Affordable turbines that DO work.

[Paul DF jet man]

I just got my first turbine and i love it. :p

It’s a Joe jet 1400

All up it cost me $2080 AUS about 1550 US

That included the NEW jj1400 with bigger intake and 12 bladed compresser
The upgraded flight works pump
The upgraded starter motor pod
Aluminium case
All solenoids / full auto start fadec system
And shipping 6 days

And the list goes on. Absolutely everything needed to make it run except fuel and gas.


I have run it 5 times and all have been great runs up to 160,000 rpm and back down to 40,000 rpm with no problem.


I personally wasn’t too sure about the jj's a when they first came out as they were having some problems but that isn’t a big surprise as most products that are released for the first time to the PUBLIC has a tough time. But now that they have the problems rectified, this new jj1400 is definitely a good buy. :D


If you would like one you can get them from www.jetjoe.com that’s where mine came from and im in AUS.

They are not the best turbine on the market and i don’t expect them to be but all i can say is that for the $$$ these are the best value for money when it comes to entering the sport on a budget.

IF you have the extra $$$$ then go out and buy a jet cat or an AMT , TJT ect but for those who don’t have $ 4000 -5000 to spend on there first turbine the jj IMO is the way to go.


So i can say to all if you have been thinking of getting one but weren’t quite sure if they work properly you can stop worrying now as I have proof they do work . :) i will get a video posted soon to prove that it runs fine im just having difficulties getting the video below 10 mb and I have already bunt all my jet fuel.

If anyone wants to know more or just talk about the jj 1400 with me you are welcome. Im not an expert yet but im willing to help.



Thanks for reading From Paul :p

[Muxje]

Nice, did it come assembled / balanced or as a kit?

What plane are you planning to put it in?

[Paul DF jet man]

it came fully assembled ready to go.

we had it running in about 2.5 hours but if i did it all over again i could have it up and running in about 30 miniuts.


as for the jet its going in see my ID pic to the left.

its a spectra from trim aircraft.

[NickT]

Just looked at the site - any one else have experience with these as they look just what I have been waiting for at a reasonable price (all relative that I guess!).

Nick

[Edgar Perez]

What are the specs (thurst, fuel consumption @ full thrust/minute, weight, etc)?
I could not find them in the website

[avicom]

Edgard, this engine will give you almost the same thrust as your trusty Bee. So you got better engine than this one. I'm not saying is bad. Just heard bad comments about them in the past. We still need to read about newer experince with this new updated version. We have to give them a chance.

As far of this post the news are that is working now. Let's keep us posted.

avicom

[avicom]

Paul, that plane looks like the jetlegend t-45. Itsn't it?

avicom

[Paul DF jet man]

Paul, that plane looks like the jetlegend t-45. Itsn't it?

avicom


NO its a trim aircraft SPECTRA

there not making them anymore :o pitty really very good jet :D

[avicom]

Thanks Paul,
I confuse the planes. In your avatar the photo is not clear. Any news in the JJ? When your plannint to maidenfly that spectra? Post pics.

Rgds,Alejandro

[treehog]

keep us posted
using cyber cafe BB tried the site but after 5 minutes its had only finihed downloading some of home page so gave up for today

How many kilos push and weight of motor and components and fuel consumption ball park

how much was the post cost to australia

I sure havent got $1600 but with a bit of saving etc might be a contender for December

For a jet I would go hot spot type direction as I havent time for scale stuff

Ralf

[fhhuber506771]

Affordable is a relative term.... That turbine is worth more than some of my friends' cars ;) (worth more than the car I traded off 3 days ago too...)

[Paul DF jet man]

Thanks Paul,
I confuse the planes. In your avatar the photo is not clear. Any news in the JJ? When your plannint to maidenfly that spectra? Post pics.

Rgds,Alejandro


thats ok

my spectra is being airbrush painted as we speak so i will post pics in 10 days when its finnished.

maidenflight will be either late this month or very early march. :D

[Paul DF jet man]

keep us posted
using cyber cafe BB tried the site but after 5 minutes its had only finihed downloading some of home page so gave up for today

How many kilos push and weight of motor and components and fuel consumption ball park

how much was the post cost to australia

I sure havent got $1600 but with a bit of saving etc might be a contender for December

For a jet I would go hot spot type direction as I havent time for scale stuff

Ralf


The turbine is supposed to have 14lb of thrust however i haven’t tested the thrust on scales yet so i cant verify that.

Postal to AUS was $80 AUS

Keep saving and you will get there BUT don’t forget you will need close to 1.5x the cost of the turbine to set up the actual jet. :rolleyes:

[Lance Nordby]

It's hard to see exactly what your jet is but it sure looks like an F-20 Tigershark. Please, can you post a better photo?

