poor winter performance

[thateb@yahoo.com]

I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.

[\Doc\]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.

Putting a sock over the head will allow it to heat up better and keep the
snow from making direct contact with the cooling fins. If that doesn't
work, pick up a cheap stock head on e-bay and trim a few fins off with a
hacksaw or sawzall, then put the sock on the shorter head.

Doc

[DanTXD]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:a6idnTt9-q9BGhbenZ2dnUVZ_vmdnZ2d@adelphia.com...
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
>> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
>> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
>> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
>> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
>> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
>> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
>> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>
> Putting a sock over the head will allow it to heat up better and keep the
> snow from making direct contact with the cooling fins. If that doesn't
> work, pick up a cheap stock head on e-bay and trim a few fins off with a
> hacksaw or sawzall, then put the sock on the shorter head.
>
> Doc
>

Or just be brutal and lean it out a bit more ;-) All that lovely cold,
dense air, and a lean motor - it'll be seriously fast :D

--
Dan

[Mark Stevens]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>

The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or slightly
cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially with
running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler than you
think especially coming off the snow.

Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get an
improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real cars
so why should your model be any different...???)

Regards........Mark
(BlueWaveStudios)
www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)

[\Doc\]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
>> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
>> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
>> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
>> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
>> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
>> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
>> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>>
>
> The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
> running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or slightly
> cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially with
> running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler than
> you think especially coming off the snow.
>
> Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get an
> improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real
> cars so why should your model be any different...???)
>
> Regards........Mark
> (BlueWaveStudios)
> www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
>

Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects ignition
timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his truck run
better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine head that is
too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still gunna hit the
head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like bunk when he
hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.

Doc

[Mark Stevens]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:xZmdnQhSud9EIRbenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@adelphia.com ...
>
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>>
>> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
>>> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
>>> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
>>> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
>>> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
>>> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
>>> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
>>> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>>>
>>
>> The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
>> running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or slightly
>> cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially
>> with running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler
>> than you think especially coming off the snow.
>>
>> Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get an
>> improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real
>> cars so why should your model be any different...???)
>>
>> Regards........Mark
>> (BlueWaveStudios)
>> www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
>>
>
> Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects
> ignition timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his
> truck run better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine
> head that is too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still
> gunna hit the head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like
> bunk when he hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.
>
> Doc

MMM you have obviously never tried Hotplugs then have you, they run much
warmer than standard plugs so keep the heat up in the head where it is
required.
We get cold temperatures here a lot in the UK probably more so than warm
temps which are very rare...so yes I have used Hot Plugs on My nephews
Subaru Impreza which does both on and off road and it runs fine....If
anything I would recommend Enya Plugs as they seem to last the longest and
are very reliable.
I would certainly recommend trying the plugs first before hacking the fins
off the cylinder heads like the previous posts....here in the UK, a plug is
under £5 so why not give it a go first.
Trust me, I have been using I/C engines now since 1976, long before all
these fancy options were available and they still work fine for me now.
Even my Heli's (all 3 of them) get hotplugs when I fly in Winter temps and
they haven't let me down yet....only my fingers do that when it gets too
cold !!!

Regards........Mark
(BlueWaveStudios)
www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)

[Dre]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:xZmdnQhSud9EIRbenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@adelphia.com ...
>
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> >>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> >> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> >> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> >> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> >> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> >> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> >> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> >> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
> >>
> >
> > The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
> > running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or
slightly
> > cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially
with
> > running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler than
> > you think especially coming off the snow.
> >
> > Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get an
> > improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real
> > cars so why should your model be any different...???)
> >
> > Regards........Mark
> > (BlueWaveStudios)
> > www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
> >
>
> Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects
ignition
> timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his truck run
> better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine head that is
> too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still gunna hit the
> head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like bunk when he
> hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.
>
> Doc
>
Re the glow plug and ignition timing, is this due to the speed of the flame
as its ignited? ie a cooler plug potentially takes longer to ignite than a
hotter one?

Cheers Dre

[Mark Stevens]

"Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:438bc184$1@patrick.nettas.net...
> ""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
> news:xZmdnQhSud9EIRbenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@adelphia.com ...
>>
>> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
>> news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>> >
>> > <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> > news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>> >>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
>> >> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
>> >> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
>> >> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
>> >> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
>> >> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
>> >> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
>> >> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>> >>
>> >
>> > The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
>> > running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or
> slightly
>> > cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially
> with
>> > running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler
>> > than
>> > you think especially coming off the snow.
>> >
>> > Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get
>> > an
>> > improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real
>> > cars so why should your model be any different...???)
>> >
>> > Regards........Mark
>> > (BlueWaveStudios)
>> > www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
>> >
>>
>> Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects
> ignition
>> timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his truck run
>> better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine head that is
>> too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still gunna hit the
>> head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like bunk when he
>> hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.
>>
>> Doc
>>
> Re the glow plug and ignition timing, is this due to the speed of the
> flame
> as its ignited? ie a cooler plug potentially takes longer to ignite than
> a
> hotter one?
>
> Cheers Dre

It is, but again it is all temperature related, a cooler plug works well in
summer as it doesn't overheat due to the ambient air temperature...even when
running with Nitro Fuel...you try a Hot Plug in summer with Nitro Fuel and
your engine will be the first to tell you about it and complain by
Overheating and possibly seizing up. In Winter though where the ambient air
temp is much cooler you need to up the heat source and that is done by using
a hotter grade plug to counteract the cooler air temps.....it is still the
same engine and will lose heat very quickly through those big head fins
unless you can up the temp inside the head...hence use Hot Plugs. (Don't
forget the fuel in your tank will also be extremely cold so the plug has to
heat that too !!!!)

I think after 29 years experience with I/C Engines, I am pretty much
qualified to know what does and doesn't work.....give it a go.

My Nephews cars are running fine on hot plugs, first time starts and we are
on freezing temps here now with snow too !!!

