THERMALING 4 BEGINNERS--Help area

[Mchone, Jake]

Hellow, all! I have been flying my 2meter AspireEP from Hanger9(in pic) for about 2 years now, and sence its EP I havent realy gotton into thermaling until I decided to start saving up for the new Bird of Time ARF. I have been reading up on thermaling for about 3 mounths now, and after everytime I learned soemthing new I went out and tryed it, but even after 3 months, I STILL haven't been able to catch a thermal of any kind!(& yes i know of winter affects):mad: :(
Am I doing something wrong or is it just luck. I have no acses to the local BSS(Blue Grass Soaring Society) club, sence it is about an hour away and I haven't a way to get there(I fly in 2 old, large corn fields RIGHT beside my house...)
I would REALY apresiate any help at all! :rolleyes:
Please hep me out if you can...I will be very glad to tel you exactly what I have and havent done and where I have gotton all my info from.
Thanks much!
-Jake


I have sence 'retired'(ok, so i totaled it :p ) and found the, now discontinued -but some can still be found- , origional Aspire-G seen in bottom pic. This plane is much nicer than the EP Aspire and the sink rate and speed range is incredible compared to my EP! Im haveing much better flying luck and performance with this one!! :cool:

[steve wenban]

well Jake I fly a lot of thermal but not for competion only for fun I have not had any real problem reading the reaction from any of my 2 metre floaters .I fly big open circles flying very flat (Minimum bank angle ) and as soon as i see a change in nose attitude of the model not my nose I'll pull the bank a little tighter and if the Thermal is there the models speed increases and it climbs in the circle .There is probably a lot of the other guy here that will give you a lot more info on the how to's But the above works for me
good luck and good thermal hunting
Steve.

[Mchone, Jake]

Here are some sites with the most info i've got off of them:

http://www.apogeerockets.com/education/Soaring_methods.asp

http://www.apogeerockets.com/education/detecting_thermals.asp

http://www.quicktechhobby.com/articles/thermal_surfing%20part%201.htm

http://www.quicktechhobby.com/articles/thermal_surfing%20part%202.htm

http://www.torreypinesgulls.org/Launch.htm

And a link to my web site:
http://premium.xanga.com/Private/home.aspx?user=trumpetier02

[Mchone, Jake]

Thanks, Steve!:D Ive tryed that..but got bord(LOL)
I'll try it again as soon as these 20-30mph winds die down...

[steve wenban]

Well with those winds find a hill and lookat the thread corro for thermal

[Mchone, Jake]

Hehe, sorry, but not good sloping sites for about 50 miles from my location!:((Believe me, IVE LOOKED!)
But i'll check the thred anyway.
Thanks

[dephela]

The rocket sites listed ARE te best source on the web for this.

I recently posted to a friend on the subject, he was asking if any one of the fields we fly at was better than the other for thermals. My reply:
It's interesting to note that if you're a flier of full sized sailplanes the
source for reporting lapse rate information that's closest to us is in Albany.
I think I have that right? The report from there is supposed to be good for everywhere nearby. Obviously one is supposed to look outside the window and see what's happening in the sky as well as what the weather channel and web info provide. In general, a good day at one field will be a good day at another. No guarantees and some days that just may not work out. A good thermal day is a day that you can go to the flying field! It's supposed to be hard work for us, its not natural and skills must be developed. The best ones to develope are having a plane trimmed to fly straight at a nice speed without constantly hitting the sticks and keeping an eye on the plane, then constantly evaluating its motion while looking at the possible reasons for the movement and making corrections or establishing a new course of action. O-O-D-A loop stuff. Evaluating sign while hanging out, retreiving the line, during flight and prior to flight will help minimize the time spent cruising in bad air, losing altitude and flight time. Good air breeds thermals, hanging out in it increases the chances of locating it and going up. Some good air may take 5-8 minutes, from the time you first enter until a thermal forms in it. If you're in the air, chances are you can find it. That was very typical of what we found in Georgia at the last F3b team selection contest, we would head out, cruise around in large circles defining the good air, and as our altitude dropped down to 150' or so a thermal would carry us to the end of the flight. We always thought we would be short and it was scary but if we were good it would work, if we chickened out and left the air, we could be in more trouble. What was it that the book says[?]...never leave good air?

I refered to reading "sign". The obvious change in air temp, sun, shifts in wind, location of birds[any kind] and what they're doing, what's happening in their flight, rustling of grass, movent of leaves or branches on a nearby treeline. All part of Thermalling 101!

[Mchone, Jake]

I ALWAYS pay attention to the birds around here, but on calm days, when i most like to fly, they tend to ground themselves for some reason....only the big hawks and such, it seems, go up, anyother time, they just do some dynamic soaring, and my Aspire isnt aerodynamic/streemlined for that stuff, plus its too light, een with the motor and battery in her.
I was in some very promising air yesterday before the winds picked up and was acualy getting a little lift, but that was just heat from a nearby road drifting, not enyf to make a diference, just enuf for me to notice...i would have stayed in it, but my battery was running down, and when I came back out(30-45min later) as expected...it was gone.
Just a thaught, is the heat rising from the roads or ground give a hint as to a thermal?
I always notice that , and try to fly to it, but there just seems to be stagnate air(air that only provides enuf lift to keep my plane from losing altitude, not gain it)
-Jake

[shoe]

How did you set the CG on the plane? The most common problem for new flyers (that I've seen) is an improperly trimmed airplane. This is where experienced help is invaluable.

A plane with the CG too far forward can plow right through lift and you'd never even know it was there.

[Mchone, Jake]

I have experimented with it by as much as 1" fore and 1" aft of the recomended CG of 3&1/2 to 3&3/4 inches from leading adge.
The forward CG did nothing but keep her more stable in the wind and make me have to add more up trim, and the rearward CG helped in a tail high attitude when I did managed to find lift once or twice(but was unable to catch it after I circled back around_ i.e. kept falling out of the lift)
So to answer your Question, no I do not think it is the CG as being the problem, But I would love to see you prove me wrong. :)

[nuevo]

About the articles, all are good. The 2nd one is golden. The sections on wind and temperature are well done. Notice the wind vector diagrams. Do you ever notice the wind shift? If there's a steady breeze, notice when it increases/decreases, or pulls to one side. That is a sign of a nearby thermal.

Also, ever notice if the wind slows down and at the same time, the air feels a bit warmer. There's a thermal just upwind of you.

Forgetting all the vector stuff, fly towards where the wind has shifted. If there is a breeze, fly upwind of that spot a little.

If you are comfortable flying with your CG more rearward, then put it there, and leave it.

Where you are right now, it would greatly benefit you to spend an entire afternoon with the club an hour away. You can learn a lot just by seeing for yourself what others are doing and saying.

