had such a great time meeting my old gas buddies that I may rejoin one of the two AMA local clubs and start flying my gas stuff!! :)

Ken

[Mars Flyer]

For me, the swap meet was great! :) I sold everything I brought by 12:00- all my motors, kits, mufflers, and assoc. It took me 10 minutes after setting up to sell all my gas motors; one guy cleared me out. :) :)

I had such a great time meeting my old gas buddies that I may rejoin one of the two AMA local clubs and start flying my gas stuff!! :)

Ken


Ken,

It sure looked like a gas guy's paradise. Glad you did well selling your stuff. I thought I saw you setup near Rick's tables. Parking was a bit of a problem by the time I got there at about 9:30. There must have been 6-8 munchkin soccer games going on out on the church's lawn.

Maybe as the electric stuff continues to catch on we'll see some electrics on the tables. The only one I saw was a Slo-V.

Rob

[Johnnie Paul]

Regarding LiPo fires...

RC Hobbies could have been a potential story...while I was visiting (shopping) a customer pointed out that one of Rick's large (9" - 10" long) LiPo packs had shorted out...and burned the display case...and 2 other large LiPo packs.

Rick had said that he noticed a burning smell when he opened the store today. Once the culprit cell was found and taken out of the case, the whole store began to stink...apparently the large LiPo shorted overnight...RC Hobbies theoretically is lucky to have not burned to the ground.

Johnnie

[ghee-grose]

OK rocket guys.... have you seen this???

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/Rocketman.wmv

[Ultralight]

OK rocket guys.... have you seen this???

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/Rocketman.wmv

Sweet! A RC guided missile. Talk about combat!


Jason

[Johnnie Paul]

Question for those that have used any Castle Creations ESC's: Can I program this unit without plugging in the motor?...or does this ESC need to see the motor?

I will call CC when they open, but I thought I might ping the group.

Johnnie

[dleviner]

I'm curious - what brand LiPos were they and what size?


Regarding LiPo fires...

RC Hobbies could have been a potential story...while I was visiting (shopping) a customer pointed out that one of Rick's large (9" - 10" long) LiPo packs had shorted out...and burned the display case...and 2 other large LiPo packs.

Rick had said that he noticed a burning smell when he opened the store today. Once the culprit cell was found and taken out of the case, the whole store began to stink...apparently the large LiPo shorted overnight...RC Hobbies theoretically is lucky to have not burned to the ground.

Johnnie

[GLIDERGIDER]

This would be fun to see chasing a DBPS.

OK rocket guys.... have you seen this???

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/Rocketman.wmv

[Johnnie Paul]

I'm curious - what brand LiPos were they and what size?

They were wrapped in Red heat shrink and roughly 9 - 10 inches long by 2 - 2.5" thick (3cell thickness?)...it was a fairly large pack that shorted out in the display case. It also melted into two similar size packs that it was resting near...definetly would have been a costly loss.

Johnnie

[Jim_Marconnet]

OK rocket guys.... have you seen this???

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/Rocketman.wmv
Thanks Gary for sharing that great video!

I found a still photo of it on-line. Actually takes two girls to hold it up. It did not look that large to me in the video. They call it a Sidewinder. So far I've not found out anything further about it.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=762572

I had optomistically hoped to be that good with my Atmopod by now. Instead.... Well I Tried!

[UAGrad2001]

Had a good time at lunch today. Jason, David, and myself all had planes in the air - some of us longer than others, unfortunately. Andy even stopped by for a bit. Jason's Pinky definitely flies much faster with the prop on correctly. David recently switched to a BP21 (actually a bm2408-21 from rchotdeals) with a 7050 prop. Flying some sort slinger type wing. Very nice performance for a motor that costs under 30 bucks, in my opinion. Someone had a nice crash that I unfortunately didn't see as I was looking in the other direction. But I did hear it and the crash bent the motor mount, if that gives you any idea of the speed. Check out the carnage. Should be easy to fix though.

Christopher

[dleviner]

Ok, before the comments come pouring in... I will not fly rolling loops at 40 feet anymore.

