Pinnacle High start

[Mirage1]

Has anyone used the Pinnacle extra large high start . Supposed to be for large sailplanes 4 meters or larger? I received mine today and it is huge. I did not get any directions as far as how much you can stretch it. I assume you must have to put a scale on it and check tension.

[histarter]

My Pinnacle used red rubber and the stretch was 4 to 1 max. At 3 to 1, the HD version hit close to 15 lbs tension, and I could handle it until 9 years ago.

Since then I use the 2M version, and it hits 10 lbs before 4 to 1. :o
I have standardized at 3 to 1, and the start is still going strong for the last 6 years. 4 years ago I stopped flying 3 times per week, so the number of launches on it is quite high. :)

This was the best launching package I purchased. :D

[dgoebel]

I use a cheap digital fish scale to measure tension on mine. 8 lbs of tension in 15 mile per hour surface winds will almost bend a wing joiner of a GP Spirit 2M..... I've launched my Oly II with 10 lbs.
I agree with histarter, my pinnacle HS has lasted longer than I expected....
PS, use a GOOD stake on both ends if you stake it under tension....

[Mirage1]

I tried to use the high start today and I was up to 24# on my fish scale before it was stretched 60 paces. I could not hardly hang on to it. I have some high grass on the section the rubber was laying on and it is slightly downhill from the launch area. Is it possible for that to add enough friction to make it pull so hard so soon?

[histarter]

I tried to use the high start today and I was up to 24# on my fish scale before it was stretched 60 paces. I could not hardly hang on to it. I have some high grass on the section the rubber was laying on and it is slightly downhill from the launch area. Is it possible for that to add enough friction to make it pull so hard so soon?
Nope, sounds like you have the Heavy Duty version with 1/2 inch tubbing! Also, you may have a 'fishermans favorite' Fishscale (with built in liar compenation), or your rubber is less than 50 feet, or your paces are bigger than 30 inch. :confused:

My old rusty spring fish scale was used for years, and may be a poor ref.

[I count paces on one foot (polish style), so I don't have to count more than 30, and each polish pace is equal to 5 feet.] :)

The HD put muscle on my right arm that is still impressive at the age of 70! :o

[Mirage1]

I went out to the garage and measured it and it is 5/8" outside diameter, 3/8" ID and of course 1/8' wall. I bet you can get 50 pounds tension on that easy. I may have to email NSP and see what they say. It is 100 foot long rubber and 375 feet of heavy duty cord.

[Robglover]

Mirage -
That rubber is stronger than you are. Stretch it back as far as you can. We don't need no steenkin scales.

[rict]

I went out to the garage and measured it and it is 5/8" outside diameter, 3/8" ID and of course 1/8' wall. I bet you can get 50 pounds tension on that easy. I may have to email NSP and see what they say. It is 100 foot long rubber and 375 feet of heavy duty cord.

Mirage1,

According to my "handy dandy atomic high-start calculator" (an Excel spreadsheet with the calcs for OD, ID, and wall built-in), with those measurements, you'll get 34.6 lbs at max usable stretch, which translates to being able to launch a 109.4 oz (6.8lb) plane (assuming you want a 5:1 tension:weight ratio).

Ric

[Mirage1]

I guess the next question would be does one person have the strength to hold the plane for more than a couple of seconds and how does 34 # compare to a winch launch? Have I designed my wing spar strong enough?

[rict]

I guess the next question would be does one person have the strength to hold the plane for more than a couple of seconds and how does 34 # compare to a winch launch? Have I designed my wing spar strong enough?


Well, I can't answer the second question, but I used to use a heavy-duty high start pulled to 18lbs tension to launch my Combat Models F-16 slope soarer (48-54 oz AUW) on flat ground; Difficult but possible.

34lbs? One handed? Trying to control the launch angle, while holding the TX in the other hand? Not this kid!

Ric

[Goinav8n]

Pull it back until your arm starts shaking...... then go back 5 more steps. Throw it level and you should be OK

Jeff

[Eyefly]

Stretch it out untill your body has to lean like the guy in this video. You should have several beads of sweat running down your forehead by this time. You will not really have to let go. Your body will simply give out...

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=551330

Alex

[aeajr]

Has anyone used the Pinnacle extra large high start . Supposed to be for large sailplanes 4 meters or larger? I received mine today and it is huge. I did not get any directions as far as how much you can stretch it. I assume you must have to put a scale on it and check tension.

I have a Pinnacle XL but mine has 1/2" red rubber 100' long. I have replaced the original line with 400 feet of pink braded mason line, similar to the original.

