Gentle Lady Maiden flight

[patv]

Hi all,
Had the maiden flight for my GL today.
I got to the field bright and early today and what a beautiful day it was in NJ.
With almost no wind, I spent about 1/2 hour doing tosses to get the plane trimmed with a nice straight glide. Then it was time to stretch out the high start. To this point everything I have flow has been EPP so I was a bit nervous to let the GL go on the hi start. I was confident I had it pretty well trimmed so I set it up (with a mild stretch of the hi start). Up it went! tracked pretty straight with a slight rudder correction but no pop off!! Not a very high launch but man does she float!! I circled around a bit and made a careful landing. over the next couple of launches I progressively put greater tension on the hi start. By this time it was about 9:30 am and starting the warm up. I was able to find some lift and get a few flights of about 6-7 minutes. Couldn't seem to wipe the grin off my face!! I'm sure if I had better thermalling skills they would have been longer flights. By this time I had to pack it in to get to my daughter's soccer game but what a great day it was!!
A sucessful maiden flight of the GL.

Pat

[intheswamp]

Congratulations Pat!!!!! She's a nice floater ain't she!!! Glad to hear things went well with the highstart and the flights. Good flight times, too!

Yelp, hard to get that grin off your face....I know this old woman(?) down the creek a piece that swings a dead cat that can get the grin off...but it only works once. :D See, it just won't go away...

Ed
Intheswamp.... :Dning

[John Gallagher]

It was a great day in NJ. I was hand launching for four hours.
Didn't realize you lived in NJ. Where do you fly?

[patv]

hey John,
We've met before. You were kind enough to spend a few hours with me 2 years ago to help me get my DAW 1-26 trimmed out and flying at your field. I also stopped by the hand launch your club hosted last summer on my way back from a trip to Toms River. You were busy timing for others so I didn't interupt to say hello. I stayed for a few round before I had to get on my way.
I've been flying in Deptford at an old sand pit that has been made into soccer fields. for about a year and half they had the fields graded and seeded while they built the the structures and parking lots so I had the run of the place. Midway thru last summer they finished up and now the soccer nets are up and the fields are in use so I don't fly there anymore. They also gated and locked the entrance. I met some guys who fly electrics locally and some gliders so I fly with them.

Pat

[John Gallagher]

Pat,
Glad to hear you are still flying. If your present flying site becomes unavailable, try the SJSF field.
Hope you can bring your GL to the SJSF sailplane/hlg fun-fly on May 15th.

SJSF Events (http://www.sjsf.org/Events.htm)

[darthdrk]

Now I gotta go dust mine off, Its been a while. Actually mine is moreless a scratch built based off the Gentle Lady. You gotta be careful on a good thermal producing day, she dont wanna come down. Ive gotten mine up so high it was but a spec alot of guys around me was saying "how can you see that far?" Little did they know I was wrestling trying to get back down to a better viewing altitude. I made a home made powerpod to get up in the air with an old enya 09 CL engine. Put a two ounce tank on it. It would really get up there before the engine would cut. I would only stay up for about 20 min(got tired of looking up). It would stay up all day if youd let it. I can remember when you could get a GL for under 20.00 Now they are $49.00 for the kit Wow! Im gettin old. As soon as I can let go of my heli addiction, I can get back to my glider flying.

[intheswamp]

YEAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

Okie dokie, got back in the saddle a touch this evening. Left the office promptly at, uh, 5:25? and after a few delays made it to the hayfield...got the highstart laid out then realized I'd left the canopy at the house....went back to the house and got it. Got everything together, brisk breeze coming from the SSE. Being as I'm on top of a hill I have to peg the highstart on one side of it and launch from the other side...in other words I can't usually see the peg from where I launch.

Ok, everything set up, radio-check...uh, uh-oh, got a servo reversed. Corrected the reversed servo (thankfully) and....launched!

I managed to get five flights before I decided to call it quits...xmitter battery was getting low from where I'd used it over the weekend plus it was beginning to get dark. Anyhow, the launches were incredible!!! A couple of them just hung on the line for several seconds until I dipped down enough to get rid of the chute...it was amazing seeing the Lady just hanging up there waiting to head out. :D Anyhow, these flights were much better than the ones I made over the weekend, still not up to the level of my maiden day flights but it sure helped my confidence!

I'm still not sure what I was flying in, I almost think I was using the wind for the lift, but then at times it'd seem like the Lady would quickly hover straight upwards 15'-20' at a time. It was nice flying for those five short flights. After the first flight I added some more nose-weight...on the first flight (the 600-foot launch) I really had my hands full keeping her upwind from me and probably could have had a much better flight time but for the fact that I had to use a good bit of down-elevator to work back upwind a few times. (Eric, if you're reading this I remembered....DON'T FLY DOWNWIND!!! :)).