[Paul DF jet man]

It's hard to see exactly what your jet is but it sure looks like an F-20 Tigershark. Please, can you post a better photo?


OK hear is a pic.

It’s had a slight instant with a tree at about 150 km/h on its 75th flight. :eek:

LOL but no its all repaired and getting painted and a turbine installed taking place of the DF :D

[Lance Nordby]

Thanks,

It still looks like an F-20 to me. Nice looking jet anyway.

[Lance Nordby]

I found the web site.

http://www.trimair.com.au/index2.html

It's not an F-20 but a nice looking sport jet anyway.

[trashmanf]

those guys websites have a sport jet "spectre" that looks freakin exactly like the bandit

[mode101]

They use to have under $1K kit, don't know if they do..the website has a note of confidence on the first page

"We are still in business & the lowest price turbine in the world !" :confused:

[Paul DF jet man]

Well I maddened my boomerang intro yesterday with the jj 1400 in it. :)

I can say with grate confidence and reassurance that this motor runs extremely well. It starts first time runs up and down smoothly and idles very well at a low 42000 rpm. :p

The intro weighs 17 lb RTF and this turbine is pushing out at least 14 lb. I know this because it will climb with authority not unlimited vertical obviously but it dose climb really well and can throw this big air frame around quite nicely. :)

I got a 6 ½ min flight with a 50 oz tank with about 8 oz left in the tank.
Mostly run at ½ to full power so quite good on fuel I thought.


SO FOR ALL OF YOU WHO ARE CONSIDERING A JJ1400 JUST GO AND GET ONE THAY ARE GRATE. :D


Im getting another one this week for the spectra and then another 2 for a special project will post later 2 weeks or so. :D


I am super happy with me JJ 1400 and I hope lots of other people get one and have as much fun as im having. :D


sorry for the in flight pics they are a bit small LOL.

[vincent from ne]

well done paul !!!
i'm not very far from australia.........i'm in new caledonia.......
i will test run my jj1400 in a very few..............and willfit it on a bae hawk....
kind regards
vincent from new caledonia

[Paul DF jet man]

well done paul !!!
i'm not very far from australia.........i'm in new caledonia.......
i will test run my jj1400 in a very few..............and willfit it on a bae hawk....
kind regards
vincent from new caledonia


thanks mate !

i put another 6 flights on the jj 1400 today (9 total). I have put over 20 L of kero through the motor now and its running very nicely.

you will love your jj im sure of it and it will go nicely in a hawk :)

[Hovertime]

So what it come to in cost per flight? How many startups (or hours?)is it rated TBO?
I keep looking at jet powered helicopters...:) out of my financial range for now though...:(

[Paul DF jet man]

So what it come to in cost per flight? How many startups (or hours?)is it rated TBO?
I keep looking at jet powered helicopters...:) out of my financial range for now though...:(


Well the guy who fixes jj's her in aus (lovely guy) has had about 40 hours on his 1400 and hasn’t serviced it yet.

i think its supposed to be 25 hours.

i worked it out its $6.50 per flight. :eek: but its all worth it. :D

[Bahamadude]

Videos would be good

[Paul DF jet man]

yes i will try hard to organise some (videos) for you guys. ill try and do a few smaller ones so i can fit them on the web space avaliable.

[hendrix]

Hi.
I just ordered my JJ1400 and obviously i will need a propane tank and a 50 oz fuel tank.
Where from did you get yours?
Any Internet shop will do i suppose.
Chris

[Paul DF jet man]

Hi.
I just ordered my JJ1400 and obviously i will need a propane tank and a 50 oz fuel tank.
Where from did you get yours?
Any Internet shop will do i suppose.
Chris


i dont use onboard gas as its just extra weight and a hastle.

just go to you local camping store and get a can on propane cooking gas. And go hear for the valve. http://www.intairco.net/default.asp?page=products&cat=5&subcat=182&MenuOpen=p7menu5


dubro sells 50 OZ tanks that what i use. :)

[hendrix]

Thank you very much for the Help.
This is my first Turbine quest and i really know nothing at all in this field.
It is like starting all over again in rc.
Chris

[Alex Chan]

Does the turbine came direct from China?
Does the CC made of inconel?

Best regards,
Alex.

[Paul DF jet man]

yes the turbine takes about 5-6 days to go anywhere in the world.

they are a good motor

i would suggest getting the new pump FOR SURE and the new Starter pod 2 musts.

[Hovertime]

Does it come with a pump and its not good enough? Why?