All electronics check out fine -- just gotta remount the mount. The foam is really thin in the back.

I do have to say, the 2408-21 is a blast with this plane on a 3cell 1800mah Lipo and 7x5 APC-E prop.

[ghee-grose]

Hey... David.... were you grinning from ear to ear while you were flying it.... and crashing it??? Then it was worth it. Just wait until you guys see the video of my indoor 3D flying last night. Let's just say... I didn't plan on leaving the gym with my plane the way it was when I came. :D

[dleviner]

Driving back to Adtran I saw some other guys flying behind SRS Technologies. There was an older gentleman flying what looked like a Cub teaching another guy to fly with two others watching. Any of you guys???

[dleviner]

Hey Gary!

Yes I was grinning ear to ear with the thought of "why didn't I go brushless/LiPo sooner???"

I am now wondering if I should just transfer the electronics from this wing to a DBPS??? I have been flying the Razor off and on for 6 years now...

[ghee-grose]

That is definitely a long life for an airframe!!! You gotta love a plane that's been around that long. I've been preaching this brushless/Lipo thing for a couple years now and eventually folks will come around. I think Rob has finally made the whole plunge. He's been Lipo for a year or more but has just recently went brushless. Rob, how are you liking it?

[Ultralight]

Driving back to Adtran I saw some other guys flying behind SRS Technologies. There was an older gentleman flying what looked like a Cub teaching another guy to fly with two others watching. Any of you guys???

I don't know them but they are the guys who had that glow plane out one day buzzing over our heads at Moquin.

Jason

[Johnnie Paul]

7AM photos...

& I managed a few turns on a SS :)

[Jim_Marconnet]

7AM photos...

& I managed a few turns on a SS :)
Johnie:

Thanks for coming, flying, and sharing the photos! It was very nice to get several of us together at one time for an early-am flight session.

When I called out, "Flight of the Bozo!" I little knew how right I was... Turned out I forgot to reverse the motor leads when I reversed the motor position. Very short first light resulted! Fortunately Don's suggestion worked - cutting, twisting and taping motor wires works well enough in the field.

I got in a few short hops on the Bozo, more correctly my Albino DBPS, AKA The Dove. The colorful nose bumper helped some, but the nose foam still got bent, and I broke the breakaway motor mount, which was not designed to break away. My future ones will be designed different! I untwisted the motor wires, taped the motor back on, and kept on flying.

So far I really like that white foam sign-board much better than the BlueCor. Only wish it came in larger sizes and different thicknesses. Rick will check on that from his supplier. So far he has gotten only one size and thickness.

Thanks Don for some intial tips and several nice hand-launches. And for not laughing at my initial flight attempts with ailerons. It sure is different! I know I'll like it when I get the hang of it. Much more responsive than the 'ole SS.

I owe a huge Thanks to GliderGider for meeting me at lunch on Electronics Blvd, and helping me really get it into the air the first flight time longer than 20 seconds. Being an engineer, I appreciated the lesson on vectors and coordinated stick movements. And later his helpful "left stick", "more throttle", "panic now!" commands :)

He test flew it several times and showed me it does fly similarly to the other DBPSs. We flew a ways away from Don and Ken to stay out of that fraccas. When the winds came up, I put it away and enjoyed the 3-man combat show. You've gotta go see that some time. Bring sunscreen. I got a sunburn.

Ken did the two most amazing things that I saw there yesterday. Of course I missed seeing a lot, focusing on my own flight attempts, and staying out of the fire ant mounds.

One flight Ken's battery came out, and he flew it back to the pits with the battery hanging off the nose on the wire, literally hanging in the air. That must have moved the CG forward a ways. I crashed, distracted by such an unusual sight. Reminder - keep your eyes on Your plane, regardless!

Later, he broke and lost a pushrod (note - make spares!). He taped that elevon in position with some tape, carefully including a little reflex. He asked for a 10 second window to get accustomed to it, and then flew with Don and Dave. He flew several combat sessions that way, and was definitely in the game. I would not have believed that could have been done had I not seen it. Perhaps it was the strong wind they were flying mostly into that made such a flight possible?