Let one of their club experts help you trim/balance your plane. It may fly fine to you, but you are used to it. An expert can tell you if the plane is trimmed well or not. You might be "fighting" against a poorly trimmed plane, which might hamper your thermal finding search.

Keep at it, don't give up. This thread is a GREAT idea !

The ever going hunt for thermals and the wonder of flight fascinates me.

[Mchone, Jake]

Thanks, Jon, but the winds around here are so unpredictable, it is hard to deturman if it is a thermal, or just a normal/regular shift in the wind velocity or speed(it tends to accure VERY often around here, but I have yet to find a thermal using that method).
I have managed to find lift(wether it be a thermal or not) when I feel it suddenly get warmer, but was unable to stay in it, or find it fast enough before it got too high, or just died off. :(
Any recomindations on that, as well?

And to anyother Newbies out there scanning threugh this thred...Please feel free to jump right in if you need a question answered!:D
-Jake

[nuevo]

Thermals drift with any wind present. Your plane should drift with them. What I do is try to cirlcle with a constant bank angle on the wings. Then let the plane drift wherever it wants.

If you are in lift and circling, take special notice. If one part of the circle, the plane climbs better, expand your circle towards that side. Move towards the area of strongest lift.

These constant wind shifts are likely indicators of lift moving through. It is especially easy to read, if the winds are < 5 mph.

[Mchone, Jake]

No, we don't get everymany thermals from my field...Kentucky's weather is just wierd and unpridictable like that, no matter how good or bad the conditions for thermals are, the wind still does the same thing, I know it sounds like im missreading the signs, but im not. It can be overcast or full sunshine, the wind will still go from a northerly heading to an easterly, then back to northerly heading then westerly....0 to 5, back to 3 to 11mph in less than 2 minutes, or upto an hour for all that stuff to take place...it just depends on the pressure systems and Jet streem that determands it. It has nothing to do with thermals being presant...but please don't get me wrong, I am not trying to start an agrument of expertise and/or knowledge, I am meirly trying to explain Kentucky's wild, wierd weather patterns to you, so I can save you your time and energy, so you can help me further.
I am a full-sized pilot with extinsive weather training...so I generaly know what im talking about when it comes to weather and such. :p
-Jake

[aeajr]

Sounds like you need to understand more about what thermals are, how to detect them and what to do when you find one.

I have to admit that if I were not part of a sailplane club I probably would not have caught a thermal if it hit me in the head. These guys taught me what to look for.

There is no reason why you can't thermal your EP plane, but you may be depending too much on the motor. When you fly a pure sailplane your only way to stay in the air is to find a thermal. The motovation is different.

A light weight floater will also make it easier to detect those thermals. The extra weight of the motor/battery means your plane is flying much faster and you could be flying right through the thermals.

Something like the regular Aspire, A great planes Spirit or a Gentlle Lady would be more sensative and more responsive to thermals.

Let me recommend a great book.

Old Buzzard's Soaring Book
http://www.carstens-publications.com/hangar/a11560.html

Great reading, very funny and chock full of good info. Written by the designer of the Bird of Time sailplane.

I love sailplanes. Did a photo essay on the subject:

Sailplanes are wonderful
http://www.rcezine.com/cms/article.php?cat=&id=18

[Mchone, Jake]

Wow, thanks...Im going to try andorder that book...:D
I do injoy getting to fly the Aspire by just motor, but I reguarly take the motor out and fly it like the normal Aspire. Thats why I love the Aspire EP, you can take the motor out and move the electrics up to the nose and add longer pushrods n about 10min.! :D
I know exactly what you mean when I rely on the motor too much, but I also know what you mean when all I have are thermals to keep me up.

[Mchone, Jake]

I have just got back in from another VERY fun and exciting flight with my GWS F4-U, and thaught I seen some birds in a thermal about 1/2-2/3 miles away..and decided to fly my Coursair around to see if I could find a thermal using that, then realised that as fast and heavy as it is, It would probably just power threw one, if I did find one. But on my way back into the house, I thaught..."Maybe I could use my GWS Slow Stick!" It is even lighter and slower than my Aspire(with or w/o motor installed) Couldn't I use it to practice and find thermals before I went threw the effort of getting my Aspire up to altitude and then ending up not finding a thing!?
Is this a stroke of genious, or stupidity?:p
-Jake

[aeajr]

Your GWS F4-U is certainly not too heavy to ride a thermal. It is probably lighter than the Aspire.

The 3 Meter Sailplane that I am going to maiden tomorrow weighs 80 ounces.

My Aerobird, which thermals very well is about 17 ounces.

If the plane will glide nicely, it will ride thermals. You just have to know what to look for.


The best conditions are calm air, hot sun and low humidity. Some big dark area surrounded by lighter areas. A freshly plowed field is good. A parking lot works. A large building with a black roof is awesome.

However I have caught thermals at 35 degrees F in 15 mph winds. They can be weak and they move fast, but the are there!

Here are some thoughts on the hunt!

Get your Aspire up about 500 feet working your way up wind. Then cut the motor and trim the plane for nice level flight. Now, focus on watching the plane and keeping it on a nice steady glide. Steady as she goes. Try to keep your hands off the sticks as much as possible.

Let the plane ride with the river of air giving it only occasional input to keep it going in the general direction you want to go, but don't be a stickler about it. Let it drift like a fly on the surface of the river, waiting for a trout. If you listen with your eyes, it will speak to you, but you have to listen.

Glide across the wind, not into it and not with it. Sort of a 45 -60 degree left for a while then a 45 to 60 degrees to the right. Nice and slow and easy. You want to cover the sky and search the moving river of air, like a bird looking for food.

As you are flying watch the wing tips the nose and the tail. If a wing seems to bump up, or if the nose seems to drop or the tail rise for a moment, you probably just brushed a thermal. Go immediately into a turn in the direction of the wing that rose.

Try to make a circle, but not too tight or you will lose too much altitude. Try for about a 50-75 foot diameter. Complete a couple of turns and see if the plane seems to be rising. If it is, just stay with the turn but give it a little up (back) stick. Not a lot, just a little. Maybe two to four clicks on the up trim. Just a little. We don't want to scare the thermal, we want to bond with it.

Try to observe if the plane is rising steadily, or if it seems to rise and fall. If the second, that means you are not centered in the thermal so work your way more toward the side of the circle where the plane rises.

Remember that thermals move with the wind, so you are not trying to stay in one place in relation to the ground. The air is like a river and you are trying to stay in a little whirlpool that is moving with the river.

If you go into the turn and make a couple of turns with no success, then just resume the search pattern I mentioned. Angles across the wind. Not into it and now with it.

If you are getting out too far, work your way back the same way, angles to the wind.

Unless you hit a boomer, you are not going to immediately know you are in lift, so you have to watch the plane. Sometimes it becomes apparent because you realize that your not sinking but appear to be holding altitude. The only way to do that is to be in lift.

