Gyro Advice

[CubanFlyer]

Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30, I
am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400


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Please remove 'nospam' if replying

[Paris]

hi there

the GY-401(Futaba) is a good one,
I have 2 and I'm very happy with them.

regards
Paris



"CubanFlyer" <aorb38@Hat.dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:3ee25971$0$10632$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com ...
> Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30,
I
> am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400
>
>
> --
> Please remove 'nospam' if replying
>
>

[Markerbeacon]

Heliproz put me onto the Futaba GY240. So far am very pleased with it. Works
as advertised!

-Mark


"CubanFlyer" <aorb38@Hat.dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:3ee25971$0$10632$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com ...
> Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30,
I
> am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400
>
>
> --
> Please remove 'nospam' if replying
>
>

[Chopper]

CSM's 400 can be a bit hit and miss, sometimes you get a good one,
othertimes they drift, Also its designed for a cheapie servo. There is no
benefit to fitting a faster digital servo later on to improve performance.
The ones I have seen tend to have a slow wander left and right. Not a high
speed wag as if the gain is too high though!

The Futaba 401 has better holding power, accepts digital servos and does not
drift.
Hope that helps
Steve

"CubanFlyer" <aorb38@Hat.dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:3ee25971$0$10632$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com ...
> Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30,
I
> am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400
>
>
> --
> Please remove 'nospam' if replying
>
>

[Biggie in PA]

I am flying the GY-401. Excellent gyro for the price!

--

Biggie in PA
sjg1958 at hotmail dot com


"CubanFlyer" <aorb38@Hat.dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:3ee25971$0$10632$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com ...
> Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30,
I
> am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400
>
>
> --
> Please remove 'nospam' if replying
>
>

[Beav]

"Chopper" <chopper@remove.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:M3tEa.10931$IV1.76612763@news-text.cableinet.net...
> CSM's 400 can be a bit hit and miss, sometimes you get a good one,
> othertimes they drift, Also its designed for a cheapie servo.

No it's not. It's designed so that an expansive isn't necessary, and as far
as drift is concerned, I've yet to see that happen with a 400 and ALL the
guys at my field have at least one heli with either a 400 or a 540
installed.

There is no
> benefit to fitting a faster digital servo later on to improve performance.

Oh yes there is. The 400 doesn't have SUPER servo mode, but that doesn't
mean that fitting either a super servo or a digital won't be beneficial, it
just won't be AS beneficial as fitting one to a 540. Fitting ANY fast servo
makes a difference to ANY gyro

> The ones I have seen tend to have a slow wander left and right. Not a high
> speed wag as if the gain is too high though!

Probably something to do with the setup not being done properly, or some
friction or slop in the tail rotor system. If the mechanical aspect of the
tail rotor is as it should be, a 400 will lock the tail equally as well as
any other gyro, eve with a cheap servo.

>
> The Futaba 401 has better holding power, accepts digital servos and does
not
> drift.

It doesn't? Maybe yours doesn't, but maybe some others do.



--
Beav


Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
(with the obvious changes)

Beavisland now lives at
www.beavisoriginal.co.uk

[Michael]

I have 3 CSM 400 and happy with them all 2 are on raptor 30's

Michael

(Australia)
"CubanFlyer" <aorb38@Hat.dsl.pipex.com> wrote in message
news:3ee25971$0$10632$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com ...
> Any body got any recommendations about what gyro to buy for my Raptor 30,
I
> am new to heli and have been looking at CSM 400
>
>
> --
> Please remove 'nospam' if replying
>
>

[Chopper]

Hi Beav, interesting comments there, though I feel I have to put a few
thinks into perspective here.
"Beav" <beavis.original@ntloxoworld.com> wrote in message
news:nnEEa.692309$vw6.4555458@news.easynews.com...
>
> "Chopper" <chopper@remove.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:M3tEa.10931$IV1.76612763@news-text.cableinet.net...
> > CSM's 400 can be a bit hit and miss, sometimes you get a good one,
> > othertimes they drift, Also its designed for a cheapie servo.
>
> No it's not. It's designed so that an expansive isn't necessary, and as
far
> as drift is concerned, I've yet to see that happen with a 400 and ALL the
> guys at my field have at least one heli with either a 400 or a 540
> installed.

I know a lot of guys who are swopping out the CSM gyros, especially the 540
due to drift in the hover, I agree that flat out 3D and backwards they hold
great, they just don't cut the mustard in precision hovering

> >There is no
> > benefit to fitting a faster digital servo later on to improve
performance.
>
> Oh yes there is. The 400 doesn't have SUPER servo mode, but that doesn't
> mean that fitting either a super servo or a digital won't be beneficial,
it
> just won't be AS beneficial as fitting one to a 540. Fitting ANY fast
servo
> makes a difference to ANY gyro

I agree that a fast servo is beneficial to most gyros. Though I have seen
several 400's where there is so little improvement when fitted with a faster
servo. that its just not worth the extra expense. (This is even after
checking for a smooth tail linkage). The Futaba 240 also has a marginal
improvement that its probably not worth the expense of a super fast digital
servo.
>
> > The ones I have seen tend to have a slow wander left and right. Not a
high
> > speed wag as if the gain is too high though!
>
> Probably something to do with the setup not being done properly, or some
> friction or slop in the tail rotor system. If the mechanical aspect of the
> tail rotor is as it should be, a 400 will lock the tail equally as well as
> any other gyro, eve with a cheap servo.

