Are the GENTLE LADY's still being manufactured?

[steelhead]

Ok- I see ads for the GL's in magazines for $44.00

I am almost thinking of buying one- for nostalgia- i love transparent wing ribs.

The problem is- are they making new kits? Are these still the DIE-CUT /SMASHED balsa?

I remember when the kit was worth the wood for $19.99, but wondering if anyone has any news on this bird.

Where is the wharehouse that housed 20,000 of these?

Dean@steelheadproducts.com

[R. Carver]

The new GL kits are laser cut. I bought one about a year ago, and wasn't that impressed, the parts still don't fit! Much better wood though....
Anyway, even if the parts don't fit it's still a great flying little ship. One of my all time favorites :D

[Sparky Paul]

The GL ARF is impressive. Looks to be well-built, with a much better wing structure.

[steelhead]

Do they use an airfoil? or is it still the GL shoe soul airfoil?

I saw the GL arf's- thats awesome.

Sounds like a neat way to get a club contest set up

Dean@steelheadproducts.com

[BMatthews]

Originally posted by steelhead
Do they use an airfoil? or is it still the GL shoe soul (sole) airfoil?
....

A Gentle Lady with the Mark Drela AG35 airfoil. Now that would be a great model. Granted I'm only going by hearsay about the airfoil but it's ALL been good at the Allegro Lite site discussions.

[Sparky Paul]

The GL airfoil isn't as bad as its reputation.
It isn't fast, but it sure comes down slow!
Useless with ailerons.
My best AP plane is a GL.

[Ollie]

A wing with open bay construction doesn't have an airfoil. It has as many different airfoils as you care to measure between the ribs where the covering sags.

The GL airfoils work well at low speeds in spite of their short comings because of high mean cambers and low wing loading.

The GL airfoil bottom is flat from the leading edge radius all the way to the trailing edge, This results in high drag at low angles of attack and limits high speed penetration into the wind.

The AG3- series airfoils have facets on the aft of the upper surface to avoid covering sag with open bay construction. The angles between the facets are small enough not to disrupt the flow and increase drag much. They are the only airfoils that I know of with this innovation. They also have an up sweep of the bottom surface (Phillips entry) from the spar to the leading edge that reduces drag and improves the glide angle during high speed penetration.

[bjaffee]

Originally posted by R. Carver
The new GL kits are laser cut. I bought one about a year ago, and wasn't that impressed, the parts still don't fit! Much better wood though....


Heh...you're the second person I've heard that from. Can someone explain how that can happen. I wonder if they just traced a bunch of die-crunched parts to get the coordinates!

Ah well, I still like the Wander 76" better. :)

[steelhead]

No not bad- they just dont ballast up very well. But that's not what they were designed for.

A friend of mine ran tests on a airfoil windtunnel simulator after tracing the airfoil and getting the coords. It works almost perfectly in the 10 to 20 mph windspeed at the average weights for hte GL. It sure looks funny compared to what we use today. A little phillips entry and the foil would be almost current. I've noticed the trend for some planes to be back to using the E203 and E204 and some witht he CLARK-Y thinned and calling them "modern day" airfoils.
The reality is- airfoils work best in the wingloading and speeds they were designed for. The open bay construction can be made better with the LE sheeting, but that might not make the airfoil that the GL works best at.
Anyone have a cross section of the middle of the rib bay area? That would be interesting to see.

Im thining of getting another kit. There is just something pretty to those open bays with transparent monokote in the 70's colors!

There used to be a website based on the GL- anyone rememebr it? I think it was based in SAN FRAN.

Dean@steelheadproducts.com

[BMatthews]

I guess we shouldn't be surprised that the GL airfoil works best at low speeds and low wing loadings. After all Goldberg in his original article in RCM stated that he wanted an easy to fly model that was based on his free flight background. He placed a great importance on light weight and slow flying to help folks, and himself, stack the deck for successful learning. The fact that so many people have enjoyed the GL over the years (me included) shows that most of us like a low work load model even if we don't want to admit that it doesn't work well for most wind conditions.

But then comes a calm summer's evening close to dusk when the dappled clouds are fat with pink underbellys and the last wisps of the day's dying thermals bouy up both the feathered and balsa birds. At these special times absolutley NOTHING can match an open structured model floating on a super light wing loading with the light showing through the coloured skins. You stand there with a stiff neck ignored because your mind is lost in euphoria with the forgotten transmitter dangling loosely from one hand as the model scribes big lazy circles about your head.

....Great, I've gone and given myself teary eyes.... :D

[R. Carver]

Originally posted by bjaffee
I wonder if they just traced a bunch of die-crunched parts to get the coordinates!


I wouldn't be surprised if they did, 'cause the laser cut parts don't fit the same way the die-crunched ones didn't :)

[Sparky Paul]

Here's an AG 24 and the GL-Electra.
I fear the pleasant low speed handling of the GL would go away! :)
BTW, Smith Bros. Hobbies in Northridge has Carl's original GL on display.

[steelhead]

That might be interesting to go see the original. Hey kids! Lets go to a hobby store!


anyone have a copy of the original article? That might be interesting for us

Dean

[InTheLift]

Originally posted by R. Carver
The new GL kits are laser cut. I bought one about a year ago, and wasn't that impressed, the parts still don't fit! Much better wood though....
Anyway, even if the parts don't fit it's still a great flying little ship. One of my all time favorites :D
How far off are the parts, about like they used to be before they started producing these laser cut kits? Or is it better than that? What happened to the Wanderer. Dynaflite give up on that one? I guess you can tell it's been a while since I've flown!