As I say in the photo essay: " It is a hunter's game, if you are up for it."

Follow me, silently, and I'll show you where there's lift.

Good luck pilot! May your hunt go well!

[aeajr]

Going hunting! What will we find?

http://www.rcezine.com/cms/article.php?cat=&id=18

[Mchone, Jake]

How high is that plane in the pic?

Thanks a lot! I just got in from a flight and I think i hooked a thermal, MAYBE 2, but the winds it too gusty to tell if your in lift, or just riding a gust. I willl be back out with it in about 30min.(after the 1500mAh batt. pack recharges) I will TRY(althow, the 0-15mph winds might not let me)
Thank you so much, aeajr and to EVRYone else that helped me on here!:D
I have been having more succes then ever before, even though I have herd the same things over and over again...lol
Another idea!:eek:
Couldn't I buy a large black tarp and spred it out on the field? That would produce a boomer given the right conditions!:D:D

[aeajr]

If you get one that is about 1/4 of an acre it might have a significant effect.

As to the height of the plane, it might have been 500 - 800 feet up. I am not sure. That picutre was taken with a telephoto lense then blown up. While the shot comes up a bit grainy, I think it suites the mystery of the moment that I am trying to convey

[Mchone, Jake]

I asked the high of the plane because I can not judge high.(thats probably a bad thing seeing as I am a private pilot! :( )

[aeajr]

Lookint at the photo, without knowing about the history of the picture i would judge it to be about 250 feet up.

I am not sure but I think that is my Great Planes Spirit 2 M sailplane.

[Mchone, Jake]

thats about the max alt. on my up-start.
I just got in to find that I blew my battery for the EP, so Im going to take the motor and stuff out and "convert" it into the glider version.
I will try and find a tarp ( :p ) tomarrow seeing as how I will not be able to fly anything because of the winds!:mad: (I HATE MARCH!)
Thanks again
-Jake

[aeajr]

Are you saying that the e-aspire is made to convert from electric to sailplane easily and as part of the design? I am not aware of this.

Tell me more about how this works. If you have any photos I would love to see how this is done.

[Mchone, Jake]

Nope, sorry, I don't have a digital camera or a scanner, AND it isn't "made" to convert, but it is easly done, if you have a spare set up pushrods as I do. You simply unscrew the 550 motor from the mount and slide it and the wires, safty on/off switch and etc. out and shift the servoes, Rx, and bettery(batt. goes in the motor slot) as far forward as possible and add 1 to 2 weights into the nose(thows pinewood derby car wieghts are ideal!)
and install the extra long pushrods and you are RTF!:D
Its easyer done than typed...

[aeajr]

That is super cool Man I would love to see you you do that.

I hope you find some thermals.

If you hit a nice one, don't get so excited that you let the plane get too high. I have seen planes just sucked into the sky. Really!

[Mchone, Jake]

When I tryed some Dymanic soaring, earlyer, and thaught I caught some lift(thermic or not) I ALMOST spected it just enuf to where I could see the tail! I cut power emediatly and cominced a search, but found nothing.
I when i went out to trim it after I too the 550 out, a BIG gust from out of nowhere(REALY!) blew me into the trees..i managed to pull around one, but she stalled and laneded at the VERY top a another, about 70-100ft up.
too high to get a later or pole(s)..so i guess ill be getting some sun tomarrow waiting for the wind to blow her down.
It happoned once before when eather my controler got tuned off or the plaes battery switch, and she flew in a circle until it hit a tree about 50ft up...I was able to climb up with a stick a nock it down in harmed...the the way its perched up there this time..when it does fall, it could land on its tail! :eek:
Ill have to be out there to try and catch it...but there is a bunch of very tall and "puffy: grass under atleast one side of the tree, so maybe I have some luck on my side in this occasion.
:(
Wish me luck! lol ;)

[aeajr]

I don't know if trees and planes are attracted to each other like magnets, but
somehow we seem to be pulling someone out of a tree every few weeks.
Fortunately it is not me these days, though I am sure I will find one again.
I can see them reaching for the plane as I fly by. The guys tell me it is the
wind, but I think they are calling my plane.

So, how do you get your plane out of a tree? Here are some methods I use, or
have seen used. Some are simple and cheap. Some are complex and some are
expensive. You have to decide which to use and when.

In my book, chain saws, axes and things that will kill the tree are not an
option. Call me a tree hugger, but I just can't see cutting down a tree to
get a plane. There is usually a better option.

I am going to list the ones I know, roughly in effective range. I hope you
can provide some others, preferably before I need them.

8-12 Feet (2-4 meters) -

Good old hand reach combined with anything to stand on and maybe a local stick
or branch - Cost $0

10-30 Feet (3-10 meters) -

When I fly I bring a 6 foot extension pole for a paint roller that I purchased
in Home Depot for $14. It extends to 12 feet. I have seen 4, 8 and 10
footers that double as well. I also saw an 8 footer that almost triples to
about 22 feet.

15-50 Feet (5-16 meters) -

I carry a spool of 130 pound test mason's line in my field box that has an 8
ounce rounded fishing weight attached to it. Costs about $5 total. With a
good throw I can usually get it up and over the branch holding the plane so I
can shake it free. Hitting the branch can take lots of throws and hitting the
plane is a real risk, but it is better than leaving it there. If your plane
is sitting on a very strong branch, use the lighter line to pull up a heavier
line. -

30-100 feet (9-32 meters) -

A bow and arrow work well at this height, but you have to develop some skill
in order to get the needed accuracy. I estimate this at $50-$100 - One
problem is that you can get the arrow stuck on a different branch which only
compounds your problem. The line will have to be light, so use it to pull up
heavier line or so you can break it if the arrow gets stuck.

A spinning rod with a weight also works but again, the line is light so you
carry stronger line that you pull up to the branch using the lighter line.


Other methods I have heard about but never used or witnessed.

Tree climber - Somehow every RC club has the phone number of a guy who climbs
trees for a fee.

Helo - I heard of one guy who used an electric helo to fly a line and weight
up and had some kind of release to drop it onto the branch. Sounds like a
good justification for a helo when I speak with my wife.

A really original idea

Control line kite - This one surprised me, but one of our members got his
plane stuck in the top of a high tree, over 100 feet up. He also flies the
large kites that look like arc shaped parachutes. He has two control lines on
the kite that let him direct it, dive it and move it around the sky. He used
it to attack the tree until the tree gave up the plane. I like the idea of
attacking the tree!

[Mchone, Jake]

Thanks.
I got up this morning @ 7:30(its 8:30 now) and took my fishing pole and after losing 1 lead wieght, 1 hook, and 2 nuts(ove the matel variety) and about 50ft of line....I just came in cause it started to poor tha rain. :'(
The winds are supposed to be pritty high today, im just hopeing the wind brings it down. But thats slim and non from the way its perched inverted setting very nice and comfterbly on 2 or 3 of the strongest and hardest to get to branches @ the top of the tree.
The only good that came of it is that it is inverted...so the rain cannot get to the electronics.
Any other ideas(ive tryed climbing the tree, but its a dead tree...so NON of the branches can hold my wieght.)
I think im going to try throwing sticks(it worked last time...:p)

[aeajr]

Sorry, you have my list of things to try.

