laws for RC

[bobert13581]

Hey

Are there any laws in Australia regarding flying in public spots like the local park?

[woodsy]

Well there are "Laws", "By-Laws", "Rules" and Common sense

Laws are set by federal and/or state governments.
As far as were concerned this covers definition of a “model” weights, size, purpose or use, frequencies we can fly on, restricted air space, etc

By-Laws are set by Local council.
Generally for us where you can fly locally providing not covered by above, from what I’ve been able to find out the local council MUST specifically prohibit the use of RC models or planes in a specific area, basically you can fly in any park or public open space as long as it’s not specifically banned OR specifically set aside for another use. Check with the local council I’ve always found them helpful, but don’t be put off by some jumped up council turd that says u cant, it must be specifically prohibited.

Rules are set by clubs, associations or they may be area (park) rules set by council (By-Laws).
If you flying in a public park you only have to worry about area (park) rules set by council (By-Laws) see above.

Common sense or what they like to call today “due diligence”
This is the sticky one, basically if something goes wrong (your model causes injury or damage) you MAY have to prove in a court of law that you had no reasonable way of knowing that something could go wrong. EG if you are flying a 500gram model in a big open area and it suddenly goes out of control and flies in to a car causing damage and/or injury
1. is it on legal frequency
2. was it airworthy before it flew away
3. are you experienced enough to fly that model
4. was the area “generally” appropriate for flying that type of model
5. were you complying with laws, by-laws
6. were the conditions appropriate for flying that type of model
that’s just a few pointers covering due diligence and I’m sure there are 100’s more people could think of, if you answer no to any of them you will probably get your ass sued and/or prosecuted, even if you did meet “due diligence” your probably still in deep brown stinky stuff for all costs but you wont end up with a criminal record

You can also fly on ANY private land as long as you get permission from the owner providing you are not in breach of laws are set by federal and/or state governments.


Phew hope that helps

[pldaniels]

Woodsy,

Thanks for that - it was actually quite informative.

I fly in a park that's made of about 4 cricket fields ajoined (Charters Towers hosts an annual Cricket competition known as the "Ashes" - almost every park is a cricketfield and we have a LOT of them for only 12,000 people). While I do fly my gliders and small electrics there and I do have the encouragement to fly from several council and sports people, it's always been something that was at the back of my mind - yes, I do also have MAAA insurance.

Paul.

[Jeremy_D]

Will MAAA Insurance cover you if you are in a park though? I was led to believe it only covers you on a registered MAAA Flying field? I guess at the end of the day common sense comes into play.. if the park is crowed with ppl don't fly.. we all know how Murphy's Law Likes to work in mysterious ways..lol.

[Mark in Aus]

but don’t be put off by some jumped up council turd that says u cant, it must be specifically prohibited.

So true.. Woodsy , you'll know this place. We used to Fly our Parkies at Mt Eliza reserve..heaps of people did. One mate thought he'd do the right thing and ask the council for some kind of ruling about what part of the reserve we could fly being that it wasn't in use and safe to do so.
2 days later there was signs everywhere banning RC Flying....Doh

Now we go to Baxter Park ,3 soccer/cricket grounds 2 huge football ovals and a massive free roam area. You'll always find someone flying there.
It's been the place to go since i was a kid. Must be a more understanding council I guess.
Even saw a bloke there who was with some surveyors ,he came over for a chat and turns out he's from council planning and he flies there.

[bobert13581]

... ask the council for some kind of ruling about what part of the reserve we could fly being that it wasn't in use and safe to do so.
2 days later there was signs everywhere banning RC Flying....Doh


Yeah I am a bit weary of that happening should I make a friendly enquiry.
Mabye I will frame my question as a 'just thinking about it/hypothetical/non detailed/maybe way

[woodsy]

Now we go to Baxter Park ,3 soccer/cricket grounds 2 huge football ovals and a massive free roam area.

From what i can find out aparently it is a designated flying area, it's even marked as such on some maps, technicaly your even alowed to fly glow there.

The story goes that when the park area was being developed they had a public meeting and just made a big list of all the things people said they wanted to do there, some one put there hand up and said RC flying. I wish it was so easy now.

[osmium_192]

Well, it really depends on what the local council decides, AND MOST IMPROTANTLY, the number of complaints. At a really nice HUGE open park, everythiing is not allowed. Cant bring your dog, no golfing, no dogs off leashes, nothing. When we fly RC we get asked to leave by the ranger (prob called up by residents). So you cant do anything on the field but walk around the edges.

THe only thing that seems to be allowed and isnt enforced is the driving of cars with the intention of doing wheel spins and making huge ruts everywhere. This isnt being stopped.

But theres another field near the river that is known to allow electrics so that isnt to bad. I guess that with the river on one side, the number of complaints is lower? Better not ask for permission.... incase it reminds them that RC is something evil.

Well more people get injured on the roads than by RC. And most RC things are self inflicted.

