Stampede too hot?

[Dan Cutter]

Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
"real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
novice, Dan Cutter

[Frater Mus]

On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:

> Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
> "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
> running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
> was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
> fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
> to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
> Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
> freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
> dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
> novice, Dan Cutter

If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
Will help the motor out a bit.

Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.

BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
$$$.

--
L.V.X., brother mouse
http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater database
http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support

[Dean]

On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 12:49:59 -0500, Frater Mus <FraterMus2004@mousetrap.net>
wrote:

>On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:
>
>> Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
>> "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
>> running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
>> was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
>> fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
>> to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
>> Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
>> freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
>> dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
>> novice, Dan Cutter
>
>If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
>Will help the motor out a bit.
>
>Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
>but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.
>
>BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
>$$$.

This is good advice. Also, how warm is it out? if it's 80+ degrees out, your
stuff will get pretty warm, there is no way around it.
---
Proud owner of:
Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
http://ripperd.com
email: dean (at) the above domain

[Dan Cutter]

Dean <look@sig> wrote in message news:<d91og05u9h0irb9ku1rbdo9i0tllvnl5oc@4ax.com>...
> On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 12:49:59 -0500, Frater Mus <FraterMus2004@mousetrap.net>
> wrote:
>
> >On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
> >> "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
> >> running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
> >> was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
> >> fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
> >> to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
> >> Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
> >> freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
> >> dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
> >> novice, Dan Cutter
> >
> >If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
> >Will help the motor out a bit.
> >
> >Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
> >but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.
> >
> >BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
> >$$$.
>
> This is good advice. Also, how warm is it out? if it's 80+ degrees out, your
> stuff will get pretty warm, there is no way around it.

Yea, good point. it was in the 90's when I ran it. I've ran it
a few times since, runs good, but I don't hammer the throttle as much.
It sure doesn't run very long though. Maybe four minutes. I'd like
to have three batteries and a good charger, somebody please instruct
me on what batteries and chargers are best. One battery and a pissy
charger sucks. Dan Cutter
> ---
> Proud owner of:
> Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
> Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
> Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
> http://ripperd.com
> email: dean (at) the above domain

[Dean]

On 31 Jul 2004 21:01:53 -0700, dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:

> Yea, good point. it was in the 90's when I ran it. I've ran it
>a few times since, runs good, but I don't hammer the throttle as much.
> It sure doesn't run very long though. Maybe four minutes. I'd like
>to have three batteries and a good charger, somebody please instruct
>me on what batteries and chargers are best. One battery and a pissy
>charger sucks. Dan Cutter

Describe your setup in detail, what motors, what batteries, what charger? This
will give me a general idea of the performance increase you'll see from doing
the below:

Well, in my XXX with a stock motor I can run over 10 minutes on a pack of
GP3300's, probably closer to 12 minutes. Pretty good in a full race setup.
Every once in a while we have 10 minute A-Mains in the electric category. I
doubt I could make 10 minutes with a mod though. Backyard bashing is a little
easier than track racing on batteries, since it is more high speed running and
less stop and go, unless your driving in grass. You might be overgeared if you
get poor runtimes and hot motor and batteries. I personally would suggest
getting a higher turn modified such as a 18 or 20 turn to just play around with
in your backyard or street. The run time will be about the same as a stock
motor, but the speed and power will be alot more. Modifieds tend to run much
more efficient than stock motors.

Personally, I run a Tekin BC112C (www.teamtekin.com) that i've had for a few
years. If I had to choose another charger then I'd choose the LRP Pulsar
Competition charger (http://teamassociated.com/lrp/Lis-2003/Sp-links-PCC.html).
A quality charger is always worth it. The LRP is $175 at tower, the BC112C is
back on the market finally (tekin closed up for a few years) and probably will
retail around $180.

For batteries, right now you can't beat the GP3300's. If your not competitively
racing then I would suggest getting a couple non-matched stick packs, I think
they can be had for around $40.
I think these are GP3300's:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGJP9&P=0
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCZW0&P=0

And these if you prefer to solder yours side-by-side like racers do:
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXFPJ0&P=0

Oh, one final thing: JUNK THE TAYMIA CONNECTORS. And the bullet connectors.
They SUCK, and it will make a noticeable difference. Switch to
powerpole/anderson/lightspeed/sermos (many brands for same connector - they are
modular and genderless), or dean's ultra plugs.

-Dean
---
Proud owner of:
Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
http://ripperd.com
email: dean (at) the above domain

[kenji]

In article <ba0fb6a.0407310635.5b001e59@posting.google.com>,
dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:

> Does this seem normal?