Regards.....Mark

[Dre]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmggi5$f84$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
> news:438bc184$1@patrick.nettas.net...
> > ""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
> > news:xZmdnQhSud9EIRbenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@adelphia.com ...
> >>
> >> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> >> news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >> >
> >> > <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> >> > news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> >> >>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an
inch
> >> >> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through
the
> >> >> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was
cooling
> >> >> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> >> >> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the
cold
> >> >> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> >> >> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> >> >> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be
still
> >> > running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or
> > slightly
> >> > cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially
> > with
> >> > running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler
> >> > than
> >> > you think especially coming off the snow.
> >> >
> >> > Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get
> >> > an
> >> > improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for
Real
> >> > cars so why should your model be any different...???)
> >> >
> >> > Regards........Mark
> >> > (BlueWaveStudios)
> >> > www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
> >> >
> >>
> >> Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects
> > ignition
> >> timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his truck
run
> >> better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine head that
is
> >> too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still gunna hit
the
> >> head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like bunk when
he
> >> hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.
> >>
> >> Doc
> >>
> > Re the glow plug and ignition timing, is this due to the speed of the
> > flame
> > as its ignited? ie a cooler plug potentially takes longer to ignite
than
> > a
> > hotter one?
> >
> > Cheers Dre
>
> It is, but again it is all temperature related, a cooler plug works well
in
> summer as it doesn't overheat due to the ambient air temperature...even
when
> running with Nitro Fuel...you try a Hot Plug in summer with Nitro Fuel and
> your engine will be the first to tell you about it and complain by
> Overheating and possibly seizing up. In Winter though where the ambient
air
> temp is much cooler you need to up the heat source and that is done by
using
> a hotter grade plug to counteract the cooler air temps.....it is still the
> same engine and will lose heat very quickly through those big head fins
> unless you can up the temp inside the head...hence use Hot Plugs. (Don't
> forget the fuel in your tank will also be extremely cold so the plug has
to
> heat that too !!!!)
>
> I think after 29 years experience with I/C Engines, I am pretty much
> qualified to know what does and doesn't work.....give it a go.
>
> My Nephews cars are running fine on hot plugs, first time starts and we
are
> on freezing temps here now with snow too !!!
>
> Regards.....Mark
>
Ok, thanks for the info.

I've also been told that nitro content plays a part when selecting a glow
plug. How does this modify the equation?

Um, and also to ask a stupid question, whats an I/C engine? (ie what does
IC stand for?)

Cheers Dre

[Richard]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:xZmdnQhSud9EIRbenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@adelphia.com ...
>
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmg8j9$q43$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> >>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> >> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> >> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> >> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> >> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> >> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> >> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> >> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
> >>
> >
> > The proper answer would be to look at your Glow-Plug...you may be still
> > running on a cool or medium plug which is fine for summer use or
slightly
> > cooler weather, you may need to change to a Hot grade plug especially
with
> > running in snow...that air closer down to the ground will be cooler than
> > you think especially coming off the snow.
> >
> > Ask your Hobby shop for a Hot Grade plug and try one...you should get an
> > improvement on performance (Winter Grade Spark Plugs do exist for Real
> > cars so why should your model be any different...???)
> >
> > Regards........Mark
> > (BlueWaveStudios)
> > www.scale-models.co.uk (Moderator)
> >
>
> Curious................seeing as how glow plug temperature affects
ignition
> timing and nothing else, how is a hotter plug going to help his truck run
> better without addressing the root cause, which is an engine head that is
> too cold due to direct exposure to snow? The snow is still gunna hit the
> head, still super cool it, and it's still going to run like bunk when he
> hits huge snow drifts as the head temp is going to plummet.
>
> Doc

I would be interested to no what the head temperature (at the glow plug) was
like while running in the snow. This is always the best indication as to
how or why your truck is running like it is. I have heard people say that
blocking some of the fins on the head head will help get the temp up to a
decent running temperature when running in winter.

I may be wrong but I thought the general rule is to keep the temp about
170*F above ambient temperature.


Cheers
Richard

[Mark Stevens]

> I've also been told that nitro content plays a part when selecting a glow
> plug. How does this modify the equation?
>
> Um, and also to ask a stupid question, whats an I/C engine? (ie what does
> IC stand for?)
>
> Cheers Dre

Yes Nitro Content does play a part in selecting glow plugs but generally in
keeping with what I have said above, ie use cooler plugs in Summer and
Hotter Plugs in winter...don't forget as stated above, that fuel in your
tank will be colder in winter so your plug has to heat that up too...!!!

I/C by the way is Internal Combustion as in all Steam / Petrol / Glow /
Diesel / Jet engines......anything that burns fuel to make them work !!!!

Mark.

[Dre]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgkqs$410$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> > I've also been told that nitro content plays a part when selecting a
glow
> > plug. How does this modify the equation?
> >
> > Um, and also to ask a stupid question, whats an I/C engine? (ie what
does
> > IC stand for?)
> >
> > Cheers Dre
>
> Yes Nitro Content does play a part in selecting glow plugs but generally
in
> keeping with what I have said above, ie use cooler plugs in Summer and
> Hotter Plugs in winter...don't forget as stated above, that fuel in your
> tank will be colder in winter so your plug has to heat that up too...!!!
>
> I/C by the way is Internal Combustion as in all Steam / Petrol / Glow /
> Diesel / Jet engines......anything that burns fuel to make them work !!!!
>
> Mark.
>
Nice, I knew I/C stood for something totally obvious!

I've been told in the past however (from experts in the field) that nitro
content plays a *big* part in selecting the glow plug...

I'm a bit dubious about doing this as changing the plug will change the
combustion and would require a re-tune to suit. I do however agree with the
idea of covering *some* of the upper fins (ie wrapping the head to reduce
air flow) as this will increase the head temp, but keep the combustion in
tune.

Also to add in the colder weather, the air is more dense so to get around
this, you can richen your main mixture screw a tad to compensate.

Thoughts?

Cheers Dre

[Mark Stevens]

"Richard" <DK@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:438bd574@quokka.wn.com.au...
> I may be wrong but I thought the general rule is to keep the temp about
> 170*F above ambient temperature.
>
>
> Cheers
> Richard

I have never gotten into measuring head temps but have just followed the
good old general advice from people in the know and my own experience at
trying out the plugs to get where I am now.

I can vouch on the knowledge I have picked up over the years having tried it
for myself, I have never fried a head yet but have enjoyed many winter hours
driving with 2 nitro cars which start up first time perfectly on a very cold
day on hot plugs and will happily run till the batteries die or until I have
had enough and my fingers get too cold. The main point is the cars run
perfect and they do so everytime.

As mentioned earlier here on this thread, I fly my Heli's using Hotplugs in
winter now too, A bit more expensive to smash if I didn't have faith in
them.

Come summer they will ALL be back on cool plugs which is what they were
running on then.

For the price of a plug, give it a go at least. you will get to ENJOY your
winter driving !!!


Mark.

[Mark Stevens]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.

Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if you
use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your normal
car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there are
hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does away
with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your car
perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all that
fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow Plugs do
exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have used
them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
banging my head on a brick wall now !!!

Mark.

[Dre]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgn5v$juk$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> >I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
> > of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
> > snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
> > the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
> > without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
> > air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
> > use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
> > electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>
> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
you
> use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
normal
> car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there are
> hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does away
> with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your car
> perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all
that
> fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow Plugs
do
> exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have used
> them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
> banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
>
> Mark.
>
Um, but 1:1 cars are 4 stroke water cooled heads/blocks. Our RC's use 2
stroke *air* cooled heads/blocks. I really dont think you can compare spark
plugs with glow plugs like this.