A great AM and also Lunch flying. Thanks to all who participated, taught, and spectated. Get out and come see the combat some time if you can. It's amazing!

[Miderror]

OK rocket guys.... have you seen this???

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/JurgenHeilig/Rocketman.wmv

I thing some of these would be fun to tie to the car or a smaller version tethered to a plane might raise some heads.

[ghee-grose]

Here you go guys.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=766552

[ghee-grose]

And the death of....

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=766706

[GLIDERGIDER]

Got TAPE? I was looking for Andy to jump out with his YAK and a combat sesson to start.

That place would be ideal as a DBPS free fire zone. I'll bet your Yak would have less damage too.

Great videos. Thanks for sharing.

And the death of....

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=766706

[ghee-grose]

Dave, my intentions were exactly to fly for a while then to bash up that old brick of a plane. It's had so much epoxy and CA on it that it's way too heavy for 3D. I took no tape or CA with me because I didn't want to dump any more money on this thing... just whack it up, strip the electronics from it, and build something else.

I had some good fun with it though! :D

[dee-grose]

Dave, I was doing my best to catch the madness on video...and trying to keep it in view while laughing like a hyena!

[ghee-grose]

FYI...

www.commonsenserc.com is having a special that ends tomorrow. They seem to be much like RC Hotdeals on their batteries and prices. Right now you can buy $89.95 worth of batteries and get a balancing Lipo charger that is worth $89.85 for free.

For more information you can look here...
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=490095

[UAGrad2001]

What charge rate do you generally use when charging your Lipo packs? You can either provide examples or express in a C rating.

Thanks,
Christopher

[atjurhs]

Most of the time I set mine at 0.8C (no matter LiPo, NiMh or NiCd), but if I really want to push the pack I wil use 1.2C and if I want to try and eeak out (or in this case "push in") every possible milliamp that I can I will use 0.2C.

Just what I do, but Don is THE Battery Guru!

[ghee-grose]

1c, they all can handle it.

[ghee-grose]

Most of the time I set mine at 0.8C (no matter LiPo, NiMh or NiCd), but if I really want to push the pack I wil use 1.2C and if I want to try and eeak out (or in this case "push in") every possible milliamp that I can I will use 0.2C.

Just what I do, but Don is THE Battery Guru!

You push your Lipo packs to 1.2C also??? :o

[UAGrad2001]

I'm thinking of buying this plane. You all think I could fly it at NDD?

http://homepage.eircom.net/~skycam/C-17A_Globemaster_III/

[ghee-grose]

You might get some calls from Redstone approach for flying that one! :D

[atjurhs]

Gary,

Yep, I push the LiPos to 1.2C as well, just not too often. Maybe once every 6 weeks or so. Most of the time I charge at 0.8C or less. I really like charging at 0.5C but it takes sooooo long. My theory of occasionally charging at 1.2C is that we pull on them harder than that during flight, so they ought to be able to handle that in charging.

That's just what I do, and I've had pretty good success so far. But I am no expert. Ask "the Don" if you want expert advice.

[ghee-grose]

I got ya. I've yet to charge at anything higher than 1C. I know that higher C rated batteries might have higher discharge rate, but still only have a 1C charge rate.

You're probably not hurting it by doing so infrequently, in fact, probably not as bad as me running my old generation one Thunder Power 1320 pack about 10 amps just about every flight. :D It hasn't died yet.

[dleviner]

Somebody correct me, but I believe what you're risking when charging at higher and higher rates is one cell (or multiple cells) peaking faster than the others (cell imbalance) and thus overcharging that particular cell since all the charger detects is the total voltage drop across all cells.

dl

[Johnnie Paul]

I have seen/heard mention of the following phrase enough to ask; what does "rip-the-bring" mean?

Johnnie

[ghee-grose]

Good luck on finding the answer to that! There's two monster threads about it and no clear answer anywhere.