I flew today. Did some recycling of balsa wood. (that is code for I crashed my plane a really messed it up)

So your plane is up a tree and mine is on the building table in pieces.

Which of us is in better shape?

If you aren't fixing, you aren't flying, as my friend Jimmy says.

Good luck with the plane.

[Mchone, Jake]

Sorry for your luck...guess im rubbing off of you, lmao
I AM going to get that @&^# plane out of that @#*& tree TODAY! I can't just let it sit up there all day tomarrow while im @ schoola dn Band practice till 5:00!!:eek: :mad:
The tree is dead, so its not strong enuf to hold me for me to try and climb it...or I would have gotten it yesterday. :(
Even the 20mph wind gusts cant move it.
If all ease fails...i will cut the nylon high stringth kite line off of my kite and pitch it up there untill i get it down. Its been raining most of the day, so I havent been able to try it yet.
But i will keep you posted on my progres as long as you keep me posted on yours (lol) :p
-Jake

[mhmitchell333]

Cornfield + match equals instant thermals!! heh heh

[Mchone, Jake]

Believe it or not...i have actualy thaught of and "tryed" that with the trees that have no place besied the field!
(model rockets are easy to do this with...haha! "It was a acident, officer! I swear to drunk im nt God..." )

[aeajr]

Originally posted by Mchone, Jake
Sorry for your luck...guess im rubbing off of you, lmao

But i will keep you posted on my progres as long as you keep me posted on yours (lol) :p
-Jake

The crash was totally pilot error. One of the good things about computer radios is that they can hold the profile for multiple planes. One of the bad things is that they don't auto sense that you have changed planes. That is the pilot's job.

Before I attach the sailplane to the winch to launch it, I always check to see that the surfaces are moving so I know the receiver is on. However I didn't check to see that they are moving in the proper direction.

So, on the way up the launch, I am trying to guide the plane, but it is going to the left, so I give it right rudder, but it keeps going left then pops off the winch line.

I continue to try and control it to no positive outcome. It came crashing down on the left wing shattering the wing into a million pieces. Fortunately that wing took all the energy and acted as a shock absorber for the rest of the plane.

I had the radio set on Model 3 which is my 3 meter full house plane that I had just been flying. I had not shifted it to model 2 which is for my 2 meter Sagitta 600 sailplane. The servos are reversed on that channel from one plane to the other. So the more I gave it right the worse it went left. I never caught on that the controls were reversed till after the crash.

So, now I go to the building table. My punishment for not being more careful on my pre-launch check list.

Thou shalt perform a valid radio check before launching a plane including all directions and control responses.

Hopefully I learned a valuable lesson and shall commit this sin no more.

[Mchone, Jake]

I always do an extencive check when ever I switch to a new plane. Sorry(again)
Im no better off then you are, though...atleast you have something to rebuild...I got my dad up in the tree and he shook for a good 2-3 mins, but its even wors now :'(
and it is now linger inverted..so when it rains(tuesday-thursda) it is gonna be crewed!
Im not sure what im gonna do...

[aeajr]

You are going to keep at it and try to find a way to bring it down.

Try the fishing pole again, but this time, when you get the line over the branch, use it to pull a much heavier rope up. then you can put more force into your pull.

[aeajr]

Originally posted by Mchone, Jake
I always do an extencive check when ever I switch to a new plane. Sorry(again)
Im no better off then you are, though...atleast you have something to rebuild...I got my dad up in the tree and he shook for a good 2-3 mins, but its even wors now :'(
and it is now linger inverted..so when it rains(tuesday-thursda) it is gonna be crewed!
Im not sure what im gonna do...

Up until now, I was either flying my Aerobird which has it's own radio, or switching between two 2 meter planes, each on its own radio.

A few weeks ago I consolidated these two planes onto the same radio, but went out of my way to make them compatible so I could fly them on the same profile/model memory, without changes. That has worked out very well as they are both RES planes. Same servos reversed and such.

Today was the first time I have ever had to change models in the radio. So, it wasn't really part of my check list.

I almost did it earlier in the day when I went from the 2 meter to the 3 meter. However three meter is a full house, so certain surfaces had not profile so they didn't work at all. That caught my attention.

Profile check is not a part of my preflight!

[fprintf]

Sorry to hear of your troubles aeajr. It is tough enough learning the hard way about turning on the radio, ensuring the right model etc. with an EPP plane. It is even tougher to learn those lessons on your assembled balsa ships. At least it will be a lesson you are likely to forget.

Back on topic, today was a forgettable day weather-wise. Rather cold and sunny this morning, then chilly and brisk 10 mph winds from the south this afternoon. It was a day I would have usually packed up to go home. Instead we took one more flight and it turned out to be a 3 or 4 thermal flight. No fussing with figuring out *where* the lift was coming from, or what was generating them. We were surrounded by swamp and woods. The thermals were just there and you had to watch your plane carefully for the signs of lift and drift with the wind. In fact most of the time I had my plane in glide trim (couple of clicks of down elevator) because of the wind and the thing was still going up.

But it was awesome. I forgot to time the flights, but the planes we were flying (my Highlander and my friend's Ascent) went up to pretty good altitude a couple of times despite the wind. All in all it was just good air without lots of sink and something you definitely cannot predict. I was up long enough that my fingers got really stiff and my neck ached from looking up. 5, 10, maybe 20 minutes of flying. Either way it was a blast, and quite honestly it showed that the Highlander can thermal pretty darn well for a 40 ounce 2 meter foam plane.

I am done trying to predict whether it will be a good or bad thermal day. Any day is a good day for flying. Except possibly when it is really pouring rain or more than 15 mph wind.

[Mchone, Jake]

That last weather conditions you mintioned was JUST like the past 4-5 days..but I fly my parkflyers anyway:D
aeajr, how much do thoughs 8ft/22ft colapasable poles and where can I get them(I only have a Wally-World and a Lowes nearby(HomeDepoe is 1 1/2 hours away...and id rather let the wind get it for me than spend $ for gas and the pole(s).
-Jake

[fprintf]

Well.... those long poles can be had for *really* cheap. They make some really cheapo painters poles that are like $25 or so and stretch pretty far.

The *really* cheap, and rather dishonest method is to buy whichever one fits the bill, get the plane out of the tree, then return it to the store. That way you save money but don't have the pole for future times you get stuck either. :(

[aeajr]

My 6 foot to 12 foot pole as about $16. Lowes should have them.