[grizzlymatt]

osmium 192 , where about did you fly in perth ,iam also in perth and used to fly at the uwa playing fields heaps of room and never anyone there until one day the caretaker asked me to leave cause i could hit someone even though there was nobody there at the time , the other places i have flown at is at Curtin Uni playinf fields and at an area in booragon down near the tompkins park around the Melville Bowling Club and Rugby feilds havent had any complains alot of intreasted people though

[osmium_192]

Im south of the river, kardinya

I usually fly at the, um dont know the name. getting street map..

Tompkins Park, near that cricket area on Dunkley Av. Page 308 of the (HOLY) 2002 UBD street directory. WOAH only just read your post properly, yeah tomkins park is where electrics are supposedly allowed. the cricket pitch on the western side has really smooth grass which we tend to use the corner of.

Or another place is a oval at the Alan Edwards Park where South street intersects North lake road. Its an oval with pine coniffers all around it, creating a somewhat wind barrier for smaller park fly planes. Its just really close to where i live so its convienent.
Sometimes cricket games occur here. And another park i used to go to is like the baseball HQ so every day theres 4 fields full of games but in a big square with golfing green smooth grass.


Owen

[Mark in Aus]

From what i can find out aparently it is a designated flying area, it's even marked as such on some maps, technicaly your even alowed to fly glow there.

I have seen glo models there, even Helis.
Biggest problem I've found besides worrying if I'm allowed to fly there is the Newbies that turn up with the ready to fly models. They Jump in head first not realising what they are doing. Never even been to a club just to see how it's done .

I remember flying at Mt-Eliza Oval and a guy turned up with a few Planes...took em out onto the Oval and just started Flying an electric glider while I was already in the Air. After speaking to him later found out he was using 3 different 36 meg crystals,one for each plane. All GWS gear.He assured me that His GWS gear would have no Effect with my JR gear even if they were the same channel because different brands are not compatible :eek: .
After that I sat at the Playground to let the kids play and watched this guy Destroy 1 GWS P-51 and 1 GWS Zero..... :(


Mark

[pldaniels]

Mark,

Interesting but sadly true story :(

The hobbiest in me cringes ... the sales man in me delights *cough* ;) [ get a chance to test that lipo in the hotter setup? ]

I tried to 'educate' the local toystore manager about using planes in the park - mostly because he saw nothing wrong with people flying glow-powered models (.40 size no less) ... "No one has complained". Tried to inform him that it only takes /one/ incident and that it's rather irresponsible to fly something like that in a park (even if it is a large park). I don't want to cry chicken-little (sky is falling) but really, sometimes you have to try and head off a looming disaster.

For now I'll keep flying my DLG's and small electrics.


Paul.

[Mark in Aus]

For now I'll keep flying my DLG's and small electrics

Same goes for me.
Not Into Glo and wouldn't even attempt to fly one in a Public Park.

[Mark in Aus]

[ get a chance to test that lipo in the hotter setup? ]
Not as yet but will on my next flying session.
Gave it a full charge today. 2105 mah. pretty darn good.

[pldaniels]

Mark,

The factory (FullRiver) is glad to see our results are going well. Mine here are still doing their job quite exceptionally well. 2105 is a pretty good capacity return, best I used to get out of smaller lipos like the ETEC700's was about 675mA, so 2105 is right up there.

Paul.

[Little John]

You have to fully conversant with council by-laws to get around flying on council property and ignorance is no excuse ie get a copy and read them. However unless it specifically says flying is not allowed you can fly until they add a new by-law. I have found that school ovals are classed as public parks NOT subject to council rules , this is before 7.00am and after 4.00pm and anytime on the weekend unless in some other use. I had a run in with the principal at the local school who happened to be working back concerned about danger to children lucky I knew the rules as children are not his problem after school hours and I explained that if they got that close I would stop flying. Most kids are'nt interested anyway, rather be home with a computer game So just remember school ovals are classed as PUBLIC PARKS not under council control to be for the use of all (before 7.00am and4.00pm weekdays and anytime scool is not in session)

[becsta]

... "scool ovals are classed as public parks..." ... in South Australia. In NSW they probably aren't, and you'll be taking a huge risk of jail time if you use school grounds/ovals without permission from the school. They're putting up cyclone fencing et al to keep people out of school grounds these days.

[woodsy]

I'm pretty sure in Vic were the same as SA but i'll chack and let u know

[steve wenban]

MAAA site list the MoPs that govern our hobby , However if there is no signage in exsistance stating that flying of model airplanes is prohibited then there is no legal reason for not flying there . Having said that local park with high volume traffic of joe public is a high risk factor for the uninsured so if you do fly there be it at your own risk of the legal implications if you do hit anyone . IMHO
SteveW
President West Sydney Slope Soarers

[cattleprod]

Hmmm. Awhile back a very friendly local bylaws bloke stopped to appreciate a small electric jet i was flying. After a bit he wonders over and tells me i am not allowed to fly RC planes here. Quick as a bat, i asked him what area in the park am i allowed to fly on? He had to go home and do some research, i never got the answer. I live in an area with about a dozen great parks within a coo-ee from home. Bottom line is, if the park/oval has people using it i don't get out of the car, i find another spot. I figure if Joe public doesn't have a reason to complain about me having fun, i can. Due caution and duty of care.