[dee-grose]

Johnnie, I've wondered that myself. It started as a sloper thing. I've never found a good answer. I'm about to think that it is just a saying that is said for the sake of saying it even though the only reason for saying it is because it means nothing and makes people ask what it means just to be funny...or something like that. And it is probably that confusing too :D

Andy

[UAGrad2001]

Hey Don,
Care to put your 2 cents in. I would like our resident expert's advice. You have waaay more experience with this than with me. Thanks.


What charge rate do you generally use when charging your Lipo packs? You can either provide examples or express in a C rating.

Thanks,
Christopher

[Jim_Marconnet]

Got back from West Va late last night, so now the real vacation begins!

Tried to fly this AM at NDD. The wind came up when I would have preferred more calm. 2 mph, gusted to 11! The SS turned on me. Duck! Guess it was mad and lonely from so much closet time. Became a clipped-wing the hard way. Guess I'll trim it off neatly and do the other one for balance.

[dee-grose]

Jim, tough luck on the SS wing....ya know, I've wondered how well one of those Slo-V wings would do on a SS. Since Hobbytown has them for only $7.50, might be worth a try....hmmm.

Andy

[Jim_Marconnet]

Jim, tough luck on the SS wing....ya know, I've wondered how well one of those Slo-V wings would do on a SS. Since Hobbytown has them for only $7.50, might be worth a try....hmmm.

Andy
Thanks for the great and timely suggestion!

I went and bought the last two Slo-V wings on the rack, since they have the same chord as the SS wing. I understand that they are a little different, that they may not fly as slow as SS wings. That might be nice in a way. Also they are not Red, so color schemes are more open.

I glued and taped back together my busted SS wing, and was surprised how OK it looked. Not like new of course, but OK. For now I decided not to clip off the wing tips after all. Just could not bring myself to do it. Perhaps will do it the next time I go to fly and I think it's really too windy.....

Any suggestions for what to plan to eventually fly in the wind around here?

Sloping is definitely out for me.

Kiting a brushless SS is fun to watch, but I don't think that's really what I'm after, long-term.

In fact, anything that can be broken easily or is tough to repair seems to be not my style. I need a lot of crashability and/or repairability! :) So flying wings are looking good to me right now.

I'm slowly learning to fly with elevons with my Dove DBPS, when I can find light or no winds. I really have no idea how strong or gusty of wind it is suitable for. At about 24 inch span, I doubt it's good for the highest winds we get.

I found myself looking at the kites at SAM'S today, thinking it might be nice to have one of them in the trunk for when the flags are waving strongly. But then how to stick a radio, battery, and some servos on; and how to rig up control surfaces to them???

[Johnnie Paul]

Has anyone heard of these nifty little wings?

They look fun...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=489142

They sell different sizes of them here...

http://www.aerocraftrc.com/elipstik.php

Johnnie

[ChromeDome]

[QUOTE=rocket_jim]..........................
I glued and taped back together my busted SS wing, and was surprised how OK it looked. Not like new of course, but OK. For now I decided not to clip off the wing tips after all. Just could not bring myself to do it. Perhaps will do it the next time I go to fly and I think it's really too windy.....

Any suggestions for what to plan to eventually fly in the wind around here?

.......................QUOTE]
Jim, I'm glad you fixed your wing. They repair pretty easily. Something I like is a strip of fiber tape along the trailing edge to resist the load when the nose strikes the ground and the wings keep trying to move forward. That puts the trailing edge in tension and starts a tear.

Regarding wind, it will calm down here as summer approaches. This is a windy time of year. Regarding airplanes, at the risk of sounding like a Renegade :) , I really don't like a SS very much. They are good for hauling a camera up for aerial photos but otherwise I'd rather fly something else. The little GWS Cub handles wind much better than my unloaded SS. There is a little video of the first flight of my foam and tape Cub in a wind of 6 mph gusting to 9 according to the weather bureau. It only weighths 7 oz but handles wnd better than my SS. And at least it looks more like a proper airplane.

[Miderror]

Has anyone heard of these nifty little wings?

They look fun...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=489142

They sell different sizes of them here...

http://www.aerocraftrc.com/elipstik.php

Johnnie

Johnnie,
I've had the 460. Ran it on a speed 400 and 8x1100 nimh packs and it did great at that time. Has to be a blast on LiPo and Brushless.I was just talking to Tom Hunt (the designer) this week.
Funny you should being up this plane as I told him it is one of the few planes I think I'd build twice.