Couple of things:

Do you have bearings or bushings on the wheels? Bearings make the motor
run cooler.

Is the pinion and spur set up correctly? A binding pinion will heat up
the motor. Also think about trying smaller pinion gears.

You may also want to rewire your ESC and batteries and use Dean's Ultra
Plugs. Also hard wire your ESC wire leads directly to the motor. The
point being get rid of any tamiya style connectors. They can sometimes
lead to overheating.

For batteries Reedy now has a stick pack of GP3300 cells, called the
Black Label, product number 690, I believe. Get two or three of those.
They sell for about 35.00 (US) each

For a Charger get the Dynamite Twin Peak. You can charge two 3300
batterires at the same time. It charges at 4 amps, and it's very simple
no frills kinda charger. Does a good job.

[Dan Cutter]

Dean <look@sig> wrote in message news:<0eupg0p3q4rqmd41q4169hb0m59jb5llcc@4ax.com>...
> On 31 Jul 2004 21:01:53 -0700, dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:
>
> > Yea, good point. it was in the 90's when I ran it. I've ran it
> >a few times since, runs good, but I don't hammer the throttle as much.
> > It sure doesn't run very long though. Maybe four minutes. I'd like
> >to have three batteries and a good charger, somebody please instruct
> >me on what batteries and chargers are best. One battery and a pissy
> >charger sucks. Dan Cutter
>
> Describe your setup in detail, what motors, what batteries, what charger? This
> will give me a general idea of the performance increase you'll see from doing
> the below:
>
> Well, in my XXX with a stock motor I can run over 10 minutes on a pack of
> GP3300's, probably closer to 12 minutes. Pretty good in a full race setup.
> Every once in a while we have 10 minute A-Mains in the electric category. I
> doubt I could make 10 minutes with a mod though. Backyard bashing is a little
> easier than track racing on batteries, since it is more high speed running and
> less stop and go, unless your driving in grass. You might be overgeared if you
> get poor runtimes and hot motor and batteries. I personally would suggest
> getting a higher turn modified such as a 18 or 20 turn to just play around with
> in your backyard or street. The run time will be about the same as a stock
> motor, but the speed and power will be alot more. Modifieds tend to run much
> more efficient than stock motors.
>
> Personally, I run a Tekin BC112C (www.teamtekin.com) that i've had for a few
> years. If I had to choose another charger then I'd choose the LRP Pulsar
> Competition charger (http://teamassociated.com/lrp/Lis-2003/Sp-links-PCC.html).
> A quality charger is always worth it. The LRP is $175 at tower, the BC112C is
> back on the market finally (tekin closed up for a few years) and probably will
> retail around $180.
>
> For batteries, right now you can't beat the GP3300's. If your not competitively
> racing then I would suggest getting a couple non-matched stick packs, I think
> they can be had for around $40.
> I think these are GP3300's:
> http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGJP9&P=0
> http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCZW0&P=0
>
> And these if you prefer to solder yours side-by-side like racers do:
> http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXFPJ0&P=0
>
> Oh, one final thing: JUNK THE TAYMIA CONNECTORS. And the bullet connectors.
> They SUCK, and it will make a noticeable difference. Switch to
> powerpole/anderson/lightspeed/sermos (many brands for same connector - they are
> modular and genderless), or dean's ultra plugs.
>
> -Dean
> ---
> Proud owner of:
> Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
> Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
> Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
> http://ripperd.com
> email: dean (at) the above domain



Thanks for helping a novice out, Dean. I've saved your post to
my desktop. The Stampede came out of the box with the "stinger"
motor, a twenty wind motor made by traxxas. Seems to be fairly high
quality. The battery and charger seem bottom of the barrel OTOH.
Radio shack six cell "2000 power index" and the five hour charger that
came with it. All for the low, low price of thirty bucks! I got what
I paid for.

I will follow your advice and order two of those 3300 batteries,
connectors, and charger from tower hobby. $180 is a little shocking
though! First I'll dig out my peak chargers for my gliders and see if
they are compatible. Then I'll start thinking new motors and gearing,
ball bearings, etc.. I feel a bug biting me.... Dan Cutter

[Dean]

On 1 Aug 2004 13:12:59 -0700, dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:

> Thanks for helping a novice out, Dean. I've saved your post to
>my desktop. The Stampede came out of the box with the "stinger"
>motor, a twenty wind motor made by traxxas.

I don't think the stinger is a fast or efficient motor, but I could be wrong, I
don't have much firsthand experience with that level of motor :)

> Seems to be fairly high
>quality. The battery and charger seem bottom of the barrel OTOH.
>Radio shack six cell "2000 power index" and the five hour charger that
>came with it. All for the low, low price of thirty bucks! I got what
>I paid for.