Are you sure about this? I think you will find there are several gyro combos
that lock better than a 400 with cheap servo. If this were the case then
perhaps all the competition pilots would be using a 400 with cheap servo.


>> The Futaba 401 has better holding power, accepts digital servos and does
>>not drift.
>
> It doesn't? Maybe yours doesn't, but maybe some others do.
>

Mine doesn't , because I have a smooth tail linkage and its well setup.

Happy flying,
Regards Steve

[Beav]

"Chopper" <chopper@remove.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:wsMEa.11928$r84.84525314@news-text.cableinet.net...
> Hi Beav, interesting comments there, though I feel I have to put a few
> thinks into perspective here.
> "Beav" <beavis.original@ntloxoworld.com> wrote in message
> news:nnEEa.692309$vw6.4555458@news.easynews.com...
> >
> > "Chopper" <chopper@remove.blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:M3tEa.10931$IV1.76612763@news-text.cableinet.net...
> > > CSM's 400 can be a bit hit and miss, sometimes you get a good one,
> > > othertimes they drift, Also its designed for a cheapie servo.
> >
> > No it's not. It's designed so that an expansive isn't necessary, and as
> far
> > as drift is concerned, I've yet to see that happen with a 400 and ALL
the
> > guys at my field have at least one heli with either a 400 or a 540
> > installed.
>
> I know a lot of guys who are swopping out the CSM gyros, especially the
540
> due to drift in the hover, I agree that flat out 3D and backwards they
hold
> great, they just don't cut the mustard in precision hovering

I can't say I've ever experienced this "problem" with any of my own heli's,
and on the heli's where I HAVE, it's always been something mechanical that
needed looking at.
>
> > >There is no
> > > benefit to fitting a faster digital servo later on to improve
> performance.
> >
> > Oh yes there is. The 400 doesn't have SUPER servo mode, but that doesn't
> > mean that fitting either a super servo or a digital won't be beneficial,
> it
> > just won't be AS beneficial as fitting one to a 540. Fitting ANY fast
> servo
> > makes a difference to ANY gyro
>
> I agree that a fast servo is beneficial to most gyros. Though I have seen
> several 400's where there is so little improvement when fitted with a
faster
> servo. that its just not worth the extra expense.

The difference here is that the 400 works so well with a non super servo,
that fitting one isn't going to imprive things out of sight.

(This is even after
> checking for a smooth tail linkage). The Futaba 240 also has a marginal
> improvement that its probably not worth the expense of a super fast
digital
> servo.
> >
> > > The ones I have seen tend to have a slow wander left and right. Not a
> high
> > > speed wag as if the gain is too high though!
> >
> > Probably something to do with the setup not being done properly, or some
> > friction or slop in the tail rotor system. If the mechanical aspect of
the
> > tail rotor is as it should be, a 400 will lock the tail equally as well
as
> > any other gyro, eve with a cheap servo.
>
> Are you sure about this?

I'm positive. I've been using CSM gyro's since the very first ones became
commercially available and only last week I got an SL 560. I've also got
some of the other major manufacturers gyros (Futaba 602 and JR 5000T to name
a couple) and none of them are any better than a well set up 400/540 or the
560. What people don't seem to realise about the CSM gyro's is they come
with a pre-programmed amount of expo BUILT IN and this gives a soft feel
around centre, but it's "get riddable" if you want a tight "feel" around the
centre of the stick movement. (Not with the 400 though, coz that's not got
the interface facility)

I know a few people who "thought" this softness was an inability to lock,
but it's not, it's just "there" to allow some error on the sticks when
you're hovering, and once they were made aware of this, the "drifting"
suddenly stopped!

I think you will find there are several gyro combos
> that lock better than a 400 with cheap servo.

The "OTC" combo's ALL have high speed servo's unless the two components of
the system are bought seperately or without thought for the performance.

If this were the case then
> perhaps all the competition pilots would be using a 400 with cheap servo.

I doubt it
>
>
> >> The Futaba 401 has better holding power, accepts digital servos and
does
> >>not drift.
> >
> > It doesn't? Maybe yours doesn't, but maybe some others do.
> >
>
> Mine doesn't , because I have a smooth tail linkage and its well setup.

And isn't this what part of the problem HAS been IS being and always WILL
be? I spend probably more hours in one week setting up heli's than most
others do in a month of Sundays, and I've heard "It's been perfectly built"
too many times to think about, but I rarely actually SEE a heli that's even
come CLOSE to being "perfectly built". Most aren't even adequate and some
are so bad a total re-build is necessary before I'd think about flying them.
Now SOME guys won't accept that they can't build, and it's these guys that
seem to have all the problems. Drifting gyro's, failing servo's, blown
motors, you name it. I don't have drifting gyro's, my regular "Sunday flyer"
heli' hasn't needed any of it's electronics replacing (apart from the
battery which is changed as a matter of course) and it's still equipped with
the same motor I fitted to it nearly 3 years ago, and the same thing applies
to quite a few of the guys I fly with. Nothing breaks and no drifting has
EVER been a problem.

Ping Alan Rait, coz he's one who I suspect will back me up on this as he
bought a 12 year old heli off me, I set up his recently acqured CSM 400 and
in the 4 years that he's owned the heli, he's barely touched it and NEVER
had to move the trim lever on his tail rotor yet. I bet he can't even
remember HOW to use it :-)



--
Beav


Please note my E-mail address is "beavis dot original at ntlworld dot com"
(with the obvious changes)

Beavisland now lives at
www.beavisoriginal.co.uk