Have a read of the engine tuning faqs on RC universe. You yourself say that
you dont tune with a temp gun and never have. Nitro engines today are
totally different in construction and metallurgy than in the past and have
to be run in and tuned in a different way to in the past.

Please follow your own advise and try out a temp gun, they are so cheap now
you might find you can get better performance with it.

For the record, I dont at all agree with your post above. Stating that
wrapping the head and tweaking your fuel mix is unneccesary is plain
incorrect, please have a look for other sources on trusted webpages on the
internet and you will see what I am talking about.

Cheers Dre

[\Doc\]

"Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:438bdade$1@patrick.nettas.net...
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmgkqs$410$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
>>
>> > I've also been told that nitro content plays a part when selecting a
> glow
>> > plug. How does this modify the equation?
>> >
>> > Um, and also to ask a stupid question, whats an I/C engine? (ie what
> does
>> > IC stand for?)
>> >
>> > Cheers Dre
>>
>> Yes Nitro Content does play a part in selecting glow plugs but generally
> in
>> keeping with what I have said above, ie use cooler plugs in Summer and
>> Hotter Plugs in winter...don't forget as stated above, that fuel in your
>> tank will be colder in winter so your plug has to heat that up too...!!!
>>
>> I/C by the way is Internal Combustion as in all Steam / Petrol / Glow /
>> Diesel / Jet engines......anything that burns fuel to make them work !!!!
>>
>> Mark.
>>
> Nice, I knew I/C stood for something totally obvious!
>
> I've been told in the past however (from experts in the field) that nitro
> content plays a *big* part in selecting the glow plug...
>
> I'm a bit dubious about doing this as changing the plug will change the
> combustion and would require a re-tune to suit. I do however agree with
> the
> idea of covering *some* of the upper fins (ie wrapping the head to reduce
> air flow) as this will increase the head temp, but keep the combustion in
> tune.
>
> Also to add in the colder weather, the air is more dense so to get around
> this, you can richen your main mixture screw a tad to compensate.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Cheers Dre

My thoughts, for what they're worth..............................(and yes
Mark, I have used hot plugs in the past; they belong in smallblocks and
low-nitro applications IMO). I use them during break in on big blocks but
pop medium cold or medium plugs in after break in.

Covering the head with a sock or removing a few fins works better because:

1) It's free (the sock)
2) It prevents supercooling by preventing contact of the fins with snow,
thereby providing a more balanced performance than a hot plug, which will
still bog when you bury it in a snow drift
3) No real need to retune other than for air temp and humidity
4) Ignition timing remains the same (no preignition) and potential
head/piston damage is thwarted
5) It looks goofy as hell!
6) The amount of heat saved using a sock or trimming a few fins far
outweighs the amount a dinky hot plug produces as compared to a medium-cold
plug.

And also, FWIW, steam engines are NOT I/C engines. I/C designates ignition
of the fuel within a cylinder or other confined space (hence the term
"internal") which thereby DIRECTLY provides power to the piston/crank. With
steam engines, the combustion is quite non-internal to the mechanical
workings of the engine. Sure, the stoves are sealed up pretty tight to
raise temps and heat the water better, but the combustion of the wood is
completely independent from the piston and crank movement. Now, if we were
exploding wood or coal inside the actual cylinder that would be a different
story <g>.

WRT nitro content, the higher the nitro the cooler the plug. Nitro reacts
with the platinum/iridium coil in the plug and acts as a catalyst for
combustion via an exothermic reaction. The more nitro in the fuel the more
heat is produced via this reaction therefore less heat is needed from the
plug itself. Nitro is also non-compressible which ups the compression ratio
which in turn also increases cylinder temps. Too much heat causes
preignition, or the fuel mixture lighting off while the piston is still
travelling UP on the compression stroke which causes a telltale "knock" or
"ping." Not enough heat causes retarted ignition where the mixture lights
off while the piston is travelling DOWN on the power stroke and causes boggy
performance.

I have no doubt you have lots of experience with I/C engines Mark, but your
understandings of their internal workings is inherently flawed. Perhaps
moving from a medium cold plug in the summer to a medium or medium hot might
be beneficial, but running a hot plug is overkill IMO. While it feels like
a huge temp difference to us, the difference between snow and sweat is only
50*.

Doc

[\Doc\]

"Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:438be2cf$1@patrick.nettas.net...

>> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
> you
>> use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
> normal
>> car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there are
>> hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does away
>> with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your car
>> perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all
> that
>> fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow Plugs
> do
>> exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have
>> used
>> them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
>> banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
>>
>> Mark.
>>
> Um, but 1:1 cars are 4 stroke water cooled heads/blocks. Our RC's use 2
> stroke *air* cooled heads/blocks. I really dont think you can compare
> spark
> plugs with glow plugs like this.
>
> Have a read of the engine tuning faqs on RC universe. You yourself say
> that
> you dont tune with a temp gun and never have. Nitro engines today are
> totally different in construction and metallurgy than in the past and have
> to be run in and tuned in a different way to in the past.
>
> Please follow your own advise and try out a temp gun, they are so cheap
> now
> you might find you can get better performance with it.
>
> For the record, I dont at all agree with your post above. Stating that
> wrapping the head and tweaking your fuel mix is unneccesary is plain
> incorrect, please have a look for other sources on trusted webpages on the
> internet and you will see what I am talking about.
>
> Cheers Dre

BINGO. You hit the nail on the head Dre. First, I've never seen nor used a
"Winter Spark Plug" and have been wrenching 1:1 vehix longer than 1:8 vehix.
Second, heat in a 4 stroke comes from the burn, NOT the spark plug which is
simply there to light it off. 4 strokes do not require heat to run, just a
spark. Third, and this is the clincher, we DO wrap the "heads" of 4 strokes
(gas/diesel) and 2 strokes (diesel) in the winter via blocking airflow to
the radiators using grill covers. I think ol' Mark needs to look at the
grill of the next big rig he sees on the road. I also think he needs to
reasses everything he "thinks" he knows about I/C engines as from what I can
see, he doesn't know a damn thing.

Doc

[Dre]

Inline..

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:37GdnQGvj6AIfhbenZ2dnUVZ_t-dnZ2d@adelphia.com...
>
>
> My thoughts, for what they're worth..............................(and yes
> Mark, I have used hot plugs in the past; they belong in smallblocks and
> low-nitro applications IMO).

Yes! this is exactly what I have been told and have read all along. Hot
plugs for low nitro apps.