Anyhow, here's a couple of RAM altimeter screen shots of the highest launch and the longest flight.

Ed
Intheswamp....I feel that :D ah comin', ah comin' down that track....

[Sparky Paul]

Neato!
Science rears its useful head!
How long is your hi-start.. gum band and string?

[fhhuber506771]

down elevator is not always the best way to fight your way out of a "boomer" thermal.... You can gain excessive airspeed and I have fluttered a wing apart that way.

Anothern mthod for geting down is to use full rudder and full up elevator... theis spirals the model on a wingtip, spilling most of the lift but the full up elevator prevents building speed. Its a technique that can come in handy when you don't have spoilers or flaps + ailerons set up for crow.

A "full house" model can sometimes make use of crow + spoiler + the spiral technique for VERY fast "dethermaling." Gets it down quickly with no appreciable airspeed increase.

Practice any new technique HIGH... and practice the recovery from the dethermaling techniques with plenty of altitude.

[uabass]

down elevator is not always the best way to fight your way out of a "boomer" thermal.... You can gain excessive airspeed and I have fluttered a wing apart that way.

Anothern mthod for geting down is to use full rudder and full up elevator... theis spirals the model on a wingtip, spilling most of the lift but the full up elevator prevents building speed. Its a technique that can come in handy when you don't have spoilers or flaps + ailerons set up for crow.

A "full house" model can sometimes make use of crow + spoiler + the spiral technique for VERY fast "dethermaling." Gets it down quickly with no appreciable airspeed increase.

Practice any new technique HIGH... and practice the recovery from the dethermaling techniques with plenty of altitude.

I don't think Intheswamp was in a "boomer" thermal"...not at 618'. He simply was just trying to make it back from downwind on somewhat of a windy day, which can be a handful with a GL.

But what you say is correct about getting out of a "boomer" thermal".

Most of the time I get out of those boomers with my GL by doing loops, rolls and inverted flights (why not have some fun while getting out?). Just be sure your GL wing is built to handle these kind of maneuvers.

[intheswamp]

Sorry folks, I intended the message with the altitude graphs to go on the "Gentle Lady Build Intheswamp" thread...shows you what happens when there's a short between the gray-matter and keyboard. :) Having said that:

darthdrk: QUOTE-saying "how can you see that far?" Little did they know I was wrestling trying to get back down to a better viewing altitude.-ENDQUOTE .

That reminds me of a friend of mines story of flying at a deserted airport. When some of the other guys (power flyers) got there he was laying on his back on the tarmac with the xmitter in his hands. The first guy there walked over and asked if he needed to call an ambulance. :p He explained that he had his sailplane up there and had had it up there for a fair amount of time. The power-flyer laid down beside him and started watching only to say, "That looks kind of boaring." My friend simply replied, "Yeah, it probably would be but for the fact that I'm fighting like everything to keep it from disappearing into that big cloud...". :)

Sparky Paul: Yelp, the RAM altimeter has finally found it's intended purpose with me. I'd had the altimeter for a while and used it on some electrics, but once I finished building the Gentle Lady and maidened her I realized the real usefulness of it! The highstart I'm using is a Dynaflight "standard" that I bought in an "open box" condition...I haven't measured it, but the latex is supposed to be 100' long and the nylon line appears to be 300' long. The 600' launch that I had *really* had to have had the rubber re-stretched back out!...I think I couldn't laid the xmitter down and the Lady would have just hung on the chute like a kite.

fhhuber506771 & uabass: Yes, the situation was not that I was trying to get down from altitude but rather trying to work the Lady back upwind. I was a tad concerned about the 500'-600' that she was initially at because of the wind blowing her around (knowing that if she got blown hard she would travel quiet a distance downwind). With the windspeed she was in at that altitude I was burning off a little altitude but at the same time working back upwind. What both of you said about "getting down" is spot on. Also, the remark about practicing anything new at high altitude is definitely correct...currently at lower altitudes my practice is gentle turns and keeping the wings level. :)

Thanks for the feedback,
Ed
Intheswamp.... :Dning

[darthdrk]

you guys wanna hear (read) something funny: I made a home made histart once. I was desperate to get my GL airborne. The hand tossing off a slight slope wasnt getting the job done. (this was years ago) . I looked around for some of that surgical tubing but I was to broke to afford it. So, I improvised I was able to purchase a bulk bag of rubberbands the size used for holding down the wings. I got them at an office depot. I took about four of them and looped whem with another four until I had a chain of rubberbands about 30-40' long. It took a while. I got some nylon cord about 50 feet long, tied it to the end of the rubberband. I looped the rubberbands around a stake and I put a keyring loop on the end of the nylon cord. The moment of truth I. I stretched it out hooked on the Gl and begin to walk back. my first lanch was not all that high because I wanted to make sure it worked. Well, it worked great. Next was further and higher. I gave it a whopper of a launch once, I thought my wings was going to fold on me. I was getting over two hundred foot launches. Over time (it didnt take long) rubberbands started deteriorating and breaking. I got popped once when the band broke so, I had to retire the homemade histart. was getting dangerous. Thats when I went with the powerpod. Its time to dig out the ole GL and get er back airworthy. Im also thinking of making vac formed fuselages for some HLG's, park size and 2 meter gliders and sailplanes. Right now Im pretty busy Vac forming Heli bodies(see em at Http://darthdrk.4t.com ) but Ive been itchin to get back to my sailplanes. These will be alot easier to make also.