The best and cheapet way to make a really long pole is PVC pipe.

At about $2 for a 10 foot lenght you can get 3 lengths of 1 inch pipe and two joiners. Glue the joiner to the end of one pipe. Slip in the other pipe and tape it in place.

Now boost it up, leaning aginst branchs and pop in the next pole.

You might be able to do 4 sections if you are lucky.

[averen]

I got my foamie wing stuck in a tree a while back...it was about 50 feet up and I used the PVC "method" to get it out of the tree...it took a while but I was finally able to get it out of the tree...and the one it fell into after that...and the one it fell into after that!

If you're able to get a little thicker PCV is will probably work better er...be stiffer and not want to wave around while you're hoisting it up. It will also be heavier so it will take some more force to work it around!

Planes are ment to fly...not hang out in trees :)

Good luck!
Averen

[RandyK1]

More thermal finding questions: Someone bought my grandson a battery powered bubble mechine for his birthday. I saw that and thought: if I were to take that to the field with me and turn it on, and watch where the bubbles go, maybe it could help me spot some thermals. Do you think this would work?? I have seen bubbles floating in the wind before and they seem to show lift and sink easly. I think the bubble thing was only about $25.00 and it blows alot of bubbles for about 30 min. What do ya think?? Should I spend the $25.00 and find out?? ...R...

[aeajr]

In an earlier post I recommend this book:

Old Buzzard's Soaring Book
http://www.carstens-publications.com/hangar/a11560.html

Great reading, very funny and chock full of good info. Written by the designer of the Bird of Time sailplane.

One of the things he recommends is to go to the field one day an just observe the air. Don't bring your plane.

He talks about how the air flows like a river and is constantly moving. Since you can't see the movement you need something to help you see it. Bubbles is one of the tools he suggests to help you observe the flow of the air.

A machine would be fantastic, but even the bottle of bubbles you buy at the store would be good.

[mhmitchell333]

cornfield plus match. I was joking of course but I have used brush fires to thermal in full sized sailplane. Other than the smell you get really good lift.

[Ollie]

Eaily the best tool for dislodging models from trees is a 20 to 24 foot long, tapered, fiberglass fishing pole that telecscopes down to about 5 feet for transportation and storage. It is far ligher and stiffer than a PVC pipe but costs more.

Soap bubble generators are a traditional thermal indicating tool used by freeflighters. Another very useful thermal indicator is 15 feet of mylar audio recording tape flown from the top of that telescoping fishing pole.

[Mchone, Jake]

Ive herd one the fishing pole method for the tree thing and thermal poles..but you have to have so many thermal poles(atleast 5-8 for one area that thermals generaly go through..I have just never baught into it..

An update on my Aspire...she is in the worst posible place emagenable for that tree and the norst attitude(nose high, with the vent in the canopy pointing strait up, just waiting to funnal the rain in that I am supposed to be getting for the next 4 days! :(
If the rain gets into that wood, it will be warped to were it can be fixed...+ the electronics will be totaly screwed over!
I am going to try and convince my father to take me to wall mart or Lowes and get SOMETHING to help me....ive try EVERYthing else in that list, except the poles.
If I dont get it out tonight...I will no longer have a sailplane seeing as its my only one(I just baught it as a trainer so I could get started in my Parkflyer addiction...but it became it's own addiction)
I probably will not have enuf $ for a Bird of Time because of my car's insurance... so this is my last day, finale hope, for me to comtinue flying sailplanes....atleast until next year. :'(

[Mchone, Jake]

"HOLY GOD!! :eek: I'VE DONE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D:D:D:D:D"

Attintion to ALL on this thred!
On March 15, 2004 at 6:17, Eastern-standard time, my friend and I, equipte with 2, 24ft colapsable fiber painter's poles, climbed 15(me) and about 25ft(my friend) into the GD tree and with a total of 48feet worth of pole(s), we commenced to pocking and shacking the living hell out of the tree and Plane, until it came 'tumbling' down(25 minutes later), into the arms of my friend's 6 year-old with absolutly n harm to the plane, tree, us, or his son!!!:D

I will post how the Aspire is doing after I clean her up alittle and (try) to charge the battery and do a check on ALL 2(LOL) components of her.

I was literaly JUST in time, bacause not 15 minutes later..it started to rain, hard at times..

My friend and I want to sencerly thank all of you who helped me get my beloved Aspire out of this very tight spot we were both in!
Thank you, all!
-Jake(, or shall I say 'Lucky'!:p :) )

[aeajr]

Let the news go out throughout the land!

Let there be rejoicing and gladness and much celebration.

The Aspire that had been prisoner of the evil tree has been liberated by the brave knights using skill and long lances to do battle with said tree.

They are hereby declared "Brothers of the Wing!"

Well done sir knights. Your name will be immortalized in song and verse!

And I hope you will be more careful with your toys next time.

Ha Ha! :D

[Mchone, Jake]

very good speech!
I am not even going to fly in that field anymore!

[Al M]

Back in my free flight days I chased my planes with am open end wrench tied to a large roll of strong string, a compass, and a set of binoculars hanging from my neck. You could often fling the wrench over a tree limb and shake the model out of the tree with the string. You want to be careful when you jump over a log while ducking under a limb. When you kick the binoculars with your knee it is real easy to snap off a front tooth. It took almost a year for a hunter to find the Fubar 36 with the Spitzy .045.

[Master_Dirt]

That tree is dead Jake, cut the damn thing down before it falls on someone!

[Mchone, Jake]

Master_D, I realy want to, its the only obstacle in the field(s)...but the owner/leaser will not let me. I dont even have anything to do it with even if he would... :(

Al, thanks, but I got it out, I tryed it your idea with some nylon kite string, but it was so high and cradled in the tree so deep, it was almost imposable to get it out with me and fly friend 25ft up in the tree with 48ft poles. She was about 80 feet off the ground, wedged in the worst way possible...but when I finaly got her, it only have one rubberband left holding the wing on...give it one good 20mph(wind) day and the wing would have come off and the fuse and wing, both, more than likely would have come down...but it pored the rain ALL night and most of the day today...I HATE THAT DAMN JET STREAM!! :mad:
Nothing is supposed to get better until friday, except for the temp.(48 up to 58)
Its so cold and windy..(thought, its not the wind so much, as it is the turbulance and gusty conditions).. I dont even feel like flying my C-150!
It's due for an anual anyway, so I guess this week-weekend will be a good time to do that.