> I use them during break in on big blocks but
> pop medium cold or medium plugs in after break in.
>
> Covering the head with a sock or removing a few fins works better because:
>
> 1) It's free (the sock)
> 2) It prevents supercooling by preventing contact of the fins with snow,
> thereby providing a more balanced performance than a hot plug, which will
> still bog when you bury it in a snow drift
> 3) No real need to retune other than for air temp and humidity
> 4) Ignition timing remains the same (no preignition) and potential
> head/piston damage is thwarted
> 5) It looks goofy as hell!
> 6) The amount of heat saved using a sock or trimming a few fins far
> outweighs the amount a dinky hot plug produces as compared to a
medium-cold
> plug.

Yep again, all follow my findings.

> And also, FWIW, steam engines are NOT I/C engines. I/C designates
ignition
> of the fuel within a cylinder or other confined space (hence the term
> "internal") which thereby DIRECTLY provides power to the piston/crank.
With
> steam engines, the combustion is quite non-internal to the mechanical
> workings of the engine. Sure, the stoves are sealed up pretty tight to
> raise temps and heat the water better, but the combustion of the wood is
> completely independent from the piston and crank movement. Now, if we
were
> exploding wood or coal inside the actual cylinder that would be a
different
> story <g>.
>
> WRT nitro content, the higher the nitro the cooler the plug. Nitro reacts
> with the platinum/iridium coil in the plug and acts as a catalyst for
> combustion via an exothermic reaction. The more nitro in the fuel the
more
> heat is produced via this reaction therefore less heat is needed from the
> plug itself. Nitro is also non-compressible which ups the compression
ratio
> which in turn also increases cylinder temps. Too much heat causes
> preignition, or the fuel mixture lighting off while the piston is still
> travelling UP on the compression stroke which causes a telltale "knock" or
> "ping." Not enough heat causes retarted ignition where the mixture lights
> off while the piston is travelling DOWN on the power stroke and causes
boggy
> performance.
>

Spot on, all of that is follows exactly what I have allways read and have
been told.

Cheers Dre

[Dre]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:2YadnV4E5p0DeBbeRVn-uw@adelphia.com...
>
> "Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
> news:438be2cf$1@patrick.nettas.net...
>
> >> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
> > you
> >> use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
> > normal
> >> car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there
are
> >> hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does
away
> >> with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your
car
> >> perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all
> > that
> >> fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow
Plugs
> > do
> >> exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have
> >> used
> >> them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
> >> banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
> >>
> >> Mark.
> >>
> > Um, but 1:1 cars are 4 stroke water cooled heads/blocks. Our RC's use 2
> > stroke *air* cooled heads/blocks. I really dont think you can compare
> > spark
> > plugs with glow plugs like this.
> >
> > Have a read of the engine tuning faqs on RC universe. You yourself say
> > that
> > you dont tune with a temp gun and never have. Nitro engines today are
> > totally different in construction and metallurgy than in the past and
have
> > to be run in and tuned in a different way to in the past.
> >
> > Please follow your own advise and try out a temp gun, they are so cheap
> > now
> > you might find you can get better performance with it.
> >
> > For the record, I dont at all agree with your post above. Stating that
> > wrapping the head and tweaking your fuel mix is unneccesary is plain
> > incorrect, please have a look for other sources on trusted webpages on
the
> > internet and you will see what I am talking about.
> >
> > Cheers Dre
>
> BINGO. You hit the nail on the head Dre. First, I've never seen nor used
a
> "Winter Spark Plug" and have been wrenching 1:1 vehix longer than 1:8
vehix.
> Second, heat in a 4 stroke comes from the burn, NOT the spark plug which
is
> simply there to light it off. 4 strokes do not require heat to run, just
a
> spark. Third, and this is the clincher, we DO wrap the "heads" of 4
strokes
> (gas/diesel) and 2 strokes (diesel) in the winter via blocking airflow to
> the radiators using grill covers. I think ol' Mark needs to look at the
> grill of the next big rig he sees on the road. I also think he needs to
> reasses everything he "thinks" he knows about I/C engines as from what I
can
> see, he doesn't know a damn thing.
>
> Doc
>

:)

I know and have seen the different heat range plugs for 1:1 cars, but have
never actually used them, cause I live in Australia, no need :) (I have had
the same type of plug in my ute which has run perfectly well in 45+ deg C
days and also in sub 0deg C days. Each time, started first go and ran
fine.)

I ran the Savage on the w/e too btw, in front of about 7 really pissed
blokes, they all loved it (judging by the laughs and shouts :) I put on a
nice show I reckon, did plenty of forwards wheelies, reverse wheelies,
jumps, rolls, crashes etc, was quite entertaining!

Gearbox is still not right, when I tightened 2nd down last time, I tightened
it too much :) back to 45/90deg adjustments again!

Cheers Dre

[DanTXD]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgfhi$slp$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> MMM you have obviously never tried Hotplugs then have you, they run much
> warmer than standard plugs so keep the heat up in the head where it is
> required.
> We get cold temperatures here a lot in the UK probably more so than warm
> temps which are very rare...so yes I have used Hot Plugs on My nephews
> Subaru Impreza which does both on and off road and it runs fine....If
> anything I would recommend Enya Plugs as they seem to last the longest and
> are very reliable.
> I would certainly recommend trying the plugs first before hacking the fins
> off the cylinder heads like the previous posts....here in the UK, a plug
> is under £5 so why not give it a go first.
> Trust me, I have been using I/C engines now since 1976, long before all
> these fancy options were available and they still work fine for me now.
> Even my Heli's (all 3 of them) get hotplugs when I fly in Winter temps and
> they haven't let me down yet....only my fingers do that when it gets too
> cold !!!

Personally, I use the same plug all year round (O.S. A3) and i've never had
a problem. I'm not even convinced that the snow supercooling it would be
much of a problem either really - last time I ran in snow I just re-tuned
slightly and it was fine.

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:438be6c0$1@patrick.nettas.net...
> Inline..
>
>
> Spot on, all of that is follows exactly what I have allways read and have
> been told.
>
>

To be fair, I've read all that too, and been told it before - but real world
experience tells me changing the plugs makes little difference, and running
in snow just requires a small re-tune :)

I understand all the theory, I'm just not sure it's strictly necessary!

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgmbv$lcl$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> "Richard" <DK@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:438bd574@quokka.wn.com.au...
>> I may be wrong but I thought the general rule is to keep the temp about
>> 170*F above ambient temperature.
>>
>>
>> Cheers
>> Richard
>
> I have never gotten into measuring head temps but have just followed the
> good old general advice from people in the know and my own experience at
> trying out the plugs to get where I am now.

Yup - never measured a head temp in my life :-) I tune on the day if the
engine doesn't sound or 'feel' right.