[Paul DF jet man]

Does it come with a pump and its not good enough? Why?

Well for some reason some work really well some don’t? Im not sure why this is the case but that’s the way it is.

Just look at it this way.

The ECU is the brain of the turbine and the pump is the heart. The brain is a Fedec unit and is extremely smart (very !!! GOOD ECU) BUT IF THE HEART (PUMP) isn’t as good eg works 100% then you will only get the performance of the weakest link.

what im saying is if the pump is not so good compared to the flight works pump for one reason or another then you only get a limited performance out of the turbine as it relies on good fuel flow and if it doesn’t get that fuel flow then you cant expect it to run at 160,000 rpm and it WONT.

Turbines are the extreme end on RC and you just have to be prepaid to spend the extra $ if you want to have a GOOD / reliable turbine.

And JJ turbines are very good and the cheapest you will find. Give it the best chance you can by getting the new starter pod and the NEW pump and you will have a 14 lb turbine that WORKS.

Mine dose :) so should yours.

[Hovertime]

Try to send them some feedback? Makers might just listen to it and fix/improve it as needed :)

[Paul DF jet man]

Try to send them some feedback? Makers might just listen to it and fix/improve it as needed :)


i have but some people are on a seriouse budget and dont want to buy the turbine with the new pump. so he has to leave both options avaliable

[Paul DF jet man]

Try to send them some feedback? Makers might just listen to it and fix/improve it as needed :)


i have but some people are on a seriouse budget and dont want to buy the turbine with the new pump. so he has to leave both options avaliable.

i spoke to Joe and he said he is working on a NEW WEB sight. so look out for it soon

[hendrix]

Hi Alex.
If you mean me yes my JJ1400 is directly from China but i haven't received it yet.
It is in Holland right now.
Chris

[wildnloose]

Paul DF Jet man,
Keep saving and you will get there BUT don’t forget you will need close to 1.5x the cost of the turbine to set up the actual jet.

Are you saying that, for ex. if you paid 1,000.00 for a turbine; it will take another 1,500.00 to set up the jet???

[Paul DF jet man]

Paul DF Jet man,


Are you saying that, for ex. if you paid 1,000.00 for a turbine; it will take another 1,500.00 to set up the jet???


Well no that’s not entirely true.

It depends on what you are building, and how you go about it.

But it dose add.

e.g for my boomerang into I got the motor for $2080 aus with everything but then I have do buy 6 digital servos, a $280 10 ch crystal less receiver the best you can get NO CRYSTAL is the way to go, retracts, ecu packs, rx packs, servo extensions , the plane, wheels and breaks if needed, smoke systems fuel tanks and pluming air and fuel, solenoid shut off valves and the list goes on.

I would have spent about another $2800 AUS easy to get the intro going.

But then there always bits and pieces that you buy after that.

But if you were to scratch build a delta wing like a mirage and only need 2 digital servos, and buy cheap gear im sure you would do it far cheaper.

[taekwondo]

Looks awesome!!

[PREACHHAMES]

Paul,

I just spent last Wed, Thurs, & Fri at the Florida Jet Rally in Lakeland, FL. What a great event! There were plenty of used turbines for sale, but they were still more $ than the JJ1400.

Anyway, I appreciate you posting this information. I have a Yellow Aircraft F-16 that is begging for a turbine. I now know where I can go & get one for a reasonable price, and go from 10 lbs. of ducted fan thrust to 14 lbs. of turbine thrust!

Thanks again,

Greg Hames

[Paul DF jet man]

Paul,

I just spent last Wed, Thurs, & Fri at the Florida Jet Rally in Lakeland, FL. What a great event! There were plenty of used turbines for sale, but they were still more $ than the JJ1400.

Anyway, I appreciate you posting this information. I have a Yellow Aircraft F-16 that is begging for a turbine. I now know where I can go & get one for a reasonable price, and go from 10 lbs. of ducted fan thrust to 14 lbs. of turbine thrust!

Thanks again,

Greg Hames

You are more than welcome mate if i can help others enjoy jj turbines as much as i have that’s grate.

By the way 10 lb of thrust from a DF can be achieved on the ground but once in the air and at high speed like in an f-16 you will only be getting about 4 -5 lb of thrust if you are lucky. Hence the major limitation with DF.

Where as the turbine you still get the 13-14 lb of thrust all the time at most speeds as the e-flux of a turbine is SOOOOO much higher than a DF. you will be totally blown away at how much faster you F-16 will be with a turbine you just wait untill that first flight you will freak out :D


Make sure you get the new pump this will boost thrust as it provides a much better flow of fuel and the bullet starter looks and works really good.