Thanks again, guys, for all you help and suggestions!:D

-Jake

[dingo]

Hello Folks
I`ve just read this thread & have really enjoyed it . I can really relate to Jakes issue as I remember trying to find thermals for what seemed a long time . I used to joke to my friends that thermals are nothing but an urban myth & they don`t even exist . I haven`t been flying long at all really ( about 18 months or so ) For the first 14 months I might have got in a themal now & then & got a little height , I even hooked a boomer once & specked it . I was hooked but I couldn`t do this again for another 8 months , I put it down to some mysterious cloud form that day & thought it would never happen again . I read all the books e.t.c & the great advice in these threads . The past 3 months have changed things completely . I can allmost speck my plane every flight & feel cheated if I don`t get a thermal . It`s strange & hard to describe but it just came to me . I can sense a themal , I can feel the wind change on my ears & face . If the planes out in front of me & starts to bump around a bit I chase around & look for the strongest lift , then you feel this wind change hit you & I`ll chase it down wind . If the plane is out front ( down wind ) & you see it in obvious sink once again you can feel this wind change when it hits you , seems colder & stronger to me . Keep flying & it will come to you .

[Mchone, Jake]

Thanks, dingo! I have been flying as long as you have, and can relate emensly to how you can feel and sence things..im like that with ALL my planes...I can sence when they are slowing down, speeding up, drifting from the set attitude or anything like that, even if im nt looking at them! :eek:
I have had them so long, i know EXACTLY what they are going to do, just by the inputs i give them.
Night flying with just 2 nav lights on the wing tips has realy helped with that...
I can't explain that eather..
Can anyone else do that? Or am I just a freak-O-nature?

[Mchone, Jake]

Hey, hey, hey! :D
I have finaly caught my very first thermal on saturday or sunday of this week! It was a light one, and was very big(origionated from a black rooved house down the street from my field) It was too far down wind to try and stay in in fear that I might drift too far and not be able to make it back. To compound the 'problem' it was about 50-75ft on the other side of some high powerlines, so if I didn't get high enough(witch i probably wouldn't have) I would have had to circle down in a spiral over the raod and try to fly under them. Not a good idea(hehe, speaking from experiance(GWS Cours' and Funnypark)
BUt it was enough of one for me to do about 5 circles in it before I felt I had to leave it and come back. I found some verylight lift over the trees and the way back and setoput to find it again after I got it back down, but it, like the other, was a lil' too far way and too light to do much good.
I have the Aspire in the non-motorized mode and balanced to where if the is lift at all it will go tail high and seem to get a little faster, which helps for penitration. I took a break for about an hour and just looked at the sky and a couple crows or haws floating on the breeze overhead. It looked like one of them found some lift, so I put the Aspire back up and sure enough, he did! :D But it was too high for my little up-start to thrust me up to it, so I glided aruound under the second/therd thermal for a bit and found myself just high enough to not sink, but I got bord and brough her back in when i seen someone had lit a brush fire, but sadly it was too far away for me to catch. I continued to glide for another hour or 2(remembering all the tips, ofcours) before I got bord and packed up.
It was simply too late in the day for me to get any other low-level thermals. I'll try again this Sunday when the weather clears.

[aeajr]

Originally posted by Al M
Back in my free flight days I chased my planes with am open end wrench tied to a large roll of strong string, a compass, and a set of binoculars hanging from my neck. You could often fling the wrench over a tree limb and shake the model out of the tree with the string. You want to be careful when you jump over a log while ducking under a limb. When you kick the binoculars with your knee it is real easy to snap off a front tooth. It took almost a year for a hunter to find the Fubar 36 with the Spitzy .045.

So, this is what free flight is all about. Think I will stick with RC. ha Ha!

[Mchone, Jake]

I used to FF all the time simply because I couldn't afford much when i first started in this hobby @ the very tender age of 9. I started with FF Balsa and tissue and slowly progressed to my level today. I think I've progressed very nicly considring ive taugh myself everything I know, except what "thows little thingys on the ends of the wings are" my Dad answered that one for me, but thats about the only thing I havent taough myself about flying. Looking back, I still don't know how I did it...! :eek: :D

[aeajr]

Obviously you did it with a smile on your face, a song in your heart and you eyes on the sky or you wouldn't be here telling us about it today.

You loved it!

[Mchone, Jake]

Yes, it waz fun, untill you had to rewind that damn rubber band... :p

[Mchone, Jake]

Ok, guys, I need to know the chanses of catching a thermal tomarrow(I'll be out from about 11am-4pm) with the only obvious sourses of a thermal being produced, being several narrow roads around the field and houses with black or dark roofs on 2 sides of the field. There are usualy some thermals that come into my field, out of the big field that I normaly do not fly in alittle less than 1/4 mile away from my 'base' field.
The weather conditions are as follows:
Sky: 1am to 4am-cloudy 7am to 4pm-sunny to partly cloudy 7pm to 10pm-cloudy
Temp(F): low 41 high 57
Wind(direction): 1am-310 4am-290 then 10am to 10pm 280(av.)
Wind(speed): 1am-4am - 4mph 7am-5mph 10am-4pm - 12mph(av.) and steady @ 13-15 threw the night.
(other additional info avalable @: http://usairnet.com/cgi-bin/launch/code.cgi?model=avn&Submit=Change+Source&state=KY&sta=KLEX

Thanks, any help would be very much appeciated
-Jake

[aeajr]

Don't forget to reread my tips on finding thermals:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=208889&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

Wind of 13 MPH is moderately strong. Be careful the plane does not get too far down wind, you will have trouble getting back. Even when you catch a thermal in 13 MPH wind, staying wiht it can be hard and, again you can get sent down field pretty fast.

I give you a 1 in 4 chance. So parctice your flying in the wind IF you feel confident enough. And remember to launch and land into the wind.

Have fun Pilot!

[Mchone, Jake]

I/it can handle the wind, the only thing im worried about is getting pushed over the tree line..I had that happon once before. The wind isn't blowing in the best direction, but i've flown in wors conditions and hooked some warm air, but not enough to bring me up with it. I am very contous about the wind and the plane getting blown too far down wind. I usualy do not go out more than 300-400ft away from me in any weather that I happon to be flying in. Im not expecting boomers, but I do hope to catch one or 2 if I play my cards right...
Thanks, and I'll be sure to review some tips on here and on other sites b4 I go to put the Aspire up. :D
-Jake

[aeajr]

One thing that helps in the wind, especially with a light sailplane is some ballast. If you put about 3-4 oz of lead right over the CG, typically right over the tow hook, you will be amazed how much better your plane will handle the wind. It will fly faster, but it will penetrate much better and you will have a better chance of getting it back against the wind.

If you have a motor and a battery in it, then you don't need ballast but an Aspire, a Spirit, a Gentle Lady, or something like that will benefit greatly from about 10% added weight to help with wind.

[Mchone, Jake]

Would an parkflyer 8cell AAA pack be about that much? I have 2 if its not.

[aeajr]

That should be close. If you put it in the plane, make sure it is mounted in some way that it will not move around. If it slips, it will throw your CG way off and could make the plane very hard to manage.

Remember if you get into a thermal, you will spend part of the time turned at high angles. A hi-start launch can put a lot of stress on the insides of the plane If you tape it, use plenty. If you velcro it, use plenty, and put some tape over it.