> I can vouch on the knowledge I have picked up over the years having tried
> it for myself, I have never fried a head yet but have enjoyed many winter
> hours driving with 2 nitro cars which start up first time perfectly on a
> very cold day on hot plugs and will happily run till the batteries die or
> until I have had enough and my fingers get too cold. The main point is the
> cars run perfect and they do so everytime.

The theory is so real substitute for the experience is it.

> As mentioned earlier here on this thread, I fly my Heli's using Hotplugs
> in winter now too, A bit more expensive to smash if I didn't have faith in
> them.
>
> Come summer they will ALL be back on cool plugs which is what they were
> running on then.
>
> For the price of a plug, give it a go at least. you will get to ENJOY your
> winter driving !!!
>

That's a fair point, a plug is only like, £3gbp. Personally, i'll just be
sticking with my A3s all winter through again :)

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgn5v$juk$1@news6.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133214871.190959.196010@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>I ran my monster gt recently through grass and gravel that had an inch
>> of snow cover. I noticed that it seemed rough when going through the
>> snow. It was about 25F that day. I figure that the snow was cooling
>> the engine too much. It ran as if I just started it up and drove
>> without a warm up. I adjusted the needle a bit more rich for the cold
>> air as well. What would you guys do to equip a nitro truck for snow
>> use? I would like to hit some really deep stuff this winter. The
>> electronics are in a box, so that is good. Thanks.
>
> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
> you use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
> normal car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but
> there are hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that
> does away with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make
> your car perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine
> in all that fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade
> Glow Plugs do exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!!
> ......But I have used them for a while now to know how well they
> work...Hopefully I can stop banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
>

But if you change the plug, you're almost certainly gonna have to adjust the
fuel mix anyway - plus, its not like its really a big job is it...

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:438be953$1@patrick.nettas.net...
> ""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
> news:2YadnV4E5p0DeBbeRVn-uw@adelphia.com...
>>
>
> I know and have seen the different heat range plugs for 1:1 cars, but have
> never actually used them, cause I live in Australia, no need :) (I have
> had
> the same type of plug in my ute which has run perfectly well in 45+ deg C
> days and also in sub 0deg C days. Each time, started first go and ran
> fine.)
>
> I ran the Savage on the w/e too btw, in front of about 7 really pissed
> blokes, they all loved it (judging by the laughs and shouts :) I put on a
> nice show I reckon, did plenty of forwards wheelies, reverse wheelies,
> jumps, rolls, crashes etc, was quite entertaining!
>
> Gearbox is still not right, when I tightened 2nd down last time, I
> tightened
> it too much :) back to 45/90deg adjustments again!
>

Yea I still need to fettle my gearbox as well - I hate that job :-)

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
news:2YadnV4E5p0DeBbeRVn-uw@adelphia.com...
>
> "Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
> news:438be2cf$1@patrick.nettas.net...
>
>>> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
>> you
>>> use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
>> normal
>>> car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there
>>> are
>>> hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does
>>> away
>>> with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your
>>> car
>>> perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all
>> that
>>> fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow Plugs
>> do
>>> exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have
>>> used
>>> them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
>>> banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
>>>
>>> Mark.
>>>
>> Um, but 1:1 cars are 4 stroke water cooled heads/blocks. Our RC's use 2
>> stroke *air* cooled heads/blocks. I really dont think you can compare
>> spark
>> plugs with glow plugs like this.
>>
>> Have a read of the engine tuning faqs on RC universe. You yourself say
>> that
>> you dont tune with a temp gun and never have. Nitro engines today are
>> totally different in construction and metallurgy than in the past and
>> have
>> to be run in and tuned in a different way to in the past.
>>
>> Please follow your own advise and try out a temp gun, they are so cheap
>> now
>> you might find you can get better performance with it.
>>
>> For the record, I dont at all agree with your post above. Stating that
>> wrapping the head and tweaking your fuel mix is unneccesary is plain
>> incorrect, please have a look for other sources on trusted webpages on
>> the
>> internet and you will see what I am talking about.
>>
>> Cheers Dre
>
> BINGO. You hit the nail on the head Dre. First, I've never seen nor used
> a "Winter Spark Plug" and have been wrenching 1:1 vehix longer than 1:8
> vehix. Second, heat in a 4 stroke comes from the burn, NOT the spark plug
> which is simply there to light it off. 4 strokes do not require heat to
> run, just a spark. Third, and this is the clincher, we DO wrap the
> "heads" of 4 strokes (gas/diesel) and 2 strokes (diesel) in the winter via
> blocking airflow to the radiators using grill covers. I think ol' Mark
> needs to look at the grill of the next big rig he sees on the road. I
> also think he needs to reasses everything he "thinks" he knows about I/C
> engines as from what I can see, he doesn't know a damn thing.
>

Also, I'd bet Pounds to Lira that if you changed the plug to a much hotter
one, you'd have to adjust the fuel mix anyway. I never use a sock myself,
but I think you get harsher temps than us over here anyway - the coldest
we're likely to get is about -5c, and thats rare.

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"DanTXD" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:3v2vvcF140g9vU1@individual.net...
>
> "Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
> news:438be953$1@patrick.nettas.net...
>> ""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
>> news:2YadnV4E5p0DeBbeRVn-uw@adelphia.com...
>>>
>>
>> I know and have seen the different heat range plugs for 1:1 cars, but
>> have
>> never actually used them, cause I live in Australia, no need :) (I have
>> had
>> the same type of plug in my ute which has run perfectly well in 45+ deg C
>> days and also in sub 0deg C days. Each time, started first go and ran
>> fine.)
>>
>> I ran the Savage on the w/e too btw, in front of about 7 really pissed
>> blokes, they all loved it (judging by the laughs and shouts :) I put on
>> a
>> nice show I reckon, did plenty of forwards wheelies, reverse wheelies,
>> jumps, rolls, crashes etc, was quite entertaining!
>>
>> Gearbox is still not right, when I tightened 2nd down last time, I
>> tightened
>> it too much :) back to 45/90deg adjustments again!
>>
>
> Yea I still need to fettle my gearbox as well - I hate that job :-)
>

P.s. Doc, I missed you on MSN - I was asleep, sorry!

--
Dan

[DanTXD]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgve0$aa5$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
>
> P.s...... Yes it is my experience with the older engines that keep them
> and the newer ones running sweetly too, they haven't changed that much
> over the years even with with Ducted Fan Engines, only the Jet Engines
> have changed and yes I have Jet turbines now too but I won't start here on
> this group....My F-15 is a real TopGun Machine !!!!!
>
> Mark.