[PREACHHAMES]

You Got It...new Pump & Bullet Starter.

Best Regards,

Greg Hames

[Jet Dreams]

I would love to have a turbine jet someday and with this unit it might just happen :D I have been thinking about buying one of these JJ1400 just to have sitting around for the day I am finally ready for turbine power :eek:


Erick

[Hovertime]

I wouldn't, technology in general and RC technology evolves so fast...

[sam_jetworks]

HI guys,

I don't fly jets but I did have some experience using engines build by Phil Heward from UK. He has built engines ranging from 20lbf to 150lbf and the prices are not that steep. For example the H20 wasp costs about USD1250. I am currently helping him out in the S-E Asia region in sales as well as technical support. If anyone is interested pls drop me a note. The last engine from him that I operated was a 100lbf engine and it was awesome. Unfortunately I cannot say was it was used on. Thanks

[treehog]

I don't fly jets but I did have some experience using engines build by Phil Heward from UK. He has built engines ranging from 20lbf to 150lbf and the prices are not that steep. For example the H20 wasp costs about USD1250. I am currently helping him out in the S-E Asia region in sales as well as technical support. If anyone is interested pls drop me a note.



Is there a web site about these engines

whats the back up in spares etc

h20 wasp $1250 is that with ECU tanks pumps electric start lipos???

Is there a self assembly versions

Can you start a seperate thread about these motors and thier suitability or non suitabilty for RC modelers

I expect that each year goes buy the price will drop dramatically and a lot of western european makers will bail out from the heat leaving a few who will probabably make under licence thier motors in China India far east factories at figures closer to $500 and I dont want to be caught out owning a $3000 motor with no manufactuer and spares if I invest in that type of motor

Ralf

[sam_jetworks]

Hi Treehog, the US1250 does include the entire set (ECU, pump, etc). Actually I forgot to post their website. It is www.heward-microjets.co.uk. They also sell self-fabrication instructions. Take a look at their website. So far their strength is in North America region. I am helping them in the Asian and Australian regions.

Regarding spares, Phil Heward has been around for more than 20 years, I reckon this will be his life business. Moreoever, since I will be slowly taking up more presence for them in the eastern part of the globe, making spares at cheaper costs is as you said the way to go in time to come. You have a point and I believe it will happen that way. Don't think it will be a concern for the next 5 years though.

Their motors are for RC modelers.

[sam_jetworks]

Hi Treehog, my apologies first for some incorrect information on the price. The kit itself is 799 pounds. This works out to be US1242 using exchange rate of 1.55 and this price does not include the full kit. A full auotstart kit would cost around 1425pounds or USD2216. My previous number of US1250 will mistaken as with full kit. Anyway please take a look at their website for more information. Again please accept my apology. Thanks.

[comanche3]

try http://www.hobbydirekt.de/product_info.php?language=en&products_id=501
Ships worldwide and costs only 1595€ with full autostart and 16lbs at 720g weight

[HELModels]

Turbines are awesome, but a part of modeling I'm unlikely to experience. :(

What I am wondering is about converting the blast to shaft power. You see helicopters with something bolted onto the back end, but it is hard to find specific info on these. For me atleast.

In the back of my mind I am thinking of a serial hybrid powered by a turbine. The turbine would only run at one speed and would turn a generator, instead of blades. Would running at one speed only and less than max RPM increase TBO?

The turbine is supposed to be the most efficient combustion cycle, from what I can understand. Simpler mechanically too, but obviously tedious to make.

Anyway, this is about model jets and helicopters, so if you can do jets then have fun and may us poor folks learn from you.

[Hovertime]

Turbines are unfortunatelly least efficient of all curently awailable combustion engines ....

[causeitflys]

http://www.jetcatusa.com/hp5.html

http://www.jethangar.com/Wren/turbo-shaft.jpg

[HELModels]

Turbines are unfortunatelly least efficient of all curently awailable combustion engines ....

I think you are right when it comes to model sized turbines, but dont confuse high rate of fuel consumption with inefficiency. Thermodynamic efficiency has to do with how much of possible BTU's of a fuel can a thermodynamic cycle turn to useful work. Turbine cycle very good at that, an IC piston engine is about the lousiest.

[DKjens]

I think you are right when it comes to model sized turbines, but dont confuse high rate of fuel consumption with inefficiency. Thermodynamic efficiency has to do with how much of possible BTU's of a fuel can a thermodynamic cycle turn to useful work. Turbine cycle very good at that, an IC piston engine is about the lousiest.

I think a turbine is still not anywhere near the efficience of a reciprocating engine. I believe 70-80% of the power produced goes right back into driving the engine.