[osmium_192]

We can all argue that we can fly in any park without signs, but nomatter what we say, we shoud take care in ensuring that what we do doesnt put anyone at risk, inparticular people of the general public.

Like Roj says, we shouldnt fly where theres people, or in places where our planes can damage property. All it takes is an accident or two and then a few people will complain and politicians will then be able to pass laws that restrict RC to fields thousands of kilometres from the town centre. Just fly where you can minimise risk.

Remember to have fun though.

Owen

[Parkflyer81]

I found these pages will doing a little surfing on the web. All concern should have a read.

http://rrp.casa.gov.au/casr/101.asp

" -Height restrictions for unmanned moored balloons, kites, model aircraft and rockets to be raised from 300ft Above Ground Level (AGL) to 400ft AGL in line with overseas practice.
-Projectiles that are capable of reaching 400ft or more above ground level not to be used without CASA approval;
-Restrictions to apply to fireworks displays near aerodromes and, if a display is within 3 nautical miles of an aerodrome

-Exemptions that apply for domestic premises;

-Requirements under relevant state and territory laws will continue to apply."

Who knew that?? I didn't :(

Should really have a read if you plan to not fly in a so called "Safe fly zone."


Phill

Here is the link for CASA rules in pdf form. 35 page doc.
www.casa.gov.au/rules/1998casr/101/101c03.pdf

[pldaniels]

400ft AGL is still a fairly respectable height.

I usually get to about that with the QFII then come screaming down to hunt for another thermal. Beyond 300ft most planes are getting hard to see unless they're 2m or larger span.

Paul.

[Extreme_RC]

Hi Guys, just to hijack the thread for a minute, as I figure its gona be hi traffic :) Hello to all! am new member, vic based, interested in the melb guys and where they fly, been into glo since a kid, designed and built own planes, now many yrs on getting back into it the electric way.

My question is, what water based coating can I use to glass over foam wings?!? I have trolled through the US forums but cannot find any corss reference of what we have here in OZ that can be bought from your local hardware or bunnings. HELP!!!!! :))
Cheers!

[pldaniels]

Mocca,

Go to the local hardware store and get some Cabbots Crystal Clear. It's "water based polyurethane". You can also try get some water-based acrylic, not sure if it's available in clear though.

Paul.

[Extreme_RC]

Another night owl huh! thanks Paul, been surfing your site, I am trying to piece together alot of things right now as a mate wants to get back into RC also, have been looking at those small balsa ARF planes from World Hobby in Hong kong, but not too sure of their motors, You sell the GWS gearbox setups and outrunners right? Any experience with these planes, and do you keep an outrunner that would suit? Am looking at the Hotpoint which is 1m by 1m size, and about 300gram flying weight. (although I think it will be rather heavier than this with batteries etc).
Thanks dude!

[hyphen]

I wonder why, in all these answers, that no-one has suggested joining a club or if none is available, start one and be legal and INSURED. I wouldn't consider flying in a park with several other people without some sort of frequency control. No good arguing over whose fault it was after another (non flying) park user gets hurt.

[Parkflyer81]

400ft AGL is still a fairly respectable height.

I usually get to about that with the QFII then come screaming down to hunt for another thermal. Beyond 300ft most planes are getting hard to see unless they're 2m or larger span.


Ha, 400 ft AGL, I have troble dealling with 100ft AGL with out something goin really bad. I also tend to use HI vise colours if I can, hence the light blue on the EB. Fulro pink is not an option but. Never. :p

Phill

[pldaniels]

Phill,

I just recently sold a GWS pink transmitter, they're definately visible from 400ft ;) :p

I've got myself some of that holographic/prismatic chrome/metal vinyl from the local sign-writer shop, it doesn't help with orientation but it's a life saver when you're looking around the sky desperately for your 'missing glider'.

Paul.

[Parkflyer81]

I just recently sold a GWS pink transmitter, they're definately visible from 400ft ;) :p

I tell you what, being 400ft away from my TX in the field, would make me nervous. Let alone a pink one, I would definetly fly alone in that case. :p

I tend to keep my planes too close to the ground, but I don't think it would have made a difference last week end, Probably just saved on the crash clean up time :(

Phill

[Phildo]

Mark in Aus ... mate, what a laugh. The same thing happened to me the other day. Newbie turned up right next to me whilst I was buzzing around in this medium sized park. He said "Giday mate can you help me fly this?" Next second he has launched his EGO cessna RTF. The EGO has pitched up, nearly come straight down onto my head, veared off and nearly took out a group of elderly people watching me fly.
%#$@&#*!!!!!! Mate I told this moron off for not only trying to take my head off but not even checking what freq I was on. I had a bit of height on (for safety with specators - MAAA 30 meter rule) with my plane (formosa) and was able to land ok.
However the oldies came over to me AND GAVE ME A SERVE!! That was it moved to a new park .... And now I get weirdos with there pants pulled up FAR TO HIGH and long socks with sandles following me. I seriously thinking of driving the 25 kms to the club. At least there I wont get shot down!!