See, isn't it much nicer when everyone just relaxes :D

By the way, in case anyone hadn't picked it up from the Pipes thread, the OP
runs a .28
(http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFunction=ShowSpecification&ItemID=23755)
MGT. Personally, no experience of this exact engine, but i've had a hand in
several TTR Pro 21s, and have had a couple of .28s myself. God that SH was
powerful - made the K4.6 i have now look slow... Ahhhh what a solid motor
the Pro 21 is. <trips off down memory lane>

Might just have to get me one of those new OS .30s.

I've gone off on a tangent here havn't I :)

--
Dan

[thateb@yahoo.com]

wow, quite a thread. Thanks for all of the banter. Ill give the sock
theory a shot since Im an hour away from a hobby shop. If that doesnt
do it, Ill get a hotter plug. What one should I try? Ive got a McCoy
MC-59 in it now. Oh, again it is a monster gt with the 4.6 TT engine.
Say, is it possible that the sock would ice up and and then cause the
motor to overheat? Thanks again

[DanTXD]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133281818.511168.251100@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com...
> wow, quite a thread. Thanks for all of the banter. Ill give the sock
> theory a shot since Im an hour away from a hobby shop. If that doesnt
> do it, Ill get a hotter plug. What one should I try? Ive got a McCoy
> MC-59 in it now. Oh, again it is a monster gt with the 4.6 TT engine.
> Say, is it possible that the sock would ice up and and then cause the
> motor to overheat? Thanks again
>

I should imagine, the sock will be hot enough to melt any snow quick enough
for it not to be an issue. I've also seen it done with tin foil by the
way - should stop any snow touching the head at all really.

--
Dan

[M78Ultra]

The hotter plug would be an MC-9...
BTW...A hot plug will not last as long as a medium temp plug..(why I stopped
running them/had to change them too often)

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133281818.511168.251100@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com...
> wow, quite a thread. Thanks for all of the banter. Ill give the sock
> theory a shot since Im an hour away from a hobby shop. If that doesnt
> do it, Ill get a hotter plug. What one should I try? Ive got a McCoy
> MC-59 in it now. Oh, again it is a monster gt with the 4.6 TT engine.
> Say, is it possible that the sock would ice up and and then cause the
> motor to overheat? Thanks again
>

[M78Ultra]

Actually, you should be fine with the MC-59...
The MC-9 is a racing plug and should be used with 25% + nitro...
Depending where you read on/about the plugs they may be listed as hot or
cold...
(e.g. The MC-9 is listed as a "cold" plug, however, it is the "hot" racing
plug for higher nitro content..)

"M78Ultra" <M78Ultra@REMOVEtriad.rr.com> wrote in message
news:fb2jf.8551$3o6.1699457@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> The hotter plug would be an MC-9...
> BTW...A hot plug will not last as long as a medium temp plug..(why I
stopped
> running them/had to change them too often)
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133281818.511168.251100@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com...
> > wow, quite a thread. Thanks for all of the banter. Ill give the sock
> > theory a shot since Im an hour away from a hobby shop. If that doesnt
> > do it, Ill get a hotter plug. What one should I try? Ive got a McCoy
> > MC-59 in it now. Oh, again it is a monster gt with the 4.6 TT engine.
> > Say, is it possible that the sock would ice up and and then cause the
> > motor to overheat? Thanks again
> >
>
>

[M78Ultra]

http://www.excelsiorweb.com/rcair/glowplug.asp
Haven't tried them but an MC-8 is supposed to be "longlife" with somekind of
platinum core....
Sorry if I am making anybody else, along with myself, more confused.... LOL

"M78Ultra" <M78Ultra@REMOVEtriad.rr.com> wrote in message
news:Cp2jf.8108$xD5.2731526@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> Actually, you should be fine with the MC-59...
> The MC-9 is a racing plug and should be used with 25% + nitro...
> Depending where you read on/about the plugs they may be listed as hot or
> cold...
> (e.g. The MC-9 is listed as a "cold" plug, however, it is the "hot" racing
> plug for higher nitro content..)
>
> "M78Ultra" <M78Ultra@REMOVEtriad.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:fb2jf.8551$3o6.1699457@twister.southeast.rr.c om...
> > The hotter plug would be an MC-9...
> > BTW...A hot plug will not last as long as a medium temp plug..(why I
> stopped
> > running them/had to change them too often)
> >
> > <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:1133281818.511168.251100@o13g2000cwo.googlegr oups.com...
> > > wow, quite a thread. Thanks for all of the banter. Ill give the sock
> > > theory a shot since Im an hour away from a hobby shop. If that doesnt
> > > do it, Ill get a hotter plug. What one should I try? Ive got a McCoy
> > > MC-59 in it now. Oh, again it is a monster gt with the 4.6 TT engine.
> > > Say, is it possible that the sock would ice up and and then cause the
> > > motor to overheat? Thanks again
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

[\Doc\]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmgtta$980$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Yes I have tried winter grade plugs on my own car but that was a Manta GTE
> years ago, I am on my 2nd BMW now with no problems starting in winter but
> I will stick by what I have said for the model engines, My nephews newest
> car ( The 2 Fast 2 Furious Nissan Skyline) has a brand new engine in it
> (GX-12), tried it on cooler plugs first for running it in (brand new
> engine) but didn't do so well so upped plugs, afer running in, to hotter
> grade as it is November now...car now runs like stink on 16 % nitro and 4
> wheel drive...even the Old scooby my nephew has is running around happily
> on hot plugs on .10 engine on 10% fuel it does doughnuts brilliantly and
> it is only rear wheel drive !!!!.......mmm will have to try it on some 16%
> fuel lol
>
> Mark.

You just made my point for me. A dinky .12 will run like poop with anything
less than a hot plug. Hot plugs are designed for smallblocks and low nitro
applications (like your 10% and 16%). Take a .25 or .28 running on 20% or
30% and we're talking a whole different ball of wax.

Doc

[thateb@yahoo.com]

I drove the truck with a sock on the head of the motor until it
stalled. The temp gage read 320 degrees F. Not good. Im using a
modified meat thermometer. I pulled the sock and richened it even more
and it ran OK unless it was throwing snow on the motor. Then I lost
front wheel drive. The little front universal joint ball cup screw
came out. Bummer! And today it is snowing heavily and I want to
drive. Im thinking of getting a CVEC pipe that is sold for the savage
..28. Will this help idling? And is it a good fit for the MGT?