If you compare two similar output reciprocating and turbine shaft engines, you will see that the turbine shaft engine consumes considerably more fuel.

DKjens

[HELModels]

I am on the right track about turbines being more efficient, but not until they are used in a combined cycle arrangement. That isnt going to happen with models any time soon. I'm obviously no expert and didnt mean to vear off with talk of efficiency of one type engine versus another. If the exhaust is too hot to touch, then there is wasted energy. I dont think that is what this discussion was intended, so pardon me.

I did ask for info on free turbines and someone provided a link. Thanks, the wren looks like a well made setup.

[rdresch]

I did a study on using my wren free turbine with a gearbox driving a generator(alternator) to power my 2 rotor V22 osprey. Mathematically it does not work. You lose 20 percent converting turbine power to electricity than another 20 percent converting it back to electrical power. Though there are loses with gears and belts etc they aren't as high. I know that in a ideal situation efficiency may be as high as 90 percent but 80 % is a more realistic number for a hobbyist. The biggest problem is all the weight a generator and motor will add. To heavy to fly. The turbine second stage and gearbox cone in at close to 7 lbs. Double that with the generator and motors. In the real world turbines biggest plus is in reliability. Their power to weight is also very high till you add in the extra fuel weight required.
Rudy

[gazza3535]

I have had my joe jet 1400 for 12 months now, no problems at all, it puts out 13lb of thrust and flys my composite roo fine, i am just about to put it in a jl t-45 hawk,
so i would say if you want a inexpensive (relietivly speaking) gas turbine i would have no fears about buying a joe jet, and as for spares i have emailed joe jet twice, just to enquire about spares (not that i have needed any) and they responded back to me inside of 24hrs

[jet-mad]

HELP PLEASE,
I want to buy a Jetjoe turbine kit. Anyone could tell me how to do it?
I tried their web site several times but had no luck, they don't answer emails, did not get any directions.
Richard.

[J Klenske]

The solution to your problem is to spend another $1k and get a Jetcat. It is what I did after I email Joejet and they didnt answer.

[jet-mad]

No way J Klenske, I can think of many things I can do with $1K-plus. Besides, what's wrong with the Jetjoes? they work well, are cheap, what else do you want? a famous name?. I've got the gut feeling all the other manufacturers are green with envy, looks like don't like or can't tolerate competition. I want a Jetjoe because I want to test it, see it in the flesh, so to speak. Please can anyone help with info please, how to buy from these guys? Anyone that has 'been there' and done it, please. Thanks.

[OzStriker]

It has been some time since this thread started, Paul are you still happy with the JJ1400? I am very close to buying one.

[Paul DF jet man]

:D It has been some time since this thread started, Paul are you still happy with the JJ1400? I am very close to buying one.



Hi mate :)

Well since I first posted in this thread I have come a long way in the turbine world and have had another 4 turbines since.

I moved onto Jet Cat’s P-60’s and P80’s and now the best of the lot IMO the G-boosters there just sooooooo good. I won’t change from G-booster any time soon. :D

Back to the JJ

They are cheap ! and for good reason. Mine lasted about 30 flights before it started playing up :confused: . I got one of the best guys in AUS to take it home and have a look at it and see what the problem was. It was a simple problem, the burner rods had been blocked with flux and it simply needed to be un blocked.

While this guy had it open he also made some internal changes (his trade secret) in his words. What ever he changed / did made the turbine really perform. :p

He also recommended the NEW ECU the one that WREN turbines use, so I purchased that as well.

When I first had it , it ran rough , had a slow ramp up speed and had only 4 kg of thrust.

Now it performs like a dream. Runs fine , quick ramp up and has 6 kg of thrust 13 lb. :D

I now run more expensive turbines $5000 + but I would have to say starting out with a JJ isn’t a bad way to gocost wise.

HOWEVER you will come across problems down the track and you will have to get them solved at some point.

I have spent about $3000+ dollars on this turbine now to get it to a proper working condition and don’t currently have it in a jet. As all my jets are to big now.

If you are interested in getting into turbines give me a call and I might be able to help you out with a cheap WORKING JJ1400 that’s already been heavily modified, tuned and tinkered with. I would rather you call me on 0439 891 550 any time so I can fill you in on the do's and don’t when it comes to turbines and that ever scary first purchase.

What ever you decide to do regardless im willing to help you out just like others did for me a few years ago. What goes around comes around and I feel obligated to do the same for you/ others.

Talk to you soon. :)

[OzStriker]

Many thanks Paul I will give you a buzz later today.
Cheers,
Tom