[Sparky Paul]

Ed, it'd be interesting to stretch the line to the 600' and measure the force needed.
With a believable number for the release altitude, a good feel for what the plane and hi-start can deliver is available.

[ejett]

Most of the time I get out of those boomers with my GL by doing loops, rolls and inverted flights (why not have some fun while getting out?). Just be sure your GL wing is built to handle these kind of maneuvers.

And if you are going to fly inverted, make sure your canopy is well secured and the radio gear is not "loose". You wouldn't want your battery pack to bail out.

EJ

[intheswamp]

I looked around for some of that surgical tubing but I was to broke to afford it. So, I improvised I was able to purchase a bulk bag of rubberbands the size used for holding down the wings. I got them at an office depot. I took about four of them and looped whem with another four until I had a chain of rubberbands about 30-40' long. It took a while. I got some nylon cord about 50 feet long, tied it to the end of the rubberband. I looped the rubberbands around a stake and I put a keyring loop on the end of the nylon cord.

Where there's a will...there's a way. :) One thing the ol' US of A is lacking right now is some good ol' "make do" attitude!

Ed
Intheswamp..... :Dning

[intheswamp]

Ed, it'd be interesting to stretch the line to the 600' and measure the force needed.
With a believable number for the release altitude, a good feel for what the plane and hi-start can deliver is available.

Well, I pull the highstart back a good piece (never measured it in feet, only by the pull on the fishing scale). I feel confident I'm pulling it back at least 200'. So figuring the tubing, line, and pull-back distance I'd be right at the 600' mark. Pull on the none-precise scales is 7.5-8 pounds.

Ed
Intheswamp.... :Dning

[WGH]

Sig sells rubber for rubber band powered planes in bulk, I can't remember for sure but I think it comes in 20 foot lengths and different widths, any way I used it to make a high start for my Bug, it worked really good but didn't like the sun at all.

[Yardbird]

My GL had her maiden flight this past Sunday. I've been using an upstart until I get the hang of things - about 30 feet of rubber and 120 feet of string.

I'm going to try a regular "adult" highstart after a few more flights and a few more re-readings of your post to the newbie Ed. I just need to find the fish scale and the books :) I'm leery of folding the wings with too agressive a pull.

Tony

[fhhuber506771]

My first "high start" was made from a bunch of bicycle tubes scrounged from the local bicycle shop's dumpster... 26 inch bicicle tubes make HUGE rubber bands :p

[Maineiac63]

Does any one know where to acquire surgical tubing to replace the deteriorated tubing in my high starts? I went and bought a new high start a couple of years ago because the tubing was to far gone in the older one, now the stuff is deteriorating in the newer one. It should be cheaper just to replace the tubing than to buy a complete new high start every couple of years , but I don't know where to get it on a roll. To bad I couldn't just go to the Post office and ask for 5 pounds of surgical tubing like I can get 5 pounds of # 64 rubber bands for free!

[intheswamp]

My first "high start" was made from a bunch of bicycle tubes scrounged from the local bicycle shop's dumpster... 26 inch bicicle tubes make HUGE rubber bands :p

With a highstart like that you could launch a full-scale! :D

I'm curious as to what year(s) you used the bicycle tubes for a highstart. For the last several years (decades?) it appears that the vast majority of tubes are made of butyl rubber which stretches a bit (enough to cover several sizes of tires) but doesn't stretch to the extent of natural rubber tubes. Back in the days of homemade slingshots the norm was natural rubber...it's hard to make a good slingshot from most of today's butyl tubes. The areas of use that still use natural rubber tubes are primarily logging, agricultural, and racing. That being said, I'm not sure about bicycle tubes being as I don't handle them in the business.