I built a little box in the center of my Sagitta for this purpose.

Try it an you will be surprised at what a difference it makes. Good luck!

[Mchone, Jake]

I thaught about building a box, but the only weights I could find were fishing wights, and thoughs arent the best...
I will use servo/foam tape. It works very good...its what I have all the electronics and stuff held down with(even the serovs) They havent moved once!
Thanks.
Its about that time so I'll ttyl
-Jake

[aeajr]

I use fishing weights in my planes. They work great!

[Mchone, Jake]

They do!! :eek:
Wow, I thaugh they would be too light, even if you did use the big ones, and you would have to use such a big box to hold them in that it would be too braud of an area over the CG.
I'll run to Wally-World after I goto the LHS to pick up yet another GWS foamie(i just can't get enough of them lil' things!:D) and build a little box that will fit under my battery tray.
Thanks a lot
-Jake

[aeajr]

That 8 cell battery would work fine too! No need to buy something if you already have it! Just make sure it is centered over the CG

[Mchone, Jake]

Ok

[Mchone, Jake]

Its a no go....I just got in from trying cross wind, downwind, and headwind launches and the winds are just too turbulent for a lil' 2 meter...maybe a hotliner, or definatly a slope/Dynamic soarer, but its not for the Aspire, even with the balast.
I did manage to get some lift this morning with the Coursair, but I wsn't in the mood to thermal with that plane.
I'll try again Monday, or the next day the wind dies down.

[Mchone, Jake]

The wind was a little gusty today, but it was very warm and sunny, and the wind was calm when its wasn't gusting, so i took the Aspire out and hooked a thermal right of the 1st launch! :D
But it was deing out, or was forming, so all I gained out of it(by flying in and out of it-cause it was so small) was about 20ft, but the winds helped me stay up for about 2 min that flight...and 3 the next!!without a thermal! :eek: :D
But I only caught the edge of one over a tree line about 30min. later and was only able to find the sink before it drifted away... :sad:
I wasn't able to find anyother lift for the rest of the time I was out. I was out from 12-3:30...guess it was just too windy for good thermals to form before they 'detached'.
I'll try again to marrow before I take my g/f to the movies(hehe, wish me luck :p )
-Jake

[Mchone, Jake]

Hey! I have an Idea! Does anyone have a Vid of someone catching a thermal and riding it for any period of time?
That would help TRAMENUSLY! :D:D:D

[fprintf]

If the wind has been blowing in a certain direction all day, the wind calm after a gust = likely a thermal directly upwind. If the wind is barely blowing you can use the new apparent wind direction to help you locate the direction of the thermal. Where there is no apparent thermal generator the wind shifts and careful observation of the plane will be your only guide to any lift.

Two minutes is great, especially when windy. 50 feet up in the air the wind is *much* quicker than you think and the plane will move downwind rather rapidly. It certainly helps if you have a big field without trees, a model that you know can make it back upwind *or* and electric model that you can get high enough to feel comfortable following a thermal downwind.

My personal observation as a fellow newbie is that flying in the wind is really tough when not confident flying over the trees. I find that if I have enough altitude that you need to be able to follow the thermal downwind to get back enough altitude to make it back upwind, and then try again. This is a tough cycle as each time the plane gets to a point where I am "should I, or shouldn't I, follow what looks like lift". Sometimes I chicken out, and other times I go with it - at this point always being more cautious to avoid having to climb 80 foot oak trees.

Also, you don't say how windy it was. There are thermals, and they form quite nicely in all kinds of wind. I have seen a guy get really small in the sky in a 30 mph gusty breeze. He had a Mantis, which is a high performance bagged/fiberglass/CF sailplane, but my point is there *were* thermals out there despite the wind. It just took courage and tons of skill to find it.

[Mchone, Jake]

The wind was/is about 3mph(calm) and 8-10 on average, but its was gusting to about 20mph! :eeK: :p WE have to be crazy!(to buy $200+ planes and gamble it all in the thin air around the wind!)

[Tinfoil]

I own a home in Trona,Ca. The thermals here are stunning. Trona is a five minute drive from Death Valley,Mojave Desert. I don't have a sailplane. I use Hobbyzone RTFs. When I see buzzards circling overhead I send my plane aloft. I have lost several planes in the thermals. I think they came down in Nevada somewhere.

[Ollie]

Hey Tinfoil,

What does land cost out there? Does it take one hand or two hands to hold your hat on?

[Mchone, Jake]

Wish I could move out there....bet the Dust Devils are something to look @ too. :D

[Tinfoil]

I bought a lovely three-bedroom two-bath home here with attached two-car garage with huge front and back yards for $24,000. I had sold my home (same size) in Orange County,Ca a month before for $529,000. I like to fly my planes between the pinnacles http://www.yellowecho.com/travel/trona.htm

[Ollie]

It sounds like soaring heaven.

[fprintf]

It may be soaring heaven, but it sure sounds like h*ll to me... that is, hot!!!

Speaking of hot, my wife is trying to convince me to drive to Florida in July to visit my parents. Is she nuts? I have heard that it rains down in Naples all summer and the mosquitos make the rest of the time when it is not raining miserable for flying! Ollie, what do you think? Is it worth it to bring a glider along?

[Mchone, Jake]

I just thermaled my GWS Funnypark! wow, it snuk right up on me! I didn't even know it was there untill the tail came up and I started to float. Wasn't big enough to circle in, but I did get about 50ft out of it by flying in and out of it before it drifted over the powerlines and on over to the subdivision next to the field.
If my FP was only alittle lighter :p

[Mchone, Jake]

Bad news everyone... :(
At 3:04pm EST I had a magor radio malfuntion(witch is still being investigated)at the start of an up-start launch and the Aspire took a 8* dive into the ground at an estimated speed of 40mph or so...
The nosecone has yet to be excivated and the first 5" of the nose(includng 1 of the motor's bulkheads) is crushed beyond repair.
The plane it's self is ok, but the wing needs a little epoxy to make it useable once again.
Does anyone have any points or suggestions on what to do next?
Has anyonelse had a simaler accedent?

[Master_Dirt]

Sorry to hear that Jake, the Aspire is such a beautiful glider when it ain't broke or sitting in a closet gathering dust.

Are you absolutely certain you can't rebuild that nose? Some guys have performed total miracles with busted fuselages.

Of course it would be off topic for me to suggest you might look for another Aspire in the FS/Wanted section.

Hope you're able to repair it.

[fprintf]

Are you sure it was a radio malfunction? I have had that happen when I didn't give the plane enough flying speed and the plane has got up to about 50 feet and then arced over straight into the ground. No radio malfunction there, just wussy throwing and the plane stalled.

[Mchone, Jake]

Originally posted by Master_Dirt
Sorry to hear that Jake, the Aspire is such a beautiful glider when it ain't broke or sitting in a closet gathering dust.