I use it to launch a 2M RES Spirit at 1.5X stretch and 12 pounds of pull. I also launch an 80 ounce Legend at 2.5X stretch on 400 feet of line which gives me about 24 punds of pull as measured on a fish scale. That is as much as I can hold and still control the plane alone. More pull than that and it takes two people to do the launch, as shown in the photo. I typically don't use it unless I have some breeze to help the plane get up to speed.

Funny story: I bought this hi-start used, when I first started. I had no idea what I was buying. When I showed it to the guys in the club, they said it would tear the wings off the Spirit. So far so good.

Then I said I was going to launch the Legend with it and they said it would never get the Legend up. Clearly that was wrong too.

One of the guys in the club loves this hi-start for launching his 100" plane. He calls it the "big bear".

I now host one of the club winches so I now use that to launch, but I would have no hesitation to launch a 100 ounce 4 M plane with this if I could pull it back far enough. I used this hi-start 100s of times to launch these and other 2M 25 ounce to 3M 80 ounce planes.

[histarter]

aeajr,

You have a copy of my HD. It did work with my 80 ounce Ellipse, and a friends 4 mtr. We usually fly with winds 5 to 15 mph. [Like surfers, when the surf/lift is up, so are we].

[ferincr]

I guess the next question would be does one person have the strength to hold the plane for more than a couple of seconds and how does 34 # compare to a winch launch? Have I designed my wing spar strong enough?
Mirage1,
I launch my AG and my AXL with the 4m hosemonster. I never measured the tension I put on it but it's hard to hold the big plane with only on hand to be honest, the good thing is I don't need to throw it, I just open my hand at the moment I manage to have it level and the rubber pull it straight up.
Fernando

[tw126a]

Ed, will this high start work on my Easy Glider, all 25 ounces of it? Or would it be better to match it up with a smaller one? I do have some larger sailplanes that I will eventually get to, the biggest being a Bird 3000 at about 40 ounces or so.
Tom

[aeajr]

Ed, will this high start work on my Easy Glider, all 25 ounces of it? Or would it be better to match it up with a smaller one? I do have some larger sailplanes that I will eventually get to, the biggest being a Bird 3000 at about 40 ounces or so.
Tom

Since we have discussed several hi-starts here, I am not sure which one you reference.

I would NOT recommend a Pinnacle XL for the typical user or either of your planes. This thing is a beast.

The Multiplex Easy Glider can go up on a very soft hi-start although it is much stronger than I expected. Your Bird 3000 is a very light 3M? Don't know this plane.

I would point you to the Pinnacle Standard or a Hosemonster 2M. The 2M competition would probably work as well, though the comp would be on the stronger side for the easy glider. It will work but the plane might have a tendancy to come off early. We had trouble launching it off my Pinnacle XL. It would just get ahead of the hi-start because the energy is applied so fast.

This is all very subjective. There is no right or wrong answer here, just shades of gray and personal preference. Better and lesser choices is how I see it. No one hi-start is perfect for all planes.

My 2M spirit launches fine off the XL, but knowing what I know today, I would not buy one to launch the Spirit. My Legend has been launched off a Pinnacle Large and I am sure the Hosemonster 3M would probably handle it, but the 2M competition might be a bit weak if there were not much breeze.

If you are thinking of going to a bigger, heavier plane in the next 2 years, you could go up to the Hosemonster 2M competition or the pinnacle large, but they would not be my first choice for what I think you are flying now. The softer launcher will give you a longer pull and a smoother, less stressful launch.

However you are not likely to hurt the planes if you go up one size.

If the Easy Glider tends to fly off the hi-start too quickly, try using a larger hook, or epoxy a couple of finishing nails to the standard hook to make it longer. That helps a lot on winch launches too.

[tw126a]

Thanks for the advice Ed, this helps a lot. I have a mini-histart that I've played with, launched my ZIP with it and it goes up like a rocket. I tried my Windfree on it and it launched quite decently, just not very high.
The Bird 3000 is based on the BOT and can be found at Esprit Models (www.espritmodel.com/) . Alan Wright has just finished a review on one and I'm just waiting for it to appear in a magazine.
Tom

[tw126a]

Ed, I had a closer look at the Pinnacle hi-starts, the 2-meter one looks like it should work out well. Do you think it could handle something like an Oly II or should I look at the next higher level hi-start, which I think is the Standard?
Tom

[aeajr]

I would consider the Standard as your minimum in the Pinnacle line. It would be comparable to the 2M competition from Aerofoam. With a light 3M ship in the fleet, or at leas on the horizon, this would be where I would point you.

Olly II is a 100 inch plane as I recall. Should be fine.

The Medium would be fine for spirits and GL and light 100s but I would send you to the Standard.

Call NESail and see what they think. They are good guys, provide good products and they generally get good reports for service.