Yeah heh. Although if you do some careful research some good deals can be had
at Radio shack on other stuff. Some of their battery packs arn't actually that
bad I've read, but I don't know which in paticular.

> I will follow your advice and order two of those 3300 batteries,
>connectors, and charger from tower hobby. $180 is a little shocking
>though! First I'll dig out my peak chargers for my gliders and see if
>they are compatible. Then I'll start thinking new motors and gearing,
>ball bearings, etc.. I feel a bug biting me.... Dan Cutter

Consider the charger not as an expense, but an investment. Unless you abuse
them, they last forever and keep their value. Standard charge rate is usually
4-6 amps, most people I know charge at 5 amps, which corelates to about 40
minutes for a peak charge on a 3300. You may be able to get by on your charger
for your gliders, but I'm not sure. I have a charger that will charge nearly
anything you throw at it, 1-12 cells NiCd or NIMH, 0-10 amps. I use it for
reciever packs, transmitters, my single cell glow ignitor, and my r/c car packs.

If you don't have ball bearings in your vehicle I would highly suggest that
also.
---
Proud owner of:
Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
http://ripperd.com
email: dean (at) the above domain

[Dan Cutter]

kenji <kenji@ripco.com> wrote in message news:<kenji-063306.10074601082004@news.ftupet.com>...
> In article <ba0fb6a.0407310635.5b001e59@posting.google.com>,
> dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:
>
> > Does this seem normal?
>
> Couple of things:
>
> Do you have bearings or bushings on the wheels? Bearings make the motor
> run cooler.
>
> Is the pinion and spur set up correctly? A binding pinion will heat up
> the motor. Also think about trying smaller pinion gears.
>
> You may also want to rewire your ESC and batteries and use Dean's Ultra
> Plugs. Also hard wire your ESC wire leads directly to the motor. The
> point being get rid of any tamiya style connectors. They can sometimes
> lead to overheating.
>
> For batteries Reedy now has a stick pack of GP3300 cells, called the
> Black Label, product number 690, I believe. Get two or three of those.
> They sell for about 35.00 (US) each
>
> For a Charger get the Dynamite Twin Peak. You can charge two 3300
> batterires at the same time. It charges at 4 amps, and it's very simple
> no frills kinda charger. Does a good job.


Thanks for a lot of good info. I was reading posts from 1997
that raved about the new "2000" batteries, but how the price was
really high. I had a good laugh and the realization of how far
battery technology has come in a few short years. I got two "3000"
batteries today for 32.00 each! Dan Cutter

[kenji]

In article <ba0fb6a.0408021830.7f42ace7@posting.google.com>,
dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:

> kenji <kenji@ripco.com> wrote in message
> news:<kenji-063306.10074601082004@news.ftupet.com>...
> > In article <ba0fb6a.0407310635.5b001e59@posting.google.com>,
> > dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:
> >
> > > Does this seem normal?
> >
> > Couple of things:
> >
> > Do you have bearings or bushings on the wheels? Bearings make the motor
> > run cooler.
> >
> > Is the pinion and spur set up correctly? A binding pinion will heat up
> > the motor. Also think about trying smaller pinion gears.
> >
> > You may also want to rewire your ESC and batteries and use Dean's Ultra
> > Plugs. Also hard wire your ESC wire leads directly to the motor. The
> > point being get rid of any tamiya style connectors. They can sometimes
> > lead to overheating.
> >
> > For batteries Reedy now has a stick pack of GP3300 cells, called the
> > Black Label, product number 690, I believe. Get two or three of those.
> > They sell for about 35.00 (US) each
> >
> > For a Charger get the Dynamite Twin Peak. You can charge two 3300
> > batterires at the same time. It charges at 4 amps, and it's very simple
> > no frills kinda charger. Does a good job.
>
>
> Thanks for a lot of good info. I was reading posts from 1997
> that raved about the new "2000" batteries, but how the price was
> really high. I had a good laugh and the realization of how far
> battery technology has come in a few short years. I got two "3000"
> batteries today for 32.00 each! Dan Cutter

charge and run them down fully in the car. It can take about 5 cycles
before they work at their best.

[J.Fields]

Thank God for NITRO!!!

Frater Mus wrote:

> On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:
>
> > Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
> > "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
> > running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
> > was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
> > fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
> > to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
> > Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
> > freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
> > dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
> > novice, Dan Cutter
>
> If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
> Will help the motor out a bit.
>
> Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
> but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.
>
> BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
> $$$.
>
> --
> L.V.X., brother mouse
> http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater database
> http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
> http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support

[Dean]

I have nitro cars also, and they have their upsides and downsides just like
electrics do. I just ran probably 3/4 of a quart through my rc10gt yesterday.