Don

[GLIDERGIDER]

There's a local guy, Stephen Gleason, who has one of these Elipstiks. Stephen visited the NDD site last fall, once that I know about. He flys all kind of airplanes.

Has anyone heard of these nifty little wings?

They look fun...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=489142

They sell different sizes of them here...

http://www.aerocraftrc.com/elipstik.php

Johnnie

[Jim_Marconnet]

Something I like is a strip of fiber tape along the trailing edge to resist the load when the nose strikes the ground and the wings keep trying to move forward. That puts the trailing edge in tension and starts a tear.

Regarding wind, it will calm down here as summer approaches. This is a windy time of year. Regarding airplanes, at the risk of sounding like a Renegade :) , I really don't like a SS very much. They are good for hauling a camera up for aerial photos but otherwise I'd rather fly something else. The little GWS Cub handles wind much better than my unloaded SS. There is a little video of the first flight of my foam and tape Cub in a wind of 6 mph gusting to 9 according to the weather bureau. It only weighths 7 oz but handles wnd better than my SS. And at least it looks more like a proper airplane.
ChromeDome:
Thanks so much for the TE suggestion. Makes a lot of sense. My SS wing broke jaggedly from the tail to the place where the fibreglass leading edge tube stopped at the wingtip! Fits your description perfectly.

About a GWS (Pico) Cub, I looked on the GWS site and did not find it. Wonder if they still offer this one. Probably I'm just looking in the wrong place.

I've seen yours with the brushless and LiPo fly, and it looked much better in the air than the SSs to me.

As I'm learning to fly with ailerons, I'm thinking I rather like ailerons better than just R/E/T control (well Duh!). The SS, for instance, even though it's twitchy in the air, still wallows around in the turns as compared to other planes I've seen. So I'm thinking that something with ailerons meant to fly that way will be in my future. I have several far-from and near-to flying projects scattered about the office now. One's reach is always larger than their grasp. And who knows what Don will come up with next! :)

Hope your recovery continues, and we can see you on the flying field again soon in time for the winds to die down some.
Jim

[Johnnie Paul]

Johnnie,
I've had the 460. Ran it on a speed 400 and 8x1100 nimh packs and it did great at that time. Has to be a blast on LiPo and Brushless.I was just talking to Tom Hunt (the designer) this week.
Funny you should being up this plane as I told him it is one of the few planes I think I'd build twice.

Don


I had made a post to a fellow looking for a stick built wing, and he came back later on with the links that I posted...I thought that the wings were unusualy unique...when I can fly a wing without plowing, I may have to go the route of stick building one of these. - it's a small world we live in Don :)

[ChromeDome]

Thanks ...............................Any suggestions for what to plan to eventually fly in the wind around here?
...................
Kiting a brushless SS is fun to watch, but I don't think that's really what I'm after, long-term.

In fact, anything that can be broken easily or is tough to repair seems to be not my style. I need a lot of crashability and/or repairability! :) So flying wings are looking good to me right now.

I'm slowly learning to fly with elevons with my Dove DBPS, when I can find light or no winds. I really have no idea how strong or gusty of wind it is suitable for. At about 24 inch span, I doubt it's good for the highest winds we get.
.............to rig up control surfaces to them???
I found this thread under Foamies titled "Is there a good windy day flyer?"
Generally they liked wings and heavier aircraft. But check out #7 . He sheeted his SS wing underneath with Depron and continued a flap on the back as ailerons. Sounds interesting. Carry-out boxes are 2.7mm and probably Depron.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=489759&page=2&pp=15&highlight=starter

[Johnnie Paul]

+*+

[dleviner]

Hobby Lobby Crash Sale

http://www.hobby-lobby.com/crash.htm

$6.90 for a 6gram servo.

[ghee-grose]

Sold Out!

[Johnnie Paul]

I am so much a novice at R/C I still have accumulated near zero air miles...but I know when a pilot is up to no good:

http://rc.andersh.com/video/crashes_and_stuff_volume_2.mpg

also included is the Slow Stik that would not die!!

