Asymetric Plane - It´s Possible on R/C ?

[Lucke]

I was thinking in a electric model of this plane, but I don´t Know too much about asymetric planes.

It´s possible to make an airplane like this R/C ? What that I have to consider on my design ?


Thanks for all help.

[vintage1]

Sure. Anything is possible.

Trimming it mmight be 'interesting' - it will tend to yaw right I'd say.

[Lucke]

Ok, I think that the CG is on the midle of the cockpit and fuselage, so I guess that the yaw will be stable, I´m not right about this....

[Andy W]

Reminds me of "Flight of the Phoenix!"
..a

[Tom Harper]

Andy,

"Warplanes of the Third Reich" reports that the plane was very docile and had no trim problems at all. Your best clue for CG location is the landing gear. The wheels were set to span the CG:

[Lucke]

Thanks Andy,

I found a draw, I guess that explain all of the Stability of the bird.

[Spinner]

Lucke,

Here's a thread by someone who's done it:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=183155&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

Have fun!

[Lucke]

Lucke,

Here's a thread by someone who's done it:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=183155&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

Have fun!

Wow !!! Nice thread !!!

Many thanks for this !!

Lucke,

[gouch]

Good luck with it Lucke, it sure looks an interesting subject!

All:
One question though, why would the designers of this actually do it in the first place? What were the advantages they thought they had in the design. Looking at that forces picture above, it appears once they had built one "offset" into it, then spent the rest of their time counteracting it :D


Was it Burt Rutan who also did this? Did he do it for a particular reason or was it just built "because" ? Congratulations to him for his global challanger too, what a brilliant man with an incredible team !!

Cheers
Paul

[Bill Glover]

Over the years there have been many models of the BV-141, AFAIK they all flew pretty well. The full-size was a reconnaisance plane I think ... so I imagine the layout was to give good visibility. A slightly more conventional variation was the FW-189

http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org/LRG/images/fw189-1.jpg

[gouch]

That's quite a nice aircraft Jim.

[Lucke]

It´s a very nice plane Bill, the pod look very similar to the BV_141 :D

[Bill Glover]

Yes it's quite graceful, I was thinking that a semi-scale version would make an excellent aerial photography model!

[Lucke]

Hy Guys,

I bought the plans from free fligth here http://www.aalmps.com/mlpics.html, so I oversize the plan to have an 49" n(123cm) of wingspan.

The target weight is no more than 25oz, (700g )

I don´t dedice what will be the engine, some tips will be so useful :D

I will use on this model, Rudder, elevator, ailerons and retracts, I post a thread about the retracts system, I don´t know if the "blue" retract system from GWs is good....

Thanks for all guys !!

Lucke.

[Sparky Paul]

A geared 350-400..GWS makes a good selection.. should be more than sufficient..
Retracts... well... if you really have to.. otherwise they're just complications and weight which doesn't need to be there..

[50+AirYears]

I think either MAN or FM have plans for the German B&V Recon plane. Uses a 45 sized engine. Probably have to balance it in two planes, fore&aft, and side-to-side.

[KOMET 44]

M.A.N. is where the plans are from.Nick Ziroli Sr.design it for a 40 two stroke.

stefanP

[lensrc]

Good luck with it Lucke, it sure looks an interesting subject!

All:
One question though, why would the designers of this actually do it in the first place? What were the advantages they thought they had in the design. Looking at that forces picture above, it appears once they had built one "offset" into it, then spent the rest of their time counteracting it :D


Was it Burt Rutan who also did this? Did he do it for a particular reason or was it just built "because" ? Congratulations to him for his global challanger too, what a brilliant man with an incredible team !!

Cheers
Paul



The asymetrical design was to be able to have radar facing both fowards and rearwards. Only a few were built, and it never reached production. The germans built, and were developing a LOT of wierd planes.Check out this site: http://www.luft46.com/

My brother built a .40 size of the BV141 from Nick Ziroli plans, and found it flew quite well. It did have one odd bit of behavior, though. A lot of larger, faster flying models need left rudder input on rollout to keep it heading down the runway, as this one did. But, it needed it the opposite direction.

Len

[Thomas B]

The asymetrical design was to be able to have radar facing both fowards and rearwards. Only a few were built, and it never reached production. The germans built, and were developing a LOT of wierd planes.Check out this site: http://www.luft46.com/

My brother built a .40 size of the BV141 from Nick Ziroli plans, and found it flew quite well. It did have one odd bit of behavior, though. A lot of larger, faster flying models need left rudder input on rollout to keep it heading down the runway, as this one did. But, it needed it the opposite direction.

Len

Actually, part of your description is correct, and part is not correct.

The BV-141 carried no radar. It was a recce aircraft that was to use eyeballs and cameras. The reason for the odd assymetrical design was that B&V wanted a SINGLE engine aircraft with the most possible visibility possible forward, upward, downward and aft. (Looks like they gave up some to the left side...;)

This lead to the fuse pod that is nearly all windows, with crew views outside unimpeded in most ways.

The FW 189 ended up fullfilling the tactical recce role for the Luftwaffe, as the BV 141 lagged in development with engine trouble and other issues, but none caused by the odd arrangement.

They did build about 13 BV-141s, so it is not quite correct to say it never reached production. 5 production A models and 5 production B models were built, after 3 prototypes.

It never reached full production, as the FW 189 had fewer teething issues.

A number of BV-141 models have been built in many sizes and several plans offerings and they are universally reported to fly well...it does all cancel out...:)

To the Rutan question....He built the Boomerang as a design exercise to create a high performance light twin with excellent performance, great structure to weight ratio, low drag and to have excellent safety characteristics due to the two powerplants being so close together. This last point is actually his most important goal of all

By having a large fuse for the people and one of the engines and a small fuse for the other engine, he was able to create a very efficient design that meets the all of above criteria.

Assymmetry is just another tool in the design toolbox, albeit a bit radical, for helping creating a design that is optimized for a particular mission or flight characteristic.

[e-sailpilot86]

Cool! :)