On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 12:36:27 GMT, "J.Fields" <castman@ameritech.net> wrote:

>Thank God for NITRO!!!
>
>Frater Mus wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:
>>
>> > Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
>> > "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
>> > running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
>> > was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
>> > fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
>> > to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
>> > Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
>> > freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
>> > dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
>> > novice, Dan Cutter
>>
>> If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
>> Will help the motor out a bit.
>>
>> Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
>> but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.
>>
>> BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
>> $$$.
>>
>> --
>> L.V.X., brother mouse
>> http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater database
>> http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
>> http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support

---
Proud owner of:
Associated RC10GT <the other basher>
Team Losi XX "CR" <the basher>
Team Losi XXX KE <the racer>
http://ripperd.com
email: dean (at) the above domain

[kenji]

You and I both know throwing a gas engine into the mix for a newbie can
be challenging. Nuthin wrong with starting out electric.


In article <410F86CA.2C0DAAF7@ameritech.net>, J.Fields
<castman@ameritech.net> wrote:

> Thank God for NITRO!!!
>
> Frater Mus wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 at 14:35 GMT, <dancutter@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Went down to my local Radio Shack and sprang for a Stampede, my first
> > > "real" R/C car. After charging the six cell pack for five hours and
> > > running the truck for five minutes (began to lose charge) the motor
> > > was pretty much untouchable for more than one second, the blue cooling
> > > fins only slightly cooler, and the battery would be very uncomfortable
> > > to hold for more than two seconds-like a potato right out of the oven.
> > > Doesn't sound right for an unmodified rc truck. The wheels spin
> > > freely and it ran great. I ran it hard, lots of full throttle in the
> > > dirt and gravel. Does this seem normal? Thanks from a complete
> > > novice, Dan Cutter
> >
> > If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
> > Will help the motor out a bit.
> >
> > Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
> > but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.
> >
> > BTW, you'll want a decent peak charger at some point. It's worth the
> > $$$.
> >
> > --
> > L.V.X., brother mouse
> > http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater
> > database
> > http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
> > http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support
>

[Frater Mus]

On Sun, 01 Aug 2004 at 20:54 GMT, <look@sig> wrote:

> On 1 Aug 2004 13:12:59 -0700, dancutter@charter.net (Dan Cutter) wrote:
>
>> Thanks for helping a novice out, Dean. I've saved your post to
>>my desktop. The Stampede came out of the box with the "stinger"
>>motor, a twenty wind motor made by traxxas.
>
> I don't think the stinger is a fast or efficient motor, but I could be wrong, I
> don't have much firsthand experience with that level of motor :)


It's not. The main benefits in that market are:

* they require no maintenance in the usual sense (no brush
replacement, comm cutting, etc).

* they are 0-deg timing, which makes them usuable both
forwards/backwards in models with two motors, and keeps beginners from
baking motors/speed controls by hammering a timing-advanced motor in
reverse.

* they're prolly cheap as hell for the manufacturer.

> Consider the charger not as an expense, but an investment. Unless you abuse
> them, they last forever and keep their value.

Absolutely. A good charger is a cornerstone investment in the hobby,
even if you're nitro-only.

> for your gliders, but I'm not sure. I have a charger that will charge nearly
> anything you throw at it, 1-12 cells NiCd or NIMH, 0-10 amps. I use it for
> reciever packs, transmitters, my single cell glow ignitor, and my r/c car packs.

Same here, though mine's only 1-10 cells. I have alligator clipped it
to most every rechargeable object in my house. :-)

> If you don't have ball bearings in your vehicle I would highly suggest that
> also.

Good call.



--
L.V.X., brother mouse
http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater database
http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support

[Frater Mus]

On Tue, 03 Aug 2004 at 12:36 GMT, <castman@ameritech.net> wrote:

[post rearranged for legibility]

>> If the motor is getting that hot I'd go to a slightly smaller pinion.
>> Will help the motor out a bit.
>>
>> Normally the pede will start to overheat in grass with stock gearing,
>> but I've not heard of hit happening on gravel.

> Thank God for NITRO!!!

An overgeared nitro model will suffer just as much (clutch shoes,
slipper (if applicable), piston/sleeve.


--
L.V.X., brother mouse
http://cbsrmt.mousetrap.net/RMTdb/ CBS Radio Mystery Theater database
http://greyhound.mousetrap.net/altus/ retired racing greyhound
http://www.mousetrap.net/~mouse/cs.html How to get good phone support