"Doc" wrote:
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmgtta$980$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
> > Yes I have tried winter grade plugs on my own car but that was a Manta GTE
> > years ago, I am on my 2nd BMW now with no problems starting in winter but
> > I will stick by what I have said for the model engines, My nephews newest
> > car ( The 2 Fast 2 Furious Nissan Skyline) has a brand new engine in it
> > (GX-12), tried it on cooler plugs first for running it in (brand new
> > engine) but didn't do so well so upped plugs, afer running in, to hotter
> > grade as it is November now...car now runs like stink on 16 % nitro and 4
> > wheel drive...even the Old scooby my nephew has is running around happily
> > on hot plugs on .10 engine on 10% fuel it does doughnuts brilliantly and
> > it is only rear wheel drive !!!!.......mmm will have to try it on some 16%
> > fuel lol
> >
> > Mark.
>
> You just made my point for me. A dinky .12 will run like poop with anything
> less than a hot plug. Hot plugs are designed for smallblocks and low nitro
> applications (like your 10% and 16%). Take a .25 or .28 running on 20% or
> 30% and we're talking a whole different ball of wax.
>
> Doc

[\Doc\]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133382861.217117.132960@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>I drove the truck with a sock on the head of the motor until it
> stalled. The temp gage read 320 degrees F. Not good. Im using a
> modified meat thermometer. I pulled the sock and richened it even more
> and it ran OK unless it was throwing snow on the motor. Then I lost
> front wheel drive. The little front universal joint ball cup screw
> came out. Bummer! And today it is snowing heavily and I want to
> drive. Im thinking of getting a CVEC pipe that is sold for the savage
> .28. Will this help idling? And is it a good fit for the MGT?

Sounds like it needed to be retuned anyways if you had to richen the HSN
after removing the sock. Perhaps it was running so cold before that it was
covering up the fact that it needed a retune. I'd try it again (leave the
top of the sock open) with the retune and see how she does. If it's still
too hot, try trimming the sock down to expose a few fins. It will require
some trial and error but you will get it right eventually. My Sportwerks
..26 (same engine as Mach .26 in your MGT with a different carb) runs
280-300* on a hot day so 320* isn't all that bad. I find it runs best
between 260*-290*.

The question is, how did it run before it stalled out?

Doc

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

> "Doc" wrote:
>> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
>> news:dmgtta$980$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk...
>> > Yes I have tried winter grade plugs on my own car but that was a Manta
>> > GTE
>> > years ago, I am on my 2nd BMW now with no problems starting in winter
>> > but
>> > I will stick by what I have said for the model engines, My nephews
>> > newest
>> > car ( The 2 Fast 2 Furious Nissan Skyline) has a brand new engine in it
>> > (GX-12), tried it on cooler plugs first for running it in (brand new
>> > engine) but didn't do so well so upped plugs, afer running in, to
>> > hotter
>> > grade as it is November now...car now runs like stink on 16 % nitro and
>> > 4
>> > wheel drive...even the Old scooby my nephew has is running around
>> > happily
>> > on hot plugs on .10 engine on 10% fuel it does doughnuts brilliantly
>> > and
>> > it is only rear wheel drive !!!!.......mmm will have to try it on some
>> > 16%
>> > fuel lol
>> >
>> > Mark.
>>
>> You just made my point for me. A dinky .12 will run like poop with
>> anything
>> less than a hot plug. Hot plugs are designed for smallblocks and low
>> nitro
>> applications (like your 10% and 16%). Take a .25 or .28 running on 20%
>> or
>> 30% and we're talking a whole different ball of wax.
>>
>> Doc
>

[M78Ultra]

I don't think a pipe will help your idle that much..( If your motor is
sealed at all the connections now with a good factory pipe, it is probably a
tuning/other non pipe related problem more than likely)
IIRC.. The CVEC is for .21-.28 engines I believe, so it should be no
problem...just be sure to get the long 3 piece pipe (Savage style) and NOT
the short 2 piece style (like for a T-Maxx)..
Blue Lock-Tite all your grub screws!
Keep in mind, that any resistance to your truck ...snow, grass, mud,
whatever it may be, will cause your truck to run at a higher temp...
You also may want to try a different fuel to see what effects on
performance/tuning it may have...

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133382861.217117.132960@g49g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> I drove the truck with a sock on the head of the motor until it
> stalled. The temp gage read 320 degrees F. Not good. Im using a
> modified meat thermometer. I pulled the sock and richened it even more
> and it ran OK unless it was throwing snow on the motor. Then I lost
> front wheel drive. The little front universal joint ball cup screw
> came out. Bummer! And today it is snowing heavily and I want to
> drive. Im thinking of getting a CVEC pipe that is sold for the savage
> .28. Will this help idling? And is it a good fit for the MGT?
>

[thateb@yahoo.com]

I will try to explain how it was running the other day. Starting it
was easy considering how cold it was. It seemed that if I wasnt really
heavy with the throttle it would seem to load up a bit. It sounded
like a chainsaw that has a miss. Then it would clear up and scream
with the throttle nailed. If it flipped over, I would go tip it right
side up and have to ease the throttle open slowly otherwise it would
stall. It seems to me that there is a rather fine line between too
rich, lean, cold, and hot. I noticed that there is considerable
resistance at top dead center. It is very stiff at that point even
with the plug removed. Im guessing that the cylinder is taperred and
might not be fully broken in. Oh yeah, I think I bent a out drive
shaft too. Oops. I noticed one wobbles a bit.

[Richard]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133398211.858149.255610@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com...
> I will try to explain how it was running the other day. Starting it
> was easy considering how cold it was. It seemed that if I wasnt really
> heavy with the throttle it would seem to load up a bit. It sounded
> like a chainsaw that has a miss. Then it would clear up and scream
> with the throttle nailed. If it flipped over, I would go tip it right
> side up and have to ease the throttle open slowly otherwise it would
> stall. It seems to me that there is a rather fine line between too
> rich, lean, cold, and hot. I noticed that there is considerable
> resistance at top dead center. It is very stiff at that point even
> with the plug removed. Im guessing that the cylinder is taperred and
> might not be fully broken in. Oh yeah, I think I bent a out drive
> shaft too. Oops. I noticed one wobbles a bit.
>

I've been trying to follow this thread as best as possible with a news
server that keeps crashing and just noticed a comment that you made about
the engine "might not be fully broken in", so I have to ask:

Is this a new truck or motor or both? Sorry if this seems like a silly
question to all but I only ask because of what I have read.


Cheers
Richard

[DanTXD]

"Richard" <DK@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:438eb59e$1@quokka.wn.com.au...
>
> <thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1133398211.858149.255610@z14g2000cwz.googlegr oups.com...
>> I will try to explain how it was running the other day. Starting it
>> was easy considering how cold it was. It seemed that if I wasnt really
>> heavy with the throttle it would seem to load up a bit. It sounded
>> like a chainsaw that has a miss. Then it would clear up and scream
>> with the throttle nailed. If it flipped over, I would go tip it right
>> side up and have to ease the throttle open slowly otherwise it would
>> stall. It seems to me that there is a rather fine line between too
>> rich, lean, cold, and hot. I noticed that there is considerable
>> resistance at top dead center. It is very stiff at that point even
>> with the plug removed. Im guessing that the cylinder is taperred and
>> might not be fully broken in. Oh yeah, I think I bent a out drive
>> shaft too. Oops. I noticed one wobbles a bit.
>>
>
> I've been trying to follow this thread as best as possible with a news
> server that keeps crashing and just noticed a comment that you made about
> the engine "might not be fully broken in", so I have to ask:
>
> Is this a new truck or motor or both? Sorry if this seems like a silly
> question to all but I only ask because of what I have read.
>

Yea I just picked up on that as well? Did you get it from new? How much
fuel has it had through it? Did you follow the breakin procedure?