Are you absolutely certain you can't rebuild that nose?
Hope you're able to repair it.

The nose is reparable, but im not sure exactly how to go about it. Would it be strong enough to just cut the damaged part off, then epoxy on a newly rebuilt replacement section? The fuse. is built of 2 ply balsa sheeting(ply wood). So couldn't I just over lap the new section on the existant? Im not sure if that method would be strong enough to support the motor(550) in a harder landing that we all tend to have everynow and then.
I am going to fix it, but I only want to have to fix it once, ya' know?:rolleyes:

[Mchone, Jake]

Originally posted by fprintf
Are you sure it was a radio malfunction? I have had that happen when I didn't give the plane enough flying speed and the plane has got up to about 50 feet and then arced over straight into the ground. No radio malfunction there, just wussy throwing and the plane stalled.

No, it was a radio malfuntion, eather something came unconneted, or the switch(on the plane) got turned off somehow. I had conrole before I tossed it, but as soon as I seen it was not climbing, but heading out strait, I pulled up an dthere was nothing...
I flew into the ground and buried it's nosecone into the ground and ws pulled to the side by the up-start and that is what broke/snapped the nose, instead of crushing it. The nose cone is imbedded into the ground, but im not sure where because the plane was pulled about 20ft up from where it inicialy hit.
It had plinty of speed :D, I assure you! :p

[aeajr]

Originally posted by Mchone, Jake
The nose is reparable, but im not sure exactly how to go about it. Would it be strong enough to just cut the damaged part off, then epoxy on a newly rebuilt replacement section? The fuse. is built of 2 ply balsa sheeting(ply wood). So couldn't I just over lap the new section on the existant? Im not sure if that method would be strong enough to support the motor(550) in a harder landing that we all tend to have everynow and then.
I am going to fix it, but I only want to have to fix it once, ya' know?:rolleyes:

Sorry to hear about your crash. I had a bad crash a couple of weeks ago with my Sagitta 600 because I had the radio set on the profile for my Airtronics Legend. The Sagitta is a 3 channel and the legend is a 6 so you can imagine that they don't match. The more I have it right rudder the more it went left till it spiraled int the ground on a winch launch.

As for repairs. I wrecked my Spirit last october on a bad launch. You can see some of the photos here.

http://www.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=67b0de21b3709961e47b&notag=1

Now, as to reapiring yours:

First, dont' throw anything out. If you are sure that you can't just glue it back together then try consider this:

YOu can try and pickup a kit for the Aspire and use it for spare parts. I did that with the Spirit. Would typically be about $45. Or you can get the ARF for about 100 if they are available. If not, or if you don't want t spend the money then try this:

The fuselage is probably two layers of thin plywood or 1/8 balsa. If that is the case, remove the covering back to where you have good fuselage, then go back about another 6-8 inches.

What you want to do is remove one layer of fueselage. YOu may have to slip a hobby knife between teh layers, or perhaps some kind of blade, but you want to leave one solid layer in place all the way around. It can be the inner or the outer layer. If you have a choice, leave the outer layer, then you are doing your joining inside.

Now, cut the plywood, one layer to rebuild the damaged piece. I will assume the nose block survived, so you can use it to shape the pieces. It is not absolutely critical that it have the exact perfect shape on the sides, just get it very close. You may have some broken pieces that you can use for cutting guides.

So, you cut one piece that overlaps the good part of the fuselage. Build on the bottom, the the two sides. Look at the nose block. How does teh fuselage join to the nose block?

Take a look at my spirit photos, they might help.

After you get one layer done, then put the second layer on so it joins up nicely with the first.

You can use CA, Yellow glue like tight bond, or you can even use white glue like elmers. Be sure you get the full wood surface coated when you join the flat pieces.

You will probably have to do a piece at a time, let it dry, then do the next piece. Take your time. use clamps or weights to hold the glued pieces together.

Ask questions. We will help you. I probably can't respond for a few days as I am out of the country right now and this is my only chance to get to the internet for an hour today or I would go into more detail.

Good luck repariman!

After you have that all together so that it

[Mchone, Jake]

Thats exactly what I was going to do! :p
Thanks.
My AspireEP doesn't have a nose block. Just 2 motor bulkheads/formers. They are going to be a bit of a challenging to recreate and get set on the right offset degress for thrust and stuff, but the hardest thing will be getting the bottom to curve into the sides and into the round former that the spinner 'sets on'.
The Pix you have are EXACTLY like my crash, except I didn't hurt the wing(just broke the seal in the middle where they join, but some 5min. epoxy will make it better than new(cause I used Elmer's white glue when I 1st put them together(I was 12, give me a break :p )

[Mchone, Jake]

Originally posted by Mchone, Jake
Thats exactly what I was going to do! :p
The Pix you have are EXACTLY like my crash, except I didn't hert the wing

[Mchone, Jake]

second(this is aeajr's crash, but mine is almost exact--just to give ya'll some ideas)

[Mchone, Jake]

last 1

[fprintf]

A translation: "Hert" = hurt, "Brock" = broke, "chalanged" = challenge. :D :D

My kids are learning to spell via phonics and they encourage creative spelling in kindergarten. My 5 year old spells a bit like this, my favorite being her spelling of butterfly: bdrfli. Fortunately by the time children reach 2nd grade they are being actively encouraged to use other tools to spell hard words. English is a tremendously challenging language, and I understand even more so for those with dyslexia, ADD, ADHD and the host of other childhood ailments.

[Mchone, Jake]

Hey, hey, hey now! You wouldn't make fun of a bad/fast typest would you?! :D
I guess the secrets out...I do not spell check. rofl!
Sorry :p(im only 15)

[Mchone, Jake]

Good news for today, everyone! I have just got in from the field with the spiner(which was in the ground about 2 inches) along with the "brock" motor mount and 1/2 of the fromer the spiner 'sets on'. I will be going to the LHS and Wally-World ASAP to see what I can find, seeing as i can't get to the HobbyTown USA about an hour away for another frew days.
I'll keep you posted
-Jake

[Mchone, Jake]

Hollow, Gentlmen
Last night and early this morning I broke out the CA and went to work on trying to put together the pieces of the broke section. They fit pritty darn good for what shape they are in! They all fit and give me exactly what I need to make sure I get the measurements right for the new nose sec. I can make exactly what I need by looking @ the old piece, but I still haven't had a chance to goto the only place for balsa around here(HobbyTown USA in Lexington)
But im hopeing i'll get to run up there soon.
-Jake

[Master_Dirt]

I dunno Jake, 40 mile each way, doncha think you should drive or hitch a ride. The excercise might be good for you but still, that's a long way to run.

[Mchone, Jake]

Well, I haven't had a chance in so long(to exercise that is..) I figured id go for it...
rofl
:p