(long download sorry)

more fun and carnage can be found here:

http://rc.andersh.com/html/video2.html

Johnnie

[UAGrad2001]

Okay, watching that video I can't help but think of the age old line...
"Hey ya'll, watch this".

[Jim_Marconnet]

Just wanted to put in a quick plug for UHO Creativ' craft glue for styrofoam, film, and foils.

I get it at Michael's. Expensive! About $4.00 for a 1.12 oz tube. But it works!

I glued the plastic-coated-foam wing tips and landing skid plates onto my Dove with it, and have put that bird thru virtual :censored: with no glue failure. Nose-hits! Cartwheels! Deep Woods landings! And Todd flew combat with it.

I used it to put my ATMOPOD together. Depron, plywood, balsa, carbon fibre. Stuck securely to all, and never a hint of a glue failure.

Accidentally set a piece with some on it onto my kitchen countertop last evening. Realized this AM that it left glue there. Had a difficult time peeling it off. It stays rubbery, and sticks like mad to everything I've used it on so far. And things I did not mean to use it on. :)

On the DBPS, I've mostly glued either to the plastic skin or to the underlying foam. Used rubbing alcohol to clean the surfaces, and let air dry thoroughly before applying the glue. Have also used it to glue to plywood and balsawood.

It's a contact cement, but it also seems to work well if you just put it on, stick the pieces together, and let it dry. Not instant like CA.

[dleviner]

OK, some of you asked for pictures of the "ghost" Zero that never fly around Research park. This one I only fly out at the middle school track.


GWS Zero
33.5" WS
204 sq in
27.8" length
13 oz AUW
9.5 oz/sq ft
3 servos -- A,E,R
TP 2410-12[delta wound] (BP12), 1530Kv
GWS 8x4HD
CC Thunderbird18, 17gr., 1.5A BEC
3S PQ1100mah 10C, 80gr, 68x38x17mm
Berg 4 DSP, 7gr, 36x20x7mm
9gram aileron, 6gram rudder/elevator



Enjoy
:)

[ghee-grose]

Looks great David!

[Mars Flyer]

David,

Great looking plane. I'm watching "Dogfights" on History Channel right now. Sure makes me want to get a warbird.

Rob

[ghee-grose]

I just tuned in Rob... thanks for posting!

[JoHowell]

David,

Great looking plane. I'm watching "Dogfights" on History Channel right now. Sure makes me want to get a warbird.

Rob

I'm leaving for Sun'n'Fun tomorrow. Be there a few days. I'm sure I will see some "For Sale" signs on some of the heavy iron there. Rob, want me to get telephone numbers for you? ;)

Seriously, anyone got a "special" plane that they'd like me to look for to take pics off? Be glad to do so. Just let me know before tonight.

Jim Howell

[Jim_Marconnet]

OK, some of you asked for pictures of the "ghost" Zero that never fly around Research park. This one I only fly out at the middle school track.

So you want us to pave you a runway at NDD or what? :)

Beautiful plane! I'd love to come see it fly some time if you know a little ahead when you plan to go.

[Johnnie Paul]

So you want us to pave you a runway at NDD or what? :)

Beautiful plane! I'd love to come see it fly some time if you know a little ahead when you plan to go.

"Pave it and they will come..."

Check out this "cold" war bird video...not my choice for theme music, but it works :)

http://www.aerialview.us/hercules_1.wmv

Johnnie

[ghee-grose]

Not a fan of the Black Eyed Peas?!?!? :rolleyes:

[GLIDERGIDER]

Yesterday I took my Mom and Dad, who are visiting from NC, to see "fighter Pilot" the movie, showing at the Space and Rocket Center IMax theater. I highly recommend this movie to all my Renegade friends. If you enjoy airplanes, then you will love this movie.

[dee-grose]

I saw that movie last year, Dave. It is pretty good. Lots of shots that would make some folks woozy!

Missed you on the slope yesterday...Don and I had fun. BIG winds.

[ghee-grose]

Seen it twice!