--
Dan

[thateb@yahoo.com]

probably ten or fifteen tanks through it now. I got the truck new a
few months ago. I ran a few tanks through it at a very rich setting at
moderate throttle usage for break in.

[DanTXD]

<thateb@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1133454375.051616.154250@g14g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> probably ten or fifteen tanks through it now. I got the truck new a
> few months ago. I ran a few tanks through it at a very rich setting at
> moderate throttle usage for break in.
>

Hmm, should be loosened up by now really. Seems like a low end tuning
problem to me. Try leaning the low end a 1/4 turn in. If that doesn't
help, put it back, and try richening it a 1/4 turn out.

--
Dan

[Mark Stevens]

"DanTXD" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:3v3023F12es7oU1@individual.net...
> ""Doc"" <nospam@noway.com> wrote in message
> news:2YadnV4E5p0DeBbeRVn-uw@adelphia.com...
>>
>> "Dre" <blah@somewhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:438be2cf$1@patrick.nettas.net...
>>
>>>> Wrapping the head and adjusting the fuel mix is totally un-necessary if
>>> you
>>>> use the right grade plugs, as a good example...do you do this to your
>>> normal
>>>> car parked outside every winter ...??? The big answer is NO but there
>>>> are
>>>> hotgrade spark plugs available for your car for winter use that does
>>>> away
>>>> with all that rubbish, why..??? because they burn hotter to make your
>>>> car
>>>> perform better in the cold months so no need to wrap your engine in all
>>> that
>>>> fancy crap so why do it with your glow-engine...??? Hot Grade Glow
>>>> Plugs
>>> do
>>>> exactly the same job !!! No I don't sell them...!!!! ......But I have
>>>> used
>>>> them for a while now to know how well they work...Hopefully I can stop
>>>> banging my head on a brick wall now !!!
>>>>
>>>> Mark.
>>>>
>>> Um, but 1:1 cars are 4 stroke water cooled heads/blocks. Our RC's use 2
>>> stroke *air* cooled heads/blocks. I really dont think you can compare
>>> spark
>>> plugs with glow plugs like this.
>>>
>>> Have a read of the engine tuning faqs on RC universe. You yourself say
>>> that
>>> you dont tune with a temp gun and never have. Nitro engines today are
>>> totally different in construction and metallurgy than in the past and
>>> have
>>> to be run in and tuned in a different way to in the past.
>>>
>>> Please follow your own advise and try out a temp gun, they are so cheap
>>> now
>>> you might find you can get better performance with it.
>>>
>>> For the record, I dont at all agree with your post above. Stating that
>>> wrapping the head and tweaking your fuel mix is unneccesary is plain
>>> incorrect, please have a look for other sources on trusted webpages on
>>> the
>>> internet and you will see what I am talking about.
>>>
>>> Cheers Dre
>>
>> BINGO. You hit the nail on the head Dre. First, I've never seen nor
>> used a "Winter Spark Plug" and have been wrenching 1:1 vehix longer than
>> 1:8 vehix. Second, heat in a 4 stroke comes from the burn, NOT the spark
>> plug which is simply there to light it off. 4 strokes do not require
>> heat to run, just a spark. Third, and this is the clincher, we DO wrap
>> the "heads" of 4 strokes (gas/diesel) and 2 strokes (diesel) in the
>> winter via blocking airflow to the radiators using grill covers. I think
>> ol' Mark needs to look at the grill of the next big rig he sees on the
>> road. I also think he needs to reasses everything he "thinks" he knows
>> about I/C engines as from what I can see, he doesn't know a damn thing.

Snip...I did not mention about wrapping any heads in smelly socks or
whatever I was against that idea myself, scroll back up the posts, I only
suggested using warmer plugs which do work for some compared to others,
depending on where you are in the states I am probably a bit further north
towards the artic circle in the UKand close to the 2nd Highest Mountain in
the UK, so yes the warmer plugs work fine for me, If you have plugs that
work fine for you then stick to them...!!!


Mark.

[DanTXD]

"Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
news:dmo5j1$6bm$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
>
> Anyway.........If you have found plugs that work well for you then stick
> to them....otherwise experiment a bit and see what gives the best
> results....without having to resort to socks or foil wrapped around the
> heads.
>
> Regards.....Mark.
>

Did a little googling, those early engines are quite interesting actually!

Well as i say, i've never used a temp gun, or a sock, or foil - but in the
UK we don't have the extremes of climate some of the other posters here
have. The only times i've used a different type of plug, has just been, as
you say, to experiment, and i've always found i've got worse performance
with anything other than an A3 - so that's all I use these days :)

I'm willing to accept tho, that if i was running in seriously cold
conditions, which i have never really done, that i might need a different
plug, or to even add a sock to the heatsink. Apparantly this is gonna be
the worst winter for a while, so i guess we'll see soon!

--
Dan

[Mark Stevens]

"DanTXD" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:3vb8qnF14meghU1@individual.net...
> "Mark Stevens" <spamspamspam@spam.com> wrote in message
> news:dmo5j1$6bm$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
>>
>> Anyway.........If you have found plugs that work well for you then stick
>> to them....otherwise experiment a bit and see what gives the best
>> results....without having to resort to socks or foil wrapped around the
>> heads.
>>
>> Regards.....Mark.
>>
>
> Did a little googling, those early engines are quite interesting actually!
>
> Well as i say, i've never used a temp gun, or a sock, or foil - but in the
> UK we don't have the extremes of climate some of the other posters here
> have. The only times i've used a different type of plug, has just been,
> as you say, to experiment, and i've always found i've got worse
> performance with anything other than an A3 - so that's all I use these
> days :)
>
> I'm willing to accept tho, that if i was running in seriously cold
> conditions, which i have never really done, that i might need a different
> plug, or to even add a sock to the heatsink. Apparantly this is gonna be
> the worst winter for a while, so i guess we'll see soon!
>
> --
> Dan

Cheers Dan, Hope whatever happens you still enjoy your winter driving. Enjoy
the reading on the early engines too, I had a lot of fun with them, still
got a few of them too and they all work Fine. Yes, I do have more up to date
engines now too but it seems a waste to bin the old engines if they work Ok.

Regards........Mark.