Nosen aka AA Ind. Citabria....

[Wind Shadow]

Hi folks,
anyone here ever build the Nosen/AA Ind. Citabria? The big 1/4 scale one--what engines are popular, any mods,etc.

VERY big box of wood,would like to hear building and flying experiences.
Thanks! :D

Wind Shadow

[Highflight]

Built several Citabria's including the Champ (pretty close to the same thing, construction and flying wise).

Engine: Either the Q-42 or the G-38 are absolutely perfect for the Citabria. No more; no less.

Mods NEEDED for using those engines:
1. Replace the balsa stringers from the firewall to F2 with spruce or basswood.
2. Don't use lite ply for the firewall, use a 3/8" piece of the good ply, but because of a mod I suggest later, you do NOT need 1/2" ply.
3. Drill 45 degree diagonal 3/8" holes that go through the top of the wing mounting plate on the fuse and out to the outside of the fuse. Epoxy in 3/8" dowel. Do three on each side; 1 toward the front, 1 in the middle, and 1 toward the back. It's easy to smooth over where you cut them flush so they won't show up on the outside and they'll be flush to the surface of the mounting plates as well.
That will make the wing mount plates a LOT stronger for the higher weight loads as well as better to take the vibration of the gas motor. You can do that AFTER you have epoxied the wing mounting plates in place; that makes it easier to drill for and install the dowels.
4. Throw away the cheezy gear that comes with it (or use it for your Kadet Senior). Buy the next size up in size, and thicker, gear from anybody. Brand doesn't matter. You want the slightly taller gear to give you more prop clearance for the 18" prop, and the thicker gear is necessary to handle the heavier aircraft (it will probably come in around 23 to 25 pounds).
5. Pay attention to the wing struts, they ARE functional. Use straight grain spruce or basswood and make steel ends for them that are pinned in with toothpicks and epoxied. For my first Citabria, I embedded wire inside but that really isn't necessary as long as you use good wood. While I don't like the obvious method Nosen designed for attaching the wings to the fuse because of the way the screws shoe, it DOES work so you can leave that alone. Just be sure to use a good grade of #6 screws rather than the cheapo ones you get in the kit.
Don't use the supplied aluminum tabs for the wing struts... you'll be sorrrrrry.
6. Similar to the mod for the wing mounts, drill a 3/8" hole about an inch in from each corner of the firewall and then about the same location through the next former behind it. Then in each pair of holes, epoxy in a length of 3/8" dowel between them that can be sanded flush with the front surface of the firewall when cured. These are also added as an "afterthought" after the fuse is framed up.
Those four dowels will form a sort of "box" between the firewall and the next former that will significantly improve strength and resistance to vibration in the front end of the aircraft where it matters most. That's why you don't need a 1/2" former.
This doesn't add much weight, but that doesn't matter especially since you'll STILL probably be adding some weight to the nose to balance it. That may not sound right, but that's what mine have required... but whatever; do what you need to balance yours.

Mods you WANT to do but don't have to:
1. BUY a fiberglass cowl for it. The built up wood thing is just plain silly.
2. Get some good .040 plastic sheet for the windows. All you get in the kit is the windshield anyway and it's junk and rolled into a tube where it's hard to work with and impossible to make look good.
3. This is a biggie on the "want" list: Instead of closing in and sheeting the bottom of the fuse between the firewall and the next former, make the bottom of it be a removeable hatch. That way, you'll always have easy access for running all the stuff that needs to be run through there as well as making it downright easy to mount the engine. Since you changed the stringers at the to spruce or basswood, and you installed the 4 dowels at the firewall/F2 location, you're not losing any strength by making a removable hatch at that location.

All of the above will give you a Nosen Citabria that you'll like and keep for a long time.

HIghflight

[Wind Shadow]

Highflight,
Thanks VERY much for your comments!
Just the kind of info I was looking for.

I plan on putting a G-38 in mine, seemed like the right engine for the plane.
Also, was definitely planning on a glass cowling for it.

How is the aerobatic performance with that power/weight, and that big flat bottom airfoil?

I plan on building it this coming winter(I like to fly, and now is flying time!) I think it will be a nice building project--I don't mind sticks, makes for a lighter plane too.

Thanks again for the info!
:)

Wind Shadow

[Highflight]

No trouble at all. I really like the Nosen kits because they're so cheap, build easy, and fly well if you make the mods. I tell anyone who asks how great these models build and fly.

You'll find that the Citabria will perform quite scale with the G-38. It's going to be a little sluggish on some manuevers, but so is the real one. It never was intended to compete with CAP's, Giles and the rest. With my Q-42, the Citabria will climb vertical for about 75 feet before falling off.
A Q-52 would probably make it a true vertical performer but that's cheating and, I don't think, as much fun to fly. I've only seen one with a Q-52 and it was just too much.
I've seen several people fly it with a G-23 but it'll only fly and not perform. It needs the kick in the pants of a G-38/Q-42 to make it a real blast to fly. With a G-38 or Q-42 at 1/4 throttle, it just putts alone like a trainer and lands like a Telemaster.

There's only one thing I want to warn you about; the Citabria IS slightly short coupled meaning that the distance from the wing to the stab is shorter than most trainers. That means that you want to fly the aircraft from the moment you start the take off run to the moment you roll to a stop.
If you put you CG slightly forward, no problem, but with the CG right on the edge (so to speak) like mine, it'll be more aerobatic which is great, but it will also snap on you if you take off slow, nose high at full power.
If you like your CG on the touchy side, pay attention. That doesn't apply much more to the Citabria than to any other aerobatic aircraft, but I don't want you to think that the Citabria is just another trainer aircraft. It's way more fun than that.

As I said, I've built several and I have two more NIB Citabria's as well as NIB a Champ , a NIB Mulligan, and a NIB Gere Sport (all, of course, Nosen kits) waiting for me in the garage. At an average price of about $85 for each of them, you just can't beat giant scale on a budget any better than that.

Highflight

[victor hull]

Hey Wind Shadow

Just a little comic relief.

I also built a Nosen Citabria back in 1983. Stuck a Quadra on the nose, coverite and pactra paint. The nose was huge. Sprayed Pactra Blue and white. The paint lifted when I used masking tape for the white trim. I had a friend give it the test flight. Flew great I guess. The muffler fell off in flight, the elevator stuck during the landing approach then unstuck. He lost his distant judgment during the approach and yelled for me to judge. I was in the same boat he was. Any way it landed safely. Hung the citabria in a small local hobby without the quadra. It fell from the ceiling. I picked it up and took it home. Finally gave it away. Don't know what happened to it. I loved Bud Nosen Kits. Right now I am into electric's and will work my way up to 1/4 scale. Love to stick build. Have a great time.

VH