[bjaffee]

They made an ARF Wanderer for a while, I think, though it didnt have the nice elliptical fin. Now they just have something called the Daydream. Looks pretty boring in comparison.

[InTheLift]

I saw the Daydream and agree with you, pretty boring in appearance. I like the tail section of the Wanderer. It was a good, durable plane. Maybe not the best TD bird in it's class, but I flew mine mostly on the slopes. Too bad.

[John Gallagher]

Looks boring? The Daydream's 3021 airfoil is a big improvement over the old flat bottom wing.

[InTheLift]

Originally posted by John Gallagher
Looks boring? The Daydream's 3021 airfoil is a big improvement over the old flat bottom wing.
I was only speaking of the appearance/style of the plane. I liked the rounded tail group and "guppy" shaped fuse of the Wanderer. No doubt the Daydream will be a better performer.:)

[bjaffee]

Heh...yeah. Unless you only view the plane from end of the wing tip, it looks boring.

[wingsnapper]

Take a look at Skybench's site. The planes listed there are of far better quality. Ray's Bird series not only look good, but will outfly a GL 99% of the time. Honestly, how many days do you get to fly in optimum (no wind) conditons. The "Birds" trade some floatablity for legs giving you many more enjoyable outings.
If you must have an old design, Ray also sells a laser cut Olympic II that would be great. JS

[R. Carver]

Originally posted by InTheLift
How far off are the parts, about like they used to be before they started producing these laser cut kits? Or is it better than that?

Almost exactly the same.

[steelhead]

Skybench's site. . Ray's Bird series ...

what website is this?

Dean

[bjaffee]

When in doubt, try the obvious :)

http://www.skybench.com/

[InTheLift]

Originally posted by wingsnapper
Take a look at Skybench's site. The planes listed there are of far better quality. Ray's Bird series not only look good, but will outfly a GL 99% of the time. Honestly, how many days do you get to fly in optimum (no wind) conditons. The "Birds" trade some floatablity for legs giving you many more enjoyable outings.
If you must have an old design, Ray also sells a laser cut Olympic II that would be great. JS
I've purchased some of the Skybench stuff, they do a nice job. I don't mention the Wanderer for any particular reaseon, it's simply an old favorite of mine. I had a GL too and also liked it. I used to fly a small beach slope and both were great for that application. Nice to see that the GL is still around. My original q for this thread was in regard to the quality of the fit of the parts now that they are laser cut. Sounds like I got my answer, no improvement. Thanks again...time to go surf the Skybench site for a while!:D

[akmoose43]

I've built a few Sophisticated Ladies. Great flying planes. I think they have the same wing as a GL. If you add a top spar- 1/8" x 3/8", the wing is almost unbreakable. I added a piece of 1/8" balsa to the bottom of the wing from the l.e. to the back of the spar, sand to airfoil shape. Got better performance in the wind.

[T. Lyttle]

Yeah, I D-tubed the wing on my GL, and it improved the performance quite a bit, and the strength immensely (no more flutter, no re-rigging).

I must have taught nearly 200 guys how to fly on GL, used to add a piece of 1/8 sq under the le and remove it when they had it figured out. Perfect.

[steelhead]

just for grins- what was the square balsa for?

Dean@*****************.com

(Im not allowed to write my email address anymore to sign my posts)

[T. Lyttle]

Positive incidence: makes the model float better, much easier for a beginner to control, if you needed an answer;)

[steelhead]

I didnt need an answer, but waws actually interested on how much difference it made on that wing. Sounds pretty good

Dean

[BMatthews]

Dean, it's not a good idea to put your email address on any of these posts because it's public and the SPAM 'bots will find it and fill your box with stuff. That's probably why the site filters for the @ sign and cuts out the addy.

[steelhead]

Bmatthews- Yeah, I was risking spam bots- but for some reason, RC groups doesnt alsways load on every computer I use, so I liked having email address available for direct replys. Plus I'm just used to signing my emails and everything else computer related with my email. I'll live... I guess...

Everyone else-
Several years ago, I made a gentle lady with an e205 wing thinned a couple of percents and had a much stronger and much better penetrating wing. I believe it was the positive entry and rounder LE. Anyone else used a different airfoil? I had to modify the wing saddle a little on the GL but it was a good modification.

10 years ago or so, I used a GL built really light as a HLG. That original airfoil really flew slow enough to catch anything. I think I still have the fuselage with no wing.
Anyone know if they sell a wing kit from that company who is now selling the kits?
Might be fun to build a stick wing again....been a while.

Dean

[Ollie]

About 15 or more years ago Dr. Walt Good built a beefed up Gentle Lady that he called his Gutsy Lady. It had an S4061 airfoil with a carbon spar and a fully sheeted wing. It also carried a Thermic Sniffler variometer. The all up weight was about 40 ounces. He did very well with it in Florida contests.

[T. Lyttle]

While its hard to improve on a good design, there are some things can be done to the GL. The 1/8 shim between the fuse and the wing is a temporary adjustment, rather than a modification; like I said, remove or add it as conditions dictate. For beginners, it tames the model down in elevator sensitivity, down side is that it slows down the model, affecting penetration in the wind (and out comes the shim).

As far as airfoils are concerned, I didn't bother too much on the GL, as I felt there was too much drag in the design to take advantage of a super-efficient wing. If I was going to put that kind of effort into the wing, I would also change the fuse and tailfeathers:presto, not a GL anymore: ).

[steelhead]

anyone else used a "super simple" or homemade airfoil on their plane with any results?

Dean