Ed
Intheswamp.... :Dning

[intheswamp]

Does any one know where to acquire surgical tubing to replace the deteriorated tubing in my high starts? I went and bought a new high start a couple of years ago because the tubing was to far gone in the older one, now the stuff is deteriorating in the newer one. It should be cheaper just to replace the tubing than to buy a complete new high start every couple of years , but I don't know where to get it on a roll. To bad I couldn't just go to the Post office and ask for 5 pounds of surgical tubing like I can get 5 pounds of # 64 rubber bands for free!

http://www.aerofoam.com/hosemonster.html

[ejett]

You need to obtain and use good quality rubber. Aerofoam is my choice of rubber. It is not cheap, but it works and lasts a long time. Yes, he sells just the rubber.

http://www.aerofoam.com

You can get a good quality latex tubing from NSP as well.

http://www.nesail.com

If you can't get it, that's one thing, but it being available, you should not bother with the other stuff.

EJ

[Sparky Paul]

Does any one know where to acquire surgical tubing to replace the deteriorated tubing in my high starts? I went and bought a new high start a couple of years ago because the tubing was to far gone in the older one, now the stuff is deteriorating in the newer one. It should be cheaper just to replace the tubing than to buy a complete new high start every couple of years , but I don't know where to get it on a roll. To bad I couldn't just go to the Post office and ask for 5 pounds of surgical tubing like I can get 5 pounds of # 64 rubber bands for free!
.
Surgical tubing is more susceptible to sunlight/ozone aging than the braid covered bungee cord available. Keep the surgical tubing in a dark area when it's not being used.

[fhhuber506771]

With a highstart like that you could launch a full-scale! :D

I'm curious as to what year(s) you used the bicycle tubes for a highstart. For the last several years (decades?) it appears that the vast majority of tubes are made of butyl rubber which stretches a bit (enough to cover several sizes of tires) but doesn't stretch to the extent of natural rubber tubes. Back in the days of homemade slingshots the norm was natural rubber...it's hard to make a good slingshot from most of today's butyl tubes. The areas of use that still use natural rubber tubes are primarily logging, agricultural, and racing. That being said, I'm not sure about bicycle tubes being as I don't handle them in the business.

Ed
Intheswamp.... :Dning

I was doing that in the vicinity of 1979 to 1985. I took a tube and cut it into bands of 1/2 inch wide strips. when I made up my chain of something like 20 bands... and tried my forst lauynch... not enough power for a Gentle Lady.. so I doubled up the rubber and got a passable short launch. Next step was to add lenght since i had found the rubber power level needed.

I could only get about 50% stretch from the tubes (where surgical tubing you can get 250% easily) so I had a LOT of rubber (it was free.. and a lot of mason's twine (it was lighter to lift than the rubber) and virtually no rubber left the ground durring launch. (but it got me up) I had LOTS and LOTS of open area.. (close to a mile long field).. so I didn't mind not liting the rubber. I did learn that a glow engine electric starter was useful for winding the thing in though. (I used a cordless drill to speed winding with my surgical tube based high-start)

***********

Try Lowes for surgical tubeing. its about $1.50 a ft for some pretty heavy stuff. 30 ft of that will launch most anything short-start style. They ofccasionally have a lighter grade.

You can also go to medical supply stores. Its hard to find it on the reels there thouugh... they like to sell it in 3 or 6 ft sections. But they have MANY different sizes.

Those will BOTH be the natural/gum color rubber.. not the more UV resistant black or red tube. I haven't found a good source for those (yet) I haven't used my current High start much... the local flying sites simply have nadequate room (in central TX.. can't find a glider field.. this is nuts.. 1,000's of open acres... no place to stretch it out.) and stretching the High start at the power plane field... I had ine power plane catch the high start on a wheel... so I quit bringing it.

I do have a sailplane.. sitting wating for finshing touches (3 meter RES) But.. no point. :(

******
darn it.. no "cry" "smiley"

[katobaggins]

I know here in Oregon, you can go down to just about any sporting goods store and find surgical tubing of differing sizes. It's relatively cheap and can be bough by the foot. Look in the fishing department on spools. The tubing is used for various fishing rigs. I use it to hold lead weights. I put together a mini-high start a few years ago with it. I must say that my NSP rubber has held up much better through the years though.

[Maineiac63]

Thanks folks for the info, I be ordering new from aerofoam soonest !

[fprintf]

$45 for a 30 foot section of surgical tubing from Lowes that will degrade in the sunlight after a season or two or $75 for a 100 foot of histart tubing from aerofoam. Either way you get a method to launch your plane, but value for money I think the aerofoam rubber is the way to go. It also helps that he is into RC planes, which I doubt your local Lowes manager is.

[pchart]

Today was my maiden flight on my GL. It was actualy my maiden flight for any glider. I had my friend old Bob who is a very experianced pilot help me.
I have been flying gas for about a year now. But the GL was the coolest experiance I have had so far in my short time of flying. Though I did not get a lot of long flights in with thermals involeved, I got some of the basic in. I know the search and techniac for finding lift will come. I am hooked now. I have also learned alot from reading on this GREAT WEB SITE for all the folks who have wrote in, AND my thanks to all.